Author Topic: New Super Mario Bros. (Read 36481 times)

IceCold · « **Reply #75 on:** January 26, 2006, 09:21:11 AM »

I don't recall having many problems at all with camera in OoT and M64. And Sunshine's camera really wasn't as bad as many people make it out to be. I do agree, though, that Yoshi should have been used a lot better.

Hostile Creation · « **Reply #76 on:** January 26, 2006, 10:16:43 AM »

" The funnest part in SMS for me was Delfino Plaza, just running around and finding hidden shines and levels and such in the staging area. I wish that it would have been larger. "

Right on.
Also the level design was fine, there just weren't enough of them.
I'm also with Mario on the camera, though it did bother me immensely at some points.
Overall, I'd say I preferred Mario 64, but I certainly like SMS quite a lot, too.

Artimus · « **Reply #77 on:** January 26, 2006, 11:20:33 AM »

I didn't have camera troubles with M64, SMS or any Zeldas.

PaLaDiN · « **Reply #78 on:** January 26, 2006, 02:56:58 PM »

The only reason I mentioned camera in SMS was that:

a) You were supposed to control it; it wasn't automatic.

b) Pachinko machine. The one you get into by jumping upwards into the hole from the boat.

couchmonkey · « **Reply #79 on:** January 27, 2006, 05:38:06 AM »

I didn't think the camera was so bad, but the Pachinko machine and some other vertically-aligned sections like the climb up the cage behind the Roller Coaster were awful.

Back on the topic of SMB DS, I hope they've got the map screens back. I'd also like to see a cameo by the Koopa Kids...not necessarily 7 individual bosses, because I think Nintendo can do more with brand-new boss designs, but maybe they could form one super boss, or they could be mini-bosses. I hope the game is long, too. It seems like Nintendo hasn't released a really long 2D platformer since Yoshi's Island and the DKC games. I guess Mario vs. Donkey Kong was pretty long, but the levels are puny, too.

KDR_11k · « **Reply #80 on:** January 27, 2006, 06:20:45 AM »

If you had the Koopa kids piloting some big machines you could have all forms of bosses...

couchmonkey · « **Reply #81 on:** January 27, 2006, 09:33:43 AM »

That's a good idea. I'm a little leery of putting "Mechs" in a Mario game (a little too Sonic for me) but seeing as Luigi's Mansion and Super Mario Sunshine have already started down that path, and I keep defending them, I can't really argue.

ShyGuy · « **Reply #82 on:** January 27, 2006, 10:00:23 AM »

Mecha Bowser was a cool level in SMS

kirby_killer_dedede · « **Reply #83 on:** January 27, 2006, 04:46:06 PM »

The only time I remember having trouble with SMS's camera was with the Pachinko machine, but I think that had more to do with poor level design. SMS had an amazing camera. I just went back and played it (after a year and a half) to see what you guys were talking about...and as far as I can tell, the camera system is identical to that of Wind Waker. Plus, as Mario said, it's really fun to play with, especially when you're going super speed with the rocket dealie.

I loved Yoshi in Super Mario Sunshine. He's just so fun to screw around with. Useless, yeah. But it's just so fun (that's the only appeal GTA has, the levels are mediocre and the missions are often overly-difficult or overly-easy, but it's just so fun to mess around)!

KDR_11k · « **Reply #84 on:** January 27, 2006, 08:17:12 PM »

couchmonkey: Not just mechs, all kinds of machinery (trains, helicopters, perhaps a mechanism that controls the room you're in, etc).

Dedede: The camera likes to move around when you make sharp turns and if that sharp turn was while moving along a narrow path you fall off. There's one secret where you have to run along a path of dissolving blocks, which means no time to reposition the camera.

Mr Bloober · « **Reply #85 on:** January 28, 2006, 06:51:18 PM »

Quote
If you had the Koopa kids piloting some big machines you could have all forms of bosses...

Yeah, they did that quite well in that Yoshi shooting game, whatever it was called.

And, they had mechs in Luigi's Mansion...? Refresh my memory.

Ian Sane · « **Reply #86 on:** January 30, 2006, 06:30:30 AM »

Here's the big difference with the cameras in Wind Waker and Super Mario Sunshine.

In Wind Waker you're not expected to control the camera during intense moments. When you're fighting you z-target and everything's cool. If you can't see where you're going just push a button and the camera is instantly behind you. No getting stuck on items, no slow pan, just behind you right when you want it. You have the option to have complete control of the camera but it is never really required. I only used it in situation where I wanted a better view of the scenery.

In Super Mario Sunshine you are required to control the camera at all times. It doesn't matter if you're just walking around or if you're running on a rotating platform. You're for some reason expected to move the damn C-stick at the same time you're pushing the A button to jump. It's a completely illogical design and the game is made considerably harder for no reason because of it. In reality it's like controlling two character at once. Hell they even treat it like the camera man is a person. He gets stuck on things and can't see perfect through walls and stuff like that.

I don't know why every game doesn't use Zelda's method. I can't see. Okay I'll just push this button and now I can. It's so f*cking simple. I think the problem is they always get hung up on the idea of it being a camera and thus for some reason it has to maneuver through areas. It's not a camera. It's the omnipotent vision of the player and thus it can teleport and see through walls and do whatever it wants.

KDR_11k · « **Reply #87 on:** January 30, 2006, 06:47:01 AM »

The camera in Wind Waker is more obedient as well, when you position it somewhere it stays there, unlike Sunshine's camera that insists on changing its position depending on how you move.

A problem with going through walls is that it could be abused to go through scenery and see things you're not supposed to see. Testing for visibility fails as well since that's done with BSP trees and those fail if you move into solid matter.

animecyberrat · « **Reply #88 on:** January 30, 2006, 06:58:27 PM »

so when is NEW Super mario Bros coming out again? I havent been keeping track.

ABlueflameA · « **Reply #89 on:** January 30, 2006, 06:59:36 PM »

This game is the best DS game I've ever played, and I only played maybe 5 minutes of it. It is that good. I wish that Nintendo would at least give us an idea of when its coming out.

Let the waiting commence....

couchmonkey · « **Reply #90 on:** February 01, 2006, 05:36:21 AM »

I was playing Majora's Mask last night, and I sorely missed the C-Stick camera controls from the Wind Waker. Particularly when I was chasing the Bombers around, I would lose the target and then all I knew was that he was somewhere offscreen. Precision jumps were also a lot harder, because you can only center the camera behind you, so if Link isn't facing in exactly the direction you want to jump, it's always off-center.

Either way I agree that Zelda's camera system is great, but I was surprised to discover just how much Wind Waker improved the system for me.

KDR_11k · « **Reply #91 on:** February 01, 2006, 06:17:32 AM »

Yeah, well, I played Windwaker first so the lack of the c-stick was even worse for me.

Hostile Creation · « **Reply #92 on:** February 01, 2006, 07:12:00 AM »

I consistently argue that Wind Waker is superior to the N64 games, at least as far as raw gameplay goes. I play OoT and MM now and it's like trying to play SSB, it just feels so sluggish and dull in comparison.

couchmonkey · « **Reply #93 on:** February 01, 2006, 09:09:29 AM »

Oh, I totally agree that Wind Waker's gameplay is superior to the N64 games. Besides the control stick camera, the fighting controls are soooooo smooth, it's beautiful. The dodging added quite a bit of depth and the combos you can stick together are insane!

But back on the 2D Mario front, I just checked out the latest screens for Super Princess Peach on Nintendo.com and I'm stoked! I haven't seen so much classic Mario stuff crammed into a few screenshots since Paper Mario...Paratroopas, Firebars, Banzai Bill, donut lifts...I may have to buy this game on launch day. And I need Chibi Robo too! Must find money before Feb. 27th...

IceCold · « **Reply #94 on:** February 01, 2006, 01:40:08 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: KDR_11k
Yeah, well, I played Windwaker first so the lack of the c-stick was even worse for me.

Ah, no wonder..

IceCold · « **Reply #95 on:** February 01, 2006, 01:53:42 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Hostile Creation
I consistently argue that Wind Waker is superior to the N64 games, at least as far as raw gameplay goes. I play OoT and MM now and it's like trying to play SSB, it just feels so sluggish and dull in comparison.

Sorry about double post..

Anyway, Hostile, OoT was designed so that the combat would be quite strategic and slow-paced, whereas in Wind Waker it was more hack 'n slash and fast-paced. The combat systems reflected the differences in the mood, atmosphere and every thing about the two games. TP will probably be more similar to OoT; I think Aonouma said that you would "feel the weight of the sword" or something like that.

However, I too enjoyed Wind Waker's combat system. It was simply brilliant in some areas - and it was just fun to beat up enemies. The parry was an excellent addition, but it was a bit too easy to pull off. And finally, the weapons were great - how they handled changing the bow to fire and ice was so simple, yet so effective..

Hostile Creation · « **Reply #96 on:** February 01, 2006, 10:25:56 PM »

Yeah, definitely. OoT was a different style of fighting, and one that I liked, just one that I find a little too tedious in retrospect.
I'm hoping Twilight Princess will mix Wind Waker and Ocarina of Time well, having the slow-paced, Germanic style of swordplay with the fluidity and speed that Gamecube is obviously capable of delivering.

Ian Sane · « **Reply #97 on:** February 02, 2006, 06:16:51 AM »

I liked the Ocarina of Time style of fighting better because it was, well, harder. The first time I fought an Iron Knuckle my heart was pounding out of my chest. In Wind Waker the only time I really felt like I was in an intense battle was when I was fighting a lot of knights at the same time. The Wind Waker combat system worked really well for those kinds of situations but one on one it was too easy to win.

Requiem · « **Reply #98 on:** February 02, 2006, 08:03:58 AM »

Agreed.

Iron Knuckles should definitely make a return. Fighting two at the same time in Ganondorf's castle[/spolier] was probably my favorite non-boss fight in the game. It's craziness. Its basically like fighting one, but it's two times as fast. If you didn't have the Goron sword it took a while.

Oh ya, and fighting those Gerudo's guards was fun as well.

I saw the WW fighting style far too easy. I did like how you could pick other people's weapons up, but overall, I never felt in danger. I wish the parry was harder to do.

Bill Aurion · « **Reply #99 on:** February 09, 2006, 06:55:57 AM »

What the hell? This topic is about Mario Brothers, not Zelda! >=|

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Author Topic: New Super Mario Bros. (Read 36481 times)