Topic: Is this a glimpse of the future? Blu-Ray Disc ...

[RahXephon]

of course, i was merely stating where we will eventual be, and i dont think it will be THAT long.  Look at how far computers have come.  You buy one today, next week it is obsolete.  We are using blue ray.  Soon it may be Violet then U.V.  We will run into a problem with physical forms being limited.  Not next gen, probably like 20 to 30 years, and some stuff i said will work off the initial idea.  But like i said, there are to many limits in physical hardwear, cost material etcetra.  
And off topic go herego here.  You can thank me later

[NickNiteQ93]

Haven't really followed the new trends with the whole Blue Ray thing, but most game makers have problems filling up 1.5-3 gigs worth of space, let alone 23 gigs.  I think things will still be compressed, and they'll probably go with very realistic pictures, but not the real thing.  not just yet.  And trust me, if you're really into graphics you'll tell the difference between 1 billion and 1.2 billion.  Hell I expect nothing less than about 600 million raw from these next consoles.  perhaps maybe even edging into the billion mark?  That might be a little much, but those kind of graphics would blow me away.  

[ThePerm]

there are cheaper bigger formats then blue ray, and then there are proprietary formats that havnt been created yet. I wouldnt doubt nintendo will use a better disk medium next generation, they will not use dvd. They will probably go bigger(not size, diskspace). They will prolly be about 3 dvds worth. The real question is whether or not it will be beckwards compatable. The answer is probably yes. How quickly and flawlessly they were able to emulate n64 was amazing. They'll prolly have a small chip in gcn that translates code funtions into soemthing the next system will be able to do.

[BlkPaladin]

Depends on how much Sony really wants to make this a standard. Which I don't see happening. Sony has tried things but kept them prepitory much like Nintendo and their game formats. The last time they tried to set a standard it didn't go well. (Beta Tape)

And as for the discs being pricy, that will fall, especially when Panasonic begin pumping out hybrids of the new terabyte discs on the market. And with technology in media and the like advancing like it is its sure to fall fast especially since we are still looking at least another year and a half before the consoles hit the market, so anything is possible.

[Slab]

this blu-ray stuff doesn't impress me...I read a while back...like a year ago...that someone was developing some sort of fluorescent light technology with disc that could hold 100-450+ gigs.  Now that impresses....
here's the link

fluorescent technology

oh...near the bottom of the article...it says that it costs about $0.76 to produce a disc.  That's pretty damn cheap.
edited: to make the darn link work...lol

[deminisma]

wrong forum, buddy.
this is GAMECUBE-RELATED ONLY discussion. No GCN2, no PS3.
GAMECUBE ONLY

mwhahahaha -sound familiar, Rick?  

[Hemmorrhoid]

Quote
Hell I expect nothing less than about 600 million raw from these next consoles. perhaps maybe even edging into the billion mark? That might be a little much, but those kind of graphics would blow me away.

Why not more, first compare the advances. Say PS2 can do 60million raw, the PSX could do like 3000.
Now take that advance and consider realistic possibilites and the new PS3 processor Cell (1terraflop) which is supposebly 1000 times as a Pentium 4 2000. Why not push 1-2billion polys?

And expect the same graphical prowess in GCN 2 or Xbox next. Wonder what system will be the most 'powerful'

[Infernal Monkey]

Quote
Originally posted by: deminisma
wrong forum, buddy.
this is GAMECUBE-RELATED ONLY discussion. No GCN2, no PS3.
GAMECUBE ONLY

mwhahahaha -sound familiar, Rick?

Hey yeah.... *Gets out pitch fork*
Damn you big wigs and your abilities to bend the rules!
*Throws pitch fork and manages to stab own foot with it*

[Termin8Anakin]

In Marty McFly tone:
"What the hell is a terraflop?!"

Is that good?
And if Sony have come up with it, I think Nintendo would be doing something better.

[Tael]

Quote
Originally posted by: Termin8Anakin
In Marty McFly tone:
"What the hell is a terraflop?!

10^12 floating-point operations per second.

[Scoobert]

There will be no way this will happen next generation. When PS2 came out DVD players weren't even a third of $4,000. Prices go down in technology all the time, but will the price drop from $4,000 to $400 in 2 years? No way! Blu-Ray is designed for HDTV'sin mind, if you don't have one their's no point to using the Blu-Ray stuff.

Knowing Sony though, they'll just use normal DVD's again with maybe some different forms of encryption.  

[Hemmorrhoid]

scoobert thats a little exxagerated, when was a DVD player 4000bucks?
it was more like 700-1500 right at the beginning, when the PS2 was released it was already down to like 200$


Terraflop is one billion flops, which is damn fast.
The Cell (developed by Sony/IBM) works at 1terraflop, but the rumored GCN processor was supposed to have 2terraflops (but after all, thats just rumors).

[theaveng]

Yeah the forum rules are too restrictive.  Even the owner can't avoid breaking them.  Rick Powers is a God

Quote
Originally posted by: BlkPaladin
Depends on how much Sony really wants to make this a standard. Which I don't see happening. Sony has tried things but kept them prepitory much like Nintendo and their game formats. The last time they tried to set a standard it didn't go well. (Beta Tape)

Sony has a 50-50 record.  They flopped with Beta & Mini-disc.  But they suceeded with CDs and DVDs.  I'm betting this Blu-Ray technology will be adopted by the DVD Consortium.

[RickPowers]

I love how all the rules are attributed directly to me, and that when ever anyone is told not to do something, or is banned, it's always MY fault, whether I did it or not.  Oh well, like it really matters.  (I also find it very interesting what people have to say over there, but don't have the guts to say to my face here.  And people tell me that I need to lighten up!    )

This is posted here because I wanted you guys to talk about something that really matters.  This is very interesting stuff, and all three consoles are rumored to be heading in this direction.  If you guys want to ride my ass about "breaking my own rules", I'll be happy to shut this one down too.  Is that what you want?  No?  Then quit whining about it.  

Back on topic,

I'm fairly certain that the first recordable DVD products came in at a similar price point, and then dropped precipitously.  It's entirely possible that we might see this technology (or something VERY close) in a console by 2005.  Or it might miss this generation, it's very hard to tell.

It sure as hell is cool looking, though.    

[EL Pollo DIablos]

Maybe teh Next gen consoles will have a dvd-burner inside so u can save on the dics.
Thats how they could use the 23 gb.

El Pollo Diablos

[theaveng]

Quote
Originally posted by: RickPowers
I love how all the rules are attributed directly to me, and that when ever anyone is told not to do something, or is banned, it's always MY fault, whether I did it or not.  

Who makes the rules then?

And yes, I think this topic should be closed.  Or moved.  Just as you deleted the message from the innocent Newbie who asked if he should buy a GameCube.  It doesn't make sense to enforce the rules for some people, deleting their messages, and allow other people to break the rules.  Everyone should be treated equally.

[RickPowers]

Quote
Just as you deleted the message from the innocent Newbie who asked if he should buy a GameCube.

How do YOU know who deleted that message?  Everyone on PGC's staff is a moderator, so when something says that it was moved or deleted by "Planet GameCube Moderator", it wasn't necessarily always ME.  (For the record, it's a pretty silly thing to come to a GAMECUBE forum and ask if you should buy a GameCube.)

This is exactly the kind of thing I'm talking about.  I don't mind being the fall guy, but just keep in mind that it's not always me.  The rules were made partly by concensus, and largely by problems that the USERS have created.  In fact, every off-limits topic is a direct result from conversations that got way out of hand.  If you want someone to blame for the strictness of our rules, you should be looking at yourselves.

That said, for every person that complains that we're too strict, ten others thank us for it.  The signal-to-noise ratio is much higher as a result, and I'm not going to apologize for it, since it's having the intended effect.  

[PaLaDiN]

Will you guys get off Rick's case and discuss the topic. This is ridiculous.

That link you provided seems to be a burner... but where's the player? Did they skip over that? Or is Blu-Ray burning by definition?

Regardless, the price needs to go DOWN, and FAST.

[RickPowers]

Stand-alone players are pointless right now.  There's no pre-recorded content yet.

[Christberg]

First off, that thing has tons of functionality that can be stripped out of it for console use- it's not like there's any need for recordable blu-ray discs in consoles, in fact, quite the opposite.  It's not like it needs VCD or CD support, although for Nintendo it might need the ability to read GODs.  Honestly, if Nintendo goes with a smaller bluray disc the size of a GOD, they'd be set.

Go and compare the price of a DVD recorder and a regular DVD player for your computer and then think about it some more.  If you go back 2 years ago, the cost of DVD recorders was ridiculously high, in the several thousand dollar range.  In fact, at launch the cost was very similar to this unit for something with similar functionality in a home unit.  Last I checked you could buy a home DVD recordable for around 500 bucks.

The drive itself can't really be much more expensive to manufacture than any other drive, honestly.  The only thing different is the type of laser used, and a proprietary interface but that doesn't really change the cost either.

I think that it's not only feasible, but very possible.

Once again though, I'm hoping Nintendo goes with a smaller disc form factor to help decrease piracy even more because around 2007 or so recorders for this thing will be affordable enough that piracy could be a real problem for them, kind of like the PS2.

I think it's very likely next generation that Nintendo WILL, in fact, have the most powerful unit, simply because it's not going to include TiVo, web browsing, picture editing, and all the other garbage that will very likely be in competing systems.  Essentially they'll be able to make a competitive unit that for the same cost will only have gaming hardware in it, and that in my estimation is a good thing.  My computer already does all that stuff much more efficiently.  Besides which, does anybody really think they'll need another DVD player by 2005?  I sure hope not.

[TAYREL713]

Now thats a damn fine question. Is Blu-Ray the vcr of disc based media with the ability to play pre-recorded stuff and record your own stuff cause consumers would certainly eat this up and that would be to dope for a console. I recall reading an article about the founder of video talking about a video game system based on magnetic tapes (basically VCR tapes). The guy swore it would have been the truth if it could be implemented, I figure this disc based media would be the relization of his vision only in disc form. The re-writability that Nintendo wanted in the 64 disk drive, the space companies like Square/Enix want for FMV and the like, sounds like a gamers and developers dream come true.

[Hemmorrhoid]

See Rick though, if you lead into a discussion about GCN possible future disc technology, it might as well be fine to talk about its future graphics and processor technology right?

Especially today after the new partnership between ATI and Nintendo was announced. Since IBM is doing the PS3 processor and Xbox Next might sport some Intel processor wheres Nintendos processing unit from? NEC?!

[BlkPaladin]

NEC has been a partner with Nintendo for a while now especially making there chips. That's how Nintendo avoid the problems that nVidia and Microsoft ran into. Not to mention that NEC has one or two complete factories working exclusivly on Nintendo's chips for their systems. They are currently stamping the GPU and the MoSys memory onto the chips.

But as for the central processor there are plenty of other sources, they could go with NEC, but they could also go with Motorola which made the GBA's processor. Then their is AMD, or they can set out of get new talent like they did with MoSys.

As for the disc they wouldn't go with Blu-Ray for obvious reasons. They may deepen their partnership with Panasonic and maybe score a hybrid of the new disc they came up with. But truely DVD should stay the standard until the developers start to figure out how to fill over one DVD because the excess money it costs for these new formats will be pointless if the developers can't fill them in the time frame they have to get games out to be viable. Because there is only so much code you can do in a set period of time and developement cycles are being pushed into a shorter time frame for the third party developers. Personally I kind of like the idea of putting the disc in a tray with a flash chip in it that could elimate the need for memory cards. (Like SD technology. )

Note: You moved this as I was writting this. I kind of made my heart jump seeing it disappear.

[manunited4eva22]

There are VERY easy ways to fill an entire DVD. Use as little compression as possible. Had ED not been so heavily compressed it would have amassed easy 1 DVD to around 4 1/4 GBs. That leaves out goodies like DVD-A and much less compressed video. There are a lot of tools that cannot be fully used because of size issues.

[nolimit19]

i havent read every post, so sorry if i am repeating what someone else said. with that type of technology nintendo could stick with its little disc format, and still have loads of room to spare.