Author Topic: PSP PRICE ANNOUNCED!!!  (Read 89968 times)

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Offline ruby_onix

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #100 on: November 17, 2004, 09:32:01 PM »
Here's my latest take on the whole "PSP profitability" thing.

Typically, if Sony is making a hardware product, they put some effort into using Sony-brand parts in the machine. One section of Sony will bill the other section for the parts, so there's really no "savings" in it, but it's more of a "keeping the money inside the family" kind of thing.

With the PSP, Ken Kutaragi has arranged for something like 90% of the parts to be made by Sony, and then ordered all the different sections of Sony to offer their parts to other Sony members at absolutely zero profit.

What difference does this make? Well, if every Sony branch were to bill each other at the full value, Sony would technically lose money on the PSP. This way, Sony in general loses money, but it's not the PSP that's losing the money.

That's detail is Kutaragi was shooting for. If everyone within Sony is playing along with his plan, then the PSP is only 20,000 yen, and at that price it'll "start turning a profit" after one year, and not be "losing money" at all.

If Sony was losing $265 on the PSP, they'd be "dumping", which is deliberately losing money in an attempt to drive their competitors out of the industry. This is especially frowned upon when you're trying to defend a monopoly, or expand from one monopoly to another.

One strategic problem with this plan is that "dumping" relies on your being able to kill off your competitors, so that you can later take over an entire industry unopposed, making back your money with an overpriced device at a later date. Nintendo will at least be competitive in the handheld arena for quite some time, and even if they weren't, there are always other groups trying to break into the industry.

Still, even if Sony only gets a hold of 50% marketshare for this generation, that would be considered a solid "breaking in", and could be worth it to Sony.

Problem is, Sony's gonna lose a lot of money all around, and the shareholders are going to want to know why, but Kutaragi can't explain the "dumping" plan to them, without getting in trouble.

Another problem with this plan is that Sony's divisions historically don't get along with each other. How will one of these divisions feel about making absolutely no money, perhaps even losing money, just so that another division can win all of the glory? Sure, they're under orders from Kutaragi to lose money, so they're not going to get fired over their lack of glory or anything like that, but how will their resume look compared to the guys in that other department after it's all said and done? IMO, the reports coming out about the "actual costs" of the PSP (which fit with all the "pre-announcement" rumors) are coming from these disgruntled divisions.

Plus, if the shareholders are on Kutaragi's back about the money losses, how long is he going to be able to hold off and not fire anyone from one of these "poorly run" unprofitable divisions? Any one of them could become a possible scapegoat at a moment's notice.

Also, of more concern to gamers, is that with the PSP's price being cut so close to the bone, there's almost zero chance of production costs coming down as the unit gets older. Obsolete parts don't suddenly become easier to make. It's mostly that as the hardware gets older, the guys making the parts can't get away with charging as much profit on them. So the PSP at 20,000 yen is basically it's "end of lifespan" price. The only way we're likely to see any price drops on the unit is if the PSP really does revolutionize the handheld industry like Sony keeps saying it will, and Sony earns $50-100 per unit in software royalties (which is high for a home console and unheard of in a handheld).

At least, that's how I think it's working right now. Feel free to point out any inaccuracies in my theory, expand on details you think are important, or bring up ideas that are completely different. I think I'm pretty close to the truth here, but I'm not trying to prove it to anyone (especially since this theory seems to be inherently unprovable). I'm just saying this because I've seen Sony fans get upset at parts of these suggestions.  
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Offline ruby_onix

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #101 on: November 18, 2004, 02:58:20 PM »
By the way, CNN is speculating that since Sony has always (twice) launched their consoles in America after the Japanese launches, the manufacturing costs have always come down slightly, so Sony has always given a price cut for the American launch, so CNN thinks that Sony's going to launch the PSP in America at $150, which is the same price as the DS in America.

Personally I think there are a lot of flaws in that logic, but I figured I'd mention it.
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I'm about to go punk up some 3rd parties so they don't release games on other hardware, ciao!
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Offline KDR_11k

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #102 on: November 19, 2004, 01:14:26 AM »
Yeah, manufacturing costs going down on the PSP will have to compensate for the losses first, I doubt it'll see a price cut in the first few years.

Offline ruby_onix

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #103 on: November 27, 2004, 03:04:17 PM »
Apparently Sony had/has an email/internet survey going in Europe, which reveals some info about the PSP's European pricing.

http://www.jeux-france.com/news6987_psp.html

As far as I can tell, it's saying that PSP games will be 40 Euros ($53).

And that the hardware should be somewhere between 180 and 450 Euros ($239-597)!

Then they ask if people would prefer...

- The PSP by itself for 249 Euros ($330)
- A "128K Multimedia Kit" for 265 Euros ($352)
- A "256K Multimedia Kit" for 285 Euros ($378)

They describe the "Multmedia Kit" as coming with one of two different sizes of Memory Stick, a USB cable, audio/video transfer software, and wireless headphones. The protective case that's part of the Japanese bundle isn't mentioned.

That "128K" and "256K" for the Multimedia Kits is referring to Kilobits. Not even KiloBytes.

That's way too small for a Memory Stick, and Jeux France thinks it's an error. But I'm thinking that maybe SCEE decided to "simplify" things, and refer to the type of mp3 you can typically use with that kind of card? I dunno. Considering that these bundles seem to focus on pushing the PSP as an mp3 player, I think it makes sense.

They also say that the "128K" one can hold 60 songs, and the "256K" can hold 120, if that tells anyone anything.
Poor people should eat wheat!
I'm about to go punk up some 3rd parties so they don't release games on other hardware, ciao!
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Offline Hostile Creation

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #104 on: December 13, 2004, 09:39:53 AM »
But isn't the PSP over 200 american dollars in Japan?  Meaning that it'd be 180 or 200 dollars here, if the price dropped?  I dunno, that's a pretty vague conjecture, just wondering.
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Offline couchmonkey

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RE:ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #105 on: December 14, 2004, 05:44:26 AM »
Well, I've seen some reviews, and honestly, I think things are starting to look pretty grim for Nintendo.  The battery life is holding up fairly well to the 4-6 hour figure Sony gave, and the graphics and pricing are both excellent, as always.  I think load times may hurt the system a little (most of them seem to be in the 10-20 second range) and no doubt it will have some durability issues, but I'm sure that for $30-$50 more than the DS, most people will be happy to overlook those problems.

That's not to say DS will fail, either, but Nintendo now has a very serious fight on its hands, methinks.  Here's hoping Nintendo can prove that the DS is truly unique, and can supply is with enough quality games to keep Sony at bay.

(Edit) Hostile Creation: The PSP is $185 US in Japan...if ruby_onix's numbers are correct, it looks like Sony is ripping Europe off.
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Offline KDR_11k

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #106 on: December 14, 2004, 05:54:55 AM »
Okay, so I'll stop insulting NoE and blast away at SCEE instead (even though there's a Metal Slug 3 for PS2 here). Are they planning on making Europe compensate them for the seriously underpriced PSP or is that a hint that the US pricing might be much higher than the japanese price as well? Well, that would make sense, in Japan the PSP is in much more direct competition to the DS than elsewhere and Sony sure as hell isn't going to sell millions of PSPs when they're losing ~250$ per unit.

Offline Savior

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #107 on: December 14, 2004, 06:54:39 AM »
The battery life is holding up fairly well to the 4-6 hour figure Sony gave

Gamespot said 90 minutes to 3 hours...

Which is terrible.

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Offline Caustic Saint

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #108 on: December 16, 2004, 09:57:34 PM »
I've been consistently getting 4+ hours out of mine with Ridge Racers and playing the demo disc to show the videos to friends. I dunno what Gamespot did to kill it in 90 minutes.

Offline PaLaDiN

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RE:ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #109 on: December 16, 2004, 10:00:04 PM »
It seems the PSP is a pretty good handheld after all.

I'm still waiting for a must-have game for it though, same as the DS.

In fact I think it's going to be a long time before I buy either one... mostly because I've got so many games to buy.
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Offline Renny

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #110 on: December 19, 2004, 07:49:46 AM »
How's battery time with multiplayer?
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Offline SgtShiversBen

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RE:ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #111 on: December 19, 2004, 09:02:23 AM »
As with Savior, I won't buy the PSP until there is something I must have.  By the looks of it though, there is nothing.  Asking my girlfriend what she thought, she said I should get the DS because it has the chat program and she absolutely loved Metroid Prime Hunters.  Another reason is because of Mario 64 (another one of her favs).  So I guess I know which one I'm getting.  I think it's great that she loves the DS, shows that they are appealing to a broader audience with their new features.  Alas, still have to wait till next year
"The next step is already being prepared for Revolution. [It's] not just a portable, not just a console -- it's exactly what we wanted in that it's the birth of a completely new platform." - Youichi Wada [Square Enix]

Offline Caustic Saint

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #112 on: December 19, 2004, 10:15:45 AM »
I can't say how long the battery lasts in multiplayer games using the WiFi. Although I've seen lots of other people buying PSPs, I don't personally know anybody who has one.

Offline BlackNMild2k1

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RE:ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #113 on: December 21, 2004, 10:03:54 AM »
The is a battery test for PSP on IGN,
expect about:
3 hrs with wifi enabled
5 hours with moderate umd access (no wifi)
10 hrs of mp3 playback (screen off)
and 24hrs of sleep mode

all of these is with screen brightness at full (when screen is on)
and volume @ 100% (when used)

Offline vudu

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #114 on: December 21, 2004, 10:05:06 AM »
What qualifies as "moderate UMD access"?
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!

Offline BlackNMild2k1

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RE:ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #115 on: December 21, 2004, 10:11:26 AM »
well as I understand it, it sounds like not contantly spinning, but accessed often, very often

Offline Hostile Creation

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #116 on: January 16, 2005, 08:35:47 PM »
You know, I didn't originally think that the battery life was a big deal at all.  But when I played my DS and even eight to ten hours seemed like not quite enough, I realized how fast time passes when you're playing video games.  It is a problem.  Five hours is crap.
HC: Honourary Aussie<BR>Originally posted by: ThePerm<BR>
YOUR IWATA AVATAR LOOKS LIKE A REAL HOSTILE CREATION!!!!!<BR><BR>only someone with leoperd print sheets could produce such an image!!!<BR>

Offline SgtShiversBen

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RE:ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #117 on: January 16, 2005, 08:53:38 PM »
Same here, while playing Mario 64 my light started blinking and I was all "Oh crap oh crap oh crap!"  I could just imagine how it'd be if you have to find a save point instead of "quit, save, bye bye!!"  
"The next step is already being prepared for Revolution. [It's] not just a portable, not just a console -- it's exactly what we wanted in that it's the birth of a completely new platform." - Youichi Wada [Square Enix]

Offline Renny

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #118 on: January 19, 2005, 06:21:03 AM »
Both the DS and PSP have sleep modes that consume very little power. Just put it into sleep and charge. Of course being tethered to the wall isn't exactly portable, but that was never the point of the PSP, it seems. Just make it portable enough for other potential buyers to see it.
"... i only see pS2s at the halfway house so its those crazy druggies playing them." - animecyberrat

Offline PJ gamer10

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #119 on: January 20, 2005, 10:24:54 AM »
The PSP is starting to pick up big with its hype. The game stores are beginning to push the pre-orders for it. I do believe though that people are misinformed about it. Many come and ask if it plays PS2 games. I just say yes but you will have to pay an additional 40 or 50 dollars for it. The price point though is rumored to be 150. That is very bad for Nintendo. People will look at both systems and for 150 they just get more out of the PSP. Maybe not a new gaming experience but they get power and style.  
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Offline calguy77

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RE:ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #120 on: January 23, 2005, 11:03:56 AM »
I just went into my EB games to pre order the PSP, they gentleman behind the counter told me GOOD TIMING. Today was the last day they were taking them. I guess EB is almost all out of pre-orders. And he thinks not all will get one when first shipment arrives. I hope I get mine.  
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Offline MaleficentOgre

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #121 on: January 23, 2005, 03:47:49 PM »
I'm willing to bet that the majority of people buying a psp will be pissed when they get home and learn they payed $190 for a system that doesn't play DVDs or PS2 games.  I know the people at my gamestop that have preordered it think they're getting a mini ps2 that plays dvds. but hey whatever sells.

Offline vudu

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RE:ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #122 on: January 24, 2005, 08:11:58 AM »
Quote

I know the people at my gamestop that have preordered it think they're getting a mini ps2 that plays dvds. but hey whatever sells.
And you don't feel the need to inform them of their mistake?  Cold.
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!

Offline Stimutacs Addict

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RE: ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #123 on: January 24, 2005, 01:34:35 PM »
seriously, tell them that they can get a DS, a game (2 if you count hunters demo), and some protective screen covers and be on your way.

great idea: Nintendo should start bundling a  pen/stylus combo in every first party game. I know Japan is getting cool Kirby pens and such, but that would be a great way for Nintendo to get some better sized (and mcuh more collectable) styli out here in the USA
I'll shut up now...

Offline vudu

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RE:ITT: PSP Discussion
« Reply #124 on: January 24, 2005, 01:46:47 PM »
Wow.  I just had to post this.  Gamers report PSP malfunction

Apparently the Square button on 4,800 PSPs have been returned to Sony because they stick.  But don't take my word on it, read the article.  It's filled with such memorable quotes as:
Quote

"This is the design that we came up with. There may be people that complain about its usability, but that's something which users and game software developers will have to adapt to. ... The button's location is [architectured] on purpose.  It's according to specifications. This is something that we've created, and this is our specification. There was a clear purpose to it, and it wasn't a mistake.
And, my personal favorite (oh, if I didn't love my current sig so much):
Quote

I believe we made the most beautiful thing in the world. Nobody would criticize a renowned architect's blueprint that the position of a gate is wrong. It's the same as that.
Why must all things be so bright? Why can things not appear only in hues of brown! I am so serious about this! Dull colors are the future! The next generation! I will never accept a world with such bright colors! It is far too childish! I will rage against your cheery palette with my last breath!