Topic: quack quack

[ThePerm]

http://media.revolution.ign.com/articles/707/707509/vids_1.html  

[Ian Sane]

Having a cursor actually kind of ruins it for me.  In the original Duck Hunt you didn't have a cursor.  You just had to have good aim.  A lightgun game shouldn't have a cursor.  Otherwise it becomes more of a mouse game than a lightgun game.

[ThePerm]

maybe there will be an option to turn it off? I'm just wondering where the dog is

[Louieturkey]

Looks like fun to me, two player duck hunt and clay shooting and alien saucer shooting.  Probably could be as many as four players I'm guessing.

[Artimus]

The dog isn't there because the ducks aren't. This is a shooting demo, not duck hunt. I'm sure they'll be similar, but this isn't actually Duck Hunt.

[jasonditz]

yeah, I'm hoping if Duck Hunt does have a cursor there's a way to shut it off.

[ThePerm]

there are ducks..there are two videos

[Renny]

Quote
Originally posted by: IGN
Since the sensor bar is placed above or below the television, players point at the bar itself, not at the screen. For this reason, the game doesn't allow pinpoint accuracy with the Wii-mote, as players have to steer a cursor rather than aiming at a point on-screen, which is a far more natural approach.

According to this hands-on of Red Steel, you point at the bar as if it were the center of the screen, thereby losing the ability to perform LOS aiming at the screen. I don't see why the game couldn't calibrate the pointer to the center of the screen, and make the necessary adjusments itself so that you could aim directly. I hope this is fixed, otherwise the pointing function is nearly useless.

[RickPowers]

I'm pretty sure that I can state with absolute certainty, that the above criticism of the sensor bar is complete and utter horseshit.

[ThePerm]

yeah.. wouldnt it just adjust for y as y + 1 ft...aye?

[Renny]

Quote
Originally posted by: RickPowers
I'm pretty sure that I can state with absolute certainty, that the above criticism of the sensor bar is complete and utter horseshit.

Ha. Thanks for the quick clarification. I read IGN for the first time in awhile, and it's the same old story. I'm now still extra pissed about the Super Monkey Ball 2 and P.N.03 reviews.

[Artimus]

Let's see...IGN who has played it...Rick who hasn't.

Sorry, but I'll trust the people who have the know. Red Steel is getting "great, but needs control tuning" remarks across the board.

[ThePerm]

apparently from what i heard..the demo's don't have a calibration option...however..the final  games will. As far as the sensor goes....its not calibrated right if you have to point it at the sensor.

[MaryJane]

if you can't do LOS(Line of Sight i had to scratch my head for a good 15 seconds to think of what it stood for lol) pointing with the Wiimote, what the hell would be the point, and whomever said y = y +1 your exactly right that wouldn't be too complicated to do, but how would the bar know how big ur t.v is and exactly where it is in position to the screen? that would take orientation points... maybe when you first boot up the Wii we'll have to do that. I don't mind, cuz it would really piss me off if where i'm pointing on screen isn't actually where the shot or whateverthehellelse i'm trying do isn't taking place.

Cursor = Stupid, if dual analog controls don't require it, neither should a pointer which is supposed to be it's replacement. If the final version (the one in stores) of the Wii doesn't do LOS pointing I will be super pissed cuz the other 2 offerings in the console war don't really appeal to me either.  

[ThePerm]

as far as how would you know where the center of your screen...well the sensor is at the bottom of the screen...your supposed to point in the relative center of the screen. Therefore the distance from the sensor to the center of the screen should be half of the screen. So twice that would measure the whole screen.

[ShyGuy]

Honestly, I think some of this sensor griping coming out of E3 is due to the interference of all wii stations and electronics and the fact that the demoers are standing a few feet from the station, rather than sitting on a couch 8 feet away.

I could be wrong though

[ThePerm]

ooh...goddamn the rf radiation that would begoing through their bodies, ugh

[Ian Sane]

Just the fact that there seems to be any complaints about the controls isn't encouraging.  It might be fine in the end but I would feel a lot better if there was universal praise.  I wouldn't be surprised if interference from other demo units was creating problems but now I have to wait until final reviews before I can commit to a Wii purchase.  We don't know if there's a problem or not and that kind of uncertainty sucks.

I'm getting a feeling that coding games like this isn't easy and we might see some really sloppy third party junk as a result.  It doesn't look like rushing games is going to turn out very well at all on the Wii.

[ThePerm]

rushing games never turns out good

[Ceric]

Ian your already committed and you know it.  (Know if the video would just load...)

[Jensen]

The controller isn't a magic wand that always knows it's precise yaw,pitch, and Lateral X,Y,Z position.  It would be really cool if that was the case, but it isn't.

There will be no LOS shooting games.  The technology doesn't allow it.  And no, It isn't lack of calibration that is preventing LOS.

[Jensen]

Ian has been apprehensive about the Wii technology being used for gestures instead of direct control.  Unfortunately, this is the only choice in many cases.  If you make a throwing motion with the controller, the controller can't accurately translate the action to the software in a way that the software could project a virtual object based on the trajectory of the real throwing motion.  

The controller doesn't know the difference between tilt and lateral movement.  It detects both, but not discreetly.

The IR bar allows 2D pointing within a certain range.  

[ThePerm]

good programming would allow it. if it doesnt have it..then its all in the programing. If i had the ability..i could program some analog actuators...the truth is...your arm can only move in certain ways...

your wrist does not have 360° motion it only has 180° motion..the joint in your elbow prevents you from turning any further.

it is impossible to move your arm in a 90° angle unless your wrist is turned up.

if your wrist is turned down...your arm moves at a 45° angle

if your wrist is turned any where from 0° to 180° that affects your range from 45° to 90° on an elbow turn

if you understand this....then yes...you can program a perfect game

also the position of your shoulder would be determined by the xy position of your controller.

the truth is the controller is limitless..your arm is not

[Jensen]

The controller doesn't give you enough information to make a LOS game even with the best programmers working on it.

Your anatamy lesson is irrelevent.  I can hold the controller in any position or angle I want to.

[Renny]

You can play with it up your ass, too, for that matter. But there's a reasonable expectation that you'll handle the controller the way the game instructs you to. Can a little bit of safe assumption compensate for the remote's lack of information? I'm curious about why the remote can't emulate a light gun. What is it about the IR positioning that doesn't allow that level of accuracy?