Topic: Nintendo 3DS Specifications Updated

[Stogi]

300 for a handheld in japan isn't that expensive. It's insane here, but **** is that expensive in japan. Seriously, you wouldn't stand for the cost of everyday goods there.

[GoldenPhoenix]

The battery issue concerns me, but only a bit, it seems to be roughly the same as the DSi. If it is too bad I wouldn't be surprised if there are 3rd party solutions, if that is the case, then some people will have to move onto something else to complain about. Really though it is all speculation, we don't know if the numbers are conservative estimates or not. To me if the system can be playable for 5-7 hours with medium settings, I will have no complaint. Even at the 3-5 it is still better then the first iteration of PSP was (I remember there being fear you couldn't finish a 2 hour UMD movie when it came out).

[Adrock]

Battery life is a legitimate thing to complain about though when you're talking about portable anything. That was the one thing Nintendo understood about portable gaming that, for some reason, no other company besides Bandai (and even then Gameboy creator Gunpei Yokoi designed the thing) seemed to figure out. Price too. 3DS is the most anti-Nintendo Nintendo handheld which in some ways is good and some ways is bad. Maybe we're just spoiled because we're used to the batteries in Nintendo handhelds lasting over 10 hours.

[MaryJane]

@Ian
I didn't read your entire post (I've read enough books already) but I did catch the part about if Sony had released a handheld that had 3 hours of playtime and 3.5 hours charging we would rip them apart, and you are right. However, quite a few years have passed since the GBAs release (btw Engadget is reporting that the GBA SP was slated to have an autostereoscopic screen but they couldn't get LCD resolution high enough) and batteries have gotten pretty close to their power ceiling and size matters. You can only put giant batteries in giant devices (if only to dissapate the heat) but the 3DS is rather small, and there other aspects to battery choice that I don't understand.

The fact remains that multitasking and gaming are heavy drains on a battery when using a modern device. This is not some Nintendo conspiracy to screw people over, but a fact of the way our technology has progressed, and batteries failing to keep up.

[oohhboy]

It's not that batteries have failed to keep up, it's that the demand placed upon the battery always exceeds it's ability to deliver. Even if you slapped a nuclear battery in it, you still have to dissipate the waste heat not only from the battery itself, but the components which have their own thermal tolerances.

However region locking is a Nintendo conspiracy in order to place artificial restrictions on trade in order to increase control, decrease price competition with no benefit to the end user.

[BlackNMild2k1]

(btw Engadget is reporting that the GBA SP was slated to have an autostereoscopic screen but they couldn't get LCD resolution high enough)

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=30917.msg648758#msg648758

[MaryJane]

@ohboy
The fact that batteries can't meet the requirements of their devices (for whatever reason) means that they have failed to keep up. New technology is a constant but we're stilling using the same batteries from 25 years ago with only marginal improvements. People have finally realised that and a lot of battery research is going on (batteries might be the first nanotube consumer device) but it is very late and slow in coming.

@BnM
Links don't show up as links for me on the forums, but I certainly don't read every post and thread, though I did read about 3D in the GC. My point was Ian referencing the GBA line for what the 3DS should be, and while I contradicted him, I wanted to show Nintendo's thinking for 3D on a portable.

Engadget also has link to a 3DS being opened up and having its internals inspected, but apparently no new info was gleamed about CPU and GPU yet.

[Kytim89]

Will the 3DS and its games be patchable?

[GoldenPhoenix]

Will the 3DS and its games be patchable?

Probably going to be completely up to Nintendo, no doubt the technology allows for it but knowing Nintendo, well, you just don't know!

[Kytim89]

Will the 3DS and its games be patchable?

Probably going to be completely up to Nintendo, no doubt the technology allows for it but knowing Nintendo, well, you just don't know!

Would it be helpful against piracy?

[KDR_11k]

Wasn't that the sort of "worst-case-scenario" battery life Nintendo said about the DS?

That was 5 IIRC. At least that's what mine was getting and I think I recall that being what Nintendo listed. I don't think the estimates will be wrong, Nintendo is only known for lowballing compared to other companies who tend to give unrealistic figures (wasn't PSP announced as 4 but lasted like 2 with heavy drive use?).

[Ian Sane]

The fact remains that multitasking and gaming are heavy drains on a battery when using a modern device. This is not some Nintendo conspiracy to screw people over, but a fact of the way our technology has progressed, and batteries failing to keep up.

Back in 1989 you could have said that a backlit colour screen is a heavy drain on a battery and that technology has progrossed while batteries have failed to keep up.  But Sega's and Atari's excuses didn't hold up.  Nintendo made battery life the number one priority.
 
Now that isn't Nintendo's priority and they're really overloading this sucker in a way that seems quite different than their previous approaches and I don't think it's a change for the better.  A lot of the 3DS's extra features I consider to be the sizzle.  They're good marketing bulletpoints that probably won't contribute much to games.  Nintendo used to be really good about delivering the steak.  Battery life is not an exciting bulletpoint but it is very important from a practical point of view.  I think Nintendo has changed where they focus more on the sizzle than the steak.  Their priority is having a marketing gimmick and practical and essential elements are a lesser priority.
 
If it comes down to 3D screen or battery life, battery life is more important for providing a good portable videogame system.  But maybe they could have both if they were a little more flexible about their profit margin.  But they assume this will sell like hotcakes anyway so they feel there is no need.  That sort of attitude is not going to do us any favours.  It isn't good for a company to feel like they can get away with anything and I fear Nintendo is at that point.

[GoldenPhoenix]

The fact remains that multitasking and gaming are heavy drains on a battery when using a modern device. This is not some Nintendo conspiracy to screw people over, but a fact of the way our technology has progressed, and batteries failing to keep up.

Back in 1989 you could have said that a backlit colour screen is a heavy drain on a battery and that technology has progrossed while batteries have failed to keep up.  But Sega's and Atari's excuses didn't hold up.  Nintendo made battery life the number one priority.
 
Now that isn't Nintendo's priority and they're really overloading this sucker in a way that seems quite different than their previous approaches and I don't think it's a change for the better.  A lot of the 3DS's extra features I consider to be the sizzle.  They're good marketing bulletpoints that probably won't contribute much to games.  Nintendo used to be really good about delivering the steak.  Battery life is not an exciting bulletpoint but it is very important from a practical point of view.  I think Nintendo has changed where they focus more on the sizzle than the steak.  Their priority is having a marketing gimmick and practical and essential elements are a lesser priority.
 
If it comes down to 3D screen or battery life, battery life is more important for providing a good portable videogame system.  But maybe they could have both if they were a little more flexible about their profit margin.  But they assume this will sell like hotcakes anyway so they feel there is no need.  That sort of attitude is not going to do us any favours.  It isn't good for a company to feel like they can get away with anything and I fear Nintendo is at that point.

So basically, 3DS is Wii and is da phail with gimmicks?

[MaryJane]

I think you're looking at this incorrectly Ian.

Nintendo's problem is that they needed a device that separates them from Sony and gives iPhone gamers a reason to buy the next DS. If they had simply released a slightly more powerful system with an analog stick, what would be that reason? Sony tried the "serious" games marketing for the PSP vs iPhone, and it got them nowhere. Games on the iPhone are getting better, and will get even better when the iPhone4G, etc. comes out. They may not be of the quality of a Nintendo game, but iPhone games are simple, entertaining, and on a device(cell phone) nearly everyone "needs".
For most people, the entertaining part coupled with the "one device to rule them all" aspect, is more than enough reason to not buy a DS or PSP.

With 3D gaming, and 3D AR, Nintendo is offering things that cannot be found elsewhere, and if battery power has to suffer because of that, then so be it. It's much better to sell a product that has bad battery life, than to not sell a product at all.

Anything less than complete domination is a failure for Nintendo and no one is going to buy/not buy the 3DS because of battery life.

[Ian Sane]

I get that the 3D feature is very eye-catching and makes the 3DS stand out in comparison to the iPhone more than just a really great portable gaming system would.  The thing is gamers know that iPhone games are ****.  They will buy a seperate handheld specific to videogames.

But Nintendo's new found focus on the mainstream requires some big shiny marketing gimmick to attract attention away from the iPhone.  And I was fine with this feature (hey, it's pretty neat sounding) until something IMPORTANT was compromised.  I feel Nintendo's focus on the mainstream compromises their product for people who actually give a **** about videogames.  It was and is VERY obvious on the Wii and now we might be seeing it here.

And I would argue that competing with the iPhone is a losing battle anyway.  iPhone games cost only a fraction of what "real" games cost.  The mainstream doesn't care about the quality of said games so you've lost them already.  If you don't care about the quality of the videogames you are playing you are going to go with one-in-all device.  Maybe Nintendo can keep those people interested with 3D but then what next time?  So every time they release a new system they have to this awe-inspiring new gimmick to keep the rubes interested?  How long will this strategy last?  Hell, we're wondering what they are going to do with the Wii 2 to make it stand out.

To me Nintendo's whole blue ocean strategy comes across as a pathetic kid trying to get the cool kids to like him by throwing big parties.  But the cool kids don't really like him and once he either can't keep up or someone else comes along and tops him, they'll all bail on him.  Meanwhile he has a group of friends that DO (or did) legitimately like him that he is neglecting at the expense of trying to attract a different crowd.

The mainstream is fickle and will bail at a moment's notice.  The battle against the iPhone is already lost, we just don't know when that will happen.  The core game market, that actually gives a **** about videogames, can be profitable (provided the developer isn't an idiot).  The problem is that market is dying in Japan and even though it is fine in North America which is a BIGGER MARKET Nintendo bases their worldwide decisions entirely on Japan.

If Nintendo can make a bundle off of the mainstream for the time being, they should do it.  But I think that is a short term strategy as those customers have no real loyalty, especially in the handheld market where the competition is smart phones.  Therefore Nintendo should not neglect the customers that do have loyalty.  Battery life probably isn't make or break on its own but the idea of compromising stuff that is important is a bad one to have and can lead to stuff that will truly bite them in the ass.

[MaryJane]

Goodness, could you be more concise with your thoughts please? I didn't read your entire book, but I did read the first 3 or 4 paragraphs.

"Gamers" aren't being renewed like they used to be. In the old days of Nintendo, you could pretty much gauruntee that every kid at least wanted to play the (S)NES. Nowadays, kids have so much being thrown at them, Nintendo is glad to have them know the name of their company. A lot of adults feel like gaming is for kids, and those who don't think Nintendo is for kids. Every faithful Nintendo gamer bought the GC and it was listed as a failure, how stupid would Nintendo be to only cater to those people with the 2nd gen DS?

I'm thinking that something like 33% of the people who buy a 3DS are going to do so solely based upon the fact that they can watch/game in 3D without glasses. Nintendo seems to realize this, and will be going hard on delivering TV shows and movies in 3D. Nintendo tried the "stay true to gamers" route, and gamers turned on them for the PS because it could play CDs, and then the PS2 for DVDs.

Then there is the fact that 3rd parties made exclusive games for a system they thoroughly trounced in sales.

Maybe it can be seen as arrogance, but Nintendo knows that their core gamers are satisfied with their software, almost regardless of hardware. The powerful graphics (drain number one on the battery) are mostly for developers, and the 3D (drain number two) is mostly for the non-gamers who bought a DS and let it collect dust in favors of iPhone games and apps for cooking and such.

If battery life is that important to you, turn off the 3D, turn off the sound, put it on lowest brightness, and never do anything on it but game.

[Mop it up]

What I wonder is how many times the battery can be recharged. Usually, for batteries of this type, it's only approximately 500 times. With that estimate for the charge life, that means between 1,500-2,500 hours of play before the battery becomes practically unusable. That might seem like a lot, but it actually isn't all that much in the big scheme of things, and replacing a battery in a device such as this can be a troublesome and relatively expensive process.

[NWR_insanolord]

If it's anything like the current DS, replacing the battery will be incredibly easy.

[Mop it up]

How much does a new DS battery cost, and can it be found in a retail store or does it have to be ordered from Nintendo.com?

[TJ Spyke]

How much does a new DS battery cost, and can it be found in a retail store or does it have to be ordered from Nintendo.com?

Nintendo does sell DS, DS Lite, and DSi batteries on their website. Each are $15 (but are not inter-usable, so the DSi battery will only work for the DSi). Amazon has third battery batteries as cheap as $6.

[BlackNMild2k1]

But what are those replacement battery power ratings?

do they sell more powerful batteries than what comes in the system already?

[TJ Spyke]

I am not sure, the product descriptions make it sound like they are the same as the ones already in the systems.

[Mop it up]

Ah, the price isn't as bad as I thought then, as if I remember rightly, the battery for the GBA SP was $40. Still, it's a bit of a pain since it isn't sold in stores, and replacing it isn't as easy as with a TV remote and such.

[NWR_insanolord]

I haven't done it with my DSi, but I have swapped out the battery on a couple of my DS Lites. It's fairly simple. You have to remove one screw, but it's a standard phillips head, nothing proprietary, and once the door's off you just pop out the old one and pop in the new one.

[Kytim89]

What will most likely happen is that Nintendo will make the 3DS battery where no one but their technical crew will be able to get to in order to prevent piracy. If you need help with the battery, Nintendo will ask for you ship it into their facility and they will repair it themselves. Also, there is a good chance that the screw holes will be covered up.