Topic: Five Things the Gaming Community Needs to Stop Obsessing Over

[Mop it up]

I found this on another site, and thought it was a good read:

http://www.gamespy.com/articles/108/1087382p1.html

It's an article about topics which get discussed too much, when people should instead be playing and discussing games. For those who don't feel like clicking, the five topics are:

Girl Gamers
The Console Wars
Are Videogames Art?
Sales Figures
Casual vs. Hardcore

[broodwars]

Hmm...I dunno if "Girl Gamers" are really discussed as much as the other 4 topics, but the rest have certainly been done to death.  Personally, I'm kind of sick of hearing companies whine about used games, and I'm getting to that point with people complaining about DLC.

[Mop it up]

Do companies complain a lot about used game sales? I recall seeing one or two statements about it, but nothing excessive. Then again, this is about the only site I go to for news, so I don't know much about what the other companies say and do.

I've been one to complain about DLC, but I try not to every time I hear about it. It's here to stay it seems, and I've already voiced my concerns.

One thing I think it is with these topics, new people who join message boards such as this might not have talked about these topics before. As an example, before joining NWR, I've never before discussed things like sales figures and casual vs. hardcore, so they were new and interesting topics to me whereas everyone else was sick of them. That's one reason, I think, they keep getting brought back up.

[broodwars]

Do companies complain a lot about used game sales? I recall seeing one or two statements about it, but nothing excessive. Then again, this is about the only site I go to for news, so I don't know much about what the other companies say and do.

I've been one to complain about DLC, but I try not to every time I hear about it. It's here to stay it seems, and I've already voiced my concerns.

One thing I think it is with these topics, new people who join message boards such as this might not have talked about these topics before. As an example, before joining NWR, I've never before discussed things like sales figures and casual vs. hardcore, so they were new and interesting topics to me whereas everyone else was sick of them. That's one reason, I think, they keep getting brought back up.

I suppose I should rephrase that "used games" comment into something more general that gets discussed to death on sites like Gametrailers and IGN, and that's "The State of the Industry" (TM), where both used games and DLC usually get brought up a lot as they discuss the various ways companies can pursue to drain our wallets dry.  I'm just so sick and tired of hearing people whine about how companies can't make money "this way", so instead they need to do it "this way".  You also tend to have people whining about big companies vs. independents, arthouse vs. mainstream games, etc.  I'm just so tired of it.

[BeautifulShy]

In the past few months companys haven't really talked about used game sales heavily. However there has been talk about Digital distribution recently. That is being touted around as a way to stop used game sales.

Sales numbers is away to say that some type of game doesn't sell on a platform or to belittle hardware sales.

It may not seem like it but all of those topics are tied together in one way or another.

[Ian Sane]

The girl gamers topic doesn't seem that big though it might exist because guys would love to have a girlfriend or wife that shares their interest in what has traditionally been a male-dominated interest.  The "videogames as art" topic comes up because we're passionate about our interest and wish to defend it.

The other three though relate a lot to one's videogame experience and that's why they remain hot topics.  Sales have an effect on which games get sequels and which don't and what genres and design trends proliferate or disappear.  Sales don't affect my enjoyment of a game but if a game I like bombs then I might not get more games like it.   Meanwhile the opposite effect can occur where a game design trend I hate pollutes tons of games because it's the current big thing.  Console wars can affect third party support.  The casual vs. hardcore thing is similar to the sales topic.  I hate casual non-games, but they're popular and successful.  That creates the threat of them overtaking core games and possibly even wiping them out completely.  I don't want Nintendo to become a casual focused company because then they won't make games for me anymore.  It's very simple and seems like those that wish the topic would go away are those that either benefit from it or feel they are unaffected by it.

I would like it though if people developed a more rational attitude about sales and the console wars.  I can't stand it when sales are treated as if that's all that matters.  Or when someone shows blind faith and unconditional loyalty to a console maker.  That stuff is just WEIRD and needs to go.

[Morari]

Gamers should start obsessing over more important topics, like DRM.

[Guitar Smasher]

I hate casual non-games

Ok I realize the whole point of this thread is to not get into obsessive discussions, but what exactly is a "non-game".  I get what a non-gamer is, but the term "non-game" seems absurd.  Is it a book, or some sort of cinematic-heavy rpg that you don't get to play?

I might be the next thing added to the list.

[Mop it up]

I might be the next thing added to the list.

Nah, you're awesome. If you were to be added to any list, it'd be "NWR Members Who Should Post More."

And I'm also confused as to what a "non-game" is and think the term is silly, but I've always viewed it as a derogatory term so I haven't much cared to discuss the meaning.

[King of Twitch]

Q explains what a game is; you can deduce what a non-game is:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmzbyuUgdHU#t=1m44s

[Urkel]

I hate casual non-games

Does that mean there are hardcore non-games? How do you feel about those?

[ShyGuy]

My first thought was Pale started this thread.

[KDR_11k]

I hate casual non-games

Does that mean there are hardcore non-games? How do you feel about those?

Elektroplankton.

[Mop it up]

I hate casual non-games

Does that mean there are hardcore non-games? How do you feel about those?

Elektroplankton.

What about Metal Gear Solid 4? It has more cutscenes than gameplay so doesn't that make it a non-game since it is closer to being a movie?

[noname2200]

And I'm also confused as to what a "non-game" is...

Any game that sells more than Halo but which isn't primarily played by 13-25 year old males.

[TJ Spyke]

Some things are obviously non-games; certain DSi Apps like any of the clocks/calculators, the myNotebooks, etc.

[Mop it up]

Are those technically referred to as "non-games"? I mean, I know they are not really games, but somehow, I don't think that is what Ian Sane was referring to.

[stevey]

The list should be

HD graphics
cpu power
red, black, gray, & bloom
Mature rating
FPS

[Ian Sane]

You guys all know what "non-game" means.  Don't play dumb to try to squash the argument.  THAT is something the gaming community needs to stop obsessing over: definition of terms.  And by that I mean questioning what one means whenever they use a term that isn't unanimously positive.  "HD" gets similar "well what does that really mean" stuff.  If you're making an effort to communicate then you'll read into the context of the statement being made.  Acting like it's some ambiguous term is just an obvious attempt to kill the argument by changing the topic to all technicalities on terms, instead of what the real discussion is about.

[NWR_insanolord]

Except, Ian, when we're dealing with you we don't know what you mean by "non-game," or at least I don't. I've seen you call Wii Sports a non-game, which is ridiculous.

[ThePerm]

Wii sports is totally a game, a non-game would be the Sims, Nintendogs, or animal crossing as there is no major goal other than pimping out your house, or dog. On the other hand a better term for Non-Game is simulation. Animal Crossing has games inside of it, and there is a certain game you play pleasing your neighbors, the Sims you play games with your Sims emotions which is equally fun as any other game, and in Nintendogs you can play fetch with your virtual dog.

[that Baby guy]

I hate casual non-games

Does that mean there are hardcore non-games? How do you feel about those?

Elektroplankton.

What about Metal Gear Solid 4? It has more cutscenes than gameplay so doesn't that make it a non-game since it is closer to being a movie?

Thank you!

[BlackNMild2k1]

I can name one thing I'm gald we stopped obsessing over.

Bits.

8bit, 16bit, 32 vs 64bit

Those were the days.

[broodwars]

I can name one thing I'm gald we stopped obsessing over.

Bits.

8bit, 16bit, 32 vs 64bit

Those were the days.

I disagree.  We never stopped arguing over them.  They just mutated in the current "SD vs. HD" argument once the concept of "bits" got outdated.

[Mop it up]

Except, Ian, when we're dealing with you we don't know what you mean by "non-game," or at least I don't. I've seen you call Wii Sports a non-game, which is ridiculous.

Exactly. The problem is, people seem to have different definitions of terms like "non-games" and use them to describe certain games that others wouldn't. No one can try to counter your argument if they aren't even sure which games you mean.

Also, we are trying to avoid discussion of non-games, because it has been discussed too much already.