Topic: Wind Waker

[Ceric]

Let me set the record straight.  I really tried to like Wind Waker.  I really did.  First long trip with my wife was to pick up Wind Waker.  Its a cute story but thats beside the point.

I think the game was great in many many ways BUT the game did not take advantage of the excellent combat system and that stupid stupid stupid ocean.  Way to much of it.  If you wanted to pop out and kill some baddies it was just not possible.  In fact some of my complaints with WW went over to TP.  If they remake the game or make a sequel I'll probably buy it hoping that the game live up to its potential.

If I get some free time I'll try to run through all of it again but, no promises.

[ShyGuy]

Let me get this straight:
- Long trip to pick up Wind Waker
- Doesn't like long trips in Wind Waker
- Irony
- ?
- Profit.

I didn't mind the sailing myself. Plus I really liked Windfall Island. The "Feng Shui" of the island layout was perfect.

[Bill Aurion]

I want a sequel with even MORE sailing...I love sailing so much...

[EasyCure]

Screw the sailing, they already did that. It's time for nintendo to innovate!

In TP link was a rancher right? Why not explore that in more depth. Hell why not even make him farm!!!

The Legend Of Zelda: The Moon of Harvest... <3

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

It's a good thing Nintendo's never making traditional Zelda games again.  That way, we'll never get another Wind Waker nor Twilight Princess.

Link's Fitness Training
Link's Lon Lon Rodeo
and Bombchu Bowling for WiiWare will round out the rest of the generation

Srsly, skip Okami and get Mario Kart.

[vudu]

From a purely visual standpoint, Wind Waker is the most beautiful game I've ever seen.  I absolutely adore the style, and I hope they make another game (Zelda or otherwise) with the same graphics.

The only part in Wind Waker where I felt cheated is when Jabun just outright handed me the third pearl.  My heart sank a little bit at that point in the game.  Other than that, the game is absolutely perfect.

[Smoke39]

They should replace sailing with a hot air balloon, out of which you would sky dive to reach your various destinations.

Naturally, Tingle would be floating around up in the sky as well, serving as both a beacon indicating places of interst as well as providing maps thereof.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Or just skip Zelda entirely and develop Tingle as a franchise.

[Smoke39]

A hot air balloon map-making franchise.  With skydiving as a means of reaching potential purchasers of your maps on the ground.

Awesome.

[stevey]

No Malon, horses, or cowgirls of any kind ------> Instant Fail!

Tingle -------> Fail^É·

No other redeeming qualities -----> the worst game ever made!

[Smoke39]

I don't know where you get this no Malon business.  Naturally she would be Tingle's love interest!

[ShyGuy]

Seriously, the best level design since DE_Dust for Counter Strike.

[Adrock]

Wind Waker had the best final boss fight in the series.... okay, Ocarina of Time did. WW did, however, have the coolest "death" scene of any Zelda game and that should count for something.

Also, I rank WW's story as one of the best in the series (despite the plotholes) and evidence that Nintendo's storytelling has progressed past simply "save the princess" and "travel to 2 worlds for some reason." Then, Nintendo raped and murdered that progress in Twilight Princess with its weak plot that even an awesome character like Imp Midna couldn't make interesting.

[EasyCure]

From the other thread:

...
how about just adding more to the sailing to make it fun instead of removing it?
...

Sword combat because I really did like that mechanic and how it was done in the game and was done far to little.

or how about both? what if there was a cool sword fighting mechanic while on the boat, for example:

you're sailing when you get boarded by pirates or something.. i dont really feel like thinking, blah.
my point is you might not of enjoyed it but some people did, so stop being selfish and compromise!!! do you think this is some sort of forum where you can have an opinion or somethign???

[Ian Sane]

I like the idea of having to sail somewhere in Zelda.  I thought that would make things feel really epic.  Since Zelda went 3D the worlds always seemed a little small.  To me going back to the Kokiri in Ocarina of Time should be a big deal but walking across the whole world is like walking across Disneyland.  Hell in OoT you've even REQUIRED to go back home to learn that song for Darunia.  They made out like leaving home was a big deal but you could go back and forth with no effort at all.

Wind Waker's world does feel big and sailing does help that.  The only problem is there's not enough land!  It's big but it's BORING.  If they had a couple significant continents and many small islands everywhere then you would have something.  Imagine starting in what appears to be a landlocked Hyrule and then at some point in the game you reach the port and realize there's so much more to see.  That would feel epic.

Sadly I think Nintendo interpreted reactions to Wind Waker as fans rejecting new ideas so they played Twilight Princess too safe and the result was that I found that overworld boring as well because I already explored it in Ocarina of Time!  And if that's the last of "traditional Zelda" we see that's a damn shame because there's more to work with.  Wind Waker's problems are not in concept but in execution.  In fact that's often something that game companies get confused by.  A new idea doesn't have to get rejected because it's new.  It MIGHT be because it just plain sucks.  It's like how while I'm fine with new ideas in Mario games but I didn't like the waterpack because it SUCKED.

Hell that's just a lesson in life.  It's like when people say "be careful what you wish for" when something you requested turns out like crap.  Well obviously whenever someone wishes for something they want it to be done right.  One shouldn't have to add "... provided you don't f*ck it up" every time one requests something.  I don't tell the waiter "make sure the cook makes my food taste good" when I order dinner in a restaurant.

[UltimatePartyBear]

You know what bugged me about Wind Waker?  At the end, Ganon says that the oceans offer no fish to catch, but there are fish skeletons in Orca's house.  This is a clear contradiction.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Orca has yet to eat Jabun.

[Ceric]

They should replace sailing with a hot air balloon, out of which you would sky dive to reach your various destinations.

Naturally, Tingle would be floating around up in the sky as well, serving as both a beacon indicating places of interst as well as providing maps thereof.

Lets Develop that idea.

From the other thread:

...
how about just adding more to the sailing to make it fun instead of removing it?
...

Sword combat because I really did like that mechanic and how it was done in the game and was done far to little.

or how about both? what if there was a cool sword fighting mechanic while on the boat, for example:

you're sailing when you get boarded by pirates or something.. i dont really feel like thinking, blah.
my point is you might not of enjoyed it but some people did, so stop being selfish and compromise!!! do you think this is some sort of forum where you can have an opinion or somethign???

I be all for on the boat fighting if I wasn't on a little row boat...

I like the idea of having to sail somewhere in Zelda.  I thought that would make things feel really epic.  Since Zelda went 3D the worlds always seemed a little small.  To me going back to the Kokiri in Ocarina of Time should be a big deal but walking across the whole world is like walking across Disneyland.  Hell in OoT you've even REQUIRED to go back home to learn that song for Darunia.  They made out like leaving home was a big deal but you could go back and forth with no effort at all.

Wind Waker's world does feel big and sailing does help that.  The only problem is there's not enough land!  It's big but it's BORING.  If they had a couple significant continents and many small islands everywhere then you would have something.  Imagine starting in what appears to be a landlocked Hyrule and then at some point in the game you reach the port and realize there's so much more to see.  That would feel epic.

Sadly I think Nintendo interpreted reactions to Wind Waker as fans rejecting new ideas so they played Twilight Princess too safe and the result was that I found that overworld boring as well because I already explored it in Ocarina of Time!  And if that's the last of "traditional Zelda" we see that's a damn shame because there's more to work with.  Wind Waker's problems are not in concept but in execution.  In fact that's often something that game companies get confused by.  A new idea doesn't have to get rejected because it's new.  It MIGHT be because it just plain sucks.  It's like how while I'm fine with new ideas in Mario games but I didn't like the waterpack because it SUCKED.

Hell that's just a lesson in life.  It's like when people say "be careful what you wish for" when something you requested turns out like crap.  Well obviously whenever someone wishes for something they want it to be done right.  One shouldn't have to add "... provided you don't f*ck it up" every time one requests something.  I don't tell the waiter "make sure the cook makes my food taste good" when I order dinner in a restaurant.

Agree.  In concept the sailing sounds pretty cool.  In Execution the sailing was sort of overpowering.  I mean I like salt but, if its the main ingredient its overpowering.  Moderation Nintendo everything in Moderation.

You know what bugged me about Wind Waker?  At the end, Ganon says that the oceans offer no fish to catch, but there are fish skeletons in Orca's house.  This is a clear contradiction.

You know what also bugs me.  Having fish people evolve into bird people AFTER the world is flooded so most of it is there original environment.  Its like there doing the opposite of what Evolution is suppose to.  Making it Harder for them to live then it already was.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

I believe the Zora were fresh-water creatures that require a riverine environment.  Their biology couldn't handle the stagnant salt water environments of Wind Waker's poison seas.

In that case, the springs in the Deku Tree island would be the only place they could survive.  But the Deku Tree despises trout, so he sent the Korok to wipeout their race and defend the island from intruders, much in the way the Ewoks would band together and defeat the Empire with rocks and sticks.

Then the Zora said "EFF THIS" and grew wings and flew away.

[EasyCure]

They should replace sailing with a hot air balloon, out of which you would sky dive to reach your various destinations.

Naturally, Tingle would be floating around up in the sky as well, serving as both a beacon indicating places of interst as well as providing maps thereof.

Lets Develop that idea.

From the other thread:

...
how about just adding more to the sailing to make it fun instead of removing it?
...

Sword combat because I really did like that mechanic and how it was done in the game and was done far to little.

or how about both? what if there was a cool sword fighting mechanic while on the boat, for example:

you're sailing when you get boarded by pirates or something.. i dont really feel like thinking, blah.
my point is you might not of enjoyed it but some people did, so stop being selfish and compromise!!! do you think this is some sort of forum where you can have an opinion or somethign???

I be all for on the boat fighting if I wasn't on a little row boat...

well of course. You could have a huge ship like Tetra's and then use a smaller boat the size of the King of Red Lions to reach smaller islands without ports or traverse flooded caverns. The image of Link stabbing his sword downward into the water to kill an oncoming enemy just looks cool to me..

[mantidor]

The only problem with sailing was how cumbersome it was to change the wind's direction, but making it very simple wouldn't have been the solution for me, I really can't think of an idea to fix it but it lies in the middle.

Besides that and the lack of some big chunk of land instead of scattered little islands the game was awesome from beginning to end but also had a lot of untapped potential to be discovered, more mini quests (NOT fetchquests) like Majora's Mask would have made the game perfect. I still hate link's model, I don't know why but it didn't fit well in the world, it was.. too simple, the facial expressions were great and the eye thing was a really neat idea but still from a pure aesthetic point it was bland and empty, the contrast with characters like the rito, Valoo, Ganondorf or just about anyone else was huge. Zelda, not Tetra, suffer a similar flaw but to a much lesser degree.

[Smoke39]

The only problem with sailing was how cumbersome it was to change the wind's direction, but making it very simple wouldn't have been the solution for me, I really can't think of an idea to fix it but it lies in the middle.

Use steam power instead of wind power?  I'm sure they could come up with an appropriately cutesy little steam ship for Link to cruise around in.  With cartoony little puffs of smoke poofing out of the little smoke stack every half second or so it would be adorable. o:

[Ceric]

The only problem with sailing was how cumbersome it was to change the wind's direction, but making it very simple wouldn't have been the solution for me, I really can't think of an idea to fix it but it lies in the middle.

Use steam power instead of wind power?  I'm sure they could come up with an appropriately cutesy little steam ship for Link to cruise around in.  With cartoony little puffs of smoke poofing out of the little smoke stack every half second or so it would be adorable. o:

Oh you mean like the Recent DS game?  (I still need to play that...)

The only problem with sailing was how cumbersome it was to change the wind's direction, but making it very simple wouldn't have been the solution for me, I really can't think of an idea to fix it but it lies in the middle.

Besides that and the lack of some big chunk of land instead of scattered little islands the game was awesome from beginning to end but also had a lot of untapped potential to be discovered, more mini quests (NOT fetchquests) like Majora's Mask would have made the game perfect. I still hate link's model, I don't know why but it didn't fit well in the world, it was.. too simple, the facial expressions were great and the eye thing was a really neat idea but still from a pure aesthetic point it was bland and empty, the contrast with characters like the rito, Valoo, Ganondorf or just about anyone else was huge. Zelda, not Tetra, suffer a similar flaw but to a much lesser degree.

I agree with most of what you say except;  I think that the relative blandness of "Link" is on purpose.  I also think it fits his roots.

well of course. You could have a huge ship like Tetra's and then use a smaller boat the size of the King of Red Lions to reach smaller islands without ports or traverse flooded caverns. The image of Link stabbing his sword downward into the water to kill an oncoming enemy just looks cool to me..

Be an interesting dynamic.  Especially if the ship was special itself.  As it at one point the key part of a larger dungen you must solve.

I believe the Zora were fresh-water creatures that require a riverine environment.  Their biology couldn't handle the stagnant salt water environments of Wind Waker's poison seas.

In that case, the springs in the Deku Tree island would be the only place they could survive.  But the Deku Tree despises trout, so he sent the Korok to wipeout their race and defend the island from intruders, much in the way the Ewoks would band together and defeat the Empire with rocks and sticks.

Then the Zora said "EFF THIS" and grew wings and flew away.

Ironically enough thats the best explanation I've heard.

[Ceric]

The only problem with sailing was how cumbersome it was to change the wind's direction, but making it very simple wouldn't have been the solution for me, I really can't think of an idea to fix it but it lies in the middle.

Use steam power instead of wind power?  I'm sure they could come up with an appropriately cutesy little steam ship for Link to cruise around in.  With cartoony little puffs of smoke poofing out of the little smoke stack every half second or so it would be adorable. o:

Oh you mean like the Recent DS game?  (I still need to play that...)

The only problem with sailing was how cumbersome it was to change the wind's direction, but making it very simple wouldn't have been the solution for me, I really can't think of an idea to fix it but it lies in the middle.

Besides that and the lack of some big chunk of land instead of scattered little islands the game was awesome from beginning to end but also had a lot of untapped potential to be discovered, more mini quests (NOT fetchquests) like Majora's Mask would have made the game perfect. I still hate link's model, I don't know why but it didn't fit well in the world, it was.. too simple, the facial expressions were great and the eye thing was a really neat idea but still from a pure aesthetic point it was bland and empty, the contrast with characters like the rito, Valoo, Ganondorf or just about anyone else was huge. Zelda, not Tetra, suffer a similar flaw but to a much lesser degree.

I agree with most of what you say except;  I think that the relative blandness of "Link" is on purpose.  I also think it fits his roots.

well of course. You could have a huge ship like Tetra's and then use a smaller boat the size of the King of Red Lions to reach smaller islands without ports or traverse flooded caverns. The image of Link stabbing his sword downward into the water to kill an oncoming enemy just looks cool to me..

Be an interesting dynamic.  Especially if the ship was special itself.  As it at one point the key part of a larger dungeon you must solve.

I believe the Zora were fresh-water creatures that require a riverine environment.  Their biology couldn't handle the stagnant salt water environments of Wind Waker's poison seas.

In that case, the springs in the Deku Tree island would be the only place they could survive.  But the Deku Tree despises trout, so he sent the Korok to wipeout their race and defend the island from intruders, much in the way the Ewoks would band together and defeat the Empire with rocks and sticks.

Then the Zora said "EFF THIS" and grew wings and flew away.

Ironically enough thats the best explanation I've heard.

[Smoke39]

The only problem with sailing was how cumbersome it was to change the wind's direction, but making it very simple wouldn't have been the solution for me, I really can't think of an idea to fix it but it lies in the middle.

Use steam power instead of wind power?  I'm sure they could come up with an appropriately cutesy little steam ship for Link to cruise around in.  With cartoony little puffs of smoke poofing out of the little smoke stack every half second or so it would be adorable. o:

Oh you mean like the Recent DS game?  (I still need to play that...)

I don't know; I haven't played it either.