Author Topic: One Problem with Wind Waker (Read 14682 times)

kennyb27 · « **on:** March 28, 2003, 02:01:24 PM »

I got my copy of Wind Waker on Wednesday, and I love it. It gives me the urge to move on in the game unlike many games I've played. One complaint I have though is the blurry effect that objects get when they are far away from Link. If Nintendo is trying to input a cartoonish style, then why would they feel the need to put this realistic effect in the game (note: I am not saying that games shouldn't have shadows and stuff if they are cartoonish, I just have a problem with this effect).

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #1 on:** March 28, 2003, 02:44:26 PM »

I think it looks cool.

cmoney · « **Reply #2 on:** March 28, 2003, 04:34:46 PM »

The blurry effect is for framerate purposes I'm thinking. It allows for the INSANE draw distance and still a playable game

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #3 on:** March 28, 2003, 04:43:54 PM »

While it's practical use is what cmoney explained, it also imitates real life (SFA does this also). In real life, when you focus on something in the foreground, things in the backround get blurry since they're not in focus. I can see how one would be irritated by it, though- I personally liked it.

Marcus Arillius · « **Reply #4 on:** March 28, 2003, 07:32:47 PM »

I didn't notice the blur that much. Its not bad though. I

However, my problem is that with all-this hype about cel-shading, it really wasn't all that it was cracked up to be. It looks a lot like the calibur of graphics found in Kingdom Hearts. Not too impressive for me, not to say it isn't good, just not impressive. I am enjoying the graphics much better now though. I guess you could say I'm getting used to it.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #5 on:** March 28, 2003, 08:03:26 PM »

SPOILERS

How far are you, marcus, because I swear, there were times when the graphics blew me away, namely the first time you played as Link, the amazing particles flying around at Dragon Roost, when the Tower of the Gods appeared and afterwards (it still looks incredible), Hyrule under it's protective bubble, and all the wind effects. All of that, plus more, just amazed me.

StRaNgE · « **Reply #6 on:** March 28, 2003, 09:18:47 PM »

I just got the tower of the gods, sailing into it looking around was great. I am amazed at many many parts of this game.
And to think I was one who was extra bummed about the change of graphic styles.

I still want both versions though, lol.

PorpoiseMuffins · « **Reply #7 on:** March 29, 2003, 08:43:22 AM »

I agree. I love the game, love the graphics, but hate the blur. In fact, I can't stand it. I can't believe that someone wouldn't be able to notice it. The thing is that in real life, when you can focus in on whatever you want. In the wind waker you can only focus on what's 2 feet in front of your face. I don't think it has anything to do with framerate because there are a few areas where there is no blur (Outside portions in the first dungeon at the top of the mountain.) Plus, when you look through the telescope there is no blur either. I think it was a HUGE mistake to put in the blur. Especially since it's so drastic and close to the camera. When you look at an island (even when you're close) it appears like it's small and far away. They should have used the blur only in cut scenes (Like StarFox Adventures). Not when your trying to see things in the distance. It's like being near-sighted. VERY annoying. Don't get me wrong, I love the game, but I can't play it too long before my eyes start bothering me. Is it just my copy? I doubt it. I almost wish I could get a refund and get a copy from Nintendo without the depth-of-field blur. It sounds drastic, but that's just how I am with these things... Obviously that won't happen. Oh well... Does anybody else agree with me? I mean, aren't we trying to get things to look clearer, not more blurry? It ruines the whole great draw-distance too. I wish the whole game looked like the intro "press start" screen.

Marcus Arillius · « **Reply #8 on:** March 29, 2003, 05:23:38 PM »

I just got to dragon roost. Actually, I was watching my little brother play through the dragon roost (temple?) and I am more impressed with the graphics then when I made that post.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #9 on:** March 29, 2003, 05:33:05 PM »

The *only* problem I have with the graphics is sometimes they're flat otu cartoony and sometimes they're pretty realistic (like some of the bosses and the Tower of the Gods). Not that I mind either, but Nintendo could've picked one and stayed with it.

RahXephon · « **Reply #10 on:** March 29, 2003, 05:36:28 PM »

Number of complaints...1. I dont want the game too end. It seems to be going by way to fast and i dont wanna have to stop. I know I will play it over and over, but still, i love entering new areas and just looking at the amazing stuff.

BTW, best graphics ever, I am praying they do the toon shading again. It is just gogeous.

StRaNgE · « **Reply #11 on:** March 29, 2003, 09:13:21 PM »

the further I get the more it seems not like a cartoon but a "Disnet" cartoon.
High quality cartoon action...

Marcus Arillius · « **Reply #12 on:** March 30, 2003, 05:22:46 AM »

SPOILER

just got the Picto-box I noticed the blur A LOT more. In fact its really really blurry when using the Picto-box.

Stimutacs Addict · « **Reply #13 on:** March 30, 2003, 06:56:06 AM »

My only problem with the game is the difficulty... your don't even have to aim your shield at the Octoroks and their rocks will go flying right back at them.

PorpoiseMuffins · « **Reply #14 on:** March 31, 2003, 09:46:29 AM »

Oh... I consider that a relief actually. I hate it when you think you're aimed perfectly and something hits right into you and kills you. Anyways, the blur isn't a mistake or a problem with the system or a limitation of the system. It's an effect just like any other. It just happens to be a very annoying one that I think is distracting and limiting. Nintendo used it in Mario Sunshine too, it was just a lot further in the distance. I wasn't even a big fan of it back then--- Now I really hate it!

theaveng · « **Reply #15 on:** March 31, 2003, 12:59:55 PM »

ALL CARTOONS HAVE BLURRING.

Okay not "all". The cheap stuff you see on TV usually doesn't, but if you watch a high quality Disney or Don Bluth movie you will see blurring. Watch the opening forest scenes of Bambi or Beauty and the Beast. Look at the blurred background. It's just like what you see in Zelda: Wind Waker. As usual, you guys are complaining about a problem that doesn't exist... and it's due to your lack of knowledge and/or observation about how high-quality cartoons are made.

Please, make *legitimate* complaints.

-----Here's how Disney did it: They create multiple transparency slides. The bottom slide is the background. The middle slide is the foreground. Next is the character slide. The top slide includes ultra-close objects like branches. Sometimes these layers will go as deep as 10 layers! The camera focuses on the character layer which cause all the other layer to be blurred.

theaveng · « **Reply #16 on:** March 31, 2003, 12:59:57 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Marcus Arillius
However, my problem is that with all-this hype about cel-shading, it really wasn't all that it was cracked up to be. It looks a lot like the calibur of graphics found in Kingdom Hearts.

That's an odd comparison. Why? Because Kingdom Hearts didn't use cel-shading. It used the standard 3D polygon method. A more accurate comparison would be Zelda v. Dark Cloud (which looked terrible) or Zelda v. Dark Cloud 2 (which was beautiful).

theaveng · « **Reply #17 on:** March 31, 2003, 12:59:59 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: PorpoiseMuffins
Oh... I consider that a relief actually. I hate it when you think you're aimed perfectly and something hits right into you and kills you!

That's why you use the Z-trigger on the Ocarina Octoroks... so that doesn't happen. The only complaint I have on targeting is the Boomerang. Boomerangs can't change direction in mid-air and hit multiple targets. That's just not possible. Boomerangs fly in a continuous arc, and only hit objects on that arc. (shrug). Oh well.

VideoGamerX · « **Reply #18 on:** March 31, 2003, 01:19:29 PM »

My only complaint is the damage reduction. I really don't know why the damage is so dumbed down. I don't know how they let this be. I fall from a huge cliff and don't even lose a fraction of a heart if it's not really all that high. I get hit by a bomb and lose 1/4th of a heart. I get hit by an enemy and almost always lose 1/4th of a heart. Very rarely do I lose a full heart of damage. Even the most difficult and frustrating battles only take me down a couple of hearts (and these are some extremely fierce battles that lasted a good five minutes).

I really think this is something Nintendo was aware of before they stamped the game complete, but I think it was a pretty big goof. It doesn't hurt the game at all, really, but it's the ONLY valid reason for people to say Wind Waker is too easy. And because of this, the game is rather easy (using the term easy lightly because the game concepts are still intact).

And by the way, isn't the boomerange is supposed to be magical? Otherwise, I would agree with you. I think it's kind of neat that they added this ability to the boomerang and used it to help solve some of the dungeon puzzles.

Bloodworth · « **Reply #19 on:** March 31, 2003, 01:38:43 PM »

Complaining about the boomerang is silly. It's a great new feature.

Difficulty...yeah, overall it can feel pretty easy, but there are places that will test your endurance later on.

kennyb27 · « **Reply #20 on:** March 31, 2003, 03:07:07 PM »

Quote
ALL CARTOONS HAVE BLURRING.

Okay not "all". The cheap stuff you see on TV usually doesn't, but if you watch a high quality Disney or Don Bluth movie you will see blurring. Watch the opening forest scenes of Bambi or Beauty and the Beast. Look at the blurred background. It's just like what you see in Zelda: Wind Waker. As usual, you guys are complaining about a problem that doesn't exist... and it's due to your lack of knowledge and/or observation about how high-quality cartoons are made.

Please, make *legitimate* complaints.

OK, I don't really care what Disney or Don Bluth does, I think (i.e. my opinion) that this style clashes with the cel-shaded technique EAD used for the game. In my opinion, it doesn't fit because it is way too close to the vantage point and it is too exaggerated. I understand what it is trying to do (in focus/out of focus), but I don't agree with it. And can you elaborate on something for me, what is your definition of legitimate, because, I believe, that if I can provide an ample argument, it is legitimate. Also, this is the Zelda forum, so therefore, it is legitimate (legal; complying with the law) to post my complaint about Zelda here. My legitimate complaint is also legitimate because I meant it in a sincere sense. In fact, I have never read or heard of a definition of "legitimate" that would contradict my OPINION here.

couchmonkey · « **Reply #21 on:** March 31, 2003, 04:01:09 PM »

I agree that the blurring seems to go against the cel-shaded style, but then I have to add that I don't think Nintendo's intent was ever to make a cartoon-styled game...I used to think that was the intent with Zelda, but having finally played it for myself, I think the company was just playing with cel-shading and liked the results. The game really isn't nearly as cartoony as I expected and so, to make a very long-winded point, I don't see anything "wrong" with the blur. In fact I think it looks pretty cool.

Dozy Boy · « **Reply #22 on:** March 31, 2003, 07:17:57 PM »

I'm halfway through the game the second time, and I've never died. What's it look like. (I don't feel like dying to find out...)

PvtDaryl · « **Reply #23 on:** March 31, 2003, 07:23:55 PM »

what i still dont understand , why do they keep on using the words "cel-shaded" who the hell said it was cell shaded ?! i mean jet grind radio was cel shaded , now compare it to this , its more.....3-Dish... you know

i dont think its ALL cel-shaded since when does celshaded have heat waves and blurryness? exactly its a NEW style of art

theaveng · « **Reply #24 on:** April 01, 2003, 07:37:46 AM »

KENNYB: "Cartoons don't use blurring therefore neither should Zelda" is an illegitimate complaint. The first half of the statement is blatantly wrong, because cartoons *do* use blurring.

As for your eyes, they too have blurring. Eyes can focus on the foreground or the background, not both at the same time. Right now, my computer is in crystal-clear focus, but the chair on the other side of the room is blurred. Zelda the cartoon game is imitating that phenomenon.

Troy (Sidles away)

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Author Topic: One Problem with Wind Waker (Read 14682 times)