Topic: No Hi-def resolution, Nintendo's cost benefit analysis

[nemo_83]

I thought I read somewhere that Nintendo's DVD addon would in fact add hd and blueray support (for movies).

[Galford]

I should clearify myself, I was going by the original ATSC that were published in the late 90s.  
Back then ,everything ATSC purposed was considering was considered HDTV.  
It's only in the last 5 years that HD has "started" at 720p, mainly for marketing reasons.  

EDTV is something that has just recently cropped up as a way for TV manufactures to ease the transition to so called "HDTV".

About broadcast formats, in 2008 the FCC is mandating that all TVs pick up digtal broadcasts.  Over those digital signals anything from 480p to 1080p can be broadcast.  Also, many new TVs support 480p right now.

This debate could go on forever, why not talk about VSB-8 vs DVB vs QAM256
or how ATVEF will be the red-headed step child of digital broadcasting???

PS - Thanks anubis6789 for the link.

[ThePerm]

every generation is different...a 300 price range is way different than a 400 price range..is way different than a 200 price range...at 400 bucks...alot of gamers wont be able to afford a new system. They may just go for the cheaper system....

gamecube was different...

honestly though...this is more of a pr war than a fact war

ain im talking usd not aud


All nintendo needed was the Zelda thats coming out now and not WW....i loved WW but it wasnt a system seller...for most it was a turn off.

[Dirk Temporo]

Gamecube had hi-def. At least to a point. I have the first generation, with hi-def. Guess how many times I've used it.

Go ahead, guess.

Right, NONE. I don't OWN a hi-def TV. NOBODY I know owns a hi-def TV.

[ThePerm]

heres what i gather

if it connects to a monitor there must be some sort of hi rez output...

on average perrin kapplan doesnt know what she is talking about

there isn't going to be a digital out port...but guess what...it doesnt matter.
anolog signals can be converted to digital and not the other way around.

http://theperm.tetrametrics.com/Images/anologvsgidigtal.gif

so that pretty much means a hi-rez signal can be sent through the port....

and the big news about xbox 360 was that it REQUIRED hi-def...Perrin Kapplan was probably misquoted..and she meant to say it wasnt required of devlopers. However, she blurbs alot ...so...
who knows.

"It is accurate that at this time we will not support high-definition [on Revolution]," confirms Nintendo of America's vice president of corporate affairs, Perrin Kaplan.

the whole [on revolution]  part is added in either by the newsletter editor or ign...it could be completely taken outy of context..my point is Nintendo the company might not have it in their games..but that doesnt mean it wont be in other games..or it wont exist...i think people should really wait until there is a big press conference because all we are hearing is ambiguous phrases...and then people like matt from ign are writing 3 page articles because news is slow and they are really bored...because seriously..what they do..and how they get paid....they have nothing better to do right now..and its sad. Gamecube is pretty much riding into the sunset and there isnt a steady flow of info from Nintendo.

[Stimutacs Addict]

the rev lacks high def support.. great. Sony and microsoft will be lacking gyro controls and possibly good 3d gaming... its about an even split

[Jensen]

I think this will hurt one of Nintendo's current advantages: Multiplayer on a single screen.  When I play Mario Kart with three other people, each player gets a 240i display, and it isn't a perfect digital signal.  Even when playing SSBM, it can be hard for newbies to track their characters in a 4 player game.

Casual, non-gamers are more likely to play split screen games, and resolution helps you see what is going on.

The main reason that there are so few HDTVs is that there is almost no content for them... it is why I held off on getting one.  But.... HD-DVDs will start coming out by the end of this year, and the two consoles that support HDTV will be out within a year.  And almost anyone that will get a next-gen console already has an HDTV....their computer monitor.

Adding more resolution to a game is virtually free for development costs (except that the console might not be fast enough to handle an HD resolution with the same detail).  I've tried a couple of n64 roms at 1920*1200 on my new computer monitor, and they look great.

I was hoping I could play Gamecube games at 720p on the Revolution, that would be a nice feature.

I just don't get Nintendo's stratagy for releasing info about the console...  They have only revealed what will make it worse than other consoles (less power because of the smaller size, no HD) without releasing anything good to counterbalance the info.... they should just not say anything)

[trip1eX]

Well seeing as how the Cube (nitially) supported 480p I don't see how it could be any lower.  480p isn't hi-def but looks good especially if they throw in some AA.   Also they are throwing in VGA support.  So I'm a bit skeptical as to why they would do that if no higher resolutions will be supported.  And are they talking from purely a hardware point of view or are they talking that most of their software won't be designed for it?  

NIntendo makes a good pt tho.  Or that analyst does.  Alot of the processing power jump from the xbox to the 360 will be used merely to support the jump in resolution.  IF they kept at the same resolution they'd be able to put alot more effects on the screen and have more objects moving around from leaves to grass etc.  

And others have made the pt that even if you have an hdtv you probably only have one.  HOw many that have one will do most of their gaming on it?  I know when I get one I won't be the only using it.  I have  a wife and son.  I do most of my console gaming on a 23" TV in my computer room.  

[Bill Aurion]

Quote
Originally posted by: The Omen

Quote
This topic is still ****ing retarded...You guys shoudn't be playing videogames, it's pathetic...

Options? Want options? Here's some for you

1) Shut up
2) Go make a sandwich
3) Fap to TVs
4) Rip your internet out of the wall

Had you yourself followed these rules, we wouldn't have to deal with your constant Nintendo P.R.

Obviously, these rules only apply to others, though...

Oh, considering this is a Nintendo forum one would expect to see more people like me...It's pretty ****ing sad that I'm the black sheep here, isn't it?  This is a forum about VIDEOGAMES and it should stay like that...Talking about TVs is POINTLESS and DOES NOT AFFECT GAMING...

[RABicle]

Well said Birry. These crybabies, most of all Aussiedude, a disgrace to Australia, are all overreacting. Even if this article isn't rubbish and Revolution doens't support HD, it's not like HDTVs wont support Revolution.

[Urkel]

I've finally found words worthy of a sig...

[Truthliesn1seyes]

Everyone just let them piss and moan.  This is typical NIntendo fanboy rants.  I am a Nintendo fanboy but I've never been the type to throw a hissy fit over such slight news.  This news has gotten all the closet graphic whores all worked up and out in the open.  They have forgoten that its about the games.  As long as I can play Zelda, Mario, and all of Nintendo's other games, I don't care how its being displayed.  I just want my Nintendo games.  These people are like pain in the ass girlfreinds, they are never satisfied no matter what you do.  Its a lose lose situation to them.  

We complained about NIntendo not going online and here we have Nintendo giving us a free online service

We were dieing for them to bring mario kart, animal crossing, and super smash brothers (among other games) online and here we have Nintendo giving that to us.

Nintendo went a step ahead of our expectations and instead of providing just backwards comp with the Gcube, they give it to us for all their previous consoles.  

Who knows what else they have up there sleeve but look at what they are giving us now.  More than what we've been asking for in yrs.  Yet we still have all these negative nancies complaining about no HD.  Big f*cking woop.  Go buy your ps3s and xbox 360s then and miss out on future zeldas, marios, metriods and whatever else since you can't have them in the "oh so amazing" high def.  

The way I see it, all you people are just looking for reasons to justify your overpriced purchases in the HDtvs.  You already can watch dvds in hi def, you can play ps3 and Xbox 360 games in hi def.  too bad you cant play Rev games in it though.  Tough, you don't get everything you want in life.  Learn to accept it.  Its not a big a deal as you putting it out to be.  At the end of the day, your going to buy a Rev regardless of it having HD or not.  If you don't then I don't consider you to be a true gamer.  

[PaLaDiN]

In all fairness, I don't think anybody here's enough of a jackass to let this personally determine their decision.

It's just that we're worried this will mean less dev support or less console sales leading to less dev support, which would mean less games.

[Ian Sane]

"Oh, considering this is a Nintendo forum one would expect to see more people like me"

Yes, that would be fun.  An entire forum of people who agree with 100% of everything Nintendo does.  THAT would make for some interesting conversations.

The fact that everyone here doesn't have the same opinion is what makes things interesting.  It would just be a bunch of boring patting Nintendo on the back otherwise.

As for the arguement that a real gamer wouldn't concern himself over something like HDTV, don't think of this as an arguement about the merits of HD.  This is about Nintendo not including a feature that the competition is including and the impact such a move would have on us, the potential Rev owners.  No HD means potential lost sales which means lower userbase and market share which means crappier third party support.  It is in our best interests that the Rev sells well.  The higher market share a console has, the more benefits and options the userbase has.  The lower the market share, the less games the userbase has to choose from and there are numerous annoying problems that come with being the last place console (ie: crappy rental selection).  

[Talon]

Ian is right, the fact that if Nintendo doesnt allow for support of HDTV gaming in their console whether or not they wish to implement it, will reduce sales.

Id say the majority of people that buy consoles would make their purchases based on the person selling them the console.  Whether Nintendo believe their console is so totally different from their competitors or not the fact is its going to be compared to the other two.  Now when a sales clerk says "Both PS3 and XBOX360 will have HDTV support and the revolution wont" immediately the customer will shun the revolution over the other two, even if the customer doesnt know what HDTV is.  Nintendo dont want to alienate themselves like the way they did without dvd playback, which really worked wonders in selling PS2s.

Rather than give people reasons not to buy your console, Nintendo you should be giving them reasons to buy your console.  It all comes down to education and unless your a hardcore gamer (where im pretty sure your mind will have already been made up to which console you buy) chances are you know little if anything at all about the hardware specs and features of all three consoles and will rely on the clerk behind the sales desk to help make your decision.

Im sure the cost of having this feature included in the hardware is not going to exponentially blow out the price of  making the console and could be reflected in the price  to the consumer.

That being said my opinion is that Nintendo themselves wont support HDTV but I think they will include it in their console for other developers to implement. Although history shows us that if Nintendo is not willing to support it chances are that none of their developers (2nd or 3rd) will either, like online support.

[anubis6789]

Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion

Oh, considering this is a Nintendo forum one would expect to see more people like me...It's pretty ****ing sad that I'm the black sheep here, isn't it?  This is a forum about VIDEOGAMES and it should stay like that...Talking about TVs is POINTLESS and DOES NOT AFFECT GAMING...

To me this whole HD thing is a non issue, I will buy a REV anyway, the only thing I want is p-scan, but to say that a type of display feature does not affect VIDEO games is a joke.

I also find myself agreeing with Ian. If everyone agreed with everyone else on this forum, the forum would not exist. Hell, one of the reasons I come to this forum is to see what crazy "the-sky-is-falling" thing Ian will say next because I usually do not agree with him. No offense to Ian of course.

Like I said, to me the whole HD thing is a non-issue, and I am not alone. Most people I know that have HDTV's don't hook up any of thier game systems to it with anything more than an S-video cable. This is not DVD playback, this is not online, and this is not cartridges.

By the way Galford your welcome.

[Rocketsastrostexans]

Well.....didn't Nintendo say they would support computer monitors?
A good ole computer (svga) monitor is far better than any HD TV......the only reason this is true is because you already own it.
Just because the monitor is smaller than a HD TV means little (if your cheap like me) all you got to do is get closer to the screen and everthing will be allright........believe me I know.

As as matter of fact.....the only reason they made the HD-TV standard is to make a new market.........companies would make less $ if SVGA was adopted over HD-TV.  Thats one win for the lobbiest and corrupt politicians.  At least thats my theory (warning: I may be full of crap....of course I did not research this because I am to lazy

[ShyGuy]

Okay, I don't know if this has been brought up yet But Nintendo did "confirm" High-Def right before E3
http://www.planetgamecube.com/news.cfm?action=item&id=6255

Unlike GameCube, the new system will play DVD's, Ms. Kaplan said, and will feature a wireless controller. It will play GameCube games as well as a new class of high-definition games, with new emphasis on online play.

From Perrin's mouth herself! I really get the feeling that Perrin Kaplan has no idea at ALL about the products she promotes..    

[WindyMan]

I let my head clear after I heard about the news, and can now say some important things on the matter.

There's no doubt in my mind that the Revolution will support 480p.  The GameCube does, and there's no reason that this basic video output shouldn't be supported.  (Then again, Nintendo is no longer making GameCubes with the progressive cable output.)

Not supporting hi-def resolutions will hurt Nintendo in America more than it will help them.  It will greatly help them in Japan and Europe since HDTVs are slow to catch on.  In the end, though, I think it will cost them some third party support, but not as much as the GameCube since a lot of publishers want their games to be online.  The Revolution will be, and that's all that should matter in the beginning.

And that's the funny thing.  Nintendo is pushing for wireless internet, a technology that is in far fewer American homes than HDTV is.  It's big in Japan, though.

Back on track.  One important thing to remember about SD is it doesn't automatically mean 4:3.  Nintendo refuses to put widescreen modes in their games, but any developer that cares will provide a 16:9 option for people who want it.  Since every PS3 and 360 game will almost surely be widescreen (and also be required to work on standard def 4:3 TVs), games should already have a widescreen feature.  All the developer needs to do is offer the option, and all Revolution games should be 16x9 and 480p.  All and all, that's not bad if we're going to get rock-solid consistency.

[anubis6789]

WindyMan, Are you sure that more American homes have HDTVs than WiFi? I know way more people who have WiFi than HDTVs in my area.

It does not really matter though, my area, Austin, my just me more advaned in regard to wireless internet than other areas, just as your area might have more HDTV penetration than other areas. Perhaps it helps that the Austin area cable provider gives out wireless routers for only five extra dollars a month, while getting an HD box is about twenty more dollars.

Regarding Ms. Kaplan's comments, I think that IGN may have taken here comments about HD out of context, or maybe she thought they were refering to HD-DVD or Blu-Ray. I highly doubt a woman that far up in a company would not know what she is talking about... at least I hope.

[Rocketsastrostexans]

Anybody think they will still support computer monitors?

[Mario]

Quote
Originally posted by: Pittbboi

Quote
Originally posted by: PaLaDiN
"Non-gamers aren't going to care about Nintendo's name, or what its console is offering-- when they make the decision on what next generation console to support, they're going to see that the Revolution does not have features that both of the other consoles support--and that's going to be one factor that turns them off."

You're not getting it.

Non-gamers aren't going to make a decision on what next generation console to support, by definition. Nintendo's planning to get unprecedented levels of impulse buying from people who have barely played any games before. Non-gamers will not care about HD... if Nintendo's revolutionary aspect/controller/games really strike a chord with people games have not struck a chord with before, they will buy the revolution over the other two consoles.

And you're contradicting yourself. If Nintendo's revolutionary aspect strikes a chord with them, and they buy it, they're still making a conscious decision to. Non-gamer's brains aren't set to random; they're not stupid. When they buy a console, no matter what, they're going to do SOME level of research and go by what they think they know, whether it be what they read in some biased gaming magazine, what their friends told them, or what the dude at EBGames told them when they walked into the store to purchase a console.

No. Non-gamers aren't going to all of a sudden care about Xbox 360 and PS3 because they can play games in high definition, because they still offer the same way of playing games they weren't interested in this generation. Nintendo's new form of gameplay has the potential to get these people interested.

Quote
Originally posted by: Aussiedude

Quote
Originally posted by: ThePerm
another thing..when it comes out looking dam,n good graphically and its 100-150 dollars cheaper than the other console...and has some crazy innovative feature...then its going to have mroe value to the casual gamer.

Gee you MUST be right.
Just like everyone bought the Gamecube over XBOX and PS2 because it is $150 - $200AUD cheaper, and does not support DVD.

YEAH RIGHT, casual gamers will be happy for sure that revolution does not support HD.

And for the record, I have 40 GCN games, 6 NDS games, 0 PS2 and 0 XBOX games. BUT this will change next gen.

You're going to buy some PS2 games next generation? I donot understand. Or are you implying that unannounced PS3 game is superior to unannounced Revolution game? I still donot understand.

The thing I don't understand most is why people are saying Revolution will get less developer support because of this. Not having the option to have the games playable in HD is just as bad as forcing devs to put HD in their games.  

[Talon]

At this point Nintendo havent stated that they will no longer support computer monitors, so yes I think they will.

Quote
Originally posted by: Mario

The thing I don't understand most is why people are saying Revolution will get less developer support because of this. Not having the option to have the games playable in HD is just as bad as forcing devs to put HD in their games.

There is no truth to this fact.  However alot of people are under the assumption that if Nintendo does not support HDTV that it will lead to less consumers opting to purchase the revolution in favour of other consoles.  Therefore with a small user-base third parties are more likely to shun the revolution because of the lack of potential sales as opposed to other consoles.

 

[Mario]

Also

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
"Oh, considering this is a Nintendo forum one would expect to see more people like me"

Yes, that would be fun.  An entire forum of people who agree with 100% of everything Nintendo does.  THAT would make for some interesting conversations.

No, that entire frame of thinking wouldn't exist, we'd be talking about games not Nintendo's financial and marketing decisions.

[nemo_83]

i need a drink

the attitude monitor

wait, you're not confused enough

twenty

21

some more interesting images

page 26 the text begins



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It appears my time has expired before I was able to finish reading those pattents.