Topic: New zelda...

[shadow]

Well there is no real point in fighting it, WW was awesome and when it's successor does show it's self in 2004 I think it's going to be Cel-shaded because anyone who had played the game knows that build another game engine of that magnitude from the ground up for another Zelda game would take to long and by the GCN 2 will be out....

So if you didn't for some reason like WW because of it's graphics, well the next time around (2004), your not going to be pleased because or Cel shaded friend is making another apperance.

[joshnickerson]

Ness, your theory is FREAKIN' ME OUT, MAN!!!!
This is why I don't visit the Zelda forums anymore. I can't keep track of all the different time theories and branching realities.

[thecubedcanuck]

Wht must you guys always jump on someone who doesnt like a game based on its appearance?

Visuals play a huge part in all forms of entertainment, if someone doesnt like what they are seeing it will surely affect his/her ability to enjoy the other aspects of the game/movie and so on.

I though the gameplay aspect of WW was brilliant, it was a snap to control and play the game, and didnt require much in the way of a learning curve. The game itself was far to easy IMO, and lacked dungeons, which are for the most part the only thing I like about Zelda games.

I do have to agree on the visuals, I think they sucked. I do admit they were brilliantly done, but I just cant stand the style personally. I have never been a fan of cartoons, even as a child, and this style used on the game just didnt suit my tastes.

This has nothing to do with Nintendo, nothing to do with the game itself really, many love the game style, I just am not one of them.

I would love a realistic Zelda, a real dark atmospheric game, where when link was getting his ass kicked, you know it, and the creatures that guard the dungeons, look like they should be dealt with with extreme caution. Again it is all about tastes, and has nothing to do with ones age or maturity, as many here seem to think is the only reason people dont like it.

I am a 32 year old gamer, and have been gaming since the vic 20 days, so am by no means a rookie to this. Liking cartoons doesnt make you mature and liking blood and violence doesnt make you a childish punk. Not understanding that everyone has differant preferances, and ragging someone for their opinions and taste is what clearly defines who the children are.

[Bill Aurion]

Yes, but *****ing about the graphical style isn't a sign of maturity, and it's not a valid reason for disliking the game.  I don't think anyone said that watching cartoons was mature, but that being able to diversify your gaming likes is.  The gamer is here to game, to take what is given to them, like it or not.  If you don't like the game only because of its graphical style, then don't get it and stop wasting other gamers' time by *****ing about it here.

[Luciferschild]

Thecubedcanuck pretty much expressed my feelings exactly. To Bill, my age shall remain a mystery but I've been playing games since I was 6 or 7 and that was a long time ago, I don't prefer any genre and play anything that I think is good. I also cannot stand the style of ww graphics, the whole cheap disney movie on crack with character models more deformed than mr. potato head thing just doesn't work for me, it's not for everyone. I'd prefer graphics similar to oot/mm since I thought those games were beautiful. I'd prefer a more mature, harder, darker zelda game like the original zelda which if you think about it had a dark and desolate feel to it. I'm not knocking people for liking the game but even if you like it you have to admit that it has kiddie feel to it, not just the graphics but the way it's presented and the gameplay. It feels very un-zelda to me. On the other hand I don't have a problem with a game like animal crossing because it looks the way it's supposed to look, it's nice and cute and fun and that's what it's supposed to be. That's not what I want out of a zelda game, nor do I care for link and co. looking like deformed freaks of nature. And to Bill if you don't think what I have to say is mature enough for you than don't read my posts, no one is making you.  

[PIAC]

-___-

as a 3 year old target audience of nintendo i think your wrong, WW looks alot like a very updated version of the Link to the Past engine, ohwell, its a moot point anyway, you've made your mind up, old or not i think your acting rather stupidly.

[Nintendo Gamecube]

How about a dark zelda in cel shading....that'll scare everyone.

[Bill Aurion]

I would like to know how WW felt "very un-Zelda."  WW's gameplay is almost identical to OoT's.

[Ness_the_Mess]

Quote
Originally posted by: Luciferschild
Thecubedcanuck pretty much expressed my feelings exactly. To Bill, my age shall remain a mystery but I've been playing games since I was 6 or 7 and that was a long time ago, I don't prefer any genre and play anything that I think is good. I also cannot stand the style of ww graphics, the whole cheap disney movie on crack with character models more deformed than mr. potato head thing just doesn't work for me, it's not for everyone. I'd prefer graphics similar to oot/mm since I thought those games were beautiful. I'd prefer a more mature, harder, darker zelda game like the original zelda which if you think about it had a dark and desolate feel to it. I'm not knocking people for liking the game but even if you like it you have to admit that it has kiddie feel to it, not just the graphics but the way it's presented and the gameplay. It feels very un-zelda to me. On the other hand I don't have a problem with a game like animal crossing because it looks the way it's supposed to look, it's nice and cute and fun and that's what it's supposed to be. That's not what I want out of a zelda game, nor do I care for link and co. looking like deformed freaks of nature. And to Bill if you don't think what I have to say is mature enough for you than don't read my posts, no one is making you.

Well, since I'm not Bill, I'll respond.  Your age will remain a mystery, eh?  One year to an 8 year old would be considered a LONG time.  Most long-time gamers are fairly grounded in they types of games they like.  I'm sure there is some pattern to what you consider good.  As bill had just said, it isn't people who dislike the graffics, but it's people who are immature about it that get on other peoples nerves.  'Cheap disney movie on crack' and 'models more deformed than mr. potato head' really make you sound mature.  Good job, thumbs up (if you are 8, although I doubt it, I will point out that the last sentence was sarcasm).  Don't you mean you think OoT and MM's graffics were more beautiful than WW's, because that is your opinion?  Thought so.  Kiddie because of the graffics and gameplay, and feels un-zelda like?  You obviously haven't played your own beloved OoT, since the gameplay is the exact same.  And oh yes, considered by some to be the best of the series, ALTTP had VERY similar graffics to WW, albeit the fact that WW was 3d.  Just thought I'd point out a few oversights in a friendly way.  Have a nice day

[Berny]

I agree, Ness. I definitely felt that WW and ALTTP were very similar. Even some old enemies were brought back. Chu chus for instance (although they were in MM, they looked more like ALTTP's green blobs in WW). Also the Darknuts made a return and they were just fun to fight. When I first saw them I was like "HOLY CRAP! What its that gi–normous beast?!" Also like ALTTP, they aren't very difficult to beat. (I found this slightly unfortunate, but picking up their MEGA WHOMPING BLADES made up for it.)
Oh and on a separate and unrelated note, Moblins rock. I like how their jowels flap when they think they hear something. And when you stab them in the buttocks...oh great stuff...

[Hostile Creation]

Well, I'm not going to call Luciferschild an idiot for what he believes in.  That's not my style.  I'll just acknowledge that he is and not complain

I liked the graphics, the gameplay. . . and if you've played the whole thing, many parts of it are far from childish.  The ending is very cool, and somewhat grim, as are other parts of the story.

Yeah, enemies coming back are cool.  If you do the Ninty Gallery sidequest, one statue you get is, of course, octorocks.  When you look at it, it says: Perfect Attendance Award.  I thought that was cool.  And the zombies are creepy.  Zombies in Zelda games always freak me out.  I mean, in Resident Evil, you're expecting zombies to jump out of the walls and eat your brains, so it doesn't bother me.  But in WW, before I know Redead are even in the game, I'm looking through the sewer in my cabana, and I go down this hole, and there are these two human figures and suddenly I can't move and they're screaming and eating me and I'm saying "WHAT THE HELL?"  Freaky, man, freaky.

[Hostile Creation]

Holy crap.  Triple post.  Sorry. . .

[Hostile Creation]

Moo.

[Berny]

Triple post, eh? That takes skill... Anyways, yeah the redeads were cool. I'm glad that WW finally showed what they were doing when they creep up behind a little boy jump on his back and start groaning. And I'll just say I'm glad they were gnawing considering the alternative... Although I thought it was weird that they sounded like elephants. Interesting touch and I'm not exactly sure if I prefer the old human scream to it.

[Hostile Creation]

Yeah, I got skills

The old ones freaked me out a lot, too, mainly because the scream seemed to come from nowhere.

[Termin8Anakin]

The redeads in OoT gave me goosebumps cause of their slow, low groans.......but the ones in Wind Waker just bloody hell freaked me out! The really freaky thing is that they're usually in the shadows (especially in that hole that goes on forever on Outset), and you just walk over and they scream!!
AHHH!
There's one over there!!!!
*runs*
*screams from distance*
Sometimes I can get so freaked out that I chuck bombs at them. It takes longer, but at least I don't have to go near them.....

[Hostile Creation]

Y'know, if you shine light on them with the Mirror shield, they get all shocked and don't scream for a little while.  Learned that after I beat the game, while I was doing the Ninty Gallery.  Came in handy later on.

[Luciferschild]

I think that the bottom line is that some people want a game like ww and other people like me want a very different kind of zelda game. I believe that we outnumber the ww people (could be wrong) but we get screwed over because they are sticking to the ww style. I don't think they will ever make the kind of zelda game I want, (on the next console either) so excuse me for being a little upset that my favorite video game series has gone in the dumpster. Anyway I'm over it, didn't mean to offend anyone.

On another note: I don't really think there are any similarities between alttp and wind waker, alttp has some bright colors but I think it's a bit of a stretch to compare it's graphics to ww. It had the best graphics for it's time while ww has quite possibly most rediculous looking graphics I've ever seen.  

[Hostile Creation]

Best graphics of its time?  My man, have you seen Mario RPG?  There is probably a gap between the time they were made, but it's on the same system.  No, alttp could have been a lot. . . darker if they had wanted it to be.  Even the dark world in the game is pretty bright.  Seen the people that travel there without that moon pearl or whatever?  Link turns into a flippin bunny rabbit!  While I don't necessarily disagree with you on what you believe about the other points, alttp and WW are definitely similar graphics-wise.

[Luciferschild]

You have a point in that they could of made alttp darker. However, there isn't much difference in the graphical style between the original zelda and alttp, alttp has brighter colors. Now look at the difference between oot/mm graphical style and ww. To me it's like one giant leap into kiddie hell.  

[Termin8Anakin]

Quote
Originally posted by: Hostile Creation
Y'know, if you shine light on them with the Mirror shield, they get all shocked and don't scream for a little while.  Learned that after I beat the game, while I was doing the Ninty Gallery.  Came in handy later on.

Yeah, i found that out too after you realise that it's teh only way to defeat the Poes. I didn't even know they were Poes!!
Still..........

People didn't WANT Wind Waker to have that graphics style. It's just something we've gotten used to and found out that it was the best way to to Zelda now. I'm not saying that this is the way that Zelda should  be from now on and forever more. It's just that if Nintendo DID make a realistic Zelda, and it didn't have HALF of the gorgeous animation and liveliness that WW had, to me, and most others, it would seem more like a BACKWARD step that forward. Leave that 3D Zelda for next generation. You want WW2 to come out on Gamecube don't ya?

[Luciferschild]

Termin8Anakin you brought up something that has been bothering me. I don't feel that cartoony facial expressions enhance the gameplay at all. I could care less if the characters face is a statue the whole game, besides it's not like you can't make facial expressions without cell shading. I guess that kind of thing just doesn't appeal to me that much, I'm more concerned with the other aspects of gameplay.

[PIAC]

you sound you like very bland characters

[Termin8Anakin]

Luciferschild: Well, I don't really mind that you don't like the graphical style of WW, since accepting it has been as much talked and debated about as not accepting it.
At least you seem to have played it. What I DON'T accept is people putting the game down for it's graphics without playing it, and demos don't really count.
The story was for me more important than the graphics, with the graphics complimenting the story. I have to say though that more detail would have been nice, as the green, blue and yellow seem to get a little blandish.

One thing i absolutely MUST say is that WW is a graphical leap over OoT and MM by a LONG shot. I've said this before, but repetition really hammers the point down, and it's that OoT just became as boring as water. Master Quest may spice up OoT a bit with the different item placement, etc, but in the end it's still OoT and for me playing either one becomes a tedious affair.
But what if WW was a dark, edgy, violent adventure game in the vein of say, The Two Towers by EA, but still retained it's toon-shaded graphics? What would people say then?

[thecubedcanuck]

I think a dark cell shaeded Zelda would be very cool, just lose the big heads and big eyes and so on.
My problem with Zelda isnt the cell shading at all, it is the actual look of the characters, not the overall look of the game. There is a huge differance.