Topic: Killer Games

[Kairon]

If we're going to talk about Kuju, I think it's worth mentioning that Battalion wars sold poorly and that the game itself was vastly underwhelming.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

IT'S FUN AND WELL EXECUTED

THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG WITH YOUR STATEMENT, Sir. (nothing to do with sales -- nintendo is just riding the nonmario/zelda/pokething=consolefailure train as usual.  Ian has the PhD on the subject.)

[Mario]

Battalian Wars sales is still up in the air because it only just came out, as for it's quality i'm not sure because I haven't played it but i've heard nothing but great things. It looks like the type of game that would be a killer app online

[cubist]

On topic...killer games should all be exclusive...I'm going to take the confirmed Metroid Prime 3, Super Smash Bros. Online sequel...and raise you a Kid Icarus that makes use of the controller with respect to flying.

As for Batallion Wars...the game has a bit of learning curve...but once you get going...you get the same satisfaction that you get when you're playing the original Pikmin.  Why not Pikmin 2?  Both Batallion Wars and Pikmin are single-player only.

[Kairon]

As a devout Nintendo Fan, I must object. I find Battalion Wars to be a flawed game. It fails to give you the tactical overview and organized control that makes pikmin so managable, and the level designs are also oftentimes designed in such a fashion that you must play through it several times before you find out that the only way to win is to do X instead of what comes naturally. I am of the opinion that Shigeru Miyamoto would create an infinitely more polished game than Battalion Wars, in both scenario design AND game control.

The only hands-down good thing about Battalion Wars is the fact that the model's feet conform to the terrain. Everything else about it I do not consider special.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[IceCold]

Quote
you get the same satisfaction that you get when you're playing the original Pikmin. Why not Pikmin 2?

*checks Gamecube collection....*

Still there, whew!

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

It may be a matter of taste, but I disagree.  For what Battalion Wars asks of one, it works well, being a game that forces you to worry about multiple targets in a very short amount of time (action-oriented), in contrast to Pikmin which is perceivably very manageable thanks a much more relaxed pace (puzzle-oriented) and not-so-vulnerable player-characters and enemy groups that aren't as numerous and capable and agressive as your own Pikmin and tactics.

And winning in BW was... easy.  Being careful and getting 90%'s in 2 out of 3 ratings, depending on player habits, on the *first try*, was a common occurrence.  You see the map, know the objectives, and get the job done while improvising along the way.  Surprise enemy advances and being flanked are to be expected given the "war" atmosphere.  The mission-based setup is another obvious sign (that should've been seen miles away) you may be faced with trial & error.  People die a lot many games, learn from their mistakes (yes, their mistakes, as in inadequate responses) and retry, win, and move on -- no big deal, that's video games.  Getting S-rankings is the difficult part.

I actually welcomed the idea of zelda-targetting and unit management via C-stick.  They helped it avoid becoming an FPS and avoid the menus & map-clicking of other strategy games.

But, saying Miyamoto could make a better game, despite him probably never bothering to make something like BW outside Pikmin, is a little unfair, don't you think?

[Kairon]

LOL. Unfair in the sense that no one should be forced to be judged against Miyamoto maybe, lol.

I still believe that if Miyamoto had wanted to make a battalion wars, it'd be a refined experience. At times battalion wars feels crude because it seems that the developers can't decide whether to treat it as an RTS-type game or an action game. This is further compounded by the feeling of being artificially hemmed in in later stages by the unit number limits, as if the game wants to be a mass-army RTS but it's gameplay just can't handle it. Another thing that irks me is the game's insistance on giving you a light tanks in later missions when heavy tanks would have suited the mission profile much better, striking me as illogical. And as much as I am forgiving in terms of accepting a game for what it is and nothing more, the non-detailed style of their FMVs and over-the-top voice acting just grated on me by the end.

And then of course there's the whole slew of small things that I get the sense could've been improved upon. The targetting reticule is not evident unles you train yourself to see it, the campaigns have virtually no distinct seperations such that you know as you go from mission to mission when you enter a new campaign (I was in the Solar Empire when I realized that I wasn't in the first campaign anymore!), and, my largest pet peeve of all, being in the last stage but being unable to capture the two flags because you have only one infantry unit and enemy infantry spawn such that you can never catch both flags.

No, as much as I was looking forward to BW, I was critical of it by the end.

Either way, let's remember that Miyamoto doesn't believe in over-the-shoulder action-shooters. He said as much in relation to Rare's Jet Force Gemini. I must agree with him that especially in BW, there's something in the gameplay that feels conflicted and torn between two genres, and thus not completely at ease.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[Don'tHate742]

Um.....anyway.....


Starfox would be incredible. The controls would be very easy, very non-gamer approachable. If they gave this game some great level designs (more planet missions, with fox flying through caves, mountains, forests, and canyons) and an incredible sense of speed (for that adrenaline factor) then it would be an automatic winner. I've always thought that starfox should lean a little more towards manouvering rather than shooting enemies. It should use enemies instead to make the gameplay more hectic, and more crazy.

I can see it now. Imagine fox flying through a canyon at high speeds. Enemies approach and he blasts them away. Another group approachs but instead of attacking fox directly, they shoot sides of the canyon, sending huge boulders in fox's path. To avoid them, fox has to do all sorts of crazy manuevers while trying to take the enemies out. At one point Fox is faced with the boulder of all boulders. The only way to avoid it is to dive below it in hopes of not getting crushed. But careful! You'll have to dive so low that you barely skim the water. Any more than barely, and it's your ass!

This game would be incredibly hard with controls of today, but with the REV it'd be so intuitive that once you know what to do, you immediately do it. That doesn't mean the game won't be hard. However, it'll be because of your abilities rather than you not being able to do what you'd like to do.

Let Miyamoto head the project and it would be a killer-app easy.