Topic: EDITORIALS: Wii Will Get Over It, Won’t Wii?

[Smash_Brother]

Haha! Been watching HSR much, KDR?

[PaLaDiN]

Which bag am I under? Because I think I could eat my way out of the potatoes one if I tried.

[RickPowers]

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I'm POSITIVE that there are higher-ups at Nintendo who must be pushing for the elimination of the home console and the focus to be placed entirely on the vastly more successful handheld console line. If Nintendo took the resources they've been investing in the home console market and put it into handhelds, they'd likely get far more return for their money. If the wii doesn't outsell the GC, I wouldn't be at all surprised if Nintendo just packed their bags and left the home console market.

Very astute theory, Smash_Brother.  I salute you.

Note that while he doesn't implicity say it, it wouldn't be an issue of whether Wii was profitable or not.  It would simply be an issue of ROI, and opportunity costs, and that the money could be better spent fattening up the existing cash-cow rather than trying to get this old girl to breed.

Terrible analogy, but I think the point stands.  Nintendo knows on which side their bread is buttered.

[mantidor]

Thats a very scary theory, I dont like it. my GC > my DS, any day.

[Kairon]

Nice theory, but it disregards a very important aspect of Nintendo: they are a gaming company. Satoru Iwata was a game developer. Shigeru Miyamoto has practically become the very core of Nintendo philosophy. And Nintendo has always worked with the belief that hardware is just as much a part of gaming as software: i.e. the N64 analog stick that perfectly complemented Mario 64.

It's always a possibility that Nintendo would drop out of the hardware market, but it's never a possibility that they'll go easily. This is a company that believes it knows where videogames can be going, and believes it should expend the effort to take us in that direction. They WANT to stay in the hardware business at a very basic level. It's in their blood.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[TheYoungerPlumber]

I think they mean Nintendo would ONLY develop portable games for their portable consoles.  I think this will eventually happen, if only because handhelds will eventually become powerful enough to appeal to the "omg, graphics!" crowd, and said handheld would double as a console hooked up to a TV & extra controllers (see Nomad).

As for the Wii name, I totally see why Nintendo chose it.  The WiFi -> Wii could be played upon for advertisements, the i's do look like their controllers, etc.  But the points about urine and unclear pronunciation are completely valid as well. Wii'll just have to see.  The next Mario game better not be called "Super Mariio," though.

[Kairon]

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Originally posted by: pap64
This is what I find extremely disturbing about the argument.

It's OK if you guys agree with the name, like the name and disagree with what we think. But when you openly question our reasons for not agreeing with the name and make allusions to our sanity in general, I can't help but feel a little disgusted by it.

In all honesty, I think most of you that support the name have a faith in Nintendo so grand that you don't want to hear any negative comments or general opinion.

This is almost like when you have great faith in God and an atheist comes to you and say "there's no God. All Churches lie to you. The bible is a fake". Your faith in God is so big that you cast aside everything that person says, wether what they say is right or wrong.

They could be telling you the biggest truth there is and you still cast it aside. Why? Because people just don't want to hear it. They want to believe that what they have faith in is right and is the absolute truth in life, even when it's clearly obvious it isn't.

This is what is happening right now with Nintendo. True, some of you have valid points as to why the name works, but from what I've seen it's all mostly blind faith in them and you don't WANT to hear what we have to say.

Want proof of this? Rick Powers' editorial. He presented his views as to why the name might not work in a smart, coherent, calm, cool and collected manner. Yet a great deal of you have bashed him and argued his opinion down, even when he offers some really damn good points! And why? Because comments like this goes against what you believe in!

Are we being too dramatic? Yes, I agree some of us have been a little too passionate about it. Are we being negative? Yes we are. Could our opinion be the truth and what we say is what will happen to Nintendo? Far from it. Like I said, we can analyze this all we want but in the end we can't determine what will happen. But guess what? Neither does your own words.

Don't like what we have to say? Fine! Disagree with us? Fine. You guys have the right to discuss this and bring your own views into it. It's the insults, the flaming and the censorship that annoys the hell out of us.

If you guys love the Wii name so much why don't you post extensive, coherent and realistic editorials and points as to why the name works?

A great deal of the Wii haters have posted some good points as to why the name doesn't work, Rick Powers' editorial being a recent example. I have yet to see a good argument coming from a Wii follower. All I've read was "The people that hate the Wii are inmature", "You guys have severe issues", "You guys are morons" and the list goes on.

If you guys want to agree with the Wii, post relevant thoughts on the matter. If you rely on insults and flaming it just proves my point that you guys are so intent on believing on Nintendo that you would be willing to insult and cast aside anyone that thinks differently.

I earnestly hope you weren't including me in this condemnation. And if you were, would this rectify it?

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[Caliban]

I was sitting in the lunchroom drinking my gatorade because it was my breaktime at work, these 2 other guys were sitting there too and we were talking about videogames, then one asked the other if he saw what Nintendo called their next console, he replied "yeah, it's Wii like W-i-i, it sounds so asian, I mean it's not like PS3 or XBox360", I kept my mouth shut. Later on, while we were working, I told him my first impression of the name, I said "at first it looked wierd but then I watched the clip and I understood it, later I went to check the forums from planetgamecube.com and I just burst into laughter with all the Wee jokes", and he's like "but it's not even written like Wee, it's W-i-i", I said "I know man, I don't get it either, I mean we speak english so we do have a basic comprehension that it isn't Wee".

This kid I was speaking with is 16 years old, and he's acting with more maturity than most people have reacted in these forums. I am not ignorant that you have the right to express yourselves. I type this because I considered many people from this forum to be essential to it in that they had shown what makes PGC's forum so special from other forums.

My rant is over.

[mantidor]

I didnt catch many wee jokes here at all, to be honest, I dont recall a single one. It was more a concern that the jokes will get the console a bad reputation. The jokes Ive seen are from the halo and GTA crowd, you know, the biggest one around. It reminds my what Ian said, why Nintendo choose a name that would inevitably turn away this crowd which like it or not is of consideration in the industry?

 

[Kairon]

That's a pessimistic assumption mantidor.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Wii is quite mature.

A lot of websites worldwide won't allow access to their content unless you're at least 18 years or older.

[IceCold]

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If Nintendo took the resources they've been investing in the home console market and put it into handhelds, they'd likely get far more return for their money. If the wii doesn't outsell the GC, I wouldn't be at all surprised if Nintendo just packed their bags and left the home console market.

We've talked about this to death, and the fact is that it isn't that easy. If Nintendo focused solely on their portables, they would have to lay off many, many people. Sure, they're not making much profit from the console market, but it is what keeps so many of their workers employed. Those people can't just work on portable games - there isn't a big enough market in that area. Also, if Nintendo just released all of their games onto a portable, there would be saturation. The games would eat into the sales of the other ones, and therefore none would sell well.

[Arbok]

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Originally posted by: Caliban
... later I went to check the forums from planetgamecube.com and I just burst into laughter with all the Wee jokes"

As mantidor said, that doesn't sound like the response I saw at all. There was a lot of concern being addressed about the name because it was generating the response you are complaing about there from other sources, including interviews being conducted with Nintendo PR, of all places, and numerous web comics and communities.

If you want Wee jokes, I can pinpoint you in the direction of many other forums to get your fix... Unless that was just an attempt to elevate the kid at work's opinion over "us", i.e. those who don't agree with the name.

Quote
Originally posted by: IceCold
Sure, they're not making much profit from the console market, but it is what keeps so many of their workers employed. Those people can't just work on portable games - there isn't a big enough market in that area. Also, if Nintendo just released all of their games onto a portable, there would be saturation. The games would eat into the sales of the other ones, and therefore none would sell well.

The Japanese, in general, hate to lay off workers, which is why Sony doing just that made such waves in the head lines. When it comes to making cutbacks, they simply cut hours from workers as opposed to sending them to the curb. If they did get rid of the console secotor - which I doubt they will - this is what I would expect them to do.

Secondly, as mentioned by TYP, if handhelds increased in power even more, won't this make them viable to be sold against both the current handheld market and consoles? If the next "Game Boy" is slightly more powerful than a Gamecube, cheaper then its console counterparts, and portable... wouldn't that start to look like a real good replacement for traditional consoles that now seem weighed down by "having" to have a hooked up TV to use?

[mantidor]

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Originally posted by: Kairon
That's a pessimistic assumption mantidor.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

I think is quite realistic. Whatever little interest the joe madden had for the Wii was destroyed when the name was announced.

[Caliban]

"As mantidor said, that doesn't sound like the response I saw at all. There was a lot of concern being addressed about the name because it was generating the response you are complaing about there from other sources, including interviews being conducted with Nintendo PR, of all places, and numerous web comics and communities."

Excuse me, but there were alot of wee jokes on this forum even before people actually started debating about Nintendo's marketing strategy, and there's nothing wrong with that, but using it as a way to manifest your disgust at Wii is infantile.

"If you want Wee jokes, I can pinpoint you in the direction of many other forums to get your fix... Unless that was just an attempt to elevate the kid at work's opinion over "us", i.e. those who don't agree with the name."

You know, I could just as easily insult you too. If you didn't understand my point, too bad, next!

I don't have anything against anyone here on PGC, I love it here, it's just that alot of you changed so drastically in opinion about Nintendo that it seemed irrational to me. I know the name might be wierd, and you guys/gals might be against it but if most of you are going to buy the system what's the point of arguing against it? I intend to play games and not stare at the logo.  

[Kairon]

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Originally posted by: mantidor

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Originally posted by: Kairon
That's a pessimistic assumption mantidor.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

I think is quite realistic. Whatever little interest the joe madden had for the Wii was destroyed when the name was announced.

A rose by any other name would smell just as sweet Mantidor, and I think you are completely ignoring the possibility of madden finding a significant audience on the Wii due not only to the idea that you can actually, physically, stiff arm a guy with the Wii, but also coupled with the fact that Nintendo is looking to find more gamers, whether or not those gamers are my dad, my room-mate (a depart-edgamer in denial), or a stranger just strolling through a mall.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[Arbok]

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Originally posted by: Caliban
You know, I could just as easily insult you too. If you didn't understand my point, too bad, next!

I never made any effort or had any intent to insult you, I was merely making my comment in reaction to this:

"This kid I was speaking with is 16 years old, and he's acting with more maturity than most people have reacted in these forums."

A response in reaction to the "fact" that many, not some but most after all, are not being mature about it.  Again, we by in large haven't reverted to "wee" jokes, and have been much more civil about this then any other video game forum where I have seen this brought up, even though tension has been very high here and people have almost dipped into personal insults on one or two occasions.

If you want to look at early responses and see how many "wee" jokes were made, I would encourage looking at topics like this:

http://www.planetgamecube.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=28&threadid=15716

Where it's clear that the general reaction was more shock then anything else, before more serious talk about it began.

Quote
Originally posted by: Caliban
I know the name might be wierd, and you guys/gals might be against it but if most of you are going to buy the system what's the point of arguing against it? I intend to play games and not stare at the logo.

What's the point of talking about sales? Why is there a DS sales thread in the DS forum?

[Caliban]

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Originally posted by: Arbok
What's the point of talking about sales? Why is there a DS sales thread in the DS forum?

I don't know, I don't even post in that thread,  to me it's pointless anyway, but it's there 'cause there are those that like to discuss it.

I never made any effort or had any intent to insult you, I was merely making my comment in reaction to this:

"This kid I was speaking with is 16 years old, and he's acting with more maturity than most people have reacted in these forums."

A response in reaction to the "fact" that many, not some but most after all, are not being mature about it. Again, we by in large haven't reverted to "wee" jokes, and have been much more civil about this then any other video game forum where I have seen this brought up, even though tension has been very high here and people have almost dipped into personal insults on one or two occasions.

If you want to look at early responses and see how many "wee" jokes were made, I would encourage looking at topics like this:

http://www.planetgamecube.com/forums/messageview.cfm?catid=28&threadid=15716

Where it's clear that the general reaction was more shock then anything else, before more serious talk about it began.

Oh I know this forum has been much more civil than other forums. And shock is the right word to describe what happened. However...well I'm not gonna discuss this anymore, because it will just be another discussion stuck in a loop.

[Smash_Brother]

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Originally posted by: Caliban Oh I know this forum has been much more civil than other forums. And shock is the right word to describe what happened. However...well I'm not gonna discuss this anymore, because it will just be another discussion stuck in a loop.

To be honest, I'm glad to hear there are people out there like him, but he's a rarity. You're just not going to find all that many 16 year olds who aren't horrified that they'd somehow ruin their image by being associated with a product with a name they consider childish.

I'd befriend that guy if I were you. Sounds like a level-headed individual.

[IceCold]

Caliban is making the most sense here.. Whatever your qualms about the name, many people were getting quite irrational in the past few days.

[Caliban]

I just really don't care anymore, end of discussion for me, and it's time to energize for E3.

[wandering]

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Originally posted by: Smash_Brother
I've seldom seen a counter-argument saying "The will will succeed because of _________."

I'll bite.

Wii will succed because it is easy to remember.
Because, in being simple, it is not intimidating.
Because it can't be abbreviated and so doesn't have a secret code word that gamers refer to it by and non-gamers feel closed out by.
Because the dancing i's are cool.
Because there are a million cool taglines to be had by replacing 'we' with 'wii'.
Because most teenagers won't make wee-wee jokes for fear of being looked on as childish.
Because, for most young men ('joe madden') the name doesn't really sound tiku tiku tiku!  or homosexual in any definite capacity.
Because most people couldn't give a sh*t about stupid names (other supercial details like the look of the console are much more important).

[odifiend]

It actually doesn't sound so bad when Nintendo prefaces it - The "Nintendo Wii".  I was flipping by G4 and it sounds good mentioned along side the PS3.  (All the console names rhyme now)  I wouldn't have paid a firm to make me the name, but it just isn't that bad.

[vudu]

Quote
Originally posted by: RickPowers

Quote
I'm POSITIVE that there are higher-ups at Nintendo who must be pushing for the elimination of the home console and the focus to be placed entirely on the vastly more successful handheld console line. If Nintendo took the resources they've been investing in the home console market and put it into handhelds, they'd likely get far more return for their money. If the wii doesn't outsell the GC, I wouldn't be at all surprised if Nintendo just packed their bags and left the home console market.

Very astute theory, Smash_Brother.  I salute you.

Note that while he doesn't implicity say it, it wouldn't be an issue of whether Wii was profitable or not.  It would simply be an issue of ROI, and opportunity costs, and that the money could be better spent fattening up the existing cash-cow rather than trying to get this old girl to breed.

Terrible analogy, but I think the point stands.  Nintendo knows on which side their bread is buttered.

That doesn’t make any sense at all.  If Nintendo executives wanted to sabotage the Wii, they would have done it back in the development stage and not in the product launch stage.

Besides, what do they have to gain by lowering the ROI of the Wii?  If they didn’t try to sabotage the system one of two outcomes would occur—either (a) the system would have a lower ROI than their handheld efforts (naturally; without sabotage) or (b) the system would have a higher ROI than their handheld systems.  If it’s the first scenario then they have an excuse to discontinue the home console line.  If it’s the second scenario, then they’re making more money than they would on a handheld system and there’s no need to sabotage it in the first place.  

The only feasible reason why someone would want to sabotage the system launch would be if they had a personal vendetta against people involved with the launch.  From a purely business perspective it makes no sense at all.

[Smash_Brother]

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Originally posted by: vudu That doesn’t make any sense at all.  If Nintendo executives wanted to sabotage the Wii, they would have done it back in the development stage and not in the product launch stage.

Besides, what do they have to gain by lowering the ROI of the Wii?  If they didn’t try to sabotage the system one of two outcomes would occur—either (a) the system would have a lower ROI than their handheld efforts (naturally; without sabotage) or (b) the system would have a higher ROI than their handheld systems.  If it’s the first scenario then they have an excuse to discontinue the home console line.  If it’s the second scenario, then they’re making more money than they would on a handheld system and there’s no need to sabotage it in the first place.  

The only feasible reason why someone would want to sabotage the system launch would be if they had a personal vendetta against people involved with the launch.  From a purely business perspective it makes no sense at all.

No one said anything about intentional sabotage. I just mean that, if the Wii doesn't outperform the Cube, it'll be the third home console in which Nintendo has lost market share and those execs will probably say, "F-it!" and demand that all of Nintendo's resources be put toward making it the best handheld gaming company that it can be.

Sorry, Wandering, but I'm giving your reply to the "Non-Deterministic State Machine":

1. Wii will succed because it is easy to remember.
2. Because, in being simple, it is not intimidating.
3. Because it can't be abbreviated and so doesn't have a secret code word that gamers refer to it by and non-gamers feel closed out by.
4. Because the dancing i's are cool.
5. Because there are a million cool taglines to be had by replacing 'we' with 'wii'.
6. Because most teenagers won't make wee-wee jokes for fear of being looked on as childish.
7. Because, for most young men ('joe madden') the name doesn't really sound tiku tiku tiku! or homosexual in any definite capacity.
8. Because most people couldn't give a sh*t about stupid names (other supercial details like the look of the console are much more important).

1. False. One syllable names are among the very EASIEST to forget. Also irrelevant, unless Nintendo doesn't offer kiosks and people will have to remember it SOLELY from commercials.

2. False. Wii is not simple. It is complex because even Nintendo cannot make a website about it without a paragraph of explanation. It's questionable how to pronounce it and the name does not relate at all to the product it represents. If people aren't even sure how to say it, how can they NOT be intimidated by it?

3. False. This is a hinderance. People saying "I play on the we." or "What's out for we?" sound like they're talking like Eddie Brock (aka Venom) referring to himself in the plural. I try to avoid sounding like a video game obsessed geek whenever possible and loved to shorten Nintendo's consoles to "GC" and "DS". Now I'll just sound like I have no grasp of the english language.

4. Irrelevant. You cannot assume that anyone has seen or will see the commercials. The letters in "Revolution" could have been made to act out gaming actions just as easily.

5. True. People will probably find the heinous puns endearing.

6. False. Teenagers will likely make jokes about the "wee" to no end, extending those jokes to the people who play it and all products associated with it. After forgetting about the console for a while, the jokes will seem fresh to these teenagers as soon as the subject comes up again.

7. False. The foundation of advertising in the United States is insecurity. If the customer feels insecure, then they can be convinced to buy products which will make them more secure with themselves. This is the reason why image sells products like iPods and PSPs. In the American mindset, it is impossible to own a product without that product reflecting on the person who purchased it. The "wee" will fall under this same scrutiny.

8. False. See #7, though I admit that people are more likely to see past the name if the product itself is exceptional.