Topic: Something Something Wii U Successor Somethng

[BlackNMild2k1]

There's a search portion on this site.  Check it out sometime.  Alot of threads degrades into portions of the same argument.  [size=78%]http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=42455.50[/size]

First of all, I'm not gonna search the site for your arguments on the subject, especially when you admit that "Alot of threads degrades into portions of the same argument." which to me means it could have been in any number of threads, none of which would have been related to what I was looking for.
If you have a point to make that you already made somewhere else in a thread I've never seen during a conversation I wasn't apart of, then make it again or quote/link to yourself so I can read it.

I don't see it as leveraging at all.  I see it as killing off the handheld portion of the business and hoping that your console portion becomes successes.

How would it be killing off the handheld portion of the business when the Handheld portion on the business is still the handheld portion of the business? The handheld is still a portable handheld and would still be getting portable handheld games.

I like Adrock's idea of being able having saves transfer and having the portable buy a game and having it auto download for the main console.  That's a neat idea.

That should be standard for any connected system and something I think Sony already does and Nintendo was talking about with their online eShops.

I just don't see it as innovative.  It's a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.  Want to play handheld games?  There's a 3DS.  Want to play console games, there's a Wii U.  They are different because the markets for those items want different things.

Want to play handheld games? There is the successor to the 3DS.
want to play console games? .... oh the Wii U is dead. refer to the handheld games instead.

A 3DS meets the demands of the market perfectly.  To shrink hardware you always pay a premium.  To develop a game for a 50" 4K 3D TV (where the console market is going) you are always going to have too much power in a handheld.  Parents have proven they won't spend $250 en mass to fit their children each with their own game system.  You are pushing things on the handheld market they do not want.  $150 for a 3DS is perfect for what the market expects.  The handheld market doesn't want to pay $60 for 4K games when they were happy with their $30 games.

A Wii Uportable is the next step for a successor the the 3DS. The 3DS was basically a portable Wii/GC
It might not technically be as powerful, but it will look just as good. A PS Vita today cost $250 and is probably a small step below a Wii U... basically a PS3 portable. There is no good reason as to why Nintendo couldn't have comparable portable hardware to the Wii U in 2.5 yrs time.

And I don't know how the console market benefits either.  PS4/XBO owners aren't clamoring for ports of those titles or they'd likely get them.  I don't see $60 copies of Layton moving Wii U's.

 
We would still get the same games as before. If someone was making a game for a portable, that wouldn't need to change. The only change would be for 3rd parties that were trying to make console style game would still be able to support Nintendo, who would likely have a very high install base, and the gamer would still be able to play said game on their TV if they chose to.

Just because the handheld is capable of displaying up on the TV doesn't mean all it's games have to be geared toward the TV type of experience.

Technology in general will get cheaper, but I don't think we are 3 years away.  Processors aren't increasing at the rate they used to and we are reaching the points of economical feasibility to keep shrinking them.  The Vita is certainly no home console.  I do think it's funny though, one of the biggest knocks on the Wii U is it is under-powered.  But we expect people to accept limited handheld power as a trade off of a hybrid system when the console market has never asked for less power?

The Wii U isn't winning any awards in design nor is it winning any races in capability. It's already designed to be low power potentially for future portable use. Wii U is under powered as a home console when sitting on a shelf inbetween the PS3 of 2006 and the PS4 of 2013. The trade off here isnt' that we are bringing you a weak ass home console that is also a portable, it is that we are bringing you a bad-ass portable that can work on your TV like a home console.

You are solving a problem that doesn't exist.  The problem is and always has been Nintendo's interactions with third parties.   Can they salvage that?  Yes, they can.  Will they?  Probably not because Japanese companies are very stubborn. 

Well if they aren't gonna fix the most obvious problem (3rd parties) then they need address the symptoms (low console sales). If they seem to be succeeding hand over fist in the handheld sector, and failing miserably generation after generation in the console sector (Wii was a fluke, bottled lightning and Nintendo cannot recreate that or hold that audience) then the next best thing to do is leverage your strengths to make up for your weaknesses.

While the 4DS is moonlighting as a TV Console during those times you are at home, and you are enjoying all your 3rd party support thanks to that large install base, Nintendo just bought some time to expand upon that companion TVbox (that is integral to my idea of a "hybrid" console) with a real home console box, if they choose to go that route.

But that's just how I see it. I see no trade off of a handheld for a console when the handheld is still a handheld, and just becomes a controller for the box hooked up to your TV when at home. The box is nothing more than a Roku like box with a HDD that interfaces with the TV. I think you never fully understood my concept for what I thought the "Hybrid" should be. My idea is more like the Wii U in reverse.

[ShyGuy]

3rd parties problems do not go away with big console sales. See the Wii.

[MagicCow64]

I highly doubt Nintendo has a replacement home console system in the works for 1 year from now.

It is much more likely that Nintendo would pursue the hybrid portable route (in 2016) to succeed the 3DS and phase out a failing Wii U than attempt to replace the Wii U after its second full year on the market. (Nintendo would NEVER Dreamcast themselves... would they!?)

And to talk about keeping expectations low for changes that Nintendo would make...
Killing a console really early with a replacement is a big change to make. I would bet on quirky and innovative before I bet on that.

Yup, as I've posited elsewhere, I believe Nintendo is haunted by the specter of Sega, and if they start releasing sorta-new consoles every two years it would be an incredibly desperate sign, one they don't need to make yet.

I'm pretty sold on the hybrid, and think this is the most likely outcome if Nintendo chooses not to release a traditional console successor. I think the latency-less streaming tech is going to be the real diamond in WiiU's rough. And like was said above, they don't need the horsepower of a PS5, probably just something a couple of times stronger than the WiiU would be perfectly fine for anything they'd want to do in-house. And more and more, they are their own best thang.

[BlackNMild2k1]

3rd parties problems do not go away with big console sales. See the Wii.

But it's not that big of an issue in the portable sector, which the hybrid essentially is. You would be more concerned on which games 3rd parties are bringing, over if they will bring games at all.

[smallsharkbigbite]

First of all, I'm not gonna search the site for your arguments on the subject, especially when you admit that "Alot of threads degrades into portions of the same argument." which to me means it could have been in any number of threads, none of which would have been related to what I was looking for.
If you have a point to make that you already made somewhere else in a thread I've never seen during a conversation I wasn't apart of, then make it again or quote/link to yourself so I can read it.

I linked right to the page.  It's just common courtesy to review discussions before trying to turn every discussion into other things that are well represented.

How would it be killing off the handheld portion of the business when the Handheld portion on the business is still the handheld portion of the business? The handheld is still a portable handheld and would still be getting portable handheld games.

They are two different markets that want different things.  Rarely have I ever seen a device that can represent two markets well.  If you can think of one, let me know.  At best, Nintendo really is putting themselves in a position that they get the benefit of one market by consolidating since there isn't much of a hope that a hybrid would do better than the 3DS is doing now in one of the markets. 

Want to play handheld games? There is the successor to the 3DS.
want to play console games? .... oh the Wii U is dead. refer to the handheld games instead.

PS4/XBO are pretty good consoles.  Don't like the Wii U you could check those out. 

A Wii Uportable is the next step for a successor the the 3DS.

Why? 

The 3DS was basically a portable Wii/GC
It might not technically be as powerful, but it will look just as good. A PS Vita today cost $250 and is probably a small step below a Wii U... basically a PS3 portable. There is no good reason as to why Nintendo couldn't have comparable portable hardware to the Wii U in 2.5 yrs time.

Wow, you are really impressed with weak handheld hardware.  No way any of that is true, I could see why you would think a handheld has enough power to replace consoles. 

We would still get the same games as before. If someone was making a game for a portable, that wouldn't need to change. The only change would be for 3rd parties that were trying to make console style game would still be able to support Nintendo, who would likely have a very high install base, and the gamer would still be able to play said game on their TV if they chose to.

Not convinced a hybrid would have high install base since your not meeting the needs of either market and not sure third parties would care since they have a market they do really well with on the PS4/XBO and they didn't care about the large installbase of the Wii. 

Just because the handheld is capable of displaying up on the TV doesn't mean all it's games have to be geared toward the TV type of experience.

Do you make it in-compatible with TV mode so they don't see how bad your game looks?

The Wii U isn't winning any awards in design nor is it winning any races in capability. It's already designed to be low power potentially for future portable use. Wii U is under powered as a home console when sitting on a shelf inbetween the PS3 of 2006 and the PS4 of 2013. The trade off here isnt' that we are bringing you a weak ass home console that is also a portable, it is that we are bringing you a bad-ass portable that can work on your TV like a home console.

In other words, play out the Wii U low power for the future approach.  I like it. 

Well if they aren't gonna fix the most obvious problem (3rd parties) then they need address the symptoms (low console sales). If they seem to be succeeding hand over fist in the handheld sector, and failing miserably generation after generation in the console sector (Wii was a fluke, bottled lightning and Nintendo cannot recreate that or hold that audience) then the next best thing to do is leverage your strengths to make up for your weaknesses.

Your ignoring the fact that Nintendo does leverage the same business plan in both markets already.  It works in the handheld sector it doesn't in the console sector.  Because the markets are looking for two different things.   

But that's just how I see it. I see no trade off of a handheld for a console when the handheld is still a handheld, and just becomes a controller for the box hooked up to your TV when at home. The box is nothing more than a Roku like box with a HDD that interfaces with the TV. I think you never fully understood my concept for what I thought the "Hybrid" should be. My idea is more like the Wii U in reverse.

I understand it.  I just think Wii U tech in the controller is much more expensive than you think.  And when a great handheld only costs $150, what's the point of combining markets? 

[MagicCow64]

Smallshark:

I understand it.  I just think Wii U tech in the controller is much more expensive than you think.  And when a great handheld only costs $150, what's the point of combining markets? 

I think the real logic behind this kind of move is tied to the converging nature of handheld and console game design. Handhelds used to be the place for mostly 2D games and a different kind of design philosophy as a result. At this point, what's so intrinsic to being handheld about games like Luigi's Mansion: Dark Moon or Kid Icarus? I'd totally play those games on a TV if they were available. Sure, Nintendo would lose the ability to spend modest to moderate sums on games like Pokemon and have them generate 10000% profit, but a Pokemon RPG with WiiU graphical fidelity and the same gameplay as X and Y would I'm sure do them just fine. The eShop is becoming the place for smaller-scale projects like Fluidity and Pushmo, which should be available on both the Wii U and 3DS even if Nintendo hasn't quite caught up to the fact.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I linked right to the page.  It's just common courtesy to review discussions before trying to turn every discussion into other things that are well represented.

I appreciate the link, but it's what was said leading up to it that "There's a search portion on this site.  Check it out sometime." as if someone is supposed to scour the site for similar discussion before entering a current conversation.

And after reading it I understand your concerns, and maybe things would be a little expensive, but if the Wii U fails, a hybrid (the the super portable/roku combo version I'm talking about, I didn't look to see how they thought a Hybrid would work) might be Nintendo's best option to buy time till the next console is ready, should they even decide to release another dedicated console.

I really don't see them shitting the bed Sega style with another system too soon, because you lose the trust of all your loyal customers to provide them with a product they can depend on for years to come. You certainly won't convince the fence sitters that this round will be different, which at best puts them right back where they are now. It's almost a suicide pact to that. A "Hybrid" as I described it would allow the Wii U to putter along (the hybrid would technically be able to play the same games) until it's natural replacement cycle is complete.

So we will have to agree to sit on different ends of the table on this one. I just see my "impossible" option to be much better than your "improbable" solution.

[sweetfeathery]

I want to ask if anyone has any idea or can point me to any charts as to how well the Wii U has been selling overall within the last two months. I ask this because where I work we have been selling the Wii U very strong as of late, especially with the inclusion of Super Mario Bros into the console.

[ShyGuy]

In North America? We won't get any hints until middle of January with the NPDs.

[BlackNMild2k1]

My guess would be better than usual, which wouldn't be saying much, but still far from good enough.

If 2013 was Disaster: Year of Luigi, then 2014 needs to be
Recovery: Year of Change

It won't do much to change the fate of Wii U, but improving relations and expectations going forward will bring good will towards whatever is next.

[Mannypon]

Damn, there is too much to touch on in this thread and I'm too lazy to start quoting everyone lol

Basically, I'm in BlackNMild's camp with this hybrid design.  I know some have a fear of weakening 1 division over the other but I think Nintendo in the home console scene is near its end.  The market and industry for home consoles has dramatically changed, gone Hollywood is what I would call it, and that is just not, and probably never will be, Nintendo's scene. Nintendo is already 1 generation behind in specs and I don't see them ever matching the other 2's specs in any generation from here on out.  There are many reasons for this that I've mentioned before but I'll summarize briefly.  1.  Nintendo will never fund and fully utilize those high end specs.  2.  The 3rd parties who do put in the effort and money for AAA releases will shun Nintendo in favor of the other 2 as their games, for one reason or another, never seem to sell on Nintendo home hardware. 

A handheld with a 1080p display and specs above a WiiU is ideal in that those still developing handheld games will still be able to do so and, as BnM I think stated, those that want a TV experience type of game will still have that option.  Hell, 3rd parties are nearly gone for Nintendo in the TV experience "genre" if you would call it that.  Its basically Nintendo the only one doing anything major for their home console.  With this hybrid, you'll get all your portable games and Nintendo would still have a venue to put out there major home releases like mainline Mario, Zelda, and Metroid games.  Nintendo has spread themselves too thin between their 2 major consoles.  Given they get little to none 3rd party help with the WiiU, they have to provide all the support they can for it while also doing what they can to keep the 3ds in the position its in.  We complain of Nintendo's large gaps in release, well a hybrid system will let them concentrate on basically one hardware.  All their developers will be able to fill in their yearly lineup a lot better when just concentrating on one platform to support. 

As for Nintendo killing off the WiiU early, aka Dreamcast?  I don't see that happening at all.  Its ridiculous to even think of it.  Nintendo could put out a system even more powerful than the PS4 next year and it'll all be for nothing.  I mentioned this in another thread but Nintendo's problem now is their image and public perception.  That'll always trump whatever specs they have. 

I think Nintendo will pull whatever slim profits they can muster out of the WiiU and treat this generation as their practice round to iron out their development techniques with HD hardware and to streamline their handheld and home console developers into one well oiled machine (in preparation for their hybrid release in a couple of years) 

[Spak-Spang]

MannyPon:

I can see that.  seems logical in all areas. 

[Mannypon]

Thanks Spak-Spang, my biggest issue with my reasoning is that it almost makes to much sense lol.  Nintendo rarely ever does what we deem to makes sense so who really knows what they'll come up with.

[Sarail]

I, too, want to see a hybrid design console when Ninty step up to bat again in several years. Everything BnM mentioned fits my own description to a "T" about how I think the Big N need to go about their next console.

Everything I hear from my local friends, who I clearly define as "western gamers", dislike Nintendo consoles, but love everything about their handhelds. What's even more puzzling are a few statements I've heard from them as of late such as, "I want my handheld to do one thing well, and that's games."

Hmmm, games, you say? Strange as that's what their consoles do well, too. But apparently the home console space needs to do more than just games for them - which is fine, mind you. I feel like the Wii U does almost everything else outside of playing games that I want. My only request is the ability to stream content through DNLA from my PC. But seriously, it's ok without. Netflix, Hulu, Youtube, Amazon Instant, web browsing, Miiverse. That's plenty! Holy needy people, Batman.

But yeah, handheld hybrid console. Do I think it would sell to the market that has abandoned Nintendo in the console space? Possibly. Three of my local friends, who are big in Ninty's portables, told they would indeed go for a hybrid-type console. A Vita-sized controller with a TV box that streams the content via HDMI to the telly? Yes, please.

And lastly, Manny, I wholeheartedly agree on the streamlining their game development studios. I think this approach would not only give us more games overall, but even better, tighter, and more incredible experiences, too.

So, yeah. Bring all that shiz together.

[MagicCow64]

Another way to look at it is: What would Nintendo most like to do in 2016? Develop PS4.5 level console games and WiiU-level handheld games, or just games for a two-WiiUs-taped-together level hybrid?

[BlackNMild2k1]

Racht, download Plex Media Server on your PC, use the Wii U browser to access it and you can stream stuff from your computer to your TV through the Wii U.

would be really nice if Nintendo would update their app selection to be more in line with dedicated smart boxes. Don't need 60 apps, but a choice from a dozen or so popular and useful ones would be nice.

[BranDonk Kong]

Microsoft has a lock on HBO GO for consoles

[Adrock]

My understanding of this hybrid box discussed here is that functionally it's a reverse Wii U so the chipset is in the GamePad so you can take it everywhere. Is that right? However, if what is being suggested is something closer to Vita TV, I just don't see it working. 3DS works as its own contained unit.

Glancing between screens inches from your face is far different than changing the orientation of your head to look at a TV several feet away and a controller in your hands. That can greatly affect your performance in a game designed with the DS/3DS in mind. The transition isn't the same though not all DS/3DS games would suffer this inconvenience, only the ones that use the second screen heavily rather than for cursory info.

DS was the brainchild of Hiroshi Yamauchi who saw this handheld-console collision course well before anyone else did. Handheld games were starting to catch up to console games in terms of sophistication so the idea was to justify the handheld by offering something different. That's a great idea until you start blurring the lines intentionally. A reverse Wii U isn't something Nintendo wants because they want to sell people two different systems. Whether the market still accepts and/or allows this remains to be seen, but I don't think Nintendo did themselves any favors with 3DS which discouraged screen switching (the action is almost always on the larger and 3D-enabled top screen). A handheld that can be played on a TV means they're directly competing against themselves.

Nintendo's console market is not beyond saving (and keeping it separate). I understand Wii U is struggling though I attribute that mostly to Nintendo failing to support it with their own games which is the entire reason anyone even cares about Nintendo hardware. This is improving with some major titles on the way in 2014. They're not Dreamcast-ing Wii U. Let's stop that thinking right there. Nintendo's software is far stronger and they have greater reserves and more valuable assets than Sega. Right now, Nintendo is looking at GameCube 2.0. They can ride out Wii U. It will come in last place, but still make a profit in the end. Nintendo can live with that, but it's not where they want to be. I don't see them doing anything as drastic as making hybrid systems or abandoning the console market. Their problem is that Sony and Microsoft aimed high so Nintendo appears in the middle, not a high-end console yet not a low-end Ouya micro-console. That leaves them with the choice of aiming just as high or aiming really low.

Nintendo could probably dominate the low-end market. Non-Nintendo fans aren't necessarily anti-Nintendo, they just can't justify spending $300 on a console just for Nintendo games. Get the price down to $100 to $130 and they might. This also means Nintendo is settling for second console status. Nintendo doesn't want to compete with Sony and Microsoft, but I think they know they have to because the market forces them to. There's no escaping that when all three companies offer products that can do the same thing: play games.

That's why I think a Nintendo branded Steam Machine is a better option. Consumers get Nintendo's first party titles as well as near-ubiquitous third party support. This takes the biggest asset away from Sony and Microsoft. This is also a better choice than the hybrid solution. If a hybrid is meant to take advantage of Nintendo's third party support on their handhelds, a Steam Machine trumps that due to a much more pervasive Western presence. Nintendo should leave their handheld market mostly as is. Japanese third parties seem content with the terms and it's thriving in that region.

In any case, Nintendo should continue expanding their own development houses. They need a stronger Western presence. It has to be more than Retro Studios releasing a game every three years and Nintendo contracting Monster Games and Next Level Games to work on existing Nintendo IPs. Nintendo's software is their greatest asset. They can continue justifying releasing their own hardware with a steady and consistent stream of excellent software.

[shingi_70]

Isn't there a high chance there won't be another Nintendo console?

[NWR_insanolord]

Isn't there a high chance there won't be another Nintendo console?

I don't think so. I'm fairly certain they'll give it at least one more go before abandoning that market.

[Ian Sane]

I think Nintendo would only quit consoles if they were financially forced to do so.  Like, if they don't stop manufacturing these white elephants right this second they're going to go bankrupt.

When I think of the hybrid I really am thinking about what makes sense from a consumer perspective.  If I buy music I can listen to the same MP3 on my computer at home or on my MP3 player on the go.  In the past I could use a discman or walkman and do the same thing.  I can buy a DVD and watch it at home or watch it on a plane using a laptop or a portable DVD player.  In these other forms of entertainment there is one medium and you can have different players that accommodate the situation.  But with games it was always two players, two game libraries.  I have console games at home and handheld games on the go and they're different games that are completely incompatible with each other.

I really just want to play Pokémon X on my TV 99% of the time.  There is no reason they game wouldn't work on a console, particularly now that Nintendo has a touchscreen on their console.  In the past the handheld specs were noticeably toned down, but we had almost two years where the 3DS co-existed with the Wii and the games for the two platforms are so similar on a technical level that it seems arbitrary for them to be on different formats.  And it isn't like Nintendo even wants to make cutting edge console games.  They would probably be more comfortable making just handheld games but I want to play their games on the TV so why not let me?  Might as well just have one format and let the customer decide what best suits his lifestyle.  What's funny is that the Wii U find of tries this with the off-TV functionality.  They're trying to be accommodating to people's lifestyles but don't quite have it right.

Gamer: If I can't use the TV why not just play a handheld?
Nintendo: Well it doesn't have the same games.
Gamer: But, why does it need to be like that particularly when your Wii U Mario games all have a 3DS equivalent and your Wii U games don't make any effort to push the hardware anyway?
Nintendo: ...

Pretty much the only game ideas that don't seem to work on handhelds are local multiplayer and games that use peripheral controllers, but is that enough to justify an entirely separate platform?  Can't you just have some titles or game modes that only work in "console mode"?  Just like how something like Boktai or Kirby's Tilt 'n Tumble would only work in "handheld mode".  It's funny that the Wii's big gimmick really demonstrated a console-only function yet the Wii U seems to only offer a stay at home version of the handheld experience and they wonder why they can't sell it?

[NWR_insanolord]

What it really comes down to is that, since Nintendo makes every effort to take a profit on hardware sales, they'd much rather be able to sell you two pieces of hardware than just one. I'd only see them going with the hybrid model if the console market stops being profitable for them, and even with how poorly the Wii U has done so far I don't doubt it will make Nintendo money in the long term.

[BlackNMild2k1]

And if Nintendo is so focused on profits especially of control of profits in their hardware, do we really think they would release a "Steam Machine" where they make none of the profits from 3rd parties (who would just bypass Nintendo altogether) without some sort of deal in place to take a share of all software bought through the Nintendo branded machine?
Which may be in Steamworks favor, as I seriously doubt they will move anywhere near as many units of Hardware as Nintendo would. That would be instant and affordable market penetration for Stream, it would be MAJOR HYPE for both companies, but severely reduced profits for Nintendo outside of first party software (not that they making much these days anyway).
Also I haven't looked, but would Nintendo play ball with the stats required for a Steam machine? This would be a major deal for Nintendo to relinquish control their software platform to a 3rd party, and EA would sure boycott platforms eternally, unless machine was also an Origin machine too.

On the other topic of my Hybrid idea, if Nintendo doesn't go that route and decides to give it one more go around in both the console and handheld markets, then they better make damn sure well the next console is planned out along side the next handheld, and that the handheld can 100% double as the main or secondary controller for their Wii U2 or wherever they are doing.
We will need feature and button parity between the two. This doesn't mean the next console has to have a screen on the controller or all the capabilities of a dedicated handheld, but the next handheld better have all the same buttons, triggers, joysticks, cameras, motion sensors, mics, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth, etc etc, as the systems main controller so that it can be used in it's place as a companion piece to the console when at home.

Otherwise I think my Hybrid handheld is probably the route to take until Nintendo can buy a clue and figure out what they want to do next in the home console space.

[Adrock]

And if Nintendo is so focused on profits especially of control of profits in their hardware, do we really think they would release a "Steam Machine" where they make none of the profits from 3rd parties (who would just bypass Nintendo altogether) without some sort of deal in place to take a share of all software bought through the Nintendo branded machine?

I've addressed most of this already in the opening post, but I'll summarize here (I know that post was ridic long, but I recommend reading it for the sake of discussion).

First, no, I don't think Nintendo would do this since it forces them to relinquish some control of their hardware (though as stated, they would retain all control of their own software which is imperative and the only way this could work). The purpose of this thread was to suggest ways Nintendo could improve things for their next home console. I think this is the best and easiest way. It allows them to keep their console and handheld separate while fixing their one major discrepancy in the console space: third party support. Nintendo doesn't need much tweaking on the handheld end (the menus could stand to be faster). I say leave it alone for the most part.

Second, Nintendo already doesn't make much profit from third parties since third parties aren't supporting Wii U anyway. The idea is to make a Nintendo console more attractive to consumers resulting in more Nintendo software sold which is where Nintendo make most of their profits anyway. Essentially, they would be sacrificing licensing fees from third parties in hopes of releasing a more attractive platform and in turn the chance to sell more of their software to a much larger user base.

Which may be in Steamworks favor, as I seriously doubt they will move anywhere near as many units of Hardware as Nintendo would. That would be instant and affordable market penetration for Stream, it would be MAJOR HYPE for both companies, but severely reduced profits for Nintendo outside of first party software (not that they making much these days anyway).

I don't know about severely reduced profits. They would be trading third party licensing fees for the potential of even stronger first party sales.

Also I haven't looked, but would Nintendo play ball with the stats required for a Steam machine? This would be a major deal for Nintendo to relinquish control their software platform to a 3rd party, and EA would sure boycott platforms eternally, unless machine was also an Origin machine too.

The cheapest Steam Machine I saw announced is $499 by iBuyPower; Digital Storm announced one for $1469 (and possibly a fraction of your soul). I suggested getting the hardware down to $399 even if Nintendo takes a similar loss as Sony with PS4. The idea, again, is to sell even more software which may or may not work. Risk acknowledged. My understanding of Steam Machines is that Valve sets the specs and vendors manufacture and distribute the console. I'm suggesting Nintendo and Valve set the specs together and locked the hardware down. Nintendo is giving up most third party licensing (which is like the entire point of Steam) to Valve in favor of control of the hardware (and obviously, Nintendo's own first party software). Nintendo doesn't want their console freely modified and upgraded. Still, Nintendo and Valve would both have something to gain here. Nintendo releases a far more attractive and competitive console (conveniently remaining in their bubble) while Steam has even greater reach than before.

As for EA, it would be a necessary loss and one that wouldn't really hurt Nintendo any more than it is now considering EA has been a cock to Nintendo for over a year now. And the more popular Steam becomes (especially backed by Nintendo) the worse Origin looks.

On the other topic of my Hybrid idea, if Nintendo doesn't go that route and decides to give it one more go around in both the console and handheld markets, then they better make damn sure well the next console is planned out along side the next handheld, and that the handheld can 100% double as the main or secondary controller for their Wii U2 or wherever they are doing.
We will need feature and button parity between the two. This doesn't mean the next console has to have a screen on the controller or all the capabilities of a dedicated handheld, but the next handheld better have all the same buttons, triggers, joysticks, cameras, motion sensors, mics, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth, etc etc, as the systems main controller so that it can be used in it's place as a companion piece to the console when at home.

I also addressed this in the opening post.

Deep And Immediate Integration With 3DS' Successor
This should be done day one. We're already kind of seeing this with Nintendo combining their console and handheld teams and Miiverse being brought over to 3DS. They need to "talk" to each other. I would even go as far as having "4DS" function as a controller. That means it requires near parity with the new console's controller.

[Ian Sane]

What it really comes down to is that, since Nintendo makes every effort to take a profit on hardware sales, they'd much rather be able to sell you two pieces of hardware than just one. I'd only see them going with the hybrid model if the console market stops being profitable for them, and even with how poorly the Wii U has done so far I don't doubt it will make Nintendo money in the long term.

This is as good of an example of short-sighted Nintendo penny-pinching that you'll ever find.  This is what they'll do until someone else beats them to the hybrid idea and eats into their handheld market.  What I realize is that we can discuss potential Wii U successors all we want but if Nintendo makes a profit with the Wii U they likely won't improve a thing.  They need to suffer some losses or at least very narrowly dodge a bullet and be spooked by it.  Oh, and they have to not come to the conclusion that they should stop making consoles.  The decision that benefits us the best would require a certain amount of self-awareness and humility that would be out-of-character for Nintendo.  If they could make the right decision for next gen then they probably wouldn't have flubbed this one.