Topic: Official Sales Thread

[BigJim]

They're #2 right now in consoles. But it's a matter of time.

It's nice *for them* to be in this position, but there continues to be the looming question of whether they are MTV-ifying videogames and if that is really good for gaming in the long term.

[Urkel]

Videogames were MTV-ified the day FF7 was released.

Nintendo merely found a way to use that tactic on a much larger demographic than the insecure teenage males that Sony roped into gaming.

[Deguello]

An MTV-ified game is Wii Sports?  How does that begin to compute?

What are you saying?

[Urkel]

Quote
Originally posted by: Deguello
An MTV-ified game is Wii Sports?  How does that begin to compute?

What are you saying?

Was that directed towards me?

I'm just saying that Nintendo has managed to turn the tables by appealing to a new demographic, like Sony did. I certainly didn't mean to imply that Nintendo is dumbing down games like so many others have suggested.

Sony made games more mainstream by emphasizing FMV and glitz and "mature" themes over gameplay.

Nintendo is making games even more mainstream by providing an intuitive and more interactive game experience that just about anyone could get into.

[Kairon]

The MTV-ification of gaming happened already with the Sony Platstation. Nintendo is iPoding it.

[BigJim]

Yeah MTV may have been a bad example. But whatever it is they're doing, some people wonder if it's good for the long-term.

[Deguello]

"Some people" is a weasel word.  Who, exactly?

"Some people" wonder if Wii is good for the long term.
"Some People" also like to squish cottage cheese between their feet.
Furthermore "some people" also enjoy centaur porn.
And I even hear "some people" like to do all three at the same time.

Who, exactly?

[Ceric]

Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
The MTV-ification of gaming happened already with the Sony Platstation. Nintendo is iPoding it.

Locking people into using an overpriced peripheral in a propieratory(sp?) system that has monopolistic tendencies?

[UltimatePartyBear]

Then perhaps Nintendo is Oprahfying video games.  Or some other icon of mainstreamness.

[KDR_11k]

They're Pokemoning games?

[BlackNMild2k1]

NPD Top 25 ranked by revenue

Rank Title Publisher

1 360 GUITAR HERO 2 W / GUITAR Activision
2 Wii MARIO PARTY 8 Nintendo
3 360 FORZA MOTORSPORT 2 Microsoft
4 DS POKEMON DIAMOND VERSION Nintendo
5 Wii PLAY W / REMOTE Nintendo
6 PS2 GUITAR HERO 2 W /GUITAR Activision
7 PS2 SPIDER-MAN 3 Activision
8 360 SPIDER-MAN 3 Activision
9 DS POKEMON PEARL VERSION Nintendo
10 360 COMMAND & CONQUER 3: TIBERIUM W ARS Electronic Arts
11 Wii SUPER PAPER MARIO Nintendo
12 360 CRACKDOWN Microsoft
13 PS3 MLB '07: THE SHOW Sony
14 Wii LEGEND OF ZELDA: TWILIGHT PRINCESS Nintendo
15 Wii SPIDER-MAN 3 Activision
16 360 SHADOWRUN Microsoft
17 PS3 SPIDER-MAN 3 Activision
18 PS2 MLB '07: THE SHOW Sony
19 360 MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL 2K7 Take 2 Interactive
20 360 GEARS OF WAR Microsoft
21 DS NEW SUPER MARIO BROS Nintendo
22 DS SPIDER-MAN 3 Activision
23 360 PIRATES OF THE CARIBBEAN: AT WORLD'S END Disney
24 PS2 GOD OF WAR II Sony
25 360 TOM CLANCY'S RAINBOW SIX: VEGAS Ubi Soft

360: 10
Wii: 5
DS: 4
PS2: 4
PS3: 2

Take into account that these titles are ranked by revenue and not units sold.
360 & PS3 software = $60
Wii & PS2 software = $50
DS software = $35

[Ceric]

An interesting article about predicting this gen by using data from the last and graphing it.

It's a pretty good read in and of itself.  

[Arbok]

Quote
Originally posted by: Deguello
"Some people" is a weasel word.  Who, exactly?

People who bought HD TVs and PS3s to go with them... ;-)

[Kairon]

Don't forget that Guitar Hero 2 costs $80.

Quote
Originally posted by: Ceric

Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
The MTV-ification of gaming happened already with the Sony Platstation. Nintendo is iPoding it.

Locking people into using an overpriced peripheral in a propieratory(sp?) system that has monopolistic tendencies?

No, no, wait. That sounds pretty accurate to me.

[vudu]

PM me if you know where I can find centaur porn.

[couchmonkey]

Whether or not Nintendo's newfound success is good for gaming in the long-term can be measured in a lot of different ways.  I think a lot of people raised on recent systems will believe that Nintendo's vision is a step back for the "art" of video games because it doesn't push forward production values and complex narratives.  It's a step back artistically...which may be true (personally I don't believe it's relevant, even though I love a game with a story).

In our capitalist society, popularity and financial success are popular measures.  In this light, Nintendo's change will probably be a good thing for the industry.  I've had this feeling for several years that video games could wind up like comic books, forever trapped in a niche realm of manchildren, but I think Nintendo is helping to put video games on the map (with lots of acknowledgement to things like The Sims and casual online gaming).

On the other hand, Nintendo could simply cause another industry implosion like that of the early 80s: build up a big, unstable fanbase and watch it all come tumbling down due to some mis-step.  But without taking steps like this, the overall health of the industry could be at stake.

We could also measure it from a civil liberties point of view or a productivity point of view, and probably many more.

Most will measure the success like so: "Do I like these games?"  Some are going to answer no.  That's too bad, but the same thing happened when N64 and Playstation hit the market, when graphics replaced text adventures, and when talkies replaced silent movies.  

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Quote
Originally posted by: PartyBear
Then perhaps Nintendo is Oprahfying video games.  Or some other icon of mainstreamness.

Actually, they're Dr. Phil-ing video games.

"GET OFF YER ASS AND DO SOMETHING.  UH-HYUCK."

[BranDonk Kong]

You also have to take into account that Guitar Hero 3 costs $90 on XBox 360, and is not sold without the controller, because there is no GH1 on Xbox 360. But...then you also have to take into account that it's the greatest game in the history of everything.

[ShyGuy]

I just got done listening to last weekends 1up Yours podcast and man, there is this seething undercurrent of contempt from the Wii that is boiling out of the edges into a meltdown. Maybe it's just the 1up guys, but all these ___core gamers seem to be really threatened by the Wii. I'm still formulating why exactly.

[Kairon]

It's a challenge to their self-identity, I'd guess. If you learn to define yourself one way, and become really, really good at it (becoming a real hardcore gamer with cred and all that), then all of a sudden the world flips on you and other people and qualities are being deemed more significant than you based on an entirely new set of standards... you're bound to feel more than a little cheated, territorial, and defensive.

Take the movie Stage Beauty, for example, starring Billy Crudup and Claire Danes. It's a movie set in England back when women couldn't be actors. So men played women... and the main character (Billy Crudup) was a star because of how well he did it. Then suddenly the world flips on him and women are allowed to act... he sorta goes ballistic halfway through the movie and acts a real jerk because he's feeling threatened that women are edging in on his turf, his identity, the very thing his entire life is based on.

All his life he'd been trained, forced, made to suffer so that he would be able to fulfill a certain role, a role that has made him a star... and then the rug get's pulled out from under him. Forever acting as women, incapable to play masculine roles... can he grow beyond his past? Adapt? Or will he rage and rage and ultimately wither away into history?



Stage Beauty now on DVD, Rated R for sexual content and language.

[ShyGuy]

That was a great post Kairon.

[denjet78]

Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
It's a challenge to their self-identity, I'd guess. If you learn to define yourself one way, and become really, really good at it (becoming a real hardcore gamer with cred and all that), then all of a sudden the world flips on you and other people and qualities are being deemed more significant than you based on an entirely new set of standards... you're bound to feel more than a little cheated, territorial, and defensive.

Why does no one every listen to me???

People are afraid of things that they don't understand. It's simple human nature. They fear it because it's different. It's unexpected. They have to figure out how to get their atrophied brains around it conceptually and for the average person that's like an ant trying to move the Matterhorn.

The average person doesn't like to think. They like to be spoon fed everything in prepackaged sound bites. It's as if they've come to believe that thinking kills brain cells.

Of course shiny things are easy distractions because all you have to do is look at them. You don't actually have to think or *shudder* use your brain.

That's why so many gamers are pissed at Wii. It's not shiny enough and it makes them think. Basically, it's not a nickel.

...

Wait, what?

[31 Flavas]

Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuy
I just got done listening to last weekends 1up Yours podcast and man, there is this seething undercurrent of contempt from the Wii that is boiling out of the edges into a meltdown. Maybe it's just the 1up guys, but all these ___core gamers seem to be really threatened by the Wii. I'm still formulating why exactly.

It's a change in power structure. Any ruling party that is disposed or legitimately challenged is going to be highly agitated, threatened, and show extreme contempt. Be it the video game "hardcore" who wield nothing but ego power (i.e. "My video game system is better then yours!") or the United States of America government which wields thousands of nuclear tipped ICBMs.

Wii is legitimately challenging the concept / construct that Hi-def graphics, 5.1 sound, and in depth story are what sell video games (even what makes a "Good" video game). Wii hardware and Wii software (Wii Sports, Wii Play, mainly) are legitimately out selling typical "gamer games". It's bad enough that the brand new Forza 2 is being outsold by Pokemon, but to be out sold by 4 month old Wii Play? Ouch, that has to hurt.

So you better believe that the Ian's and the "know it alls" of gaming are feeling like outcasts now. That's not supposed to happen, "they" are the 'true' gamers!

Eh... I think that's enough dramatics for one post.  

[Ceric]

NPD Software top 10 May by Units Sold from GamesAreFun

Quote

1. NDS - Pokemon Diamond - Nintendo - 331,200 (1,335,700)
2. Wii - Mario Party 8 - Nintendo - 314,400 (NEW)
3. PS2 - Spider-Man 3 - Activision - 248,700 (390,700)
4. NDS - Pokemon Pearl - Nintendo - 238,000 (950,000)
5. Wii - Wii Play w/ remote - Nintendo - 227,000 (1,120,000)
6. 360 - Forza Motorsport 2 - Microsoft - 217,300 (NEW)
7. 360 - Guitar Hero II w/ guitar - Activision - 183,600 (671,600)
8. 360 - Spider-Man 3 - Activision - 139,800 (256,800)
9. 360 - Command & Conquer 3: Tiberium Wars - Electronic Arts - 137,700 (NEW)
10. PS2 - Guitar Hero II w/ guitar - Activision - 130,900 (1,980,900+)

and this is what IGN is reporting so I'm not sure who to believe because they are both suppose to be the May NPD Numbers.  NVM I know exactly what this is they excluded Handheld games.

Quote

  1. Mario Party 8 (WII) Nintendo
  2. Spider-Man 3 (PS2) Activision
  3. Wii Play (WII) Nintendo
  4. Forza Motorsport 2 (X360) Microsoft
  5. Guitar Hero 2 (X360) Red Octane/Activision
  6. Spider-Man 3 (X360) Activision
  7. Command & Conquer 3: Tiberium Wars (X360) Electronic Arts
  8. Guitar Hero 2 (PS2) Red Octane/Activision
  9. Super Paper Mario (WII) Nintendo
 10. Legend Of Zelda: Twilight Princess (WII) Nintendo
 11. Crackdown (X360) Microsoft
 12. Spider-Man 3 (WII) Activision
 13. MLB '07: The Show (PS3) Sony
 14. MLB '07: The Show (PS2) Sony
 15. Everyone Game Bundle (PS2) Multiple Manufacturers
 16. Shadowrun (X360) Microsoft
 17. Shrek The Third (PS2) Activision
 18. Spider-Man 3 (PS3) Activision
 19. God Of War II (PS2) Sony
 20. .hack GU Vol. 2 Reminisce (PS2) Namco Bandai

Posted here for record.

Anyways, I agree with Kairon.    

[Kairon]

Quote
Originally posted by: 31 Flavas

Wii is legitimately challenging the concept / construct that Hi-def graphics, 5.1 sound, and in depth story are what sell video games (even what makes a "Good" video game).

Quote
Originally posted by: denjet78

People are afraid of things that they don't understand. It's simple human nature. They fear it because it's different. It's unexpected. They have to figure out how to get their atrophied brains around it conceptually and for the average person that's like an ant trying to move the Matterhorn.

Yeah, I agree that that's also a part of it. Hardcore traditionalists are used to thinking of games in easily measured terms of bump-maps, draw distance, framerates and textures, but HOW do you measure fun? And just because they can't measure this new, non-technical experience, some seek stick their heads in the sand and discredit it.

Though I wouldn't be so quick to disparage the "average" person denjet78. After all, it's the AVERAGE person who's "getting" the Wii. This is actually a story about an insular elite being misguided and feeling marginalized because they're out of touch with the reality of the general population.

Take a look at Nintendo and Nintendo fanboys circa N64 and GC... let's not forget that we were the ones bemoaning the "casual, violence-hungry, sensationalistic mainstream gamer" then.