Author Topic: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread  (Read 89119 times)

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Offline ShyGuy

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #300 on: September 17, 2014, 05:47:45 PM »
I can't see a dreadnaughtus with feathers.

Offline Stratos

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #301 on: September 17, 2014, 10:14:45 PM »
Keep in mind that the sail shape is still a working hypothesis--the spine is still very much a composite of specimens.

As for actual diversity vs. ontogeny, that's constantly being revisited in dinosaur taxonomy. Certainly, this problem has raised its head in theropods, ceratopsians, and especially lambeosaurines multiple times. This is more a relic problem left over from The Old Days of paleontology, when people weren't as...hmm...caution about taxonomic knots as they are today.

The most famous (and persistent) example of ontogeny vs. diversity is "Jane," a small tyrannosaurine from Montana. Charles Gilmore found it in the 1940's and suggested it was a new species of Gorgosaurus ("G. lancensis"). In 1988, Bakker, Currie & Williams noticed that many of the skull bones were fused, which they took to be an adult condition, and gave it a new genus: Nanotyrannus. In 1999, however, Thomas Carr provided a takedown of the adult features, pretty well convincing everybody that it's a juvenile, and since it occurs in known Tyrannosaurus beds, he considered it a juvenile Tyrannosaurus rex.

And that's pretty much where it stays today, although a few workers (Peter Larson in particular) continue to be unusually forceful in their belief that Nanotyrannus is real, and is a pygmy tyrannosaur, even though that makes absolutely no sense from an ecological perspective.

Gilmore discovered and named a small ceratopsid in 1913, Brachyceratops, based on five clearly juvenile specimens. As so few ceratopids were known in 1913, the new name at least sort of made sense. However, much later, in the 1990's, it became clear that all juvenile ceratopsids pretty much looked the same until they hit puberty, so Brachyceratops was abandoned, and those specimens were labeled "indeterminate subadult" for several years until 2011, when Andrew McDonald showed that one of the frills showed characteristics of Rubeosaurus ovatus, so today we think "Brachyceratops" is just a baby Rubosaurus.

I could go into it with lambeosaurines too, but you get the idea. Dinosaurs changed a lot as they grew up, and that fact wasn't always well-known or even considered. Every new specimen that came out of the ground got a new name during The Bone Wars, and we're still untangling those taxonomic knots today.


I am glad to hear all of this came out. I was laughed at in my class as a kid and accused of being a "religious nut" because I was arguing the exact thing (except more worded as a youth would). Even teachers made fun of my arguments that many species were just juvenile forms of the larger creatures. People thought I was trying to discredit evolution when I just though someone had to account for there being so many similar species and few baby dinosaur specimens. Though my wording may have also been to blame for how others reacted.



How reliable is a composite that spans creatures from around the globe? I would imagine there would be a number of regional and special differences between them all.
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Offline Halbred

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #302 on: September 18, 2014, 09:22:25 AM »
@ShyGuy: There's no evidence that sauropods had feathers, so I wouldn't worry about it.

@Stratos: Well, the composite isn't from "around the globe," it's from a few locations in Egypt and Morocco, which are basically right next to each other. You're right to question provinciality; it's been brought up already in paleo-circles.
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Offline Ceric

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #303 on: September 19, 2014, 06:49:52 AM »
So does the Paleo Diet not being about eating dinosaurs go into this thread?
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Offline Halbred

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #304 on: September 22, 2014, 09:05:13 PM »
I don't know what that is. I don't pay attention to diet fads.
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Offline Stratos

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #305 on: September 22, 2014, 09:28:11 PM »
I'm a rather large fan of the paleo diet and it various off-shoots. If someone creates a thread for that I would certainly participate.


Halbred, the core of paleo's premise is to eat as our ancestors ate since our bodies evolved for ages on that diet. So there is a lot of personal research if you want to go "beyond the fad" and find the ideal for yourself. A lot of anthropological research on ancient and tribal diets are referenced in several quality works. Rules of thumb would be to avoid overly processed or refined foods like cakes and cheese whiz while eating more whole/natural/raw meats and produce. If your ancestors were herdsmen them your genes are probably more adapted to drink dairy and those with ancestors who did not have access to them tend to be lactose intolerant.


You can take it farther and try to "live" like your ancestors did. Some go overboard but, again, boiling down to the principals prove to have plenty of substance. Blue light from TV screens disrupts out sleep cycles and removing those light sources at night betters our sleep patterns.


Sitting in a chair for 8+ hours a day has lead to a rise in the need for more doctors and chiropractors. Our ancestors ran, played, hunted and fought. They had little need for chiropractors. You do need to watch what you read though. Some of the ideas can be quite hokey. But there is a growing body of science that supports the core principals that drive the diet.
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Offline Halbred

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Offline Stratos

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #307 on: October 22, 2014, 03:31:14 PM »
For a minute I thought you said Deinonoychus. My mind was blown for a second. This thing is a weird one.
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Offline ThePerm

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #308 on: April 07, 2015, 12:44:42 PM »
NWR has permission to use any tentative mockup/artwork I post

Offline ShyGuy

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #309 on: April 07, 2015, 04:21:19 PM »
Flintstones is canon again, so that's good.

Offline Stratos

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #310 on: April 08, 2015, 05:34:37 PM »
I always knew Little Foot was a Brontosaurus.
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Offline ShyGuy

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Offline Stratos

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #312 on: September 19, 2016, 05:34:11 PM »
So I am enrolled in a Geology course all about Dinosaurs for my final natural science course. Pretty excited to dig into some more meaty material and I'll post anything cool I find here. Would be fun to discuss what I am learning with Halbred.
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Offline ShyGuy

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #313 on: September 19, 2016, 05:49:58 PM »
As I get older, dinosaurs keep getting uglier. First feathers, now this:
http://www.scpr.org/programs/take-two/2016/09/15/52105/forget-jurassic-park-this-is-what-a-real-dino-look/

Offline ShyGuy

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #314 on: September 28, 2018, 08:36:02 AM »

Offline Stratos

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #315 on: September 28, 2018, 09:28:31 AM »
I just realized I said I would post thoughts from my Dino class last year and never did. When I get home tonight I'll have to post my final project. It was an info-graphic/poster on the raptors of North America, had a lot of cool things I never knew before.
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Offline nickmitch

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #316 on: September 29, 2018, 07:54:49 AM »
Pretty cool design, but it looks like a naked Kommo-o.  I think gamefreak can do better.
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Offline Stratos

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #317 on: September 30, 2018, 01:10:27 PM »
Here is my presentation of Raptors. My favorite tidbit from it was the discovery of "Balaur Bondac" the raptor with two claws on each foot.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/uqb1i3k6ad2vgkt/HASCUP_GEOL106_ContinentProject.pdf?dl=0
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Offline ShyGuy

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #318 on: September 30, 2018, 05:47:26 PM »
That's a dang impressive report.

Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #319 on: October 16, 2019, 08:41:28 PM »
Mummified Dino limb with skin, muscle and bone discovered!? Has a hoof and not a foot... (and no feathers)

https://www.facebook.com/188713700944/posts/10156834000825945/

Where is Halbred!? Someone excavate that man, and get us some answers!!!

« Last Edit: October 17, 2019, 06:19:03 PM by BlackNMild2k1 »

Offline ShyGuy

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Re: Halbred's Paleo-News Thread
« Reply #320 on: October 30, 2019, 09:21:55 PM »
Holy cow. It does look like a bird's leg though. Until you hit the hoof!