Topic: So, do you think Wi-Fi Connection will actually go anywhere?

[NotSoStu]

Let's face it: Nintendo has a long history of connectivity features that were never persued. Let's go through a little list, shall we? I'm just writing this down as it comes to my mind. GBA-GCN linking, E-Reader, Gameboy Camera/Gameboy Printer, LAN'd together GCNs, 64DD, GBC infrared, N64 transfer pack, Satellaview, GBA wireless adapter, GBC cell phone adapter, the infamous GCN broadband adapter, etc.

Think WFC will really be pursued by Nintendo? I mean, it has a hell of a better chance than the other things I've listed (E-Reader? Who the hell thought that would sell?!), but the fact that there's only 4 announced games using it isn't really a good sign, IMO. Think it really has a future? MKDS online is cool and all, but the four-player limit is sort of disappointing. I think this bottleneck will become a problem for Nintendo in the future, and may eventually be the WFC's downfall.

Oh, and "Nintendo Wi-Fi Connection?" Dumbest name choice ever. People have started to associate Wi-Fi with everything wireless, be it 802.11*, BlueTooth, or RF. And even then, even if that misconception wasn't there, does "WFC" really roll off the tongue as easily as "Xbox Live?" Nintendo needs a catchphrase. I mean, my mother's stopped calling my GCN a Nintendo and started calling it an Xbox.

[ShyGuy]

I think the biggest difference between wifi and the connectivity features you mentioned is the fact that WiFi is built into the DS, not an addon component.

Third parties will see the success of Mario Kart and Animal Crossing and hop on board.  

[Mario]

They really have no choice but to go all out with this, this IS their online plan.

I'm very pleased with the online software, MKDS online is incredibly fun, I don't care about the little things like 4 player limit and stuff, the one thing i dislike is how unstable the actual connection is. First, you can go online with wireless routers, yet only a handful are actually supported and most of those require lots of configuration. Then there's the USB Connector, which is frustrating the hell out of me at the moment, and i've seen a LOT of people having problems with it, considering this is Nintendo's official device this is very concerning to me, i'm really hoping everything with that gets ironed out by the time it hits retail, or Nintendos credibility is going to be at risk. Seriously i've NEVER had a major problem with an official Nintendo product until now.

Hotspots are good, i'm impressed with how they've managed that, but when the Revolution comes will we be able to take it to McDonalds? I'm pretty sure there's going to be other ways to connect Revolution to the internet though, at least I hope there will be.

Nintendo WiFi Connection / WFC looks good in text, but saying it feels a bit odd. It's too late to change it now though, at least for the DS.

Oh, and YES I think it will go everywhere, a ton of people are going to use it, though their experiences with it will vary.

[Hostile Creation]

I think they're dealing with online in a more serious manner, and it's something more people are interested in than, say, E-Reader or connectivity.  So I think it'll go places (haven't nearly half who bought Mario Kart played it online?), but from what I've heard they still have to work out some kinks.  Hopefully conditions will improve and they'll be able to include more online content, too.

[Ian Sane]

Most of Nintendo's extra features flop because they're either so proprietary that they're almost useless or they're not supported by Nintendo in any serious way.  By proprietary stuff I mean like the GBA wireless adapter.  Games had to be programmed to use it so was almost useless.  The Cube broadband adapter falls into the "not supported by Nintendo worth a crap" category.

But while linking between a console and a portable and swiping barcodes are largely useless features no one ever asked for online play is something that both gamers and third parties want.  This isn't just Nintendo trying to sell us something.  This is a feature now considered mandatory for gaming systems.  And Nintendo has actually supported it well with a major killer app for the DS.  At least on the DS Wi-Fi is here to stay.

The Rev is a different matter.  Wi-Fi on a console is nifty but largely useless.  No one is going to be bring the Rev to McDonald's.  Hot spots for the Rev are a waste of time.  The Rev shown at E3 did not have an ethernet jack and Nintendo constantly pushed "Wi-Fi" in their speech.  Thus it is a common assumption that the Rev is Wi-Fi only.  This makes no sense as much more people have "wired" broadband than wireless.  Wi-Fi makes sense on a portable because you carry it everywhere but not on a console.  If the Rev is Wi-Fi only then I think there will be problems.  But on the DS everything should be fine as is.  

[UncleBob]

Why does everyone diss my beloved e-Reader?  I mean, comeon!  There were over 1,100 cards released for it!  How many NES cartridges were there?  Heck, how many GB/GBC cartridges are there?!?

Comeon... Give the e-Reader some kind of respect.  

Oh, and aren't "LAN'd together GCNs" and "the infamous GCN broadband adapter" pretty much the same thing?  Not quite, but they fall in the same catagory.

[MrAustin]

I think it will be a huge success, regardless of whether the Rev has wired broadband or not.  My house has been wireless for almost two years now.  I am running a Linksys WRT54G router with DHCP and a dynamic IP address.  I had ZERO issues setting up wireless play on my DS (read: turned the system on; worked).

I know wireless networks cost money, but honestly this technology has been around for years, and it's about time that people adopt it.  I would much rather have Nintendo build wifi into their next-gen system than having to spend $99 to buy an adapter to make it wireless (ala Xbox ThreeShitty).  On the flip side, I don't see why Nintendo would forego the $5 to include a basic 10/100 ethernet port, but it appears that they are going to do just that.

Quote
Originally posted by: UncleBob
Oh, and aren't "LAN'd together GCNs" and "the infamous GCN broadband adapter" pretty much the same thing?  Not quite, but they fall in the same catagory.

They utilize the same peripheral, but the GCN did use the broadband adapter for PSO, so it's a different purpose on those two points.

[Pale]

There are a couple things Nintendo needs to fix about it, but it is definately a great start.

1.  They need to fix nintendowifi.com, as interesting as it is to know when i logged on last, I'd like a little bit more.  Here they should take a page out of what the new X-Box live is doing.  We need sig images that say what gamess we are playing and whether or not we are online in real time.  Give me access to the server logs and I'll write it for you Nintendo!

2.  Match making in mario kart needs some work.  There needs to be a buddy list and a way to request games if people are playing other people.  It should also be possible for players to log themselves onto the wifi connection, then play single player until one of their friends pop on.

As I said, I'm happy that the technology is in place, and I hope that every game from here on out improves on it.  Also, just to show a differing opinion to some that have already been stated, my router works flawlessly.. I never drop connections.  Also, after wiring a 100 foot ethernet cable from my upstairs office, through air ducts into my basement, then back up through the floor into my living room for my ps2, I'm looking forward to the Rev being wireless.  It ISN'T a pointless feature.  (I won't argue that wired shouldn't be an option though.)

[Darkheart]

Quote
but the fact that there's only 4 announced games using it isn't really a good sign, IMO

Nope already confirmed that Lost Magic, Bleach Ds, and the new Harvest Moon will support WFC!  You have to realize they just probably put together the online devs together this year.  Give the developers some time to get it implemented in together.  I bet you 10 dollars we have at least 10 more WFC titles announced/shown at E3 next year.  

[Ian Sane]

"I know wireless networks cost money, but honestly this technology has been around for years, and it's about time that people adopt it."

A lot of us said the same thing about broadband period when Nintendo was initially showing reluctance in taking the Cube online.  This very type of arguement is happening right now with the Rev regarding the lack of HD support.  Yet if you mention that issue tons of Nintendo defenders pop out of the woodwork to tow the company line and support Nintendo's decision to not include it.  So for HD it's "well not enough people use it yet" but with Wi-Fi it's "get with the times and upgrade your technology"?  It's pretty dumb for Nintendo to do one thing regarding one issue and then take the exact opposite stance on the other one.  Both are unnecessarily restrictive of course.  Neither decision, even if they seem to be polar opposites, is even remotely flexible or user friendly.

[Pale]

It's true of both.  Not enough people use HD to make it worth it (after significant research I'm sure) for Nintendo to do it.  Not enough people have WiFi that not including wired ethernet in the Rev would be stupid.

To try and get into Nintendo's head a bit, I think that they decided to jump on this term WiFi because they feel it is a buzzword that will help them sell their online plan.  MS doesn't have WiFi!  There is a lot of ignorance in this thinking, but it does have some grounds from a marketing standpoint.  That said, there is a difference between only talking about WiFi in an attempt at differentiation, and only including WiFi in the device in an attempt at differentiation.  My thinking is that Nintendo is taking the former approach rather that the later.  I bet we will see wired ethernet in the final model, but Nintendo's ads won't ever mention it because they will be pushing the WiFi connection brand (no matter how bad of a brand name some may think it is, it does have a distinct differentiation when comparing it to X-Box Live) as a way to get online with both your DS and your Rev.

So again, I'm gonna ask Ian to stop spewing forth that the Rev won't include wired, because no one knows for sure.  If it actually comes out ONLY wireless, I will write a 1,000 word essay on why Ian is always correct.

[Ian Sane]

"To try and get into Nintendo's head a bit, I think that they decided to jump on this term WiFi because they feel it is a buzzword that will help them sell their online plan. MS doesn't have WiFi! There is a lot of ignorance in this thinking, but it does have some grounds from a marketing standpoint."

I think that's likely too.  Plus Nintendo just spent the last generation bashing "online" to try to convince their fans why it was a good idea that they didn't support it.  They would look like hypocrites if they suddenly starting pushing "online".  If they push "Wi-Fi" then it's something "different".  Like this is "better" and is what Nintendo was waiting for.

So it could just be a buzzword.  The reason I'm assuming that the Rev will be Wi-Fi only is because it's a stupid restriction and sadly Nintendo has a reputation for enforcing stupid restrictions for no good reason.  Hell they're doing it with the no HD support so it's not like there's strong evidence to suggest Nintendo has changed in that sense.

[Pale]

Calling no HD support stupid is relative to your/our position on the issue though.  To all of us it seems stupid because we want the possibility to be there, but I'm sure Nintendo made the decision based on the fact that it would require more computing power which means a higher cost.  Someone decided that this higher cost wasn't worth pleasing their HD-capable fan base... but I'm just beating a dead horse now.  The moral of the story is that, at best, the population of this forum only sees issues from two perspectives, the player, and in some ways, the developer.  Sadly, in most businesses, these persepectives come in last and second to last respectively on their list of priorities.

This thinking, though frustrating, has allowed Nintendo to weather the storm (which some may argue is caused by this thinking) financially, which isn't all bad.

[Plugabugz]

I'm sorry but Nintendo WiFi Europe is absolutely pathetic.

If after 2 weeks after Tony Hawk launches, [and almost 7 days after] Mario Kart this is all we get, then I don't understand why they bothered launching in the first place.

I specificially decided to wait because I wanted to find information on whether my router is compatible, and coming soon for at least 3 weeks doesn't help me.

[Ian Sane]

"I'm sure Nintendo made the decision based on the fact that it would require more computing power which means a higher cost."

Yeah but Nintendo themselves doesn't have to make HD games.  They just have to have the Rev support it so that third parties can use it if they want to.  That's the big difference between how Nintendo should do things and how they do.  When Nintendo doesn't want to use something they don't just not use it.  They decide that NO ONE will and should use it and that's reason number one why they're in last place and Sony's in first.  It's stupid because Nintendo's whole fall from being the market leader is directly related to their "we decide what's best for everyone" attitude.  So to continue with this attitude means Nintendo hasn't learned from their mistakes and not learning from your mistakes is stupid, particularly when you've had almost ten years to do so.

The effect on Nintendo for including HD support with their console and putting an ethernet jack on it is minimal.  Their inclusion does add to their hardware costs but does not affect their game development and will not increase their game development costs.  They don't suffer from including these options but gamers and developers do suffer from their exclusion.  Thus they are needless stupid restrictions.

[UncleBob]

However, if the Revolution "supports" HD, then Nintendo has to make the hardware powerful enough where it can actually take advantage of the HD.  Which means a higher cost.  It doesn't matter if Nintendo doesn't program any HD games - if Nintendo throws in lackluster HD support (like, say, GameCube's online plan) then it'd be useless.

[vudu]

I was going to say something, but UncleBob pretty much summed it up.  Nice going.

[UncleBob]

And yet, still no one gives my e-Reader the love it deserves...

[PaLaDiN]

"The effect on Nintendo for including HD support with their console... is minimal."

Start quoting some prices and I'll listen to your unfounded crap.

[Shecky]

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
The Rev is a different matter.  Wi-Fi on a console is nifty but largely useless.  No one is going to be bring the Rev to McDonald's.  Hot spots for the Rev are a waste of time.  The Rev shown at E3 did not have an ethernet jack and Nintendo constantly pushed "Wi-Fi" in their speech.  Thus it is a common assumption that the Rev is Wi-Fi only.  This makes no sense as much more people have "wired" broadband than wireless.  Wi-Fi makes sense on a portable because you carry it everywhere but not on a console.  If the Rev is Wi-Fi only then I think there will be problems.  But on the DS everything should be fine as is.

This statement makes absolutely no f'ing sense.

"WiFi" is not a _useless_ addition.  You don't have to travel to "hotspots" to use it, and Nintendo is never going to promote hotspots to bring your Revolution too.  Plain and simple, WiFi is a marketing name for a very useful piece of technology that allows you to network devices without the need to run a cable between them.  It is more versatile than a wired only solution.  Your statement of "If the Rev is Wi-Fi only then I think there will be problems" is a complete handwaving.  Clearly, offering both wireless and wired connections offers the greatest flexibility to the end user, but if you could only have one, then wireless would be the way to go.  People don't see the cost of slapping on a NIC card to each console as a big thing, but when your making millions of these units it adds up *quick*.  Nintendo might feel that it's a safe corner to shave, and I can't say that I'd blame them.  To many people the cost of running a wire, is either impossible or very close to cost of installing a wireless solution (check your local store for the cost of a 50' ethernet cable).  Furthermore the system at E3 was guaranteed to be a prototype and the existence or lack of ports means nothing.  Nintendo may decide to include an ethernet jack for the final build, thus rendering this whole discussion moot.

My point is that built in wireless access is a good thing and by NO means "largely useless."

Personally I'm disappointed with the Xbox 360's lack of wireless networking.  To me it's a cheap way of lessening the cost for Microsoft and would require me to do what someone has mentioned already, buy a wireless bridge (which, by the way, are even more outrageously marked up than the cost of ethernet cables! )  

[Renny]

Well that's because the Xbox 360 wireless network adapter includes 802.11a support; for super-high speed, super-short range wireless ethernet. Streat video from your Windows MCE PC all the way across the room!

[Artimus]

This thread is silly and pointless.

[Shecky]

Quote
Originally posted by: Artimus
This thread is silly and pointless.

I agree

[ruby_onix]

Quote
Originally posted by: UncleBob
However, if the Revolution "supports" HD, then Nintendo has to make the hardware powerful enough where it can actually take advantage of the HD.  Which means a higher cost.  It doesn't matter if Nintendo doesn't program any HD games - if Nintendo throws in lackluster HD support (like, say, GameCube's online plan) then it'd be useless.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v291/rubyonix/main/project6420051124045339653zm.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v291/rubyonix/main/project6420051124050007929gn.jpg

Not possible on Rev's Virtual Console.

Only 4 Xbox360.  

[Jensen]

Quote
The Rev is a different matter. Wi-Fi on a console is nifty but largely useless. No one is going to be bring the Rev to McDonald's. Hot spots for the Rev are a waste of time. The Rev shown at E3 did not have an ethernet jack and Nintendo constantly pushed "Wi-Fi" in their speech. Thus it is a common assumption that the Rev is Wi-Fi only. This makes no sense as much more people have "wired" broadband than wireless. Wi-Fi makes sense on a portable because you carry it everywhere but not on a console. If the Rev is Wi-Fi only then I think there will be problems. But on the DS everything should be fine as is.

I think more people have wireless than have a 40ft cat5 cable running from their computer modem to the console by the TV in the living room.  And for people who have neither(which is most people), wireless is likely the cheaper and simpler option.

And wifi does add portability too!  Bring your WiFi Revo to your friends house for a low hassle LAN party.

And it means no wires connectivity between the DS and the Revolution.