Topic: IMPRESSIONS: Metroid: Other M

[GoldenPhoenix]

Another aspect to the Samus/Baby Metroid relationship is that it also represented a link to the Chozo people.

[Chozo Ghost]

G.P. your avatar is hot.

[Stogi]

you mean creepy.

[iDraTion]

I gotta say I agree about the emo-retarded nature of a lot of Japanese characters over the years, and with how anime-styled this game looks, it would seem to go hand in hand.  I'm anticipating flat voice acting making that feel even worse, and with how present the cinematics and backstory will be, I'm preparing for pain throughout the game. 


And I don't get the authorization thing; Samus has always been the one, single person in the galaxy to get the job done regardless of the cost when no one else could.  I think Echoes made you feel that more than anything.  She's a no-holds barred survivalist one-man army that kills EVERYTHING in sight.  Having her be managed to the point that she's going to hold back using her full arsenal?  There's a disconnect for me about that.  Regardless, I do trust them with the gameplay itself because that's what Nintendo has always been, and will always be, exemplary at; it's their top priority.  Game-driving plot and story, not so much.

[NWR_insanolord]

Has Nintendo been confirmed to be exhibiting at PAX East? I'd love a chance to try this game out for myself.

[NWR_Neal]

Has Nintendo been confirmed to be exhibiting at PAX East? I'd love a chance to try this game out for myself.

You and me both!

I imagine it would be there. Or at least I really want it to be.

[Ian Sane]

I cannot fathom why you would opt for that kind of control when an analogue stick is readily available if the nunchuck were to be used. This would also provide an extra "accessible" button, and make it so that the controller would not have to be flipped to shoot first person. I am not saying that the NES style won't work, I just don't see why they need to make it work.

Have you not yet realized that with the Wii Nintendo's priority regarding controls isn't about using what's best but rather what's more marketable?  Nintendo likes the sideways remote thing because of the NES controller comparison.  There was no reason for Super Paper Mario, Warioland or NSMB to use that control scheme either.  Just like how the remote was made to the look like a TV remote for marketing purposes, Metroid will use that control scheme because Nintendo wants to make the connection with the classic NES Metroid.
 

 It is time for the Metroid series to grow and evolve, deal with it.

I agree.  But making Metroid more accessible is de-evolution.  It's going backwards.  The concern is that Nintendo is stream-lining Metroid to give it more universal appeal.  The thing is Metroid's core design is intimidating and uninviting.  That's part of the appeal for Metroid fans.  It's supposed to be a game where you will have to backtrack, you will have to remember where you weren't able to go before, you will have to search every nook and cranny to find a secret passage that unlike secrets in most games is absolutely REQUIRED to continue in the game.  That's Metroid.  In Super Metroid you were fucking lost and there was no hint telling you where to go and that's why that game is such a classic.
 
The problem is mass appeal means action-focused gameplay, linear progression and clearly defined objectives.  This is awesome if you're making that sort of game (NSMB) but Metroid is not that type of game.
 
Nintendo has a big obsession these days with giving their games universal appeal but the problem is intimidating complexity is part of the design for some of their franchises (Metroid, Zelda) and a simple design philosophy will ruin those games.  Nothing is safe so I think concern is justified.  I have the same concerns with Zelda.

[NWR_insanolord]

Don't forget, Nintendo made people play Brawl with horizontal Wii remote controls at press events before it came out and that had plenty of control options, so it's not that unlikely that this game will support other control schemes. It is odd, though, that they'd build the game around these controls when it seems like the same exact gameplay would work better with nunchuk controls. I'd argue that it's considerably less accessible to play with NES style Wiimote if it means you have to use the A and B buttons and switch how you're holding the remote regularly.

[Caterkiller]

Wait the Chazo aren't completely extinct are they? I thought for certain they just up and left to a far off galaxy never to be seen again.

Interesting GP, didn't think about Samus' connection with what could be her only connection to "her people". Well a living breathing organic connection that is.

[Rize]

I'm still confused about the basic

SM64.  But with a relatively fixed perspective.

That really doesn't say much.  I'm still highly confused as to the perspective of this game.  I understand that when you point the Wii-mote at the screen you get a first person aiming-only view, but what is the control style when not in this view?  What does the camera do?  What is the level layout like (is it so 3D that your map is an overhead map, or is the map still traditional 2D because the 3D usage is limited)?

EDIT: I didn't realize a bunch of new screens were released.

So basically it's like an actual 3D game but the camera probably follows a rigid set of tracks the whole time.  The level design appears to be mostly flat, but they could probably add some layers using elevators and separate map screens.  Should be good.


The only thing I'm afraid of now is the voice acting.

[Nemo]

The problem is mass appeal means action-focused gameplay, linear progression and clearly defined objectives. 

You just described Metroid Fusion. Every Metroid has at least some focus on action. But Metroid Fusion had linear progression and clearly defined objects. And I really liked it, therefor I don't consider this a problem. I guess it's a problem for those of you that hated Metroid Fusion.

I don't view this as evolution or de-evolution. Just as a side-step game. Kind of like Zelda II, SMB 2, Majora's Mask. They all tried out some different gameplay (which with these examples, I really liked) and then they go back to the normal. Personally, I like the variety.

[MegaByte]

It's 3D overhead, and you don't have control over the camera.  The camera may automatically zoom into a more of a 2D side view, especially when engaging enemies.  The map is 2D overhead, meaning the locations of items on different levels is ambiguous.

[Rize]

The problem is mass appeal means action-focused gameplay, linear progression and clearly defined objectives. 

You just described Metroid Fusion. Every Metroid has at least some focus on action. But Metroid Fusion had linear progression and clearly defined objects. And I really liked it, therefor I don't consider this a problem. I guess it's a problem for those of you that hated Metroid Fusion.

I don't view this as evolution or de-evolution. Just as a side-step game. Kind of like Zelda II, SMB 2, Majora's Mask. They all tried out some different gameplay (which with these examples, I really liked) and then they go back to the normal. Personally, I like the variety.

I agree.  If you just keep doing the same thing over and over, you'd get what Castlevania has become...   stale  (though I still buy and enjoy the games).

[Ian Sane]

You just described Metroid Fusion. Every Metroid has at least some focus on action. But Metroid Fusion had linear progression and clearly defined objects. And I really liked it, therefor I don't consider this a problem. I guess it's a problem for those of you that hated Metroid Fusion.

I liked Metroid Fusion and I often defend it.  Though I understand why others don't.  Metroid Fusion was right on the line.  To me it was as close as one could get to stepping over the "this isn't Metroid" line without stepping over.  Refilling health by tilting the remote?  That's dumbed down casual bullshit.  Do you even try to find energy tanks now and if so what's the point?  That right there removes a core element of Metroid.  And even though Metroid Fusion had "can't go in there" doors the abilities you gained were earned not arbitrarily turned on.
 
Building up Samus from a weakling to an unstoppable machine is a HUGE element of Metroid.  And the player has to feel like they earned it and did it themselves.  The impressions we have suggest that a big part of this has been removed.  Well, ****, if this bullshit where the captain tells you when you can use abilities is the standard method of achievement in this game (and not just a first area-only thing) then they just strepped over the line.  They fucked with part of Metroid that you are forbidden to **** with.  It would be like if in Zelda instead of finding an item in a dungeon you were given it to you by the Gods or whatever when the need to have it came up.

[greybrick]

I cannot fathom why you would opt for that kind of control when an analogue stick is readily available if the nunchuck were to be used. This would also provide an extra "accessible" button, and make it so that the controller would not have to be flipped to shoot first person. I am not saying that the NES style won't work, I just don't see why they need to make it work.

Have you not yet realized that with the Wii Nintendo's priority regarding controls isn't about using what's best but rather what's more marketable?  Nintendo likes the sideways remote thing because of the NES controller comparison.  There was no reason for Super Paper Mario, Warioland or NSMB to use that control scheme either.  Just like how the remote was made to the look like a TV remote for marketing purposes, Metroid will use that control scheme because Nintendo wants to make the connection with the classic NES Metroid.
 

 "Have you not yet realized?"...  how do you come off talking to people like they are idiots? "Have you not yet realized" that all of those games you mentioned are primarily/exclusively played from a 2d perspective? Since that is the case  I would argue that it makes the most sense to use a Dpad anyways.

That is not the case for games taking place in a 3d realm like Zelda or Super Mario Galaxy one and two, which last time I checked aren't controlled with a dpad.

[Ian Sane]

"Have you not yet realized?"...  how do you come off talking to people like they are idiots?

Actually that does sound pretty harsh.  Sorry about that.  I meant it more as a sarcastic jab at Nintendo's controller design policies but that sort of tone doesn't convey through writing very well.  I honestly didn't mean to offend.

[greybrick]

"Have you not yet realized?"...  how do you come off talking to people like they are idiots?

Actually that does sound pretty harsh.  Sorry about that.  I meant it more as a sarcastic jab at Nintendo's controller design policies but that sort of tone doesn't convey through writing very well.  I honestly didn't mean to offend.

Wow an apology! Ok, we're cool 

[D_Average]

Man that control scheme sounds horrendous, not sold on this one yet.

[Sundoulos]

So, I wonder why Nintendo hasn't published a new trailer of the game or gameplay videos yet?   Waiting to lift a magazine embargo?  To raise curiosity?

You just described Metroid Fusion. Every Metroid has at least some focus on action. But Metroid Fusion had linear progression and clearly defined objects. And I really liked it, therefor I don't consider this a problem. I guess it's a problem for those of you that hated Metroid Fusion.

I liked Metroid Fusion and I often defend it.  Though I understand why others don't.  Metroid Fusion was right on the line.  To me it was as close as one could get to stepping over the "this isn't Metroid" line without stepping over.  Refilling health by tilting the remote?  That's dumbed down casual bull****.  Do you even try to find energy tanks now and if so what's the point?  That right there removes a core element of Metroid.  And even though Metroid Fusion had "can't go in there" doors the abilities you gained were earned not arbitrarily turned on.
 
Building up Samus from a weakling to an unstoppable machine is a HUGE element of Metroid.  And the player has to feel like they earned it and did it themselves.  The impressions we have suggest that a big part of this has been removed.  Well, ****, if this bull**** where the captain tells you when you can use abilities is the standard method of achievement in this game (and not just a first area-only thing) then they just strepped over the line.  They ****ed with part of Metroid that you are forbidden to **** with.  It would be like if in Zelda instead of finding an item in a dungeon you were given it to you by the Gods or whatever when the need to have it came up.

The whole "captain's orders" thing doesn't really bother me.   For one thing, according to 1up, the demo only lasted 45 minutes; there could still be a scenario in the game where Samus gains new equipment or powers.   Samus had all of her weapons in the first part of Metroid Prime as well.  Who knows how the game will play out at this point?

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

http://verydemotivational.com/2010/02/20/demotivational-posterssuper-smash-brothers-brawl/

[Rize]

About the controls: 3D games have been controlled with a d-pad many times in the past.  While it's not optimal, the auto-aim should help greatly along with the tightly controlled camera.

Also, I can't help but think of Scurge: Hive.  At the time many compared it to Metroid because of thematic similarities (killer alien creatures in space are taken on by a lone bad-ass woman), but the level design had nothing in common with Metroid game's as it was all in Isometric 3D.  Yet you could jump, and there were areas where you might climb up to something and could potentially fall several screens downward.  It was a real 3D space using 2D graphics in fixed perspective.  All in all, the game controlled well enough.  The biggest problem was shooting being limited along the 8 directions, but the auto-aim in Other M should fix that.

[greybrick]

About the controls: 3D games have been controlled with a d-pad many times in the past.  While it's not optimal, the auto-aim should help greatly along with the tightly controlled camera.

People don't get out of their functional cars and push them with the thought that the occasional hill will help greatly. My point, when an obviously better option is available... why do it? What 3d games do you play on a d-pad that are on a system with an analogue stick?

[D_Average]

About the controls: 3D games have been controlled with a d-pad many times in the past.  While it's not optimal, the auto-aim should help greatly along with the tightly controlled camera.

People don't get out of their functional cars and push them with the thought that the occasional hill will help greatly. My point, when an obviously better option is available... why do it? What 3d games do you play on a d-pad that are on a system with an analogue stick?

Precisely.  Its a very odd choice, feels forced.

[KDR_11k]

I believe the goal of Other M is not to dumb it down for the masses but to foist Sakamoto's view of Samus onto everybody. If we're going to foist a view at least it could've been Retro's since they're the creators of the most popular Metroid version and Metroid is generally more popular with the West. Westerners prefer western writing, especially over an eastern hack job. Samus is a character that should appear like a real person, not that semi-manga style Team Ninja uses.

To be fair the refills don't sound like something you can afford to do in mid-battle (unless you go Halo  by hiding somewhere...) but it still removes the inventory rationing you might otherwise need on longer trips (well, if they buff missiles enough that you'll actually use them over the charge beam).

A character that needed a speaking role much more than Samus is Ridley. I mean, Samus is a human, we all know what humans are capable of but Ridley is a fucking space dragon. It's clear that he has to be sapient since he's the commander of the space pirates but the way we see him he appears more like an animal. Hell, outside of Metroid Prime it's not even clear that the space pirates are sapient creatures.

[Luigi Dude]

A character that needed a speaking role much more than Samus is Ridley. I mean, Samus is a human, we all know what humans are capable of but Ridley is a ****ing space dragon. It's clear that he has to be sapient since he's the commander of the space pirates but the way we see him he appears more like an animal. Hell, outside of Metroid Prime it's not even clear that the space pirates are sapient creatures.

Actually they are.  In the Metroid manga, which was made with Sakamoto's involvement and considered canon with the series, Ridley and the space pirates do talk and are sapient creatures.