Author Topic: Castlevania SOTN remake by Silicon Knights (Read 17286 times)

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #25 on:** November 01, 2003, 10:10:55 AM »

Well, for what other reasons did it not sell? The game was a bone fide masterpiece, and by all accounts should have sold millions of copies. I personally don't buy Denis's theory that it didn't sell because it's not a game you can immediatley get into- I have yet to play an RPG I could immediatley get into, and yet games like Final Fantasy sell several millions of copies within the first month alone. It's more of an excuse, if you ask me.

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #26 on:** November 01, 2003, 10:36:38 AM »

Final Fantasy also sold very poorly until they loaded it up with FMV and turned it into something different.

Bona Fide masterpieces such as Valkyrie Profile, and Dragon Quest also sell very poorly in North America.

Flames_of_chaos · « **Reply #27 on:** November 01, 2003, 01:25:56 PM »

BrainLord wich was a Enix title sold badly in america too

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #28 on:** November 01, 2003, 01:27:42 PM »

Silent Hill has also sold quite poorly. (I would say for the same reason as Eternal Darkness. People play it for 5 minutes then give up)

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #29 on:** November 01, 2003, 01:36:43 PM »

That's not the point, Ninja- FFX probably has more cut scenes than the whole lot of them and it took me forever to get into the game, and that sold extremely well. The simple fact is, if people don't know about the game, chances are they won't buy it, either. I can't remember the last time I bought a game blindly.

Flames_of_chaos · « **Reply #30 on:** November 01, 2003, 01:37:36 PM »

Well Silent Hill was over shadowed by alot of PSX games at its time.

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #31 on:** November 01, 2003, 03:36:44 PM »

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Originally posted by: mouse_clicker
That's not the point, Ninja- FFX probably has more cut scenes than the whole lot of them and it took me forever to get into the game, and that sold extremely well. The simple fact is, if people don't know about the game, chances are they won't buy it, either. I can't remember the last time I bought a game blindly.

That's because by this point Square has a million little fans who go out and buy every piece of crap with their name on it, and that goes double for Final Fantasy. It's not like Eternal Darkness wasn't advertised, because it WAS, and quite heavily I might add. The problem was that everyone saw it as a crappy Resident Evil clone, and there's just no way to show how untrue that is in an advertisement.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #32 on:** November 01, 2003, 03:38:31 PM »

But how did Square get so many millins of fans if they make RPG's, which take a long time to get into?

And saying Eternal Darkness was heavily advertised is a boldfaced lie and you know it.

I didn't see ONE commercial, much less any other type of advertisement, for the game, and I watch TV ALL the time. Don't even try to convince me that Nintendo advertised the game, because there is no way in hell even you believe that. Any sort of commercials Nintendo quickly rushed out was shown very late anyway, just like those Conker's Bad Fur Day commercials.

Cap · « **Reply #33 on:** November 01, 2003, 03:39:09 PM »

although i did see it quite often, the eternal darkness ad was quite possibly the most boring game commercial i have ever seen.

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #34 on:** November 01, 2003, 03:41:32 PM »

Because they advertised the hell out of Final Fantasy VII, and took great care to show nothing of the gameplay, only the FMV. People knew dick all about the game, but bought it because of the FMV. Of course, that might work for Silicon Knights, if they added a whole bunch of swearing and blood and guts to their game, and advertised the hell out of that. But would you or I approve of such an activity? I would like to think not. I know that I don't want to see another GTA.

EDIT: I watch TV VERY seldom, and I saw the Eternal Darkness ad at least 3 times on TV.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #35 on:** November 01, 2003, 03:42:21 PM »

"Because they advertised the hell out of Final Fantasy VII"

What a great day and age when the people I'm debating against prove my point.

And don't try to tell me FFVII only sold because people saw the FMV- that's another boldfaced lie right there. It's not like the same people brought the game home and hated it.

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #36 on:** November 01, 2003, 03:43:21 PM »

read further mouse clicker. Read further.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #37 on:** November 01, 2003, 03:45:00 PM »

I did, man, but I just HAD to mention that you proved my point. I added to my post.

REGARDLESS of why Eternal Darkness didn't sell, the whole idea of this thread is about Castlevania's rumored remake at the hands of Silicon Knights, which I don't like. If we can, we should probably get back to that.

nemo_83 · « **Reply #38 on:** November 01, 2003, 05:18:41 PM »

I've seen the majority of people quit playing Zelda and Metroid this generation because the games were not immedieately exiting like Oot or A Link to the Past. That was the fault with those games. Most people don't have the patience to sit through the first hour or two of WW or Prime. I have seen many people pick up the games and then put them down, but those who sat there a while and let them grow on them fell in love to a degree with those games. I didn't like the beginnings of the games myself, but I am a follower of those series and knew what to expect later on so I kept playing despite the horid first steps full of instructions.

Eternal Darkness was not that hard to get into, perhaps harder than WW or Prime, but not nearly as bad as Nintendo makes it seem. I didn't expect ED to get off the ground fast, but it got moving a lot faster than say Final Fantasy. This attitude in Nintendo makes me worry that they may also not advertize FFCC or any other RPG because the games are supposed to be story driven like ED was. ED failed to sale because of lack of advertising. I would definately make part two easier to jump into, but I wouldn't simplify the experience any.

I want ED2 to be harder, deeper, and darker. I want to have to summon small armies of creatures in fights. I want to summon creatures that can summon creatures.

I want ED2, WW2, and Prime2 to all be easier to get into. Metroid wasn't any fun till you got to the planet (sounds like the same situation with Halo). WW had WAY too much instructional bordom in the beginning of the game. Whatever happened to starting the game and learning as you go rather than trying to read everything in the first hour. The beginning of WW was redundant. I already knew how to do all of that stuff. There were days of old when they put the instructions for the slow people in the instruction booklet. As for Eternal Darkness, the first parts may have been integral for the push off of the story, but they were boring untill the game reached the Middle Ages. I wish Nintendo would invest more time making more sincerely difficult games than making so many scavenger hunts.

Deguello · « **Reply #39 on:** November 01, 2003, 06:01:07 PM »

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I want ED2 to be harder, deeper, and darker. I want to have to summon small armies of creatures in fights. I want to summon creatures that can summon creatures.

I want to be able to dance around in a chicken suit in MGS:TS. If I cannot dance around in a chicken suit, or other things like having a chicken suit, but no dancing, or being able to make Solid Snake dance, but no chicken suit option, MGS:TS has disappointed me in my completely reasonable, totally specific, and undisputedly possible expectations, and shame on Silicon Knights for making video games without my input.

"Disappointed" is the most dangerous word in the English Language.

nemo_83 · « **Reply #40 on:** November 01, 2003, 07:13:39 PM »

What the hell are you talking about Diguello? MGS has nothing to do with dancing in chicken suits. ED actually has to do with summoning creatures in battles. It isn't like I asked for jumping or the ability to crawl in ED2.

Urkel · « **Reply #41 on:** November 01, 2003, 09:33:14 PM »

I'm really starting to get a little tired of Nintendo being blamed as the reason for ED's less than stellar sales. It was not a very mainstream game. It quickly got labeled as a Resident Evil knockoff. The early impressions from the stripped down demos lead people to believe that it was a mediocre hack'n'slash. As for it not getting enough advertising, I think it got way more than you're average Nintendo game. I saw the ED commercial AT LEAST 10 times. Must depend on which channels you watch. Maybe the reason the ads weren't very effective was because there wasn't a good way to present ED to the public in 30 seconds. Seeing a skeleton talk to a giant lobster is completely confusing out of context, but if you were actually playing the game, it makes perfect sense.

Regarding this whole SOTN thing... it seems pretty unlikely. Not gonna do it. Na ga da. I think Ninja hit the nail on the head as to why SK is remaking MGS. Hardly any of those reasons would apply to a SOTN remake. SOTN isn't a story driven game. It's not like the kind of games SK makes.

Too many people are starting to make the assumption that since SK remade one game, then they're going to remake a whole bunch of other games. Honestly, I think the only remake SK will ever make is Twin Snakes. I think that some of their biggest reasons for remaking the game are still secret, and if you read between the lines in several interviews, you just might see what I mean.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #42 on:** November 02, 2003, 07:32:33 AM »

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I'm really starting to get a little tired of Nintendo being blamed as the reason for ED's less than stellar sales. It was not a very mainstream game.

What wasn't mainstream about it? It had guns, it had monsters, that's pretty mainstream, isn't it?

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It quickly got labeled as a Resident Evil knockoff.

Shouldn't that HELP sales, considering how popular Resident Evil is and how many people want games like it?

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The early impressions from the stripped down demos lead people to believe that it was a mediocre hack'n'slash.

Name me ONE casual gamer that read one of the demo impressions- only hardcore nerds like us do that.

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As for it not getting enough advertising, I think it got way more than you're average Nintendo game. I saw the ED commercial AT LEAST 10 times.

Why is your "ten times" trumps my "jack diddly squat"- I watch TV nearly all day when there's a big gap between games, like last June, and I failed to see even one mention of the game.

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Maybe the reason the ads weren't very effective was because there wasn't a good way to present ED to the public in 30 seconds. Seeing a skeleton talk to a giant lobster is completely confusing out of context, but if you were actually playing the game, it makes perfect sense.

Like I said, look at how well some RPG's sell, and there's no way to present THEM in 30 seconds. Eternal Darkness sold very poorly despite being an extremely good game, and other games of it's type have sold well in the past. What went wrong, then?

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #43 on:** November 02, 2003, 09:24:30 AM »

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What wasn't mainstream about it? It had guns, it had monsters, that's pretty mainstream, isn't it?

It had a storyline too deep, and references too subtle to appeal to the casual gamer UNLESS they sat with the game for a few hours.

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Shouldn't that HELP sales, considering how popular Resident Evil is and how many people want games like it?

Nobody likes a cheap imitation. Like when Pepsi Vanilla came out, I don't know one single person who thought that Pepsi wasn't just ripping off Coke. I know about as many who actually drink the crap.

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Name me ONE casual gamer that read one of the demo impressions- only hardcore nerds like us do that.

There were Cube Clubs in the US, and there was a bit of talk about it before the game came out. Most of it was pretty negative.

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Why is your "ten times" trumps my "jack diddly squat"- I watch TV nearly all day when there's a big gap between games, like last June, and I failed to see even one mention of the game.

The point here is that 2 out of 3 of us say that we saw it on TV all the time, and I know that I know casual people who noted the commercials. You can't just say that it was a bald faced lie just because you never happened to notice any.

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Like I said, look at how well some RPG's sell, and there's no way to present THEM in 30 seconds. Eternal Darkness sold very poorly despite being an extremely good game, and other games of it's type have sold well in the past. What went wrong, then?

The ONLY RPG that sells well in North America is Final Fantasy. It doesn't need to be advertised. It's got 50 million little fanboys running around who will buy it regardless. And I was around for the rise of the Final Fantasy era. It happened with Final Fantasy VII. They showed clips of the FMV, and magazines showed artwork. The focus was on making the game seem really massive, and to show the FMV as being actual gameplay graphics. Back then, people didn't know any better, and bought into it. In a sense, Square advertised something completely different than the product. People bought the game because of that, but it was a pretty good game in its own right, and easy to get into, so they gave good word of mouth on it, regardless of the fact that it wasn't what they expected.

Now I am sick to death of fighting over this.

NinGurl69 *huggles · « **Reply #44 on:** November 02, 2003, 11:20:53 AM »

Why is this thread even around?!

the crazies!

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #45 on:** November 02, 2003, 12:44:07 PM »

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It had a storyline too deep, and references too subtle to appeal to the casual gamer UNLESS they sat with the game for a few hours.

RPG's have incredibly deep stories- why do you continually ignore this?

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Nobody likes a cheap imitation. Like when Pepsi Vanilla came out, I don't know one single person who thought that Pepsi wasn't just ripping off Coke. I know about as many who actually drink the crap.

Yeah, and guess what- almost everybody I know now drinks Pepsi Vanilla constantly.

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There were Cube Clubs in the US, and there was a bit of talk about it before the game came out. Most of it was pretty negative.

In about 10 or so big cities in the US- how many people do you know that not only played Eternal Darkness in a Cube Club but decided not to buy it as a result? Even if this is true, it's now Silicon Knights' fault that their game didn't sell, because in their effort to keep spoilers hidden they ruined people's impressions of the game, according to you.

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The point here is that 2 out of 3 of us say that we saw it on TV all the time, and I know that I know casual people who noted the commercials. You can't just say that it was a bald faced lie just because you never happened to notice any.

And you can't say Nintendo advertised the game properly simply because you saw a few commercials.

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The ONLY RPG that sells well in North America is Final Fantasy. It doesn't need to be advertised. It's got 50 million little fanboys running around who will buy it regardless.

Then tell me, how did Final Fantasy get 50 million little fanboys that will buy it regardless?

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #46 on:** November 02, 2003, 12:54:50 PM »

*sigh*. Can we please drop this Mouse Clicker? Fine. I will just concede the argument to you. Because you never saw any commercials for Eternal Darkness, that means that they only had 2 or 3 during the advertising period, and I was lucky enough to see them both. Final Fantasy's FMV is not a selling point at all, and people buy the games for the incredibly deep stories in such shallow games as Final Fantasy 8 and 9. Eternal Darkness was a game that any joe shmoe would understand and appreciate in a 30 second trailer.

You win. Can we stop fighting now?

ThePerm · « **Reply #47 on:** November 02, 2003, 01:21:03 PM »

i was gonna buy castlevania 64 as soon as it came out...but i rented it and it turned out to not be so great...it acutally locked a few times and carrying that nitro everywhere...now that was a pain in the ass. Also i played castlevania 64 part 2 and it was actually pretty sweet...except i played it on an emulator at a friends house....its also very rare and very hard to find...this would be one of those sleeper games like mystical ninja that i would buy the next time i saw it.

savanna03 · « **Reply #48 on:** November 02, 2003, 03:10:01 PM »

for me, i dont really want SILICON KNIGHT to do a remake for any other games. i rather want them to do original contents or a sequal of their old games. its nice for them to make collaboration with other companies because they will learn and gain wisdom by the experience but remaking existing games doesn't give them any freedom at all. those wisdom will be a complete waste because you dont get creative control of the project because you will just spend your time satisfying the creator of the orginal game to make sure it doesn't ruin the essence of the game.

NinGurl69 *huggles · « **Reply #49 on:** November 02, 2003, 04:06:50 PM »

I have both N64 Castlevanias. I love both, but of course there's a lot of unrealized potential, however like the webmaster from the Castlevania Dungeon says, they do have some good points.

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Author Topic: Castlevania SOTN remake by Silicon Knights (Read 17286 times)