Topic: Microsoft's Xbox Kinect - Nov 4th 2010

[DAaaMan64]

What?! Optimization is always possible. And its possible that Kinect can be patched, how would we know. Anything can be optimized anywhere. Maybe they can already do 3/4 of a 3rd person, but just left it out. That isn't that much optimization.

[BlackNMild2k1]

No, 4 players would take too much CPU, that can't easily be patched (maybe it would have worked had MS not removed the processing chip in the camera for cost reasons). Maybe games could sacrifice visuals for more players but... Not happening on the 360.

All the demos at the conferences were faked (probably to avoid a situation like Miyamoto had with Zelda) but there were apparently playable demos at the booth.

Reports from the Primesense say that they put that chip back in. Natal was too limited without it.

[kraken613]

I will never buy this until I can buy it for $50 or less.

[BeautifulShy]

Why does the 4 player Kinect have to be patched in? Why can't they make it work when it is launched? Why does game companys have to patch things in later?

[Mop it up]

I will never buy this until I can buy it for $50 or less.

I'll give it three months, then you can find it for $50 because every store will be attempting to get rid of their unsold stock.

[DAaaMan64]

Why does the 4 player Kinect have to be patched in? Why can't they make it work when it is launched? Why does game companys have to patch things in later?

Because they have to get things out at certain speeds in order for them to seem legitimately marketable.  Some times discoveries such as optimizations aren't made until stress levels have lowered.

[Ian Sane]

With the standing up thing I'm wondering if this will perhaps be the biggest bomb in videogame history.  This has NOTHING going for it.  It already had enough reasons for it to fail before they revealed the standing limitation and the two-player only limitation.  Now they just need an insanely high price.

Give me a pro for Kinect.  Seriously what positive element does it have?  It looks to control like **** to begin with, and none of the games look any good, and you have to stand up to play, and it's only two players.  What is there that actually impresses?

[DAaaMan64]

Its not a bomb already, Kinect is No. 2 on Amazon's best sellers in the video game category. And thats just to pre-order it.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/videogames/ref=pd_ts_h?pf_rd_p=264215801&pf_rd_s=center-6&pf_rd_t=2101&pf_rd_i=home&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=15QRZBYERZ4KYMJSDEW2

Long term though, it might bomb.

[BlackNMild2k1]

With the standing up thing I'm wondering if this will perhaps be the biggest bomb in videogame history.  This has NOTHING going for it.  It already had enough reasons for it to fail before they revealed the standing limitation and the two-player only limitation.  Now they just need an insanely high price.

Give me a pro for Kinect.  Seriously what positive element does it have?  It looks to control like **** to begin with, and none of the games look any good, and you have to stand up to play, and it's only two players.  What is there that actually impresses?

[BlackNMild2k1]

With the standing up thing I'm wondering if this will perhaps be the biggest bomb in videogame history.  This has NOTHING going for it.  It already had enough reasons for it to fail before they revealed the standing limitation and the two-player only limitation.  Now they just need an insanely high price.

Give me a pro for Kinect.  Seriously what positive element does it have?  It looks to control like **** to begin with, and none of the games look any good, and you have to stand up to play, and it's only two players.  What is there that actually impresses?

You ask and you shall receive....

Kinect cost MS $150 each to manufacture

Publisher claims Microsoft ended up spending far more than expected on the device

Microsoft is paying around $150 in total manufacturing costs for each Kinect unit, Develop understands.

A highly-positioned, trusted source had given Develop the “$150 manufacturing cost” figure on the condition of anonymity, adding that the expenses of Kinect is a topic of concern for his company.

The news comes in the wake of rumours suggesting an internal struggle at Microsoft on the retail price of Kinect, a kit once touted to sell at ÂŁ50, but now thought will cost over twice the price.

Microsoft says the company “does not comment on rumour or speculation”.

Last year a publishing source told MCV that Microsoft is “trying to get as close as possible to impulse buy” with Kinect – a plan which is looking less likely as evidence points towards a $150 retail price for the device.


Screen Digest games analyst Ed Barton said he was “not surprised” by the $150 manufacturing figure that Develop put to him.

“In pure console peripheral terms, $150 costs are expensive but the question is how much Microsoft is wiling to cut to raise market share,” he said.

“The further above manufacturing costs it is, the tougher it becomes. Especially since Microsoft is targeting Kinect to a more casual market.

“Presumably, a big portion of Microsoft’s target market for Kinect won’t have a console already, so adding in the console costs along with the camera costs, the result is starting to look a bit pricey.”

Microsoft had previously acquired Primesense, a 3D imaging company based out of Israel. The firm brought with it a number of patents and technologies for Kinect.

Barton believes that the Primesense acquisition may come into the cost equation.

“There’s basic hardware tear-down costs,” he says, “but Kinect isn’t just a number of components, it’s also a software layer – one that is absolutely key for the whole experience.

“Kinect’s R&D costs might be sunk into the manufacturing costs, because Microsoft needed to ensure that Kinect’s basic imaging actually has a software layer that can be fed into the developer toolchain.

“These are things that require investment, and serious expertise, and would argue would have pushed the manufacturing costs of Kinect up even more”.

But Barton is confident that, with Kinect, Microsoft has a technology that can be implemented in different sectors outside of traditional gaming.

“I wouldn’t at all be surprised to see Microsoft apply the technologies elsewhere, for things like video conferencing,” he said.

“It may have been possible, in its planning, that Microsoft has decided the investment it has made into Kinect can spread across all sorts of areas beyond gaming.

“The commercial guys at Microsoft will obviously want to sell the unit at its lowest price, but the accountants will be arguing that Microsoft has to start paying for all the R&D and goods that got it to this position.

“The one thing that Microsoft has proven over the last few years, especially with its aggressive price cuts, is that the company is prepared to add pressure on itself to win market share.”

[Guitar Smasher]

It's hard to imagine a more poorly conceived add-on.  Every new detail decreases its potential appeal.  No wonder investors are calling for MS to cut the Xbox brand.

The troubling thing, for Xbox, is that if Microsoft continues to push this after it's failed in the marketplace, they could undo any marketshare/customer interest they've gained with 360 (outside of RRoD).

[BlackNMild2k1]

It's OFFICIAL

Kinect is priced at $150 in MS's own Online store
http://store.microsoft.com/microsoft/Kinect-Sensor-for-Xbox-360/product/C737B081

What comes in the box
Kinect sensor for Xbox 360
Power supply cable
User's manual
Wi-Fi extension cable

Before you buy
Here's what you'll need to use the Kinect sensor:
Xbox 360 console
6 feet (1.8 meters) between you and your television for play space†
You!

Technical specifications
Color VGA Motion Camera 640 x 480 pixel resolution at 30FPS
Depth Camera 640 x 480 pixel resolution at 30FPS
Array of 4 microphones supporting single speaker voice recognition

[Stratos]

So an Arcade system ($99) plus Kinect ($150) makes it $249. Same as Wii but without the pack-in game. Doesn't matter that you get free games with the 360, anyone taking the plunge for Kinect will want Kinect specific software. No pack-in game could hurt their target market's interest when there are cheaper motion options.

[NWR_insanolord]

So an Arcade system ($99) plus Kinect ($150) makes it $249. Same as Wii but without the pack-in game. Doesn't matter that you get free games with the 360, anyone taking the plunge for Kinect will want Kinect specific software. No pack-in game could hurt their target market's interest when there are cheaper motion options.

Unless Microsoft dropped the price again in the last few days, the Arcade model is $150, not $100, and that's only as long as supply lasts. They've said that there will be a lower-end model of the new Slim 360, but its specifics and price haven't been announced yet. [/TJ Spyke]

[Shaymin]

A "Arcade" slim is apparently coming this fall and it would be $200.

So Kinect + Arcade = $350.

[Spak-Spang]

Plus Nintendo is not $249 for the Wii.

But $199.99 for the Wii plus Wii Sports, and Wii Sports Resort and Wii Motion Plus. 

So obviously, the choice is Nintendo for $200.00 you are set up with 2 games.  Now, take that extra money $150.00 and buy Wii Play, and any game that packs in the Wii motion Plus, and you have 2 complete controllers and 2 more games for still less than the price for the Kinect experience.

I don't even want to talk about the bargins you can get in comparison to the Sony Move experience.

[SixthAngel]

The system price is a bit much but how much will the games cost?

Are Kinect games going to be the typical 60$ price?
That destroys any kind of spur of the moment purchase and I have the feeling the publishers won't want to give up their high price tag.

[that Baby guy]

Kinect games, I believe, are all supposed to be a lower cost at retail.  I think $40 is actually their target price-point right now.

[TJ Spyke]

None of the launch games worth more than $40; ports of Wii games, clones of Wii games, and casual games. I hate the term, but there are no "hardcore" games announced for Kinect.

[BeastMode]

hey guys! tell me what your opinion is on the kinect that microsoft is developing!

[BlackNMild2k1]

Possible Kinect Display box and boxart

[King of Twitch]

It's minty fresh!

[GoldenPhoenix]

Possible Kinect Display box and boxart

Where is the big warning sign over the people sitting down?

[GoldenPhoenix]

Much better.

[Peachylala]

Kinect.

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