Topic: Wii U in Review (News & Rumor Consolidation)

[NWR_insanolord]

I'd much rather have the GamePad than a Wiimote 2.0, no matter how improved it might be. Compelling motion control was pretty rare on Wii, even (arguably especially) from Nintendo themselves, and I really don't think the tech is available to make it work that much more broadly.

[nickmitch]

You can say the first half of your second sentence about the gamepad.

[NWR_insanolord]

True, but even without unique functionality the GamePad offers everything a standard controller does, which makes it more acceptable to me. The Wii remote wasn't used that well as a motion controller very often, but was pretty lacking in the role it usually had as a fairly standard controller. I'm also a huge fan of Off-TV play.

Really, the best answer would've likely been to do neither, but if choosing between the two, I think they made the right one. They just needed to come up with more compelling reasons to use it. The Wii U is basically showing everyone what the Wii would've been if not for Wii Sports; Nintendo Land is more of a Wii Play, neat, but not that convincing as a showpiece for the tech.

[nickmitch]

Yeah, off TV play is great, but it's kind of a hard sell to a generation of gamers obsessed with HD graphics.

[NWR_insanolord]

It also hurts that PS4-Vita remote play, at least in my experience, works pretty much just as well, as an optional thing without requiring expensive bundled hardware.

[nickmitch]

But it does require owning a Vita.

[broodwars]

It's not a point at all, considering that Xbox is $200.

And that the 360 is 9 years old, so the 4 GB model is intended for people buying one to play Kinect and watch Netflix (or is the other way around?  : ).

[NWR_insanolord]

But it does require owning a Vita.

Which is actually totally worth it. That thing is crazy underrated.

It's not a point at all, considering that Xbox is $200.

And that the 360 is 9 years old, so the 4 GB model is intended for people buying one to play Kinect and watch Netflix (or is the other way around?  : ).

Regardless of when it came out or what it costs, the Basic 8 GB Wii U was aimed at the same audience as that 360 model. A better comparison, though, would be the launch 360 Core System, aka the hard drive-less model they only released so they could say they got in under $300.

[smallsharkbigbite]

Maybe the problem lies with people expecting Nintendo's home console to refine online the way the SNES refined 2D controls.

I think the problem lies with people expecting Nintendo to match the online experience of Sony/Microsoft. 

And that the 360 is 9 years old, so the 4 GB model is intended for people buying one to play Kinect and watch Netflix (or is the other way around?  : : : ).

I think the bigger problem is in the world of 500 GB consoles Nintendo's Deluxe included 32 GB.  With the transition to digital content there should have been a harddrive. 

The Gamepad was a risk, but they didn't take the concept far enough to sell the idea entirely.
multiple pad support from the onset, multi-touch, semi-independence(?) & more features.

I think this is key.  Most houses already had a form of tablet.  The Wii U didn't match up to the existing tech leaving consumers  to compare the two techs and ask why should I get a Wii U if I already have a tablet that has better touch controls and a better screen? 

And my mind is blown that multiple pad support wasn't there initially.  While Sony/Microsoft have pushed online play, Nintendo had quietly been cornering the market for great multiplayer experience with everybody in one room.  The Gamepad doesn't seem conducive to that.  One player Gamepad all other some other controller provides an uneven experience.  It's cumbersome in that you have to adjust to multiple control schemes to play a single game.  It's also a parent nightmare as kids will fight over which player utilizes the Gamepad. 

[smallsharkbigbite]

I think that's precisely why Nintendo goes against the grain. Sony and Microsoft may look great to consumers and third parties, but they're playing a losing hand. Nintendo doesn't believe that business model is sustainable and I'm inclined to agree with them. That bubble is bound to burst. Nintendo's problem is that they have no filter. They don't look at the competition and pick the best parts. Nintendo just decided everything both competitors do is wrong. That's why they end up with things like Friend Codes and a Basic Set with 8 GB of solid state memory. It would be extremely beneficial for them to accept and admit the fact that other companies also have good ideas sometimes.

I get that line of thinking.  Sony/Microsoft aren't exactly raking in $ in the console business even with large sales.  I think the problem is Nintendo's business model is failing and they never address it.  Maybe their competitors model is also failing, but that doesn't absolve Nintendo from the necessary changes they need to make to show value to consumers. 


Ipads stream to TV now, they get annual CPU increases, they get better games each year, and it's only a matter of time until apple releases a blutooth controller to work with it.  Amazon is coming out with a $99 stream box that plays game similar to Onlive, Steamboxes are gaining popularity.  The market is quickly becoming saturated with people that view gaming as an add-on and won't be leaving the market due to poor video game sales.  Apple and Amazon are competitors with Nintendo now.  Nintendo hasn't shown to me that they have a plan to operate in a future market with Apple/Amazon or in the current market with Sony/Microsoft.  We can talk competitor failures all day, but that's not going to put Nintendo in a better position. 

[Soren]

I think the bigger problem is in the world of 500 GB consoles Nintendo's Deluxe included 32 GB.  With the transition to digital content there should have been a harddrive. 

I'm not going to begrudge Nintendo for their digital storage strategy. While it's true they only offered 32GB (or 8 in my case) they immediately redeemed themselves by letting me use whatever hard drive I had lying around, the extra cost being that of a Y-cable.

[Oblivion]

Regardless of when it came out or what it costs, the Basic 8 GB Wii U was aimed at the same audience as that 360 model. A better comparison, though, would be the launch 360 Core System, aka the hard drive-less model they only released so they could say they got in under $300.

...which, like Broodwars said, was 9 freaking years ago. There's no way you can justify 8GB in 2014(13).

[Adrock]

32 GB will probably be enough for me. I just think the choice is odd. Nintendo is asking people to pay more for less storage. Okay, fine. What are the benefits? They don't have to pay SATA licensing fees. Sure. I understand it's faster than a regular hard disc drive, but Nintendo specifically choose hardware with lesser performance. If they cite performance, that seems inconsistent to me.

Expansion via a USB hard disc drive is nice, but it's an extra expense for some people. Nintendo is over-complicating a very simple idea. Additionally, Nintendo builds flash memory into the console, but doesn't recommend it for expanding storage. What the what?

[Ian Sane]

I'd much rather have the GamePad than a Wiimote 2.0, no matter how improved it might be. Compelling motion control was pretty rare on Wii, even (arguably especially) from Nintendo themselves, and I really don't think the tech is available to make it work that much more broadly.

I've rather have neither and just have a normal controller.  I really don't care about the controller.  To me it's just a matter of the controls being responsive.  Does this have all the expected features?  Does it have enough buttons so that I don't have to resort to weird button combos when playing multiplatform games designed for the competition's controllers?  Is it ergonomic and well made and durable?  It's just a tool to play the game and if I notice it after a few days of owning the console then you probably fucked up.

And I certainly would NEVER care enough that I would accept a trade-off for extra controller doodads.  No controller is worth a price increase or compromised specs or a loss of functionality that previous generations offered.  Controllers are practical and there are only so many new ideas that a new controller feature can introduce.  At this point video games are a mature enough concept that the basic controller design has become pretty standardized.  Motion control was not a new standard, it was just a nifty peripheral like a light gun that worked well for some games and worked like crap for everything else.  Most controller ideas are like the analog clicky buttons on the Cube - a neat idea that gets used well in like three games and then you forget about it.  And the Wii U wasn't even a new idea.  What could it really do that couldn't have been done on the DS?

I want a Nintendo console where in the reveal the controller is just some background element in the promotion material that gets no extra attention because then I can assume their priorities aren't screwed up.  The second a console debut presentation starts with the controller we're in trouble.  Go with something conventional and if you think of a few games that need something more specialized then do what everone else does and release it as a peripheral.  It won't get used much if it isn't standard?  That's fine because such a concept shouldn't be standard in the first place.

Nintendo stops using wacky controllers as a crutch and they'll be forced to do something more substancial.  The console will need real enhancements.  The games can't just be the same old sequels now with controller X.  Gimmick controllers are phoney innovation.  Without them they have to come up with something truly creative.

[ShyGuy]

Where is the News and Rumors in this thread?

Here we go: http://nintendoeverything.com/nintendo-picks-up-various-advance-trademarks-in-japan/

Wii U Advance with a back lit screen!

[Spak-Spang]

I wasn't trying to totally down Nintendo.  And I think you can say that I was a little harsh saying Nintendo hasn't taken any risks or any hasn't improved online gaming at all.

They have, and some of it is interesting and perfect Nintendo.  Miiverse is a good example of Nintendo doing something pretty cool. 

However, BnM is correct that Nintendo seems not to go for broke with their ideas.  They are usually first to the table with that new idea, but sometimes, the technology isn't truly ready yet.  Wii U, should have probably waited on more generation before being released.  The technology just isn't there in both price, or power to be able to run 2-4 screens at the same time. 

However, Nintendo could have revised the motion controls, with a new Wiimote, that could of had a better camera, and better sensor bar.  Could have had better button placements, and they could have enhanced the Nunchuk to be fully functional with motion controls as well. 

Plus Nintendo could have done all this and keep it functional with almost all accessories for the original Wii, and focused on bring a better motion control experience, with a complete online structure, a complete HD experience.  Nintendo wouldn't have had to go as powerful as PS4 or Xbox One, but if they would have pushed for more powerful CPU, GPU, and RAM...it would have been a boon.  Also Nintendo Land could have still been the packaged game pushing Nintendo's ONLINE presence with asymmetric game play instead of the Game Pad.   That and online Wii Sports launching would have been a big hit. 

[BlackNMild2k1]

Had Nintendo released a wiimote 2.0 (camera tracked/better motion) along with the Wii U, and launched with Nintendoland built in along with Wii Sports 2.0 as a free download, pushed asymetric play along with a new online Wii motion experience, I think things could have been a lot better off for Nintendo. It would allow for devs of the previous gen to refine ideas they had for games on the Wii with superior motion control and/or they could explore dual screen gaming in HD with ideas they may have had that were just too big and ambitious for the 3DS. It also would have pushed asymetric and online play from Day 1.

Had they also had universal accts on day 1, everyone making NinID's would be prompted to create/connect it to their ClubN acct, and now Nintendo can track what everyone is doing, what they are buying, what they are playing, how many players, how often, etc etc.. which would allow them to push the surveys to your inbox, allow you to track you points for participation right in the Wii U interface, and then select your prizes and whatnot without having to do much extra than select it from the ClubN channel on your Wii U.

There is so much more that Nintendo could have done with the Wii U, but it just seems like they have one foot in and one foot out, and the foot that is out is draaaaaging behind, holding everything else back. They really need to figure out what direction they are going, and then really put all they can into getting the most out of whatever that may be. The competition has laid lots of ground work that Nintendo can't continue to pretend hasn't become the baseline for expectations.
I'm not saying that they can't continue to "Nintendify" everything they do, but that thing they do (mostly in reference to online) still needs to be comparable in function to what everyone else is and has been offering for close to if not more than a decade now.

[Nile Boogie Returns]

Nintendoland Online: at launch would have been a "killer app".

[Soren]

Nintenfinilander figurines.


Wii U saved.

[azeke]

Upcoming Wii U update will speed up the boot process:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8czOjP-jaQc

That's nice, though i don't really mind current boot speeds. It already boots up faster than PC and Xbox even with USB hard drive connected.

[Oblivion]

Has that quick boot menu always been there? I haven't touched my Wii U in a few months and I don't know what they've added recently.

[Spak-Spang]

Had Nintendo released a wiimote 2.0 (camera tracked/better motion) along with the Wii U, and launched with Nintendoland built in along with Wii Sports 2.0 as a free download, pushed asymetric play along with a new online Wii motion experience, I think things could have been a lot better off for Nintendo. It would allow for devs of the previous gen to refine ideas they had for games on the Wii with superior motion control and/or they could explore dual screen gaming in HD with ideas they may have had that were just too big and ambitious for the 3DS. It also would have pushed asymetric and online play from Day 1.

Had they also had universal accts on day 1, everyone making NinID's would be prompted to create/connect it to their ClubN acct, and now Nintendo can track what everyone is doing, what they are buying, what they are playing, how many players, how often, etc etc.. which would allow them to push the surveys to your inbox, allow you to track you points for participation right in the Wii U interface, and then select your prizes and whatnot without having to do much extra than select it from the ClubN channel on your Wii U.

There is so much more that Nintendo could have done with the Wii U, but it just seems like they have one foot in and one foot out, and the foot that is out is draaaaaging behind, holding everything else back. They really need to figure out what direction they are going, and then really put all they can into getting the most out of whatever that may be. The competition has laid lots of ground work that Nintendo can't continue to pretend hasn't become the baseline for expectations.
I'm not saying that they can't continue to "Nintendify" everything they do, but that thing they do (mostly in reference to online) still needs to be comparable in function to what everyone else is and has been offering for close to if not more than a decade now.

I disagree about the motion controls and Wii U tablet.  I think the problem is a mixed message.  Does anybody really know what is the main control method of the Wii U.  Obviously single player is the Gamepad, but then you have the Wiimotes and sometimes the new Classic Controller, which adds new features to the controller just because...forcing a new purchase, then there is the old classic controller, and then there is the Wiimote + nunchuk combos. 

It is pretty silly. 

I think clean starts are important for new generations.  This is why I think the technology is not yet ready for a streaming controller like Nintendo created, because it can't be used with 4 controllers at a time, It can't be produced and sold cheaply.

Nintendo should have created the Wiimote 2.0 and refined perfect that controller.  It should be usable with other accessories like the balance board, classic controllers and such...however, Nintendo should have clearly stated that the old Wii controller won't work and separate it.  Finally, the Nunchuk 2.0 should be included in every new controller period. 

Motion controllers weren't perfect, but they were not broken either.  And motion controls are what made the blue ocean strategy work.  It was interesting and fun for people.  Nintendo failed to see that it wasn't in need of a new gimmick, but it was in need to pushing the gimmick further and perfecting it. 

And Yes, Nintendo Land online with Wii Sports Zone built into the experience with Wiimote 2.0 as a launch game would have basically helped the Wii U launch more than anything.  They could have even withheld some games for additional download content. 

[BlackNMild2k1]

We are on the same page, I stated that motion control refinement should have been a priority even if they were to also introduce the gamepad.

But the Wii U should have been the refinement of the Wiimote+, maybe adding a camera and losing the cord between it and the nunchuck. I think I had a perfectly plausible idea in the Wiimote 2.0 design I posted here some years ago, and there was more that could have been done with the concept, even if they also introduced the Gamepad into mix.

I also agree that the GamePad is a half baked ill thought out concept that falls short of potential. But I don't need to restate that anymore.

[Fatty The Hutt]

we incurred temporary one-off expenses from the purchase of technology that we did not expect at the beginning of the fiscal year

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/library/events/140508/index.html

Some reports are saying Nintendo spent $100 million on some "mystery tech".
What could it be? Let the speculation begin!

It is interesting to note that, but for the "mystery tech" investment (if true) Nintendo's operating losses would have been close to half of what is reported.

[Ian Sane]

Whatever the mystery tech is I'm guessing it is something that Nintendo themselves are much more impressed by than anyone else.  I would like to be pleasantly surprised but Nintendo's recent trend is to build their systems around a nifty tech gimmick.  They thought glasses-free 3D would be the bee's knees but it really didn't impress that much, to the point that they're okay with releasing a 3DS without it.  I'm guessing this is the hot new gimmick Nintendo is hoping will make their next project a big success, which unfortunately means they haven't really learned from the Wii U and the 3DS's slow start.  It might not be a whole system idea but a peripheral like the Wii Fit balance board.

The most insane idea I can think of that actually could be a big hit would be mind control.  I don't know if that would be feasible but that would create a Wii Sports style frenzy if it was done half-decently.  Lamer wacky idea - smellovision.