Topic: Ahh Gimmicks?!? Why do enthusiasts seem to hate them?

[Razorkid]

gim·mick/ˈgimik/
Noun:A trick or device intended to attract attention, publicity, or business.

The prime thing that sets apart Nintendo systems from the competition each generation (besides 1st party  software) are "gimmicks". I place quotes around "gimmicks" because, to me, they add something significant to the experience of gaming. 

• The N64 controller with its 3 prong handles and lone analog stick

• The Gamecube controller with its ergonomic design and radial button layout

• The DS with its 2 screens

• The Wii with its split controller and motion sensing

• The 3DS with glass-less stereoscopic 3D

• The WiiU with its GamePad

Every time new Nintendo hardware arrives, enthusiasts moan and groan over the new features as "gimmicks" and "things I don't want in my gaming" instead of celebrating the fact that they will be able to experience something new or fresh takes on familiar territory.


If you've followed Nintendo over more than a generation, you know that with every hardware release they are gonna bring something unexpected to the table.  So why do enthusiasts continue to complain as if this is a shock when it happens? I can't stand it when enthusiasts (especially games journalists) crap all over something because it's new or not something attempted by other console developers successfully in the past, especially when they haven't tried it for themselves yet.


Stop me if you heard this one before:


"Oh my god, 2 screens? That's so dumb. I can just press a button instead of using a dumb stylus"


"Ahh, *flails limbs* whats with all this waggle? Motion control is dumb, I can just press buttons"


"Oh my eyes! I'm never gonna play with 3D on because it's dumb and all things 3D is dumb"


"This is just a fisher price tablet with buttons. How do I know what screen to look at? This is dumb, It's just gonna be used for maps anyway"


On podcasts, anytime people talk about something that a game does new (and well) with a specific hardware feature, the word gimmick is often used and almost in a derogatory way.  Like, despite this gimmick being in the game, the experience is rather enjoyable. It's as if people are afraid to admit that they like something because of things like motion control (including Kinect), stereoscopic 3D, and going foward the use of the GamePad (or Surface) to name a few recent examples. 


Like whats wrong with liking games because of that? Is it uncool to be wowed by something that's suppose to be a gimmick? It certainly seems that way with enthusiasts.


I bring this up because in less than 12 hours, the WiiU will be released and a lot of game reviews will be up from embargo.  I can almost guarantee that some reviews will be complaining about the use of the GamePad screen outside of the actually implementation of it in said game, similar to how people had a hard time getting over the fact that, "Yes, motion control was intricate to the Wii." and "Yes, motion control was mandatory in a lot of software"

Now, I'm not complaining about the games that use these new technologies and ways to experience games badly.  A bad game is a bad game no matter what bells and whistles you dress it in.  But what's wrong with experiencing a new game (or old experience) on new hardware on it's own terms? Why must enthusiasts always insist on doing things "the old way" and never giving good fresh experiences a fair shot? 


I can tell you right now, more than their 1st party offerings, what Nintendo does each and every hardware cycle is the only that brings me back to console gaming. I'm a PC enthusiast and I can care less about what the next xbox or playstation will bring because I know it's never gonna be as whimsical or out of the box as Nintendo.


Why do enthusiasts act like fart knocking old grognards whenever something new arrives in the industry that isn't ooh, grafix ?


Why do people hate fun?

[ShyGuy]

Enthusiasts are old and set in there ways. They're too old to enjoy change.

Deep down, an enthusiast's negative reaction to motion control is the same thing that makes grandpa not want to stop using AOL.

YOU HAVE BECOME YOUR FATHER HARDCORE THE REBELLION WAS A LIE

[Kairon]

We fear what we don't understand. Innovation is always an enormous risk. Change is a threat to the status quo.

But I say "rise and rise again, until lambs become lions."

[Razorkid]

I get wanting parity with what's standard in the current market, but do people honestly believe that a simple bump in graphics alone will allow fresh experiences to propagate? I can't wait to read all the impressions decrying the use of the GamePad altogether and advising people to play with the classic controller whenever possible. The irony is that going forward, every console maker is gonna copy this in some form or fashion to make standard on their platform like many of Nintendo's innovations on the controller in the past.

[SixthAngel]

Shyguy nailed it.

Combine that with the techies who only care about cutting edge graphics, and only in their narrow experience, instead of actual new tech for the industry like motion.  These people say they like new things and the push of new tech but only in the small area they care about. Motion and even 3D left their "increase fidelity and just give me a better version of what I already have" comfort zones.

[BeautifulShy]

Yep Shyguy has it right. I am one of the older gamers on the site here but I personally am open to new types of gameplay and games and I think that has been been like that at least since the middle of the GC generation. I just think that has to do with because how long I have been playing games and how old I am.I kinda seen a lot of the gaming landscape and any change is a bonus or else it is just stagnation in this hobby of ours otherwise.

[MrPhishfood]

I get the feeling Shyguy has it in reverse. Isn't it the younger gamers that are more resistant to change because they weren't appeased by new control methods and automatically thought it would always be bad. Whereas the older generation have been using standard control pads for so long they are now more open to new ideas and experiences.

[BeautifulShy]

I get the feeling Shyguy has it in reverse. Isn't it the younger gamers that are more resistant to change because they weren't appeased by new control methods and automatically thought it would always be bad. Whereas the older generation have been using standard control pads for so long they are now more open to new ideas and experiences.

I think you may be both right. I know for me personally I am not the norm on this forum in that I am open to trying out new things and such for games. If we are talking gamers in their mid 20's and such and younger then yeah I think those gamers are resitant to change. Most teens want to have it their way don't want things to change and the mid 20's as well.

[EasyCure]

All I know is new ways to play are the only thing keeping me in gaming because otherwise what's left besides Annual Shooter/Sports titles?

[Razorkid]

I get the feeling Shyguy has it in reverse. Isn't it the younger gamers that are more resistant to change because they weren't appeased by new control methods and automatically thought it would always be bad. Whereas the older generation have been using standard control pads for so long they are now more open to new ideas and experiences.

I disagree.

Most games journalists have these types of opinions and reactions to new hardware whose prime feature isn't pushing polygons, especially if it forces them to do something that they haven't done before.  They're the lightening rods that most enthusiasts gravitate to and their opinion, in turn, affects a lot of younger gamers. 


A kid raised on the Wii and Kinect won't have a problem with motion gaming vs someone who grew up with the NES and is content with just pressing buttons from the couch. Like was stated earlier, people fear change to their beloved hobbies, especially those who become cynical and calcified in their tastes in this industry.


It becomes less about "Is this fun?" and more about "Why can't this be like how I've been playing for a thousand times now?"

[MrPhishfood]

I'm 27 myself and I grew up on gaming starting with the NES. Maybe I'm just in the minority on this one. Video gaming has felt incredibly stale this generation, its come to a point where I get this feeling of deja vu everytime I play a game.

[Razorkid]

I'm 27 myself and I grew up on gaming starting with the NES. Maybe I'm just in the minority on this one. Video gaming has felt incredibly stale this generation, its come to a point where I get this feeling of deja vu everytime I play a game.

Exactly.


31 here and in the same boat. For as cynic and dismissive as some enthusiasts can be, you'd think they'd be all over something fresh in this great hobby of ours.

[EasyCure]

I'm with MrPhishfood and Razorkid (31? hardly a kid!)

[Razorkid]

I'm with MrPhishfood and Razorkid (31? hardly a kid!)

Always at heart

[SixthAngel]

Most games journalists have these types of opinions and reactions to new hardware whose prime feature isn't pushing polygons, especially if it forces them to do something that they haven't done before.  They're the lightening rods that most enthusiasts gravitate to and their opinion, in turn, affects a lot of younger gamers.

To go further on this point, reviews generally don't take into account when a game is bold or tries new things.  They only appreciate changes they expect. 

You would think that a game that does something new and exciting with a few small problems should be something to go crazy for but instead it is dealt with extremely harshly.  Meanwhile fps #243 goes completely by the numbers, takes no risks but is not special in any way, gets a much higher score.  Mediocrity is rewarded, even more so if the studio has the money to throw enough shiny graphics to make it look better than other games.

[broodwars]

Personally, I despise Nintendo's focus on gimmicks because they use them as a crutch to rarely ever evolve their software design. Instead, they just iterate on the same ol' concepts and franchises, just with tacked-on gimmicks as the selling point.  That's why "gimmick" is a word with such negative context: it's used as a means to hide complacent software development and maintain the status quo for as long as possible.

If I had a reason to believe that we'd actually see new IP or radical new ideas along with Nintendo's latest gimmick, I wouldn't have too much of a problem with them. But I'm getting tired of "it's the same game you've been playing for 25 years, but NOW with <X>! See! Adding <X> totally makes up for the fact that it's essentially the same game you've already played many times over!"

I just want to see something truly new and compelling from Nintendo on the software side. Mario, Zelda, etc. are great, but I want to see new ideas in the game design itself, not just excuses to show off Nintendo's latest gimmick.

[Kairon]

If I had a reason to believe that we'd actually see new IP or radical new ideas along with Nintendo's latest gimmick, I wouldn't have too much of a problem with them.

I don't know about you, but that's what I'm seeing when I look at Brain Age, Ouendan/EBA, Wii Fit, Style Savvy, Wii Music, Dillon's Rolling Adventure, and more. I personally find the "no new IP" complaint flabbergasting.

[SixthAngel]

I don't know about you, but that's what I'm seeing when I look at Brain Age, Ouendan/EBA, Wii Fit, Style Savvy, Wii Music, Dillon's Rolling Adventure, and more. I personally find the "no new IP" complaint flabbergasting.

Those don't count. I mean new IPs like a steam punk Zelda or an fps in a different environment. Totally original ideas with brand new gameplay like that.

[TJ Spyke]

Kairon mentions new IPs, then you reject them and say they don't count. Those are original ideas with new gameplay. You just mean they are not in genres you want.

[broodwars]

Kairon mentions new IPs, then you reject them and say they don't count. Those are original ideas with new gameplay. You just mean they are not in genres you want.

I believe he was being sarcastic.

[EasyCure]

I don't know about you, but that's what I'm seeing when I look at Brain Age, Ouendan/EBA, Wii Fit, Style Savvy, Wii Music, Dillon's Rolling Adventure, and more. I personally find the "no new IP" complaint flabbergasting.

Those don't count. I mean new IPs like a steam punk Zelda or an fps in a different environment. Totally original ideas with brand new gameplay like that.

@TY I'm sure this quote was meant to be facetious

[Razorkid]

Personally, I despise Nintendo's focus on gimmicks because they use them as a crutch to rarely ever evolve their software design. Instead, they just iterate on the same ol' concepts and franchises, just with tacked-on gimmicks as the selling point.  That's why "gimmick" is a word with such negative context: it's used as a means to hide complacent software development and maintain the status quo for as long as possible.

If I had a reason to believe that we'd actually see new IP or radical new ideas along with Nintendo's latest gimmick, I wouldn't have too much of a problem with them. But I'm getting tired of "it's the same game you've been playing for 25 years, but NOW with <X>! See! Adding <X> totally makes up for the fact that it's essentially the same game you've already played many times over!"

I just want to see something truly new and compelling from Nintendo on the software side. Mario, Zelda, etc. are great, but I want to see new ideas in the game design itself, not just excuses to show off Nintendo's latest gimmick.

Say what you will about Nintendo reusing old IPs, at least the gimmick in question makes them fresh experiences. I can't say the same for the majority of 3rd party software that have come out, especially this generation.

I agree that new ips are important, but they alone cannot keep gaming from stagnation from one generation to another as far as I'm concerned.

[Mop it up]

I've been playing videogames since the NES era, so nothing really surprises me anymore. New experiences... it's very rare to find them these days, and it's been this way for at least five years. After playing so many games over the past 20+ years, I know how games work, I know how they all control, I know how they all play out, I know what to expect from pretty much any game I play, no matter the genre or developer. Fortunately I don't need a game to be a new experience for me to enjoy it, but the sense of wonder I once had playing games will never be had again. Though to be fair, part of that comes with growing up, but even so, I've played too many games.

Perhaps Nintendo feel somewhat similarly. Maybe they try to come up with crazy new ideas for their systems because they, too, are looking for that new experience even after so many years and so many games. Sometimes things work out, and sometimes they don't, but no matter the outcome, I applaud Nintendo for all their gimmicks, and for having the guts to try then even in the face of doubters.

[MrPhishfood]

Say what you will about Nintendo reusing old IPs, at least the gimmick in question makes them fresh experiences. I can't say the same for the majority of 3rd party software that have come out, especially this generation.

I agree that new ips are important, but they alone cannot keep gaming from stagnation from one generation to another as far as I'm concerned.

Exactly, how else can designers create new gameplay experiences without a new control interface? Gaming as we know it today has reached a point where all games are just combining different elements from other games to create a "fresh" experience, but I've played so many of these that I've started getting deja vu.

People want something new that's not a gimmick, how is that even possible?

A lot of the arguments against Nintendo boil down to this:

I don't want gimmicks and 6 year old hardware and reused IPs
So you don't want any of that?
No
So you want little to no change in the control scheme, newer better hardware and new IPs?
Yes
You want all 3 next-gen consoles by Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo to be almost the same?
No
So what do you want?
I don't know
So you know what you want, but you don't know what you want?
Uuh yeah

[UncleBob]

So what do you want?
I don't know

110% This.

If making (good/popular/successful/self-financing) "new IPs" and "new experiences" was easy to do, then every developer and publisher would be doing it non-stop.  And if they're just all too worthless and lazy, then we'd see garage developers popping out large-scale new IP projects on a regular basis.