Topic: People Need To Stop Bitching

[Oblivion]

So Bitch on! 

Says the guy who bitches about the Wii U more than anyone I've ever seen?

[Evan_B]

When did this become about game localization and not about bitching about the Wii U...?

Oh, please tell me that the whole "bitching about the Wii U" thing is becoming old...!

...These boards are so sad nowadays.

[NWR_insanolord]

These forums are very fluid with topics. I'd probably go as far as to say if things stay on topic for too long it's a bad sign.

[Evan_B]

I'm starting to notice that. I like it, because bad topics can sometimes change to good ones! Yay!

[Chozo Ghost]

So Bitch on! 

Says the guy who bitches about the Wii U more than anyone I've ever seen?

I've always felt it was important for people to practice what they preach.

[ejamer]

Plus when a game comes to Europe it is translated into English which makes NoA holding the game back even more outrageous because the work is already done. True, the voicing may be in a British accent, but it would still be easily understood by Americans and Canadians. Reggie finally did cave with Xenoblade, but what was really sad was how much bitching it took for that to happen.
...

Except Reggie didn't "cave".  He was approached by an outside party that agreed to take on the publishing risks to see the game released in North America - otherwise it would still be the same "import or nothing" approach for people interested in playing a quality JRPG on Wii.

No matter how much you hate GameStop, that was a pretty cool move of them to take on.

When did this become about game localization and not about bitching about the Wii U...?

...

Not sure about others, but for me localization complaints are a symptom of why I was disappointed after Nintendo's E3 showing.  It is an example of why I don't trust Nintendo to provide a full gaming experience on a console, especially when they refuse to announce titles outside the launch window and fail to show me any software that I'm really anticipating. Localization complaints are an example of NoA saying they want to support core gamers but failing to back up their claim with action even when an opportunity is sitting in their hands.

Nintendo is a company that makes solid hardware, creates some amazing game experiences, and holds a nostalgic sway over much of my gaming choices.  They are also a company that consistently fails to make the most of their potential or promises.  It's frustrating; wanting to support Nintendo but knowing that if I do I'm cutting myself off from a lot of gaming that would otherwise be very appealing.

When I bitch now, it's because I'm not sure that I'm ready for another go-round on the same damn horse of seeing games that I want but being unable to ever play them.

[NWR_insanolord]

Well I think for at least the first couple years you'll be fairly safe with the Wii U, as I'm pretty confident it'll get most of the same third party support as the other consoles, plus Nintendo's support. It only really becomes a question mark when Sony and Microsoft's next consoles come into play.

[lolmonade]

Well I think for at least the first couple years you'll be fairly safe with the Wii U, as I'm pretty confident it'll get most of the same third party support as the other consoles, plus Nintendo's support. It only really becomes a question mark when Sony and Microsoft's next consoles come into play.

Even then, I question how much of a leap we can really expect when the recently leaked info from Microsoft showed they planned on releasing their next console at a $300 price point.  If it's a marginal upgrade more than a generation forward for Sony & Microsoft's systems, couldnt it be possible that Wii U might be able to handle multiplatform games, just maybe be the worst looking version?

[NWR_insanolord]

I think it's likely to be significantly less of a difference between the Wii U and next Xbox/PlayStation than there was between the Wii and 360/PS3. Neither of them is going to go insane with the hardware because it's unnecessary to go that far beyond the current level and it's a lot easier to stay profitable by playing it a bit safer. Add to that the fact that the 360 and PS3 will continue to get significant software support even after their successors launch, and I think Nintendo's safe through 2014 even if the competition launches next year. Assuming all that, and everything we know about how Nintendo's designed the system and its services, and at least a year's head start, I think Nintendo's in really good shape.

[Chozo Ghost]

everything we know about how Nintendo's designed the system

They designed it to look like a clone of the 6 year old Wii. Maybe the internal guts of the system are far more advanced than the Wii, but those guts are enclosed within a shell that is going to confuse people. Apparently Jimmy Fallon, CNN, and others have already been confused into thinking the Wii U is just a tablet peripheral and not a new system. If Jimmy Fallon and CNN are confused, what is going to happen with consumers in general? And didn't someone even say a Gamestop employee was also confused? So the confusion is real and apparently widespread. Its a real problem even now, and this holiday season its only going to be much worse.

I still can't understand why Nintendo made the system look so identical to the Wii. I get the name because they want to tie their new product in with something that's well established, but why have it look the same as well? This has me puzzled and no matter how hard I think about it I can't figure out any good reason why they would want to do this.

[NWR_insanolord]

What the physical case looks like is beyond irrelevant. I think you vastly overestimate the problems that will cause. Like the name, no gamer will give a **** what the box looks like if the games are there.

[Chozo Ghost]

Aesthetically speaking the system looks fine, or even looks good. The only problem with the appearance is that it looks exactly the same as something else and will inevitably cause frustration, headaches, anger, etc. It won't be a problem for you or me or anyone else on this site, but what about the millions of consumers out there who don't know any better?

I don't care about how it looks aesthetically. The box could literally look like a turd with polka dots for all I care. But at least looking like a turd with polka dots wouldn't confuse people into thinking its the same system they already own. How can you say mass confusion is irrelevant? Not only is it relevant, its very relevant. It will have an impact on sales this holiday season, and beyond.

[lolmonade]

Aesthetically speaking the system looks fine, or even looks good. The only problem with the appearance is that it looks exactly the same as something else and will inevitably cause frustration, headaches, anger, etc. It won't be a problem for you or me or anyone else on this site, but what about the millions of consumers out there who don't know any better?

I don't care about how it looks aesthetically. The box could literally look like a turd with polka dots for all I care. But at least looking like a turd with polka dots wouldn't confuse people into thinking its the same system they already own. How can you say mass confusion is irrelevant? Not only is it relevant, its very relevant. It will have an impact on sales this holiday season, and beyond.

Here's the thing: Even if people are confused about what it is right now, when they go and buy what they think is a stand-alone perhipheral and open the box, they will soon find it is a completely new console altogether.  Core gamers are the only ones that will truly care about the graphical and processing upgrade, all of the "blue ocean" consumers would be interested in the gamepad and gameplay mechanics that come specifically with that. 
 
It looks similar to the Wii for the same reason it's called the "Wii U".  Despite recent sales figures, the Wii was an incredible success, and they are going to make it as similar looking as the Wii in an attempt to use that name-brand equity to market it to the same consumers who bought a Wii just for the sake of Wii Fit or Wii Sports.  Nintendo realizes that the Wii's biggest problem has not been as much the graphical disparity as much as it was software support outside of their core franchises, and the lousy sales now are probably mostly attributed to a mix of market saturation and publishers starving the system from software releases from now until the Wii U release.

[Adrock]

The similar console design will be a problem for some at least initially. Then, it won't. Like 3DS, people are going to figure it out eventually and it likely won't take more than a few months at most. Personally, I think it'd be worth it to just avoid that entirely because the shape of the box affects nothing about the hardware's performance.

Nintendo realizes that the Wii's biggest problem has not been as much the graphical disparity as much as it was software support outside of their core franchises, and the lousy sales now are probably mostly attributed to a mix of market saturation and publishers starving the system from software releases from now until the Wii U release.

They probably also realize that the graphical disparity between the Wii and PS3/360 is part of the reason software support suffered. That won't be a problem with Wii U for at least a couple years.

[Chozo Ghost]

Like 3DS, people are going to figure it out eventually

Do we really know that everyone figured out the 3DS? There could still be a lot of people out there who are confused about it being a new handheld, versus a mere revision of the DS. I don't see any reason to just assume everyone's figured that out because there's no hard data supporting it one way or the other.

One thing we do know is 3DS sales are doing a lot better since the price cut and release of better games, but that doesn't mean that even as good as sales are right now they couldn't be even better without market confusion being a factor. We simply don't know.

I can't help but think if you showed a 3DS to a lot of elderly or soccer moms they would say "Oh, I already have that", referring to the original DS Phat/lite/i. People aren't going to buy what they already have, or what they THINK they already have.

If that's the case with the 3DS it most certainly will be with the Wii U as well. Elderly and soccer mom consumers are going to look at the Wii U and think "I already have that, except for that new tablet controller thing". Then they will pass on buying it because they think its what they already have, and don't feel like paying $350 for a tablet peripheral.

[Evan_B]

I think that Nintendo won't be selling tablets separately either, at least until games that support two tablets come out. That means the only way for casuals to get "the new Wii peripheral" will be to buy the console itself- then they'll see.

[Chozo Ghost]

I think that Nintendo won't be selling tablets separately either, at least until games that support two tablets come out. That means the only way for casuals to get "the new Wii peripheral" will be to buy the console itself- then they'll see.

As I said in my previous post I don't think consumers will plunk down $350 just to get what they think is a Wii peripheral. They just won't buy it at all, and that's why I said its going to impact sales.

I'm not saying that the Wii U won't sell well, but something like this might cause it to be somewhat less successful than it otherwise could have been. So the Wii U may still do well despite consumers being confused, but it won't do quite as well as it could have if Nintendo had made it clearer that this is more than a new peripheral or hardware revision.

Reggie is a PR guy, so its his job to make this clearer to consumers. But from what we've seen on Jimmy Fallon he doesn't seem to be doing a good job of driving this important fact home to people. He spends most of his time focusing on the Tablet, but its actually the console itself that people need to be sold on.

[Adrock]

Do we really know that everyone figured out the 3DS?

Well, I didn't say "everyone," I said "people" denoting a general understanding from consumers. There's no way to prove that everyone ever understands everything, but ultimately that doesn't matter. What's important is that 3DS sales have improved to the point where it's considered successful for Nintendo. They can't reach every last man, woman, and child. They don't need to. Nintendo could change the box and some people still wouldn't get it right away. Nothing to be done. Some people just won't get it no matter how hard you beat them over the head with something. The design will cause some confusion despite being completely avoidable, but I don't believe it'll persist. If Wii U fails, it won't be because of the box design.

[Chozo Ghost]

Some people just won't get it no matter how hard you beat them over the head with something.

Sadly this is true. There are still people who think the world is flat, that the moon landings were faked, etc. Getting everyone to understand something is impossible, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't try to get the remaining 99.9% on board. Your attitude seems to be that since 100% is impossible Nintendo shouldn't even bother trying at all, but I don't agree with that.

If Wii U fails, it won't be because of the box design.

Ian said in a post awhile back that if the Wii U fails there's probably not going to be a single smoking gun to which we can lay all the blame on. He said instead it would suffer a death of a thousand cuts. I think that might be true. Market confusion would certainly be one of those cuts. Will it be the only cut? No. Will it be the worst problem the Wii U faces? Probably not. But is it something Nintendo should be worrying about? Absolutely.

[Adrock]

I disagree. It may be something that shouldn't be a problem but it's more like not refilling your cat's water bowl before leaving for work rather than leaving the stove on. Your cat might be cranky when you get home, but she won't die. Could Nintendo sell more units initially? Probably. Will it hurt them in the longrun? Not likely.

[Chozo Ghost]

Will it hurt them in the longrun? Not likely.

You have to keep in mind the clock is ticking for when the competition show up. Even if people will "figure it out eventually", the longer it takes them to figure it out the more likely it is they will start hearing about the PS4 and 420 with its shiny casual friendly Kinect 2.0 or whatever, and so the danger here is by the time they finally figure out that the Wii U is a new console it may be too late because by then the casual blue ocean market will have lost interest and their attention will have shifted over to the competition. You don't think that would hurt Nintendo in the long run?

Nintendo has a very short window to lock up the market before the competition shows up. By confusing consumers, the Wii U adoption will be slow and Nintendo's early lead advantage will have been squandered. Letting people "figure it out eventually" could be disastrous, because "eventually" might come too little too late.

[Adrock]

Play the doom card if you want. I don't see it being anywhere near as disastrous. I've stated numerous times that I believe some people will be confused. Nintendo could redesign the box before launching and some people would still be confused. In either case, I see that number in the thousands rather than millions. Many will come around sooner rather than later. At the end of the day, it really won't be the difference maker.

[Chozo Ghost]

At the end of the day, it really won't be the difference maker.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/For_Want_of_a_Nail_%28proverb%29

[UncleBob]

Why did Nintendo make the Game Boy Color a clone of the Game Boy/Game Boy Pocket?

[Chozo Ghost]

Why did Nintendo make the Game Boy Color a clone of the Game Boy/Game Boy Pocket?

Even Nintendo themselves seem to view the GBC as a mere revision of the Gameboy because they combine the sales figures of the GBC and GB together.