Topic: Wii U in Review (News & Rumor Consolidation)

[the asylum]

So Nintendo's solution to being completely unprepared to deal with HD development (in the year of our lord 2013!) and almost zero third part support (outside of the usual shovelware) to fill in the gaping holes of their release schedule is re-re-rereleasing 15 year old games

I hope this really is just a rumor.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Sounds like a Nintendo plan to me.

[Mop it up]

I think most GameCube games could look nice in HD without much effort, but Nintendo 64 titles? That would take way too much work. Even as a fan of the N64, I'd much rather any money/studio spent on that be used to make new games.

[nickmitch]

I'd rather Nintendo spend money on new studios. Let them figure things out with DLC levels of Mario or something and then have at it.

[shingi_70]

Nintendo never eeally recovered from losing Rare to Microsoft and never took the proper steps to build replacement studios. It seems around the time that Rare jumped in Nintendo took it as an opprtunity to drop all western support that wasnt Rare or a Mario and Donkey Kong game.[size=78%] [/size]

[BlackNMild2k1]

But they didn't "lose" Rare to MS, they gladly sold them off for a profit.

MS is still trying to make the best of that investment, to the point where even though Rare was hardly the Rare we knew and loved when Nintendo sold their shares to MS, but now Rare isn't even the Rare they were then anymore. They've moved so far from who they used to be that they are only Rare in name, much like Atari.

[tendoboy1984]

Retro Studios is a much more capable studio than Rare, in my opinion. Nintendo also has the quirky folks at Intelligent Systems, who have proven their worth on more than one occasion,

[ShyGuy]

The problem is Retro is nowhere as prolific as Rare. From 2000-2013, they have released seven games and assisted with two. And two of the seven were enhanced ports. Five games in 13 years is less than Nintendo needs.

Nintendo should either increase the size of the studio or add another western studio to fill in the gap.

edit: Tropical Freeze isn't out yet, so I guess that doesn't count.

[pokepal148]

I have to find... here we are,
http://www.gamerevolution.com/news/platinum-games-interested-in-becoming-secondparty-nintendo-studio-21261

Iwata, get to the negotiation tables now

Imo this is what nintendo needs to do, accept them in, and begin making deals to get stuff for smaller games like a wayforward developed 2d metroid or a shinen f-zero where they can get these less established franchises some time in the spotlight without having to spend their own resources on these less profitable ventures

[shingi_70]

What Shyguy said was mostly what I was talking about. As much as we like to talk about Nintendo needing to diversify more and offer a broader range of games. The simple truth is that once upon of Time Rare handled that for Nintendo. Retro doesn't even come close as they don't seem to have the autonmy or man power that Nintendo once gave Rare of Old.


I'm still wondering what Nintendo was doing between 2009 and 2011 when they first announced the Wii U.  That coupled without any good messaging about what the Wii U is a big mistep for nintendo.


I will say Nintendo's line up for 2014 actually has alot of promise to furfill the Wii U equal Gamecube redux. I'm just worried about the spacing between releases and if were going to see the major droughts that won't be on the PS4 at least.


But If were being honest Wii U will gave a pretty diverse line up taking ques from both the Gamecube and Wii.


Usual Nintendo Suspects
New Super Mario Bros U
Pikmin 3
The Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker HD
Game and Wario
Super Mario 3D World
Pokemon Rumble U
Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze




Wii Style Games
Wii Fit U
Wii Sports Club
Sing Party
Wii Party U


Third Party Exclusives
ZombiU
Lego City Undercover
Sonic Lost World
Mario and Sonic at the Sochi 2014 Winter Games


Core Oriented Games
Nintendoland
The Wonderful 101
Bayonetta 2
X
Shin Megami Tensi X Fire Emblem

[BlackNMild2k1]

I have to find... here we are,
http://www.gamerevolution.com/news/platinum-games-interested-in-becoming-secondparty-nintendo-studio-21261

Iwata, get to the negotiation tables now

Imo this is what nintendo needs to do, accept them in, and begin making deals to get stuff for smaller games like a wayforward developed 2d metroid or a shinen f-zero where they can get these less established franchises some time in the spotlight without having to spend their own resources on these less profitable ventures

If Nintendo hasn't worked some sort of backroom deal on that already, then I don't know what they are doing to secure more exclusive content for their content starved platform.

A new willing a second party from an established enthusiastic and creative developer is a good place to start. Even if they didn't make them official 2nd party, a 5 year 3 game or first refusal contract would be a good alternative. Don't use Wonderful 101 as a test. Throw them the Starfox franchise they asked for (Nintendo probably isn't doing anything worthwhile with it at the moment anyway...), assuming they haven't already, and see what they are capable of doing with an established Nintendo IP inbetween work on their own IP's.

[BlackNMild2k1]

What Shyguy said was mostly what I was talking about. As much as we like to talk about Nintendo needing to diversify more and offer a broader range of games. The simple truth is that once upon of Time Rare handled that for Nintendo. Retro doesn't even come close as they don't seem to have the autonmy or man power that Nintendo once gave Rare of Old.

I would love to see an output comparison timeline between the two studios during their time with Nintendo. Some put that together please.

[shingi_70]

Rare was with Nintendo for eight years. (1994-2001) within that time frame they released

Donkey Kong County- 94
Killer Instinct- 94
Donkey Kong Land- 94
Donkey kong country 2: Diddy King's Quest- 95
Killer Instinct Gameboy- 95
Ken Griffy, Jr's Homerun baseball - 98
Donkey Kong Land 2- 96
Donkey Kong Country 3- 96
Killer Instinct Gold- 96
Blast Corps- 97
007 Goldeneye- 97
Donkey Kong land 3=97
Diddy Kong Racing- 97
Banjo Kaozzie- 98
Conker's Pocket Adventure- 99
Jet Force Gemani- 99
Donkey Kong 64- 99
Mickey's Magical racing- 99
Perfect Dark- 00
Perfect Dark GB- 00
Donkey Kong Country GBC- 00
Mickey's Speedway USA- 00
Banjo-tooie- 00
Conker's Bad Fur Day- 01
Mickey's Speedway USA GB- 01
Starfox adventures-02
Donkey Kong Country GBA- 02

Retro has been with Nintendo for nine year (2000 to present)
Metroid Prime- 2002
Metroid Prime 2 echoes- 2004
Metroid Prime 3: Corruption-2007
Donkey Kong Country Returns- 2010
Donkey Kong Country Tropical freeze- 2014 


But to be fair Retro came in  at a time of rising dev costs. With that said Rare has been with microsoft for seven years and have put out.


Grabbed by the Ghoulies- 03
Conker Live and reloaded- 05
Kameo- 05
Perfect Dark Zero- 05
Viva Pinata- 06
Jetpac refueled- 07
Viva Pinata: Trouble in Paradise- 08
Banjo and Kazooie: Nuts and Bolts- 08
Kinect Sports- 10
Kinect Sports: season 2- 11
Kinect Sports Rivals preseason- 13
Kinect Sports Rivals- 14


I tend to think Retro is vastly overrated and Rare has been unfairly **** upon due to gamers hate of Microsoft. I feel that Retro should be a two or three studio instead of working on one project at a time.

[Spak-Spang]

That is not the whole picture though.  You have to ask yourself how big each studio is.  If Rare has 3-4 development teams working for them…then those numbers are not that high.

Retro is a fairly small studio that I think only has one or two teams. 

[the asylum]

Why do people still talk about Rare as if they're the same company in 2013 that they were in 1994? The only thing that Rare has now thats in common with Rare of yesterday is pretty much just the name.

Any team of trained monkeys can crap out casual titles like Kinect Sports. That's not a real big achievement to parade around.

[shingi_70]

Why do people still talk about Rare as if they're the same company in 2013 that they were in 1994? The only thing that Rare has now thats in common with Rare of yesterday is pretty much just the name.

Any team of trained monkeys can crap out casual titles like Kinect Sports. That's not a real big achievement to parade around.

Too bad Kinect Sports is pretty awesome game in its genre. You guys talk about Rare like all they've put out are casuel or bad titles when in the past 10 years they've only put out 3 Kinect Games and out of their past output only one of the games was truly bad.

But than again people seem to be okay with all the Wii insert title here games for Wii U so there must be double standard of some sort.

[the asylum]

Too bad as well that Ghoulies, PDZ, and Nuts n Bolts were all flops as well

Compare that to Retro, whose "worst" game was Metroid Prime 2.

Really lends perspective, doesn't it?

[shingi_70]

Commercial flop doesn't mean a game is bad. Perfect Dark Zero is **** tier bpp, but nuts and bolts is a really good game. It just isn't the one that people wanted from Rare or the franchise.

[Mop it up]

I don't really get the Rare/Retro comparisons. The only thing they have in common is that they both made a Donkey Kong game... but other companies have done that also. Oh, and I guess their names start with R. But other than that, they're completely different companies.

[Ceric]

I don't really get the Rare/Retro comparisons. The only thing they have in common is that they both made a Donkey Kong game... but other companies have done that also. Oh, and I guess their names start with R. But other than that, they're completely different companies.

Also an E and Two R's.

[Adrock]

I don't really get the Rare/Retro comparisons.

I think it's because Rare was Nintendo's major non-Japanese studio and Retro kind of filled those shoes. The major difference is that Retro Studios releases one new game every two to three years while Rare contributed more. Retro's games tend to receive wider acclaim so really it's quality vs quantity.

I never really got into Rare's titles. I liked Conker's Bad Fur Day a lot, but other than that, I only found them to be okay. They did help round out Nintendo's lineup. I think Retro's philosophy more closer matches Nintendo's which makes sense considering they're first party.

I think it would greatly benefit Nintendo to open new studios around the US. One in New York, one in California, then just officially make Monster Games and Next Level Games second or first party if (and only if) they're willing.

[Stratos]

People are really touting the release rate of Rare? Nearly EVERY major title of theirs on the N64 and Gamecube was delayed at one point or another. I distinctly remember a news bit in Nintendo Power talking about how Banjo-Kazooie and Conker were delayed on Nintnedo's call by nearly a year due to "quality control". The only game I remember NOT being delayed was Diddy Kong Racing and that could have been because it was a surprise reveal only a few months before release. Who knows if there were internal delays before it was revealed.

This may be why Nintendo stopped showing games far off from release. They always are willing to take extra time to finish and it frustrated fans to see these kinds of delays.

~Just read that 'reUmagined' article cited earlier in the thread. It mentions multi gamepad support. Could this be them ramping up a potential 2014 launch of the system supporting dual gamepads with several games both retail and on the eShop?

[BranDonk Kong]

Modern CODBLOPS 4 Ghosts is supposed to be pretty good on Wii U.

[Stratos]

Does it have split-screen local multiplayer? Or at least two-player support w/ the gamepad?


What were the multiplayer options with BLOPS 2? Split-screen local? Gamepad local multi? split-screen/gamepad online multi?

[shingi_70]

I think Sony needs to look at Sony and Microsoft when it comes to expanding their studio output. I would start by expanding Retro and NST.


Retro- expand to have another team working on something on par with Monolith Soft's X


NST- I would expand the studio since Nintendo is putting more effort in core software. Have these guys make smaller Wii U eshop games while working to do another Wave Race or 1080 snowboarding. 


Next Level Games- Get these guys to work on the console versions of the none Wii branded sports games.


Monster Games-another digital Excitebike game and maybe bringing back F-zero.




In Europe I would build a studio or two to work on maybe a WRPG or something.




In Japan pick up Platinum since they make great bomba's but I doubt they keep getting work like Suda51 somehow does.