Topic: Microsoft's Xbox Kinect - Nov 4th 2010

[BlackNMild2k1]

MS is attempting to Disconnect all who try to Diss Kinect
No Reviews before launch and no criticism of advertising either...
http://gamer.blorge.com/2010/10/18/xbox-360-microsofts-kinect-review-embargo-is-a-red-flag/

Kinect is Microsoft’s biggest push for the Xbox gaming division to date. The Xbox division could sink or swim depending on the success of the device. However, in an unusual move the company has been hesitant to send out the device for review.

Many journalists in the gaming industry have complained about Microsoft’s hesitation to send the Kinect and any of its software offerings for review.  This is actually something that has been actively talked about on game press forums.

In addition the publisher has also placed an embargo on posting any sort of review for the device prior to launch. Microsoft’s internal anti piracy investigation group has also issued a take-down notice to Destructoid, who incidentally made fun of the Kinect’s new commercials.

The fact that Microsoft is being so sensitive about any sort of criticism towards the device is a major concern. Just like how film studios won’t hold a pre-screening for movies that is expected to tank, the video game industry operates exactly the same way.

But you think, "Why would MS do this? they would never do this...."
Well, just replace Vista with Kinect when you watch this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWLfEVGwjrA
and you get the idea of whats being implied here.


edit: And if you follow the link to the Destructoid take down notice story, you can see the take down notice from MS where they refer to Kinect as Kinetic, the Sony Eye-Toy game.
http://gamer.blorge.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/image14.png

[Chozo Ghost]

With all that huge amount of money behind it this thing is either going to be a spectacular success or a spectacular failure. The half billion in advertising really raises the stakes. It does greatly increase its chance of success, but at the same time it adds even more losses to the xbox division that may or may not ever be recovered. Apparently being profitable isn't something that's on their agenda just yet. I guess we'll just have to wait and see where this goes.... but with a half billion dollars of advertising behind it its going to be something we're going to be hearing about on all forms of media CONSTANTLY. Its not going to be like other failed products like the Virtual Boy where it was launched with a whimper and largely went unnoticed. Kinect is going to be something everyone is aware of, Microsoft is going to make damn sure of that.

[Spak-Spang]

And Microsoft will buy opinions and exposure.  Microsoft is going to buy off people that are cool, but don't really know games to sell their machine...where it will grow in popularity with the non-gamers which Microsoft wants to sell...while the true gamers will not touch the device with a 10 foot pole.

[KDR_11k]

It'll live and die by the software, not the hardware and the software is just a bunch of uninspired Wii ripoffs.

Non-gamers aren't stupid, they know a cheap knockoff when they see one.

[Stogi]

Is that why Deca Sports has been doing so well?

[Luigi Dude]

It'll live and die by the software, not the hardware and the software is just a bunch of uninspired Wii ripoffs.

Non-gamers aren't stupid, they know a cheap knockoff when they see one.

Yep, this is what Microsoft doesn't seem to get.  The Wii entire success was because of Nintendo and their own software.  Just because low priced third party shovelware like Carnival Games and Just Dance manage to sell 3-4 million copies doesn't mean sh!t when Nintendo's own full price games like Wii Sports Resort and Wii Fit sell over 16-20+ million copies.  Not to mention a lot of the people who bought Carnival Games and Just Dance bought the Wii because of games like Wii Sports, Mario Kart Wii and Wii Fit.  It's was Nintendo's own software that made them buy the system while the third party imitations were bought after they owned the system.

Microsoft has nothing that's going to come close to rivaling Wii Sports Resort and Wii Fit in quality, which is going to hurt Kinects word of mouth for the long term.  The real reason the Wii became the huge hit it did is because Nintendo provided quality software that the audience loved and as a result the system had great word of mouth.  Microsofts 500 million marketing campaign might give Kinect a good launch this fall, but if the quality software isn't there, then it's going to have terrible legs in the long run.

Is that why Deca Sports has been doing so well?

Deca Sports has sold over 2 million copies worldwide vs Wii Sports which sold somewhere over 60 million copies.  Of course Wii Sports was a pack in with Wii's in America and Europe, but it's sequel, Wii Sports Resort sold over 16 million copies as a full price stand alone game before it eventually became bundled with the system.  This pretty much confirms what KDR_11k said by how non-gamers aren't stupid since they knew that the Wii Sports series from Nintendo is a quality series and as a result it's sequel sold lightyears better then any of it's ripoffs.

[Stogi]

Well how do you know 16 million Nintendo fans didn't buy it?

[BlackNMild2k1]

This is sooo good. Who doesn't want this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq--Ve70t0o

^Kinect launch on HSN with live demonstrations

"I'm gonna jump back in and 2 people will appear in the raft!!..."
only one person is in the raft...
they both jump and the race is over
there is still only one person in the raft
L.O.L.

[King of Twitch]

With Kinect, Microsoft Aims for a Game Changer

A slim, 32-year-old psychologist, he spends his days behind a one-way mirror at Microsoft's video games research center here, watching people play the company's Xbox systems. He looks for smiles,...When a game is good, it elicits all the above and gets a "fun score" high enough for Microsoft to consider selling it.

How can these people see what they're typing when their lips are glued to Microsoft's butt?

[Stratos]

This is sooo good. Who doesn't want this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq--Ve70t0o

^Kinect launch on HSN with live demonstrations

"I'm gonna jump back in and 2 people will appear in the raft!!..."
only one person is in the raft...
they both jump and the race is over
there is still only one person in the raft
L.O.L.

She mentions the wonders of XBox Live but fails to mention the fact that it costs money every month.

[BlackNMild2k1]

This is sooo good. Who doesn't want this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qq--Ve70t0o

^Kinect launch on HSN with live demonstrations

"I'm gonna jump back in and 2 people will appear in the raft!!..."
only one person is in the raft...
they both jump and the race is over
there is still only one person in the raft
L.O.L.

She mentions the wonders of XBox Live but fails to mention the fact that it costs money every month.

she also mentions that" it comes with a controller.... but you won't need it."
and GameFly will let you download games!!

[Caliban]

And they also say that they are giving 30 days worth of the Gold membership... which already comes out of the box anyway. At least they're adding in the HDMI cable which Microsoft no longer gives.

[TJ Spyke]

And they also say that they are giving 30 days worth of the Gold membership... which already comes out of the box anyway. At least they're adding in the HDMI cable which Microsoft no longer gives.

They do the same thing for Wii, mentioning Wii Sports as one of the games they are including in the bundle even though every Wii comes with it anyways.

[Mop it up]

Do they count Wii Sports as five games like eBay does?

[BlackNMild2k1]

http://www.businessinsider.com/kinect-pre-orders-sold-out-at-amazon-best-buy-2010-10#ixzz13cKiWgbj

Amazon U.S. and Best Buy's online site are no longer taking pre-orders for Kinect, the motion-controlled game sensor for the Xbox 360 that launches November 4th.

A quick check of Amazon's U.S. product page for Kinect bundled with one game reveals that preorders are now available only through affiliates. You can still pre-order bundles with a new Xbox 360, however. The Kinect page on Best Buy simply says "Coming Soon." GameStop and Wal-Mart are still taking orders.

The pre-order sellouts follow similar reports from the U.K. earlier this month, and suggest that Microsoft has a hit on its hands. Or at least that there are a lot of Xbox 360 users out there who want to extend the lifecycle of the console for another couple of years with the new gadget.

sorta pointless without launch/pre-order numbers once again, but atleast we know that whatever is being supplied being sold.

[Chozo Ghost]

At least its selling. But, that doesn't mean there aren't going to be thousands (millions?) of very pissed off Kinect purchasers once they take it home and start to "enjoy" the Kinect(TM) experience.

[Stratos]

I was talking with a former co-worker today and they were asking me about Kinect. I tried not to let my fanboyism taint the conversation but I did warn her that the camera has very specific requirements like a clean open room and such. I also mentioned the worry about Microsoft pouring billions into advertising while barring people from reviewing the device. I also told her he to Google Red Ring of Death. I assured her Microsoft had fixed the RRoD but advised her to perhaps wait and see before investing to see if there are any similarly major defects in the Kinect before buying. I also encouraged her to try it before she bought it since demos I saw on TV didn't seem to work right. She said the biggest appeal was the lack of a controller (big surprise there).

[BlackNMild2k1]

money may not buy love but it sure buys confidence

Microsoft: We are going to sell 5 million Kinects this year
http://thenextweb.com/microsoft/2010/11/03/microsoft-we-are-going-to-sell-5-million-kinects-this-year/

Microsoft has raised its sales predictions for the Kinect in 2010 to 5 million units from a previous guess of 3 million.
[...]
This update on forecasts comes just minutes after the company announced a sweeping partnership with the Boys and Girls Clubs of America, which will put the Kinect in 4,000 buildings frequented by the target demographic of the Kinect.

According to Microsoft’s Don Mattrick, if the company meets its 5 million unit forecast, that would make Kinect the ‘biggest Xbox product launch ever in terms of sales.’

As we have noted before, the Kinect goes on sale tomorrow in the US.

from 3 mill up to 5 mill the day before release....
Looks like somebody is hoping to do some MAJOR bragging around the time NPD comes out next month.

[Kytim89]

I am curious to see how Nintendo will react to whatever success that Move and Kinect have in the nest six months. I am hoping that both systems are successful not becaues I want to see Nintendo get beat, but I do hope that it forces Nintendo's hand in regards to the Wii successor. I will be watching Kinect to see how the controller free gameplay works out.

[TJ Spyke]

I think Kinect is too overpriced to be anything more than niche, no way do I see them selling 5 million (unless they are counting the Kinect bundles plus all these Kinects they are giving away in contests like the Burger King one and this Boys & Girls Club giveaway). PlayStation Move might be a little better since it is far cheaper, but I see it being like EyeToy was and only being successful in Europe and mediocre in other regions. I don't see Nintendo being worried at all about these clones.

[KDR_11k]

Besides, Move promises to improve first person shooters which are a very common genre on these consoles. Kinect cannot boast anything of that sort.

Also, again, the official Kinect libraries will only support avatars, any game wanting to use differently looking characters must reimplement those algorithms so the quality of the detection will vary. Ubisoft already fucked it up.

[Peachylala]

That review made me laugh.

[BlackNMild2k1]

MS: You are the controller.... but sometimes the controller needs a controller too

"Hybrid" Kinect/Controller Games in Development[
http://www.1up.com/news/hybrid-kinect-controller-games-development

"We love controller-free games, we love Kinect experiences and we'll continue to grow our set of those as well. What we haven't really talked about, but exist, are hybrid games," Kipmen explained to GamesIndustry.biz. "Games that are using the controller, which we know and love, and pieces, if not all, of the Kinect experiences to again make those experiences more immersive, more fun and more emotionally connected."
[...]
"This is where I look at the world, and I know it's easier to look at the world and talk about 'or,' but I look at the world and I talk about 'and,'" Kipmen continued. "It's about how we take all of these things and fuse all of them together to create unique experiences...It doesn't always mean using the same colors, the same paintbrushes -- the stories you tell are about using the appropriate combinations of all of the colors and brushes to create something meaningful."

Headtracking, voice recognition and...... close quarters combat?

[oohhboy]

Looks like Kinetic is good for something after all. So many classic references.

Then it's time to view that six man-strong character roster. All the fighters look like extras from a scene in a Police Academy film where one of the dislikable characters ends up in a gay bar. Think leather waistcoats, bare chests and big beards, and characters with names like Ratface and Rider. Good grief.

It gets a 2/10, so I went and looked up their scoring info.

10/10 - Phenomenal
 9/10 - Excellent
 8/10 - Very good
 7/10 - Good
 6/10 - Above average
 5/10 - Average
 4/10 - Below average
 3/10 - Bad
 2/10 - Atrocious
 1/10 - Bloody atrocious

I really want to know how it didn't get a 1/10. I then checked to see what their review history, only to be disappointed not to find anything scored lower than a 2/10. I can only conclude that a 1/10 must be very special seeing even NWR has a single one. Loneliest indeed.

I look forward to the tsunami of mocking reviews of Kinect to smash in.

[Chozo Ghost]

If Kinect is really that awful (and all signs seem to be pointing that it is), then I don't see how MS's sales projection of 5 million units this year is going to be met. I can see the initial preorders selling out, but if its as terrible as the reviews say then its going to only take a day or two before the **** hits the fan and everyone all over the world is going to know how much this thing really stinks.

You can invest all the money in the world in advertising something, but that will only get you so far. Word of mouth is something MS won't be able to control, no matter how much money they have.