Topic: PS3: gaming takes a backseat

[MaxXUnlimited]

Quote
"The PlayStation [3] is not a game machine. We've never once called it a game machine," stated Kutaragi at the beginning of his latest interview.

"The PS3 is the product we have been aiming for since the establishment of SCEI," said Kutaragi. "We haven't been creating our [past] PlayStations for the sake of games. Our belief, and the motivation behind running our company, has been to [explore ways of] applying the power of computers to entertainment and enjoyment. We equipped the original PlayStation with a 3D graphics chip, and we equipped the PS2 with the Emotion engine. The PS3 isn't designed to lean towards games. It's not a computer for children.

Source

Oh this is sad... so very sad.... I don't think gaming should go this way.... I'm beginning to think that another crash is more and more inevitable. We've been hearing about it for years, it happened once (1983) it can happen again.

[King of Twitch]

but it's called a PLAYYYYStationnnn not a ComputerrrStation.

If there's going to be a crash, I imagine it would be a crash of game developers going bankrupt trying to compete with competitors over increasingly flashy games and non-game buying console users.

[KnowsNothing]

Wow, what an arrogant ass.  There are alot more things I could say right now, but I don't think they really need to be voiced at this point.  It's only a matter of time before Reggie kicks his ass and mounts his head over his fireplace, anyway.  Pronoun confusion much?  I blame Sony.

Ian makes a good point a few posts down! Sony has customers while Nintendo has fans.  This strategy is not a good one for fans or potential fans, and if Ken vocalizes his view like this, it can't do anything but hurt.  Right now Sony is being very arrogant, which will end up hurting them quite a bit.

 

[darknight06]

I've said this time and time again around my group and yet nobody wanted to believe it.

"The PS3 isn't designed to lean towards games. It's not a computer for children."
And this quote just burns me up more than anything.  F*ck Sony and their entire electronics brand.

[Ian Sane]

Wow Ken.  Way to sh!t on your best customers.  This "not about games" sh!t is going to bite them in the ass.  The N-Gage made fun of GBA users and thus completely killed it's credibility with gamers.  If Sony or MS spend too much time focusing on non-gaming stuff the real gamers are going to get pissed.  Now I don't think it would be a mass exodus but the hardcore gamers might start to drop off.  And once they're gone it's just the casuals and once the fad is over they're gone and Sony has no one with legitimate interest in gaming to keep them afloat.

The mainstream is all about novelty and fads.  They'll like something for a few years and then completely dump it later on.  The hardcore is what keeps you afloat between fads.  It's the reason why New Kids members are on the Surreal Life while Iron Maiden is still selling records and selling out shows despite having virtually no mainstream radio airplay.  Nintendo has real fans.  If Sony isn't careful they won't and then some day they're going to be totally f*cked.

[PaLaDiN]

I called this one... I said Sony and Microsoft would try to avoid the next game crash by shying away from games.

This is the only alternative Nintendo has to making games for nongamers. Personally, I prefer Nintendo's approach.

[Ian Sane]

"I called this one... I said Sony and Microsoft would try to avoid the next game crash by shying away from games.

This is the only alternative Nintendo has to making games for nongamers. Personally, I prefer Nintendo's approach."

How is Nintendo's method any different?  Both methods alienate hardcore gamers for another group.  Gamers who know what Herzog Zwei is aren't going to cause a crash.  Guys who play nothing but Madden are.  So the strategy of these companies to avoid a game crash is to stop targeting the core gaming fans that will never lose interest in gaming?  That's lunacy.  Turning away the hardcore is what will cause a crash because all that will be left will the fad gamers and when they lose interest *CRASH*.

[MaxXUnlimited]

Quote
How is Nintendo's method any different?

Well at least Nintendo's method still involves games. I think games like Nintendogs and Electroplankton are a much better way to do it then just adding Digi-cam and MP3 (expensive) extras.

[jasonditz]

I still don't think making games more approachable for others is the same thing as alienating hardcore gamers. What ever happened to the idea of "simple to learn, hard to master"?

[KnowsNothing]

Ian seems to think that Nintendo is just giving up on their fanbase.  Seems kind of strange seeing as how we have a Fire Emblem and a Zelda coming for the Cube, and how the DS has new versions of, like, every Nintendo franchise in the works, along with games like Nintendogs and Electroplankton.

[Djunknown]

It seems Kutaragi is pulling an Iwata. He's talking and talking some more, but wonder whether if they're on planet earth

Simply put, the next gen is theirs to lose. If the PS3 is this all purpose entertainment center, they're either going to A) Charge a hefty amount, SCEI will spin the facts by saying you're not buying a game machine, justifying its price tag or B) Pull a PSP by fooling the analysts, journalists and gamers themselves with a compromise, yet taking a loss.

We'll see if this logic holds water when the time comes.

[anubis6789]

I can't really say that I am surprised by this anouncment. Who didn't see this coming. This also furthers my own belief that a crash is coming, and I am very surprised that I am the only one seeing a crash comming.

I am also going to use this time to voice my disagrement with Ian. I think that Nintendo's stance to target the "non-gamer"is not going to leave hardcore gamers behind. In all actuality Nintendo only seems to want to make games simple, in otherwards easier to understand.

I will give you a good example of a "hardcore" simple game: Contra. I know mothers and fathers who don't play games except with there children and this is there favorite game ever. It is a very easy game to get into and there really is not much to it except kill everything. Heck they even know the Konami code(just not by that name), and to me that is enough to be considered any kind of gamer.

It is true that the "hardcore" won't cause the crash, at least not by themselves anyway. Mainly they will do it because of their elitist whinning will be heard by the devs. The dev will then continue to make games more complex and as a side effect more unaccessable to new people to enjoy. Also the constant snobbery that the "hardcore" lays on to everything deemed not hardcore scares people away from ever wanting to play games.

Ian did you always know what Herzog Zwei was?

[TheYoungerPlumber]

If "New Super Mario Bros." isn't fan service to Nintendo's hardcore and former hardcore, I don't know what is.

[Myxtika1 Azn]

What is Herzog Zwei?

[anubis6789]

Good one.

But just in case you are not joking (which is OK, nobody knows everything) its an old Genesis RTS.

[PaLaDiN]

Ian is just the paranoid spouse convinced that Nintendo's planning to cheat on him. He hasn't really brought up any evidence other than his paranoia, but it's a very real thing to him and we should all show some understanding.

Everything's going to be okay, Ian. Nintendo doesn't love them like they love you. They're just doing it to earn the money they need to keep you happy.

[ThePerm]

this doesn't sound good for gaming. He has companies by their balls, but can that change? Microsoft is just as bgad. They are making xbox 360 have so much gui its like a computer...why? Because Microsoft wants the hardware world. Sony wants to turn the ps3 into a computer. Its odd because really the console and the computer are cousins and they have the same origins. if you have ever seen a prototype famicom...it looks like a damn computer...it even has a keyboard. But since nes/famicom....atari..sega..consoles lost their multimedia purpose.

Their GAME SYSTEMS

that is what makes the differene between a console and a computer. One is meant soley for playing games and the other is meant for multipurpose processes. It pisses me off. The whole console industry and the pc industry were always opposed to each other until the playstation. They evolved in their different generations..ut now their coming back together. Honesty.....I DONT THINK GAMERS WANT THIS.

it reaks havoc on the pc industry too...why because its going to be competing with it.

Nintendo is making Game Consoles. Sony and Microsoft are trying to make computers.
god i wish reggie would say that.

[Caillan]

Quote
This also furthers my own belief that a crash is coming, and I am very surprised that I am the only one seeing a crash comming.

I've believed that the next gen will have a bit of a crash for a while now. But because it's nothng much more than a hunch I can't really argue my case very well.

Quote
How is Nintendo's method any different? Both methods alienate hardcore gamers for another group.

Well so far all evidence completely contradicts your theory. If Nintendogs was a half-assed tamagotchi clone it wouldn't have got 40/40 from Famitsu. Seriously, if a game is good, its good, and it doesn't matter who the target audience is. If Nintendo didn't cite Electroplankton as a 'non-game' you'd never complain about it. It would just be niche instead. And finally Nintendo is making some sort of multimedia dictionary apps which will cost them almost nothing, just like Electroplankton did. Honestly, the people who know what Herzog Zwei is probably don't care how the games are labelled/marketed as long as they're good. So far they have been.

[Don'tHate742]

All I have to say is, wait till they show the interface before we start judging the depth of games.


Ok, I'll say a little more.

Why can't Nintendo cater to both the hardcore and the non-gamers? Is it really that hard? The DS will have a fantastic year. Why? Because of its diversity. There is literally something for everybody. I expect to hear great things come Christmas. Xbox be damned.

What's wrong with using the same philosophy for the REV? It's brilliant, really.

The REV controller could open up the same possibilities the DS has: easy developed, easily/intuitively played, rich games.

How fun would an archery game be? It woudl focus on one aspect of the controller, much like the DS and it's touch-screen. A whole game based on gyration aiming that could potential be very, very fun. Simple, yet fun....that's Nintendo's answer.

That's not to say, they won't bring any complex games to the table. SSB: Online has been confirmed, along with Zelda, Mario, and Metriod. What further proof do you need?

[anubis6789]

Sorry to confuse, but I meant to say: This also furthers my own belief that a crash is coming, and I am very surprised that I am not the only one seeing a crash comming. Most of the people I hang out with think that I am crazy for thinking that though, and that is why I am surprised.

[nemo_83]

Oh, Sony is crazy. MS and Nintendo seem more aimed at delivering game machines than Sony even though all three companies all seem to be abandoning their bases this coming gen. This quote shows Sony has lost their collective mind. MS is abandoning its fanbase going after Sony's sports gamers but their system won't appeal to the graphic whores who bought the Xbox, especially since they may have just bought the Xbox recently as it has finally found its footing. The 360 won't be backwards compatible, so basically MS is saying fock it, the people who bought Xbox didn't make MS any money. As has been sugested Nintendo is making moves to abandon multi console owners.

They split with SK to persue smaller games. The REV prototype is wifi only, no net port. The download service attracts a lot of different types of gamers including Nintendo fans, but what about the fans and general hardcore gamers who are not fanboys of Nintendo. They just respect them. What about the fans who already own these games who want a console with new content, something Sony and MS have not shown. What about how Nintendo's DS' library thus far has left a lot to the imagination. Or how this year may see the release of only two or three games on Cube I would consider buying in Zelda and RE4? Or how there may be only two or three games that I'm interested in even renting like Geist, Star Fox Armada, and Fire Emblem. I hope this new Cube Wars rocks, I can't remember the new title of it or when it will come out; but the videos looked awesome. The point is though there better be a lot of software coming for REV because it is for damn sure noone is releasing Cube games. What can Nintendo do to keep hardcore gamers? They could start by buying a new company to make original mature games for REV and fill the gap left by SK.

[Deguello]

WTF?  You type too much, man.

[KDR_11k]

Attracting non-gamers might carry them through the crash because the crash will come because of Joe Average Gamer being too tired of the same games over and over with more gore and polygons. The newly attracted non-gamers will still marvel at the many types of games they have never seen before. Sure, they might crash some day as well but by then the standard casual market will have recovered.

[jasonditz]

I'm surprised he said it, but the tactics are nothing new.

Sony, Microsoft, and even Panasonic and Philips before them... they were never about the games. The video game console has always been a means to an end for all of them. You guys ever listen to a Microsoft investor's conference? They're not touting the popularity of Halo, I can tell you that. Its all about using the Xbox to "get our foot in the door", or "gain a presence in the family rooms of middle america". Sony's the same way, this is just the most publicly they've ever said so.

And in all fairness, they have to be. Look at what happened this generation. The PS2 was way more of a retail success than Sony ever had a right to expect. Did it make them any money? Not really. You guys may not remember this, but early in the PS2's life, when they were taking an absolute financial beating, many of the major investors were calling on Sony to pull the plug on their video game hardware division.

The truth is, the only really profitable video game hardware makers have always been the ones that have strong first party lineups. That's something Sony's never had, and never really tried to create.

But I wonder what a company like Square Enix thinks of all this. Their success is now almost totally dependent on Sony's game machines... now Sony says those machines aren't "for games". I'd be awfully nervous at statements like that, because somewhere along the line they will be used to justify moves with the hardware that are good for Sony's vision and bad for game companies.

[KDR_11k]

Square-Enix thinks "let that nutjob say what he wants, we are where the money is".