Author Topic: Next Gameboy  (Read 27639 times)

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Offline Savior

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Next Gameboy
« on: January 20, 2005, 06:35:42 PM »
Now that theres some initial reports, from Matt on the mailbag about the next Gameboy i think it deserves its own posts. Supposidly it will be a portable Gamecube. I think its highly possible, since Nintendo was developing its own LCD Screens on top of gamecubes a couple of E3s back. Its an extension of that. Obviously WIFI play to be able to play Smash, Time Splitters among other things on the road....  What else? Clam Shell or GBA design? Name? Gameboy evolution or Neo Gameboy or Next Gameboy?
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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2005, 07:01:42 PM »
Let's hope that Nintendo puts a little more effort into updating the most successful consumer electronic device of all time than just making a portable version of what clearly ISN'T the most successful consumer electronic device of all time. That would be more stupid than lazy, and believe me, it would be freakin' LAZY. If the next Gameboy was nothing more than a portable Gamecube than I would be displeased, backward compatibility would be one thing, but failure to innovate beyond that would stink and be uncharacteristic of the Nintendo I stand by. I WANT one of those Sharp 3D screens with a big wide display, I WANT, nay, NEED some sort of online/network option. It's too late for Gamecube games to take advantage of any of these things, but games developed specifically for the next Gamboy could and should use said features to thier fullest, assuming it has them (knocks on wood).

Media is a significant issue. Not only are GOD's completely bare and free of ANY hard-casing or protection, the Gamecube itself is constantly streaming data off of those little badboys to cut-down on load times.  It's a great idea and a brilliant feat of engineering, and it was all made possible because they were designed and created without portability romotely as issue. At least PSP designers know to anticipate this problem from the get-go; but, barring some major advancement in battery technology currently unforseen a game like Metroid Prime (which created THE gold standard in load-time avoidance) would rip some piddly little battery to shreds. BUT a funny fact about the Gamecube's architecture is that the A-RAM has been ubgradeable since day 1, that would significantly reduce load times therefore allowing for a more economic use of the disc drive allowing for a longer battery life. The only problem is getting this to work for older GCN games assuming proper code isn't there already, which I doubt. Then there is the memory card/need for data storage, another inconvenient reality that comes with using an optical media. How many Reggie cracked about the PSP's memory sticks? Those jokes are funny because having memory sticks suck.  Built-in hard-drive or bust. It wouldn't even have to be that big since virtually all Gamecube savedata was designed to be compact and contrite. 512 MBs of built-in flash memory would be more than enough for Gamecube saves, leaving more than enough room for next-gen GB games, which there had better be.

What about the controller? Gamecube has gargantuan shoulder buttons, portruding analog sticks and a rumble so fierce that it may have rendered me steryl. Granted the rumble can be romoved, the buttons shrunk the C-Stick tucked away somewhere (convenient) and the Z-button can go anywhere. That all seems reasonable, no worries there.

Maybe there should be something that greys-out any and all Gamecube multoplayer options. Even if they could find some-way to recreate and emulate  the 4 controller port aspect over a wireless network, you'd still have the 4 screen split on every one's system. That might be funny at first but get-old quick.

No handheld anywhere would be able to display much better than 1/2 the Gamecube's standard resolution. Games like Wind Waker and Metroid Prime 2 might look awfuly strange on a Gameboy.

It had better have a clamshell design if only to protect the display. Screen cracks are no good, and a unit like the one I'm describing would cost alot more than 60$ to replace.  
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Offline nemo_83

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RE:Next Gameboy
« Reply #2 on: January 20, 2005, 11:01:06 PM »
I wouldn't expect the first model to feature rumble.  


I think Nintendo has always wanted to make the Cube portable; that is why they chose minidisk.  A second chance for the Cube.  Most people don't have a Cube yet.  The system could be relaunched with an existing library of games that stomp the PSP's graphics and load times.  I also don't think we will see a GameBoyEvolution or GameBoyCube until fall of 06.  It is a good reason for developers to keep making Cube games.  In the future we could see the porting of MS games like Halo or Perfect Dark Zero to the Cube architecture for the GBE.  
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Offline Noble~Feather

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #3 on: January 21, 2005, 04:46:44 AM »
# The working title is "Game Boy Evolution".
# The system will have a flip-top design, similar to the GBA SP.
# Games will come on mini-discs, as opposed to cartridges.
# The graphics will be slightly better than those found on the Sega Dreamcast.
# Bluetooth wireless networking will be built in.
# The system will feature backwards compatibility, but not in the same way the GBA plays old Game Boy games. Supposedly there will be a device that will allow you to download games from their carts into a harddrive-like element of the new Game Boy. Confusing, yes, but that's all we've managed to gleam. Speculate as you like.
# The system's screen will be lit, similar to the GBA SP.
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Offline Bill Aurion

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #4 on: January 21, 2005, 06:12:25 AM »
Supposedly there will be a device that will allow you to download games from their carts into a harddrive-like element of the new Game Boy.

Come on, do you really believe this?  Piracy ahoy!
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Offline Ian Sane

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #5 on: January 21, 2005, 06:15:12 AM »
"Obviously WIFI play to be able to play Smash, Time Splitters among other things on the road"

How could that feature possibly work if those games don't have the code for it already?  I guess they could re-release those games with those features added but part of the whole reason I like the idea of a portable Cube is that it eliminates the whole expense of buying a game twice just to play it portable.

In theory having a portable Cube is kind of nice but the system is such a huge flop that I think Nintendo would be better off making something new.  They could always add Cube backwards compatibility but the Cube has a negative stigma attached to it that could hurt the new Gameboy's image.  Though as a Cube owner I would like how they would be making new Cube titles.

I really hope Nintendo sits on the next Gameboy for a while.  The GBA's life was cut short far too quickly.  Sure you can say the DS is the third pillar or whatever but the fact of the matter is everyone but Nintendo regards the DS as the GBA followup.  So if they suddenly spring the next Gameboy on us next year, even if it's intended to co-exist with the DS, third parties will move to the newer system and DS owners are going to be PISSED that their system has been "replaced" so quickly.  It would be like Sega when they abandoned the 32X after less than a year.  The DS is the next Gameboy.  It doesn't matter what Nintendo says the public says it's the next Gameboy and they're the ones who decide.

Rumour has it the Revolution will not connect with the DS but rather the next Gameboy.  I can't think of a bigger DISASTER than that.  I really hope that's not true.

Offline KDR_11k

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #6 on: January 21, 2005, 06:27:12 AM »
Well, it COULD attempt to sync game states similar to how emulators do that for older consoles but I doubt that'd really work. Using Peer to Peer won't work at any rate (try playing GTA multiplayer and watch it desync).

Besides, I have no idea where Feather pulled that from but I guess it's someplace the sun doesn't shine. His "inside contact" didn't want him to divulge any information, after all.

Offline Spak-Spang

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RE:Next Gameboy
« Reply #7 on: January 21, 2005, 06:28:25 AM »
I don't believe that the next Gameboy is going to be a portable Gamecube, but I think that within this statement is the truth.

I believe Nintendo is trying to deliver a portable with similar functionality of a Gamecube.  Similar or Better Processor and RAM, obviously same programing tools and language, but I believe Nintendo will change the obvious.  Different media format and different memory for storing memory.  I would also predict that the control will be redesigned, and probably won't feature the same functions.

So in reality, it won't be a portable Gamecube, but will be a portable with the power and functionality of a Gamecube.

Why do I believe this?  It just doesn't seem feasible for Nintendo to make a comfortable, safe, affordable, portable Gamecube.  At the same time it doesn't seem economical either.  

Think about it.  If Nintendo gives gamers a huge library of Gamecube quality games with their portable from the start it will hurt sales of new projects and products.

However, if the system is similar enough Nintendo could compile games into a portable format that people would buy.  I would buy a portable version of both Mario Golf and Mario Tennis together with wifi support to play multiplayer games.

I guess what I am saying is I am actually expecting something different from the Gameboy Evolution and something MORE from it.


Offline vudu

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #8 on: January 21, 2005, 08:14:19 AM »
Quote

So in reality, it won't be a portable Gamecube, but will be a portable with the power and functionality of a Gamecube.
Great...so we'll have another port-friendly handheld.  Just what Nintendo needs.
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Offline Noble~Feather

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RE:Next Gameboy
« Reply #9 on: January 21, 2005, 08:44:15 AM »
Quote

Originally posted by: KDR_11k
Well, it COULD attempt to sync game states similar to how emulators do that for older consoles but I doubt that'd really work. Using Peer to Peer won't work at any rate (try playing GTA multiplayer and watch it desync).

Besides, I have no idea where Feather pulled that from but I guess it's someplace the sun doesn't shine. His "inside contact" didn't want him to divulge any information, after all.


I can tell you that info. No harm.

Edit: Ian, remember, Reggie said that DS/Revo connectivity is "possible and probable".
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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2005, 08:54:24 AM »
Not huge on subtlety are you Ian Sane? If it's not a Huge Flop DISASTER that pisses on people when it's replced, it might as well be nothing at all. I can dig that.


Feather's "Information" nothing but a cut'n'paste job taken from an N-Sider article posted last April. I'm well-aware that expecting a source citation is almost an enigma in todays day in age, especially when your dealing with a young man like feather with all the inside information. The whole thing can be found at http://www.n-sider.com/articleview.php?articleid=296 but I'm going to gurantee that every thing that article states has been changed, assuming it was ever accurate to begin with.
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Offline Savior

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RE:Next Gameboy
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2005, 09:27:29 AM »
Quote

How could that feature possibly work if those games don't have the code for it already?


You would have to trick the GBE, or GB Next, to treat other Gameboys as Wavebird controlers.. How they would pull this off, i dont know..  Basically it would be a Gamecube inside of a Wavebird controler. Its amazing tech if true.


I like it personally, theres a small posibility that the Revolution wont play Gamecube games, what better way to be able to play my Gamecube games then , on the road...  
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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RE:Next Gameboy
« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2005, 12:31:55 PM »
'IF' GBE is in fact a GCP, I think that that would be amazing, for the fact that you would have access to a vast collection of already released GC games, and you would be able to play all your portable games on the Revolution because of Backwards Compatability (BC).  This would inturn extend the life of the GC (they wanted it to last for 8+ years) indefinately and all new games could be programed or the GC with the GCP in mind.  Older games could have a Special Edition released with New!! GCP compatibility (hopefully they would have a trade in policy)

Also the GCP should have SD card standard (hardwired to trick all games into thinking it is just like the regular memory card)

Offline Caillan

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2005, 07:24:02 PM »
I don't want to see another Gameboy soon, and when I do see I don't want it to be another Gamecube.

The Gamecube currently retails, at a small loss, for 100USD. Shrinking it would cause heating problems, especially as the Gamecube gets hot even with massive vents on the sides. The technology required to make a system so small would be too expensive to make a marketable product. (This is especially the case becuase a similar system is already on sale at a low price.)

The DS, PSP and dwindling GBA are enough competitors for the handheld market, and they'll continue to be so for the next few years. A new handheld, especially a generic one, would not cause an expansion of the market (as Nintendo currently hopes the DS will), it would only take its share from its competitors. Since these competitors are mostly produced by Nintendo, a new handheld in the near future as Matt predicts is unlikely.

Even presuming the DS and PSP did not exist, a portable Gamecube would still be a comercial disaster. First, as has already been pointed out, are the hardware issues: the screen, the controller and the media. Secondly, games that have developed for the Gamecube would likely be incompatable with a smaller screen and no controller ports. For example, much of Metroid Prime's HUD would be useless when rendered at such a small size. Lastly, since Nintendo's fans already own Gamecubes, where would they draw their userbase from? I know I wouldn't pay much for a portable version of a console I already own. Sega's Nomad did not provide a buisness model that other companies would like to follow.    

Offline KDR_11k

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #14 on: January 21, 2005, 09:41:29 PM »
Tech progression also means less power consuming and heat producing hardware. The GC has a fairly large manufacturing process (I think it was over 200 Micron) and could already save a lot of power by going with a smaller process. Hell, my PDA is about 20 times as powerful as a 486 that required active cooling back then! It certainly will be possible to make a passive-cooled low-consumption GC in the future, though I have no idea how far off that is. I'd say the system could emulate one controller in Port 1 and be able to mount its internal memory to any of the two memcard slots.
Besides, it's already possible to add a battery and an LCD to the GC and have a battery life about half that of the PSP, hardware optimized for portability should be able to last Nintendo's required 10 hours in a few years.

Offline Savior

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RE:Next Gameboy
« Reply #15 on: January 22, 2005, 03:09:54 PM »
The GBE is the replacement of the GBSP. Nintendo cant expect the GBA to continue to sell, eventually they will want to replace it. Thats how they make money.


Quote

incompatable with a smaller screen and


Sure but the screen would be bigger than the SP/GBA...  i dont think the screen size will be the problem. Heat? Well the DS is effectively a Portable N64 and it doenst get warm.. in a couple of years... 2006-2007-2008 potential GBE release time, i think they can make it happen... , it would probably be released after the Revolution...  
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Offline vudu

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RE:Next Gameboy
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2005, 07:58:58 AM »
Quote

Even presuming the DS and PSP did not exist, a portable Gamecube would still be a comercial disaster. First, as has already been pointed out, are the hardware issues: the screen, controller and media. Secondly, games that have developed for the Gamecube would likely be incompatable with a smaller screen and no controller ports. For example, much of Metroid Rrime's HUD would be useless when rendered at such a small size. Lastly, since Nintendo's fans already own Gamecubes, where would they draw their userbase from? I know I wouldn't pay much for a portable version of a console I already own. Sega's Nomad did not provide a buisness model that other companies would like to follow.
I agree with everything you said there.  Furthermore, handheld systems typically have a much smaller tie-in ratio than home consoles.  It's something like 7 or 9 games per console for home consoles and 2 or 3 for handhelds.

If the GBE used the same media as the GC, the tie-in ratio would be even smaller, because of the abundance of used GC games selling for cheap.  

Conversely, if the media is different, loyal Nintendo fans are going to be super pissed off about buying the same games all over again.  
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!

Offline diiskrej

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #17 on: January 26, 2005, 05:20:57 PM »
I think everyone is possibly speculating wrong. They are not going to make the gamecube portable, but instead make a system as powerful into a handheld. Its going to be like the PSP. It will not play gamecube games, but Nintendo will be able to get 3rd parties because it will be easy to port Gamecube games to the evolution with upgraded multiplayer ect. Nintendo has already taken this approach many times. Nintendo would not make an opportunity for great wireless multiplayer and then put a bunch of game out that wont support it. They are gunna port GC games. Save themselves time, make lots of money, get more 3rd parties.  
 

Offline nemo_83

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RE:Next Gameboy
« Reply #18 on: January 26, 2005, 08:37:38 PM »
Quote

Originally posted by: diiskrej
I think everyone is possibly speculating wrong. They are not going to make the gamecube portable, but instead make a system as powerful into a handheld. Its going to be like the PSP. It will not play gamecube games, but Nintendo will be able to get 3rd parties because it will be easy to port Gamecube games to the evolution with upgraded multiplayer ect. Nintendo has already taken this approach many times. Nintendo would not make an opportunity for great wireless multiplayer and then put a bunch of game out that wont support it. They are gunna port GC games. Save themselves time, make lots of money, get more 3rd parties.



it is suicide if they start porting games from the failed cube to a new portable.  what was the whole purpose of using minidisks in the first place on cube if there was never a plan to make it portable?

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Offline PaLaDiN

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #19 on: January 26, 2005, 11:30:26 PM »
"what was the whole purpose of using minidisks in the first place on cube if there was never a plan to make it portable?"

Piracy protection.
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Offline nemo_83

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RE:Next Gameboy
« Reply #20 on: January 27, 2005, 02:17:20 AM »
Quote

Originally posted by: PaLaDiN
"what was the whole purpose of using minidisks in the first place on cube if there was never a plan to make it portable?"

Piracy protection.


the xbox is a piracy haven and third parties flocked to it.  the only thing that can redeem their choice of minidisks for the cube now is if they take advantage of the portable nature of the medium now and rescue the cube's lineup from obscurity.  abandoning the cube and porting its games to a portable that uses minidisks is like giving the finger to the people who bought the cube and its games.  both the revolution and gbe need to be backwards compatible with cube games.  
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Offline diiskrej

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RE:Next Gameboy
« Reply #21 on: January 27, 2005, 03:23:14 AM »
If they use the GBE for Gamecube Ports it means that the DS will be used for the 2d gaming.  
 

Offline Ian Sane

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #22 on: January 27, 2005, 06:25:00 AM »
I think it's sad that whenever someone talks about a portable the first thing that pops up is ports.  I prefer the idea of a portable Gamecube because I can just play the games I already have without buying new versions just to go portable.  Of course this would be the exact reason Nintendo wouldn't want a Cube portable.  They make more money off of ports than they do off of old Cube games.  Hell they probably make more off of ports than they do off new games.

But Cube ports might not be that lucrative anyway since the Cube is (aside from Virtual Boy) Nintendo's least popular console yet.  If no one wants to buy Metroid Prime now, why would they later?  Nintendo could never get someone to buy a portable for a port of Luigi's Mansion or Super Mario Sunshine.  Part of the reason why the GBA was able to sell ports so well is that the ports were all from the NES, SNES and Genesis which are all very popular consoles.  There are tons of gamers who loved the Genesis but never cared about the Saturn or Dreamcast and loved the NES and SNES but never cared about the N64 or Gamecube.  2D era Nintendo is cool but 3D era Nintendo is not.

Offline KDR_11k

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #23 on: January 27, 2005, 08:16:15 AM »
Well, if the GBE supporting GC disks would not be profitable, how would the DS using GBA carts be? By having the GBE use GC disks they could make profit off of new games AND reissue older ones to make profit without any portwork. Especially since the GB series reaches a much larger audience than the GC does now. The number of people buying a GBE and only using it to play their existing GC library is going to be neglectible, the rest will start buying GC games again.

Offline Ian Sane

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RE: Next Gameboy
« Reply #24 on: January 27, 2005, 08:42:12 AM »
"Well, if the GBE supporting GC disks would not be profitable, how would the DS using GBA carts be?"

I meant if the GBE was just a portable Gamecube and nothing more.