Topic: Too Human Speculation

[BlackGriffen]

This board is too full of gushing and b_tching about current games. It's time to add some more of the the PGC forums' traditional baseless speculation and wishful thinking.

The Subject: Too Human - gameplay mechanics, desired upgrades, features, etc. are all fair game.
The Rules: Posts containing facts are not permitted, unless those facts are couched between sound speculation. Posts containing nothing but the obvious are a waste of everyone's time, don't do it.

I'll start the ball rolling:

minor upgrades:
Muscle type - contol the balance of fast and slow twitch muscle tissue. Quick customization of speed and strength versus stamina with little impact on your humanity.
Adjust where tendons connect to bones: moving them out increases strength and speed (better leverage) while reducing range of motion.
Braces - you gotta look good while your kicking butt!
Eye inversion - human nerve cells actually go over the top of rods and cones, requiring the use of axons without myelin sheaths (slower conduction speed) and reducing light sensitivity. Squid have eyes that are built right, so I imagine this shouldn't be too difficult (may even be genetically engineered in to the general population by then).
vitamin C production - not actually an upgrade, but something I'd like to see mention of in the game is fixing the genetic defect only present in humans and chimps that makes it so we cannot produce vitamin C on our own.

Medium upgrades:
catalyst based power plant - Permits cyborg parts to be run off of food taken from the digestive system instead of a battery (yes, I want the guy to have to eat and recharge to power whatever he does to himself - everything comes at a price).
scent control - in case you need to sneek past dogs, or go out on a hot date.
stereo sense of smell - snakes actually do this, they can "smell in 3-D," that's what' their forked tongue is for. May be possible just by splitting the nasal cavity.
Active and Passive sonar - speaks for itself, I want the guy to be able to "visualize" his surroundings with sound. Useful for detecting false walls, cybernetic implants (sensitive to the density of the material sonar is being used on), seeing though dust too thick for infrared, etc.
Increased speed (mental and physical) - Upping your mental speed slows the game down. Increasing your physical speed speeds you up. You'll need both to be really effective. (novelty = distinguishing the two) It will be interesting if SK doesn't "speed up" gravity like so many other visions of super speed do (when Neo tried to fall back to dodge the bullets in The Matrix, he would have lifted his feet off the ground instead of falling back because gravity is not strong enough to pull him down that fast).
Vocal control - permits impersonation, ventriloquism, etc.

Advanced Upgrades:
Continuous feed lungs - by having an extra air sack, it's possible to keep fresh air moving over the lungs, even while exhaling. Birds do this.
Continuous feed heart - an eight chambered heart (aritficial or not) can keep blood moving constantly, instead of a pulse.
Poison cells - for the close in and silent killer, have consciously controlled poison cells similar to those found on a jellyfish.
Interface needle - Hack in to a guard's brain to gain access to sensitive areas without going in yourself, pray no one sees the needle mark, though.

Yes, I want this game to be that detailed. The game is also supposed to contain a library where you can read histroy from now to then. I want to expand that. I want the game to be three discs - two for the game/FMVs, one for all the text! Hell, don't waste space on the FMVs, fill that up with text, too! Maybe they should just make this game a MUD...

BlackGriffen

[vudu]

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The Rules: Posts containing facts are not permitted, unless those facts are couched between sound speculation.  Posts containing nothing but the obvious are a waste of everyone's time, don't do it.

this probably falls under that category, but damn dude, you put a lot of thought into this.  i hate to break it to you, but i sincerely doubt the game is going to be that detailed, and it's not likely to live up to your expectations.

ever thought of producing video games yourself?  i'd buy one.

[Hemmorrhoid]

Black Griffen nice ideas although perhaps not quite what you expect to be inside a Cyborg. Id really think most organs are enhanced by machines, like eyelens implants, enhanced muscle power...

My ideas

Eye features: Infrared view, Nightvision, Xray, Farsight

Body features: Muscle enhancement, either going for brute power and toughness or speed and agility.
So one might be stealthy and do all sorts of dodging acrobatics, or one is strong enough to wield 2 Gatling Guns and tough enough to eat
50bullets.

This is all I can come up with now, but in general, I have huge hopes for this game, as in infinite hype and a game that makes Wind Waker look like crap.

[Ian Sane]

BlackGriffen a lot of the stuff you said is pretty cool in theory but some of it doesn't really add anything to the game.  Who cares if the character can smell better?  Will this realisicaly affect gameplay?  Ditto with that Vitamin C production.  Unless the designers made it so that the character required a certain amount of daily vitamins to stay alive (which would likely be a huge annoyance much like any RPG that requires you to eat food every five minutes) it doesn't really affect gameplay.  However stuff like Sonar and increased speed are all good ideas that translate well to gameplay.

One thing that I think would be cool is if your character could later in the game aquire several bodies and have the ability to switch his consciousness to the different bodies.  That way you can essentially create multiple characters and use them for different situations.  You could have parts where he kills an guard and takes over their dead body to sneak around.  Meanwhile he has to hide his "real" body so no one else finds it and if he gets caught he has to risk escaping in the inferior guard body instead of his superior real body.  The guard body makes it easier for him to get around unnoticed but doesn't have as good of strength or firepower so you have to choose what body to use depending on whether you want to sneak around or run in with guns blasting.

Another cool idea would be the ability to learns things via direct brain download like how Neo learns Kung Fu in The Matrix.  In terms of gameplay this could be a way to learn moves or gain abilities like medical knowledge to heal yourself or hacking knowledge to hack into security systems and turns off specific cameras, etc.

[Epitaph]

Ok if you ever read some of the reviews or comments Denis Dyack makes on this game is that alot of the weapons, upgrades, buildings, etc... are bassed on things that nasa and other science labratories are working on. Here are some of the things I know you can expect and things that are very possible.

If you look at some of the pictures theirs one of a space station with the big pole under. This is actually something nasa was discussing, it would be a giant elevator to transport people to the space station, it would be axed to the ground and transport at high speeds. Im not sure when or if nasa will release this. But it is what that picture states.
Here is the Picture im talking about

Also I imagine another likely possibility is the new camoflage being developed will be in this game. It was originally created by a canadian since the americains have joined with canada to develope this technology. I believe theirs also russians and someone else. This camoflage is designed to change with its surroundings, So lets say you go from a jungle to a desert, you suit will change color to suit your suroudings.

I also believe you will have guided bullets, just like a smart bomb their are in the works bullets that follow a target. I think this is something that will surely be in the game.

I also think you will have access to learn curent martial arts to aply it into your game. Not only will you get things in developement but things in the present.

I also remember reading that in this game you will be able to upgrade your skin to make it tougher like armor, so no longer will you be carying armor you will be armor.

Their are also such things as strength, mind, agility, stamina etc.. upgrades

I know their where some more upgrades but I can't think of them at the moment, But I can garantee you this will be one stunning game that won't dissapoint no matter how high your expectations are. Its been in developement for as long as I can remember and it won't be made to forget about. Silicon Knights is going for the kill with this game, and i know they can deliver.

[BlackGriffen]

By smell better, did you mean the scent control on the 3-D sense of smell? Scent control would be good for clandestine operations where you have to sneak past dogs or there are ammonia detectors. 3-D sense of smell would, theoretically, permit you to "see" your surroundings with smell (i.e. in chemical profile). As for the vitamin C thing, I would just like to see it in the game, like something that gets fixed in the future. The braces were a joke (though only partly, they should put some funny upgrades, too!).

Also, the whole purpose I put this stuff in here was in the hopes that Denis might see it and say, "Why not?" Assuming they still have time, that is.

Good idea on the adaptive camo.

EMP grenades - fun for fragging cyborgs and computers alike. Just make sure to turn off your own stuff before the bomb goes off.

Holographic head - great for the disguise ops, your actual senses and brain are "relocated."

Sonic Resonance Gun - requires much skill, but devastating when used right. Basically, it's a tunable focused sound weapon. The device will detect the vibrations in the target (very sensitive laser range finder, maybe) and tune itself to fire on resonance. Then it will release a blast of sound that will make whomever/whatever you're facing literally fall apart. Advantage: very powerful. Disadvantage: relatively short range, takes time tracking the same target to tune itself (SK adjustable, of course), you're easy to detect when using it.

Proximity Mines with coded Friend or Foe signal reciever - proximity mines that won't blow up when you're too close.

Internal oxygen 'tank' - stores and releases oxygen directly to your blood stream, permitting you to hold your breath and move more silently.

Shades - no cyborg is ocmplete without a set of shades.

A dealer who is always trying to sell you 'enhancements' to your sex life - wouldn't be realistic without some sleezeball trying to peddle something like this. Especially the small fry black market dealers.

Come on, guys, be more creative and specific! We did a lot better than this with insanity effects brainstorming and features for Zelda!

BlackGriffen

[Epitaph]

ok let me add some more then if you want to be more creative

-why stop with holographic head make it possible to generate a whole hologram to deture a enemys perception so you can slip around him.

-have a type of upgrade sort of like wolverines abilities, metalic implant in the bones to make them extreamly strong, retractable blades inplanted in your body(very possible btw we do have head implants that you can retract now days) and the abilitie to heal yourself.

-how about limb rejeneration, you get your arm shot off a new one grows. although not without its problems the regenerated limb will need to get exercised before use if you want the same strength.

-steroids to help with fighting

-Little robotic creatures that you can set free and control via a little screan, or if possible gba connection.

-retractable wheels in your feet to speed up your movement

-gas imunities, to avoid getting affected by various gasses you can get implants, shots, etc to stop you from being harmed by deadly gasses.

-lie detection, you interogate the oposition for info, and without its a guess if he is lying or not now you have a percentage guess of the truth

-gills, much better then a air tank

-poison fangs, you are now a cobra

-remember what was the super heros name, well anyway he could chew a thousand times per minute or something like that, what a grusom way to kill someone.

-training to seduce woman

-arm blades have many blades lined up our arm, this would make for some kick ass stealth. Grab a guy with your arm and push him down the blades. I think they have it in blood rayne actually

-claw implants

-bonocular eyes you can zoom in and out at will. um ok thats all i have for now  

[BlackGriffen]

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Originally posted by: Epitaph
ok let me add some more then if you want to be more creative

-why stop with holographic head make it possible to generate a whole hologram to deture a enemys perception so you can slip around him.

That's the spirit!

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-retractable wheels in your feet to speed up your movement

Go go, Gadget skates! Sorry, I couldn't help it. Do you suppose we'll be able to build an inspector gadget? That would be fun .

BG

[Duriez]

Here are a few things I'd like to see:

1)  Spider-like feet and hands upgrade:  This would allow you to crawl or walk up walls and on ceilings.  This could be used for stealth and to get to hard to reach places

2)  Mind enhancements:  You could buy different different CPUs that would connect to your brain.  The differnent CPUs could enhance your mental capabilities to do different stuff, like allow you to access and store data in picture or video form, allow you to connect to information mainframes, allow you to hack into computers to unlock doors in a building or obtain blue prints for a building so you know where you are going, allow you to control various aspects of your surroundings (change traffic lights, open or close doors, get money from ATMs, remote control vehicles) and of course, allow you to play mini-games in your head just for fun.....hehehe.   You could upgrade the CPU (faster processor and more memory) in your brain to perform these tasks faster or to do additional tasks (that I haven't thought of).

3)  GBA connectivity:  This wouldn't be required, but it would add to gameplay.  It'd be cool if a friend could play against you with the GBA.  I dunno, have mini-missions that you can only get with the GBA connectivity.  Your friend could control squads of robots or have control over various aspects of a building, like sentry guns and elevators and then try to stop you from getting to a certain room.  I'd have fun trying to devise strategies to kill my friend.  This would be hard to balance, but what the heck, this is all speculation anyways.  

Yeah....that's enough trying to think creatively for one night.  

[Hemmorrhoid]

What would certainly be cool is a map that the character would actually see. What I mean is that in games like MGS for example, you know where the enemies sight is directed at, but that wouldnt really be possible. But in the future where Too Human plays, some sort of device allowing this (which many of your ideas already somewhat mentioned) would really make sense.

Imagine you could accelerate your body particles for a limited time and then go through walls etc, or be invisible (got this idea from Smallville anyone remember ), this would also fit into the future.

He should also be strong and fast enough to outdo gravity, so he can run up walls or jump mega high ala Matrix(but this should be time/energy limited too, or an hard to obtain upgrade that doesnt work under certain conditions).

[BlackGriffen]

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Originally posted by: Hemmorrhoid
What would certainly be cool is a map that the character would actually see. What I mean is that in games like MGS for example, you know where the enemies sight is directed at, but that wouldnt really be possible. But in the future where Too Human plays, some sort of device allowing this (which many of your ideas already somewhat mentioned) would really make sense.
Imagine you could accelerate your body particles for a limited time and then go through walls etc, or be invisible (got this idea from Smallville anyone remember ), this would also fit into the future.
He should also be strong and fast enough to outdo gravity, so he can run up walls or jump mega high ala Matrix(but this should be time/energy limited too, or an hard to obtain upgrade that doesnt work under certain conditions).

If the guy is fast enough to dodge bullets, he'll certainly be fast/strong enough to run up walls like gravity wasn't there. The tricky thing, though, would be that the character would have to learn to bounce along like the astronauts did on the moon...

BlackGriffen

[Hemmorrhoid]

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Imagine you could accelerate your body particles for a limited time and then go through walls etc, or be invisible (got this idea from Smallville anyone remember  ), this would also fit into the future.

BTW, would this theoretically be possible, or is it just some of the typical crap you hear on tv.
The funniest movie BS Ive ever seen was the Bio-Chemical Weapon Containment foam talked about in Universal Soldier 2 (god that movie sucked).

[vudu]

am i the only one thinking that if this guy could do all that you've been talking about the game's not going to be very fun/hard?

he sounds practically indestructible.  i imagine it would be pretty hard (impossible) to die unless he was allergic to kryptonite and the enemy had a rather large supply of it (unlikely due to licensing problems).

plus, seriously, if the guy was made out of pure titanium, why would he need holographic doubles or super stealth ability?  what's going to happen if an enemy spots him?  the bullets would bounce right off.  why would he need to take over the mind of a guard to open a locked door?  he could bust right through it using his retractable jack hammer arm (which doubles as a weapon to be used against those pink demons from doom ii).  come to think of it, why shoot people with homing bullets when he can grow to thirty times his size and crush the entire base under his foot?

while these all seem to be entertaining ideas, i don't think they'd make a really good video game.

on a side note, i think if he did have all those abilities, you'd wind up only using 3 or 4 of them on a regular basis and ignore the rest.  kind of like the cards in castlevania:  circle of the moon or the rings in zelda:  oracle of ages/seasons.  nice ideas, and fun to try to collect them all, but did any one ever use the cards that let you use mp instead of hearts for sub-weapons or the ring that let you throw bombs farther?  

[Ian Sane]

"am i the only one thinking that if this guy could do all that you've been talking about the game's not going to be very fun/hard?"

That's a good point but it's not like you would be able to get all of these abilities right off the bat.  You would start off quite weak and build up as you go along.  Plus these are all customization options.  You don' t have to have all of these abilities and likely they would make it so that you're limited in how many enhancements you can have.  Plus you're limited by body parts so you can't have your left arm be both a gun and a blade.  It's one or the other.

Plus a good deal of this stuff is all what if.  We're just throwing around ideas.  In any sort of realistic game you likely would include less than half of them.

[BlackGriffen]

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Originally posted by: kingvudu
am i the only one thinking that if this guy could do all that you've been talking about the game's not going to be very fun/hard?

he sounds practically indestructible.  i imagine it would be pretty hard (impossible) to die unless he was allergic to kryptonite and the enemy had a rather large supply of it (unlikely due to licensing problems).

Actually, one of the points of the game is that you have to choose how you want to play and how many upgrades you want to get. Certain features will definitely be mutually exclusive (a lumbering heavy hitter isn't too good at sneaking around).

The enemies will have access to this tech, too, of course.

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plus, seriously, if the guy was made out of pure titanium, why would he need holographic doubles or super stealth ability?  what's going to happen if an enemy spots him?  the bullets would bounce right off.

Three words: electromagnetic rail gun. Oh yeah, I definitely want to see one of these bad boys in the game. Even just a simple high powered maser (microwave laser) could melt someone wearing metal. There is no defense so strong that an offense cannot be devised around it, and there is no offense so destructive as to be completely unavoidable.

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why would he need to take over the mind of a guard to open a locked door?  he could bust right through it using his retractable jack hammer arm (which doubles as a weapon to be used against those pink demons from doom ii).  come to think of it, why shoot people with homing bullets when he can grow to thirty times his size and crush the entire base under his foot?

Big guys make for nice big targets.

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on a side note, i think if he did have all those abilities, you'd wind up only using 3 or 4 of them on a regular basis and ignore the rest.  kind of like the cards in castlevania:  circle of the moon or the rings in zelda:  oracle of ages/seasons.  nice ideas, and fun to try to collect them all, but did any one ever use the cards that let you use mp instead of hearts for sub-weapons or the ring that let you throw bombs farther?

If they make the game like I'm expecting they plan to, you'll only be able to afford 3 or 4, but they'll all be useful if combined with others in the right way.

I also realized that there's another realistic limit to how fast this guy can go: air friction. Sure, if he's strong enough he can theoretically overcome any air friction, but all that friction generates heat. So, even if he could power himself moving that fast for a long time (and the concrete/ground doesn't just disintegrate under his feet) he'd burn up. Yeah, that still leaves a lot of room: upwards of mach 2 or 3 I'd guess (the SR71 flies at around mach 3 and it has to be built so that it leaks fuel on the ground because all of the metal plates expand so much in flight).

spider silk spinnerets: mechanical or organic. The point being that spider silk has a tensile strength higher than steel. That makes such a spinneret perfect for climing/rappelling, tying strong cyborgs up, and as a garrote cable.

Internal compartments for concealed weapons: shielded to avoid metal detectors, of course. Nothing too big, either, something simple like thin combat knife, some "chewing gum" explosives, or whatnot. That is, assuming there is the possibility of getting captured, or a need to slip in through the front door as a "respectable citizen."

BlackGriffen