Topic: Sony getting hit Hard lately

[KDR_11k]

Their games have been selling horribly anyway, and they are hardly a "system seller calibur" company anymore.

Indeed, the only part of Sega that could maybe be compared with Excalibur is Treasure. Or did you mean "calibre"?

[IceCold]

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Oh, and it looked like Microsoft scored a minor upset, they've got exclusivity to next-gen FIFA and PES[L=http://www.gamesindustry.biz/content_page.php?aid=19281[/L...[/L] uh... what's PES? Anyways, it sounds like the first FIFA soccer game on the PS3 (Or Wii) will be in 2008.

I don't think this should be pooh-poohed. Microsoft has stated that they believe the next-gen battlefield will be Europe, and soccer IS bigger there (and elsewhere in the world) as compared to our American sensibilities.

Pulling a BnM, though I'm not sure why I posted it there..

EDIT:

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Sega is dead. I might have agreed with you before the Sammy merger, but presently I could care less about them. Their games have been selling horribly anyway, and they are hardly a "system seller calibur" company anymore

Are you sure you're thinking of SEGA and not Namco?

EDIT 2:

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A Nintendo-Namco

Well, that answers my question..

[couchmonkey]

I think Nintendo has come to the conclusion that it doesn't want partnerships anymore.  All of its close partnerships from the 90s have ended in a split (Rare, Angel, Left Field, Silicon Knights) or a buyout (Retro).

This has its ups and downs.  I miss the freedom some of those second parties had and the new franchises they introduced.  Without Rare, my N64 would have been pretty dull - Nintendo made great games, but they were so few and far between.  Looking at Retro or NST, they make good games, but they tend to work on a limited, franchise-heavy lineup.

On the other hand, both Rare and Silicon Knights wanted to head down the path of big-budget theatrical games which wasn't what Nintendo wanted.  Having seen the Wii, I'm convinced that Nintendo needs to be free to do what it wants, hardware-wise.  I think the company's new method of teaming up with small developers for individual projects works, because it gives us great new games while leaving Nintendo free to follow its own path without painful "break ups".  I was really disappointed when Rare's lineup went out the door.  In practice, it didn't turn out to be a bad deal, but at the time I was crushed.

[JonLeung]

Rare needed Nintendo a lot more than Nintendo needed Rare.

I loved Rare's N64 games too, but what did they have for Xbox?  Wasn't it just Grabbed by the Ghoulies and Conker: Live and Reloaded or whatever?  And I didn't even think the original Conker's Bad Fur Day was as great as everyone made it out to be, so that generation was almost entirely forfeit.

Sure, the Xbox 360 has got Perfect Dark Zero and Kameo: Elements of Power, both of which were to be GameCube games.  But for some reason I think those games (as well as Viva Pinata) would do better on a Nintendo console.

Heck, with the Xboxes being all "mature" and stuff, you'd think Kameo and Pinata would even do better on the PS2/PS3 than on the Xbox 360.

[Spak-Spang]

Nintendo has chosen to partner with talent more than to partner with companies.  Nintendo has stated you can buy a company or even sign second party ties with them, but if/when the talent disappears what do you have left?  A second rate company that became a money pit for you.

Rare is a talented developer.  But they needed time to create masterpieces too much time.  Furthermore, they didn't know how to truly polish a game without Nintendo's assistance.  Nintendo made Rare who they are today...and without Nintendo's help and instruction I don't think Rare would have ever grown to its potential today.

The same can be said with almost any company Nintendo has nurtured as a second party company.  And you can understand why for the most part those companies continue to have good relations with Nintendo.  

But, Nintendo doesn't need them.  I think it would be smarter for Nintendo to invest in creating more development teams of their own.  I think another American based company that creates franchises and games with a more American flavor would be smart for Nintendo to develop.  Sorta like Retro Studios.

[couchmonkey]

Yeah, it's been pretty downhill for Rare since they left Nintendo, but that doesn't change the fact that I miss the games the company once made.  Plus, Microsoft doesn't seem to mind footing the bill for Rare's products, even if they aren't huge sellers so far.

Edit: Spak...I'd like to see Retro itself grow to the point where it can develop two or three games at a time.

[Kairon]

In the later years of Nintendo's parnership with rare, they were at 200+ employees. Size and manpower is NOT the reason that Rare gets so few projects out the door.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[Hocotate]

Didn't most Rare employees leave after the move to MS? Didn't the main bigwigs start Zoonami or something like that?

[Bill Aurion]

Two Rare people formed Zoonami; one being Martin Hollis, the project lead for Goldeneye and Perfect Dark...

A few others, including David Doak (or Dr. Doak ), formed Free Radical...I don't believe as many left Rare at the time as many think, but Doak and Hollis were two of the best there...

[Kairon]

Actually, I think I've heard something along those lines Hocotate. Hmmm...

Either way, Nintendo has it right. People make games, not companies.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[IceCold]

More Kaz rambling..

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"We look at our products having a 10-year life cycle, which we've proven with the PlayStation," said Kaz. "Therefore, the PlayStation 3 is going to be a console that's going to be with you again for ten years. We're not going to ask the consumers to suddenly buy another PlayStation console in five years time, and basically have their investment go by the wayside. So for all those reasons, I think at $599 we're offering a very good value to the consumers."

RE:Wii

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During the interview, he also implied that Nintendo's Wii console could face some unexpected competition - from the PS2, of all things. Discussing the Wii, Hirai admitted that, "Some consumers will compare features or software offerings and decide that they may want to go with a different console," before adding that, "You also have to realize that we have a very strong, market-leading console called the PlayStation 2, which is at a very affordable price right now."

[BigJim]

Did anybody else mentio this? The PS3 is supposedly getting down-clocked.


The INQ Story

Yes it's the INQ, but the story has picked up a little steam. Might be true.

[Spak-Spang]

BigJim:  With the problem of creating perfect Cell chip yields, and the fact that you must have all but two of the cells working for the PS3 to work properly, I can understand why this might happen.  

We shall see what comes from the PS3.  Personally, I expect a delay, or a very limited launch instead of a world wide launch.  That is just me.

After fullying reading the story I doubt its creditability as the writer is completely unprofessional, and writing is subpar.

[Ceric]

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Originally posted by: IceCold
More Kaz rambling..

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"We look at our products having a 10-year life cycle, which we've proven with the PlayStation," said Kaz. "Therefore, the PlayStation 3 is going to be a console that's going to be with you again for ten years. We're not going to ask the consumers to suddenly buy another PlayStation console in five years time, and basically have their investment go by the wayside. So for all those reasons, I think at $599 we're offering a very good value to the consumers."

RE:Wii

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During the interview, he also implied that Nintendo's Wii console could face some unexpected competition - from the PS2, of all things. Discussing the Wii, Hirai admitted that, "Some consumers will compare features or software offerings and decide that they may want to go with a different console," before adding that, "You also have to realize that we have a very strong, market-leading console called the PlayStation 2, which is at a very affordable price right now."

First of all he's basing that 10 year figure on a console that is 1 year back.  Nintendo did that with the Cube.  They said it would last 10 years like SNES and NES.  We saw what happened there.  It could happen but I really doubt it.  Plus with Sony's hardware history do you honestly beleive that your PS3 will last 10 or even 5 years?

lol.  PS2 being real competition for the Wii.  Thats sort of funny.  The PS2 will go away.  If it doesn't Sony is just shooting themselves in the foot in regard to the PS3.

[Hocotate]

Is Sony TRYING to lose? Sometimes I wounder...
btw, thanks for the Rare info. I knew I heard something about staff leaving after the move. That would explain the sudden sucking of Rare's games... well that and the lack of Nintendo.

[couchmonkey]

Here I go again...for the record, most of the "important" Rare employees left well before the merger, in fact I believe Hollis left before Perfect Dark was even developed.  As for employees leaving after the Microsoft merger, Rare itself has stated that it was less than 10.  And last but not least, I can't vouch for any of the Xbox games, but Sabre Wulf and It's Mr. Pants definitely don't suck.

On Sony's comments: ten years just isn't going to happen, and previous consoles are piss-poor proof of the concept, because anyone playing  Playstation 1 the last three years has seen basically zero new games.  The PS2 vs. Wii comment is laughable.  I guess it's possible in theory that PS2 will steal some thunder from Wii, but I highly doubt Sony is planning to use that strategy, they'll just hope that third parties keep the PS2 popular enough.  If Sony did try to support PS2 vs. Wii, it would be splitting its attention too many ways and would likely fail on every front.

[JonLeung]

I remember a Sony rep (I wouldn't be surprised if it was Kaz, if he was around then) bragging at some conference in 2001 about the PSX (or PSOne if you prefer) to be selling better than the GameCube and Xbox.  They aren't just arrogant now....they were already arrogant then.  Even if the PSX did sell better than the GameCube and Xbox (which I seriously doubt it ever did,) did they seriously think that would last?  Sheesh.

People play PlayStation because of the plethora of titles, but they should see some of the silliness that Sony themselves say.

[capamerica]

Grabbed by the Ghoulies - Sucked badly, There was nothing good about it.
Conker: Live and Reloaded - Was okay, They really ruined the multi-player. Graphicly it was better but the N64 version wins.
Perfect Dark Zero - Was a so-so FPS, It was nothing special, pretty much a game just to tied you over till a better FPS came out.
Kameo: Elements of Power - Really sucked, I couldn't get into it at all. Everything was pretty much bad or sub-par.


Back on topic, for the whole $ony comments, I think they are just getting in defence mode since they know they are in some serious trouble.

[Bill Aurion]

"in fact I believe Hollis left before Perfect Dark was even developed."

I could have sworn he left more towards the end of the game development cycle, or at least in the middle of it...

[JonLeung]

Then maybe Sony should just shut up - I remember earlier this summer it seemed like every week they opened their mouths and said something that was either blatantly or strongly implied to be bad news for their PS3.

They probably feel like they need to remind people that they're out there, what with initial support sliding towards the Wii...but it's hard to say that there's no such thing as bad attention when they speak.

[Athrun Zala]

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Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
BigJim:  With the problem of creating perfect Cell chip yields, and the fact that you must have all but two of the cells working for the PS3 to work properly, I can understand why this might happen.

actually, it's all but ONE, so it's even worse

[Spak-Spang]

Athrun Zala:  Oops.  I stand corrected.  Poor Sony...poor, poor, Sony.

[JonLeung]

"Poor" as in "you should take pity on me", or "poor" as in "I have no money"?

[Donutt007]

I work at the Metreon in San Francisco and I was just talking to some of the employees at the Playstation Store. They don't plan on having any demo units up until 3 days AFTER the launch at the EARLIEST!

Kinda strange that the official Playstation store won't have playable units until after the release. I remember when the PS2 came out they had one up well before the release. Even a pretty cool set-up for it in a seperate room with a big screen TV and a couch. Hell they even had PSP to try out before they came out!

Oh well. But they did say they are planning on having three PS3's set up.

[Donutt007]

So interesting thoughts about the PSP...but to a non-sony fanboy it doesn't look that great.

PSP to become virtual PS3

Some things that look kinda bad

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Kawanishi was then asked to comment on how the PSP will evolve from here. Specifically, Nikkei asked if he feels the system will become an information terminal in the future. "It depends on what the users want," responded Kawanishi. "It already has a Web Browser, and along those lines, schedule management and mailer applications will likely appear. However, it's important that the concept not lose focus. It would be troubling to have it become a machine whose use is unknown."

Well UMD movies failed, why not scrap the games too!

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"The PSP started off clearly with the position of a portable game machine," continued Kawanishi. "However, looking long term, there's the thought that it ought to become a portable network device. At that time, if there's demand for an information terminal, it is possible to take it in that direction."

OK, let's just make it a portable HardDrive with a screen

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Could the PSP ever replace your cell phone? "There is a possibility," said Kawanishi. "I won't deny it. Personally, I'm interested in it. Of course, it's not the case that you can connect to wireless LAN everywhere, so you can't call it a permanent connection. But cell phones are permanently connected. Cell phones get more interesting as their data transfer rate increases, and I think it would be extremely interesting to try something like that."

Just look at the success of the N-Gage!

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Sony will be demonstrating two new technological sides of the PSP at the Tokyo Game Show in September, where the system's GPS Receiver and camera will be on display. We also hope to see something regarding Sony's PlayStation emulation and e-Distribution programs.

A GPS receiver...WHY? wow, what utter useless crap in a game machine...I mean portable movie player...wait I mean.....BIG ASS MP3 player.