Topic: Metroid Other M

[Sundoulos]

Are you sure? They feel different. Though I haven't spent too much time with Zero Mission.

For the record...
http://gameboy.ign.com/articles/488/488084p3.html

"We used Metroid Fusion as a base for Metroid Zero Mission, but in the process we rebuilt portions of that engine. We added some new parts, and did a lot of fine tuning. It was a little more efficient than to create this game from scratch, but it wasn't quite as fast as we'd like. We still spent quite a bit of time with it. " - Yoshio Sakamoto

[Halbred]

Ah, so it's kind of a hybrid new/Fusion thing. Cool.

[KDR_11k]

That's pretty standard for engine reuse, you always find parts to improve or change. The game doesn't have to feel the same as even small tweaks to the physics variables can make a huge difference.

[NWR_insanolord]

Metroid Prime was Super Metroid in 3D in first person. Apart from the story and the exact sequence of events, they're the same thing.

[Mop it up]

Using that logic, you could connect any two games.

Mega Man is like Mario with a gun to shoot enemies instead of jumping on them. Aside from the non-linear progression and weapon selection, they're the same game.

[NWR_insanolord]

I'm saying the gameplay is the same, just from a different perspective. Way closer to Super Metroid than Other M, at the very least.

[Halbred]

My phylogeny would suggest otherwise. :-)

[Mop it up]

I disagree with that assessment. I do think that Metroid Prime was a good way to bring Metroid into 3D, but it has key differences from Super Metroid. Samus moves really slow compared to Super Metroid, and has much more restrictive jumping ability. There is also a much larger focus on gunplay, even if most of that comes from the transition to 3D space. The perspective in Other M feels like a more natural progression from 2D, Samus is almost as speedy and even more agile, and the gunplay is reduced to simply aiming in the direction of enemies, which is basically how it is in Super Metroid.

[Chozo Ghost]

I disagree with that assessment. I do think that Metroid Prime was a good way to bring Metroid into 3D, but it has key differences from Super Metroid. Samus moves really slow compared to Super Metroid, and has much more restrictive jumping ability. There is also a much larger focus on gunplay, even if most of that comes from the transition to 3D space. The perspective in Other M feels like a more natural progression from 2D, Samus is almost as speedy and even more agile, and the gunplay is reduced to simply aiming in the direction of enemies, which is basically how it is in Super Metroid.

Most of what you're talking about is probably due to the first person perspective than anything. Moving and jumping around in 1st person is a lot clumsier and difficult than it is in a 3rd person game like Super Metroid where you can see your character at all times, as well as where she is in relation to her environment. In 1st person when you're trapped inside a suit of armor its very difficult. So that difference from Super Metroid was one of necessity because it has to do with the limitations of being in FP.

I think the greater emphasis on "gun play" is also related to the perspective change. The first person genre of games are known to be gun heavy, and with that in mind as well as the fact that the Prime games were meant (at least in part) to be Nintendo's answer to Halo that probably put some pressure on Retro to have more gun blasting action incorporated.

I agree with you though that the Other M perspective is great and more natural from Super Metroid. I don't have a problem with that at all, and I hope to see that be used in future Metroid games. Of course, I am a very strong critic of Other M and there is a lot of things I don't like about it, but the perspective of it is something I actually approve heartily of. The things I dislike about Other M are completely unrelated.

[NWR_insanolord]

the Prime games were meant (at least in part) to be Nintendo's answer to Halo

For the last time, no they were not.

[Mop it up]

The only element of the Prime games that might have been in response to Halo is Prime 2's multiplayer mode, as some people regarded it as Nintendo's shooter. I don't think it was ever intended to be that though, as the mode seems more like an experiment.

[Spak-Spang]

I disagree with that assessment. I do think that Metroid Prime was a good way to bring Metroid into 3D, but it has key differences from Super Metroid. Samus moves really slow compared to Super Metroid, and has much more restrictive jumping ability. There is also a much larger focus on gunplay, even if most of that comes from the transition to 3D space. The perspective in Other M feels like a more natural progression from 2D, Samus is almost as speedy and even more agile, and the gunplay is reduced to simply aiming in the direction of enemies, which is basically how it is in Super Metroid.

I don't understand why people say Super Metroid didn't have a lot of gunplay.  Most of the game has significant gunplay or other traditional action segments.  I would say Super Metroid and Metroid Prime are very similar in pacing.  Both focus on not just shooting but learning your enemies and abilities and figuring out how to exploit and beat them.  Super Metroid's jumping and platforming feels faster and more acrobatic...but it also didn't have a feeling of realism to it. 

Metroid Prime I felt Samus had great jumping abilities that I could feel a weight to, but also I understood the scale and it felt like she was performing super natural jumps with a realism to it. 

[KDR_11k]

What I miss in post-Super-Metroid games is bosses that are defeated by slamming missile after missile into them, nowadays it's mostly trick and pattern based, making me wonder what I'm supposed to use 250 missiles for.

[gbuell]

That's a good point. Hunting down missile upgrades doesn't feel that important when you rarely use more than 50 of them in a boss fight. Other M seems to have responded to that by simply lowering the maximum missile count.

[Halbred]

But then giving you a bunch more missiles in the post-game scenario that you don't really need for Phantoon.

[Sundoulos]

What I miss in post-Super-Metroid games is bosses that are defeated by slamming missile after missile into them, nowadays it's mostly trick and pattern based, making me wonder what I'm supposed to use 250 missiles for.

Well, even in the original Metroid, you only needed to hit Mother Brain with about 40 missiles or so.  I suppose the problem was actually hitting her since there was so much junk flying around the room. 

[Mop it up]

I don't understand why people say Super Metroid didn't have a lot of gunplay.

I never said that, I said that Metroid Prime has more focus, and is expanded due to the first-person perspective. And to be clear, I still think Metroid Prime has a lot of the same elements, but Other M feels like more of a natural progression from the 2D games.

The key word with all my statements is "more."

That's a good point. Hunting down missile upgrades doesn't feel that important when you rarely use more than 50 of them in a boss fight. Other M seems to have responded to that by simply lowering the maximum missile count.

In fairness, part of the reason Other M has a much smaller missile count is because you can refill your stock at any time by holding the Wii Remote upward for a couple of seconds.

[KDR_11k]

What I miss in post-Super-Metroid games is bosses that are defeated by slamming missile after missile into them, nowadays it's mostly trick and pattern based, making me wonder what I'm supposed to use 250 missiles for.

Well, even in the original Metroid, you only needed to hit Mother Brain with about 40 missiles or so.  I suppose the problem was actually hitting her since there was so much junk flying around the room. 

In the original Metroid your gun was so weak you'd need to use missiles on many regular enemies too.

[Sundoulos]

What I miss in post-Super-Metroid games is bosses that are defeated by slamming missile after missile into them, nowadays it's mostly trick and pattern based, making me wonder what I'm supposed to use 250 missiles for.

Well, even in the original Metroid, you only needed to hit Mother Brain with about 40 missiles or so.  I suppose the problem was actually hitting her since there was so much junk flying around the room. 

In the original Metroid your gun was so weak you'd need to use missiles on many regular enemies too.

While that's true, it's never been necessary to max out your missile capacity.   If you were just making a run to Tourian, you could probably get by on 75 or so, accounting for all the Metroids you had to take out.

[KDR_11k]

Yeah, the metroids also drop a lot of missiles and the rate of fire on the things is limited either way (remember that you need 15 missiles for every zebetite though). IIRC Super Metroid let you fire them as fast as you could tap the button. In Prime the charge beam and lengthy reload of the missiles made them not very useful except as ammo for the combination beams.

[BwrJim!]

Super Metroid = quick character with about an under 2 hour adventure
Metroid Prime = Tank Character with about 6-8 hour adventure
Metroid other M = quick character with about 4 hour adventure

[vudu]

Who was the traitor?

Pretty sure it was James. You find his body where someone confronts Melissa Bergman (I used this instead of MB because 2 letters might defeat the purpose of spoiler tags) then a shot is heard when the screen fades to black. As you know, Melissa lives to be one of a few predictable plot twists later.

However, shame on you, Caterkiller, for not knowing this. James was the only one with a molestache, you should have known he was bad from the get-go. And unless I missed something, I found it odd that after the yellow Metal Gear battle, Samus doesn't go looking for him or anything.

I apologize for bringing back a post that's over a month old, but this is the only post on the subject of the deleter (other than to make fun of the name) in the entire thread.

I thought the deleter was KG.  If you go into his character bio in the post-game section it says something like "even though they searched the bottle ship no sign of KG has been found".

Adam was the one who confronted Melissa Bergman in the cut scene Adrock described above.  We later get to see the scene from a different point of view at the end of the post-game section (after beating Phantoon).  Besides, that scene happens in a different room than the one where Samus finds James' body.  James was most likely killed by the deleter.

[Sundoulos]

The game's writers took the opportunity to hit the player over the head with a hammer with every other plot point; it seems odd that they would choose to leave the identity of the deleter a little ambiguous.

[Chozo Ghost]

Well, I finally worked up the motivation to restart this game after giving up in disgust after running into that stupid glitch. I hope and pray the glitch doesn't occur this time around, because if it does I'm giving up on this game for good and then selling it.

[Mop it up]

I thought the deleter was KG.

It can't be. KG has the big plasma gun, and in the scenes with The Deleter, the person doesn't have that. Rewatch the scenes with James, you might notice suspicious behavior that you missed before.