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TalkBack / Re: Second Opinion: Mario Kart 8 Review

« on: May 15, 2014, 03:58:42 PM »

It's hard for me to totally judge how I'd treat this game if I didn't review it, but I have a feeling this is how it would go down:

I would get MK8 day one, play it furiously for a weekend. I likely wouldn't play it much after that outside of multiplayer. I don't think I would regret the purchase at all.

Thanks!  This mini review is actually more helpful than the paragraphs of texts we get with traditional reviews.  Not that I dislike long-form reviews, but these few sentences packed in a lot of meaning.  Maybe including something like this in each talkback thread would be something reviewers can consider.

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TalkBack / Re: Second Opinion: Mario Kart 8 Review

« on: May 15, 2014, 02:25:03 PM »

I'd really be interested in how all these people got advance copies of the game that allow them to know what score it deserves.

While it is ridiculous for someone to claim that a game they have never played deserves a better score, it is not ridiculous to question whether a reviewer approached the game with a certain bias for or against it based on the text of the review.

No more than to question whether a reader approached a game review with a certain bias for or against it based on their history with a company.

My criticism is not based on my history with Nintendo.  It is based on the words in the first two paragraphs of this review.

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TalkBack / Re: Mario Kart 8 Review

« on: May 15, 2014, 02:22:03 PM »

Every single person who owns a Wii U has played at least one previous Mario Kart game. Everyone has different opinions if this series coming into the newest game, and those are going to color (not pre-determine) your reaction to what the new one brings or doesn't bring. That is inevitable when you're dealing with such a long-running franchise.

Exactly!  Shouldn't the overall opinion of the reviewer be taken into account when the review is assigned?  Neal has stated that he was not tired of Mario Kart games when he approached this review, and I trust that he is being honest.  I wouldn't want to read a review by someone who dislikes or is tired of the game's genre or series.  Perfect example: as a Metroid fan I would get no benefit from reading a review of a Metroid game written by James Jones.

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TalkBack / Re: Mario Kart 8 Review

« on: May 15, 2014, 02:17:34 PM »

I would argue that "this is more of the same" is exactly what longtime Nintendo fans that frequent and Nintendo fan site would want to know.  You can assume that most of NWR's readers have played damn near every Mario Kart game so their experience would be similar to that of the reviewers'.  You're essentially saying that they should review it from the perspective of a newcomer but that's not the staff or the audience.

Mario Kart 8 sounds like it's Mario Kart, no more no less.  If you're sick of it, then you'll probably not be interested.  If you're not, you'll probably like it.

I was not at all trying to say that games should be reviewed from the perspective of a newcomer.  Just the opposite.  All reviewers have their own tastes for certain games and genres.  I'm arguing that those tastes should be taken into account when the review is assigned.  I don't want to read a review of a football game by someone who is tired of football games.  Their opinion is going to be "this is like other football games I've played, and thus it is boring because it resembles those games."  How is that useful to me as a reader?

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TalkBack / Re: Second Opinion: Mario Kart 8 Review

« on: May 15, 2014, 11:00:59 AM »

I'd really be interested in how all these people got advance copies of the game that allow them to know what score it deserves.

While it is ridiculous for someone to claim that a game they have never played deserves a better score, it is not ridiculous to question whether a reviewer approached the game with a certain bias for or against it based on the text of the review.

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TalkBack / Re: Second Opinion: Mario Kart 8 Review

« on: May 15, 2014, 10:59:01 AM »

IMO, both reviews seem completely reasonable, if not differing about one point from the average. I'm personally glad Neal got the NA review copy because he was right in the middle of the hype. He wasn't so excited that he would be guaranteed to give the game yet another 9, but he wasn't so down on the game that he would be guaranteed to give it a 5 either.

I won't speak for the site specifically when I say this, but I think the best reviewer for a game is one who understands what a game is supposed to be while not holding a severe bias for or against it.

I can agree with your point.  If someone enters a review with an unreasonable bias toward a game the review can be much less meaningful.  I just have a problem when Daan begins his review by admitting that his viewpoint is tainted by a previous entry in the series.  There are types of games that I do not enjoy, and it would be unfair to ask me to give a fair opinion on the quality of those games.

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TalkBack / Re: Mario Kart 8 Review

« on: May 15, 2014, 10:53:30 AM »

I actually went into playing the final version of Mario Kart 8 being super excited for it. I might have had reservations over the past year or so, but in the past month, I've gotten more and more excited for it. My logic? Well, it's Mario Kart. I'll have fun with it because it's Mario Kart. I embraced it like that, hoping to recapture the love and affection I had for MKWii and MK:DD.

Then I played the final game, and it really made every reservation and worry come to light (as I wrote about in the review). I played a lot of Mario Kart 8, and while I totally had fun with it (and I'm sure most of you critiquing this review will have even more fun with it), it just felt hollow to me. I started playing this game wanting to love it unabashedly like everyone else. It didn't happen that way. I didn't even totally realize I was skewing negative until I put the pen to paper.

Sorry you guys disagree with my score and my text.

Fair enough.  All I expect is that the reviewer approach the game with an open mind, and it sounds like you did.  I admit that my comment was aimed a bit more at Daan, since I am usually irked when a reviewer begins an "unbiased" review by stating how bored he or she has been by previous entries in the series.  Then again, it is impossible to be truly unbiased about anything.


I don't hate the review, Neal, and I have never been the guy to rage about a review of a game I haven't played.  I just wanted to submit my two cents about pre-review expectations.

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TalkBack / Re: Second Opinion: Mario Kart 8 Review

« on: May 15, 2014, 10:00:56 AM »

Neal and Daan's review scores were determined before they ever played the game.  Based on comments from Connectivity, it's clear that Neal and Daan are tired of the core gameplay of Mario Kart.  I respect that that is their honest opinion of the game and the series, but maybe take that into account when reviews are assigned.  This is a Nintendo enthusiast site, so I assume that there is someone on staff who is still excited about Mario Kart.  Let that person review the game.  Personally, I still really love the core Mario Kart gameplay elements, and I'm okay that it has become a bit iterative.  I spent hours playing MKWii and MK7, and I can't wait to spend hours playing MK8!


I love the content you guys make, but if you find yourself thinking "this is more of the same," realize that this game series doesn't match your personal tastes anymore and find someone who can look at the game from a less jaded perspective.

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TalkBack / Re: Mario Kart 8 Review

« on: May 15, 2014, 09:59:47 AM »

Neal and Daan's review scores were determined before they ever played the game.  Based on comments from Connectivity, it's clear that Neal and Daan are tired of the core gameplay of Mario Kart.  I respect that that is their honest opinion of the game and the series, but maybe take that into account when reviews are assigned.  This is a Nintendo enthusiast site, so I assume that there is someone on staff who is still excited about Mario Kart.  Let that person review the game.  Personally, I still really love the core Mario Kart gameplay elements, and I'm okay that it has become a bit iterative.  I spent hours playing MKWii and MK7, and I can't wait to spend hours playing MK8!


I love the content you guys make, but if you find yourself thinking "this is more of the same," realize that this game series doesn't match your personal tastes anymore and find someone who can look at the game from a less jaded perspective.