Topic: Official Sales Thread

[Adrock]

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GoldenPhoenix wrote:
A lot of f*cking words.

Basically, I'm saying PS3 sucks, but should be sucking worse and you're saying "No, you're wrong. PS3 sucks." Seriously, what the hell? Are you just trying to disagree with me?

Jeez, I made a simple statement and you jump down my throat like I just slashed your tires and called your mother a whore. Take a chill pill, please.

[GoldenPhoenix]

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Originally posted by: Adrock

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GoldenPhoenix wrote:
A lot of f*cking words.

Basically, I'm saying PS3 sucks, but should be sucking worse and you're saying "No, you're wrong. PS3 sucks." Seriously, what the hell? Are you just trying to disagree with me?

Jeez, I made a simple statement and you jump down my throat like I just slashed your tires and called your mother a whore. Take a chill pill, please.

You've been praising Sony left and right, pretending to be the "anti fanboi", so this latest is just in a long line of it. If you honestly think I'm "Jumping down your throat" you are sadly mistaken, you would know it if I was. The fact remains that PS3 is doing bad by any standard and anything to the contrary is spin even with its "mistakes", the PS3 should be doing much better even with the screw ups if the Sony name meant anything.

[Kairon]

Oh for GOSH SAKES. Can't we agree that the PS3 is doing bad ENOUGH? I don't care about how one can perceive it as not as bad as X or the worst thing since Y, but surely we can all agree that the losses at Sony's games division will continue for quite awhile?

[Blue Plant]

I'm certainly happy after all these years. :3

[Adrock]

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You've been praising Sony left and right, pretending to be the "anti fanboi", so this latest is just in a long line of it. If you honestly think I'm "Jumping down your throat" you are sadly mistaken, you would know it if I was.

I can't believe this all sprung from a post where I mentioned people crapping their pants. Honestly now.... And I don't know what you consider "praising Sony left and right" when you just quoted me saying Sony sucks. Ceric is right, you're reading way too far into my comments.

Whatever...

[GoldenPhoenix]

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Originally posted by: Adrock

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You've been praising Sony left and right, pretending to be the "anti fanboi", so this latest is just in a long line of it. If you honestly think I'm "Jumping down your throat" you are sadly mistaken, you would know it if I was.

I can't believe this all sprung from a post where I mentioned people crapping their pants. Honestly now.... And I don't know what you consider "praising Sony left and right" when you just quoted me saying Sony sucks. Ceric is right, you're reading way too far into my comments.

Whatever...

Someone is a little grumpy aren't they? The main reason why I jumped on this is that it reminded me so much of Harrison's little spin, even if you may not have intended it that way. When I originally read it came across as spin that things are not going too badly when you take things into consideration, which is pretty much what Harrison said in EGM.  

[GoldenPhoenix]

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Originally posted by: Ceric
GP I think your reading to much into Adrock's comment.  Though for the record.

In Sony's home Territory (aka The only place we get consistent numbers.):

For the year the PSP is Sony's top seller selling more then the PS2 & 3 combined

Also for the year the PS3 sold more units then the PS2

It is on a slight decline but I don't see that lasting.  I don't see a large  sudden up swing either.  Though with the lead it already has unless something drastic happen it will be Sony's #2 seller in Japan.  The rumor of a new PSP coming at the current price point could really spark PSP sales if it happens.  There is a market for the PSP it seems.  Also isn't the PS3 eventually suppose to be able to play PSP games on the big screen?  If the PSP jumps in sale such a function could push PS3's though the price would need to drop but that isn't happening until PSGimped gets released in all territories.

There ways to argue both side so we do.

I didn't even mention PSP, in regards to the PS2 vs PS3 isn't PS2 now outselling PS3 in Japan? Heck the GBA was outselling it at one point with the Xbox 360 being the only one that didn't beat it. Regardless the biggest indicator of a consoles success is game sales, not hardware sold, and Sony is failing miserably at that. On a side note I wonder if Sony is making money yet on PSP? Or is each console sold more money lost?

[nitsu niflheim]

I think I get what you are saying.  The PS3 should be doing better because of its branding and the company who makes it.  The PS1 and the PS2 were both huge sellers regardless of the faults of the systems, that the PS3 should also be enjoying the same success.  And that regardless of the outcome/outlook, Sony has a convinient excuse to completely disregard how the PS3 is doing in hardware sales and in software sales and lay blame on something/one that has no provable connection whatsoever to the true underlaying reason why the PS3 is a complete and utter failure in a market that should have, by all rights and purposes due to the success of PS1 & PS2, been theirs.  It was their market to lose, and they are doing a very good job of throwing it away.

[Shift Key]

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Originally posted by: nitsu niflheim
The PS3 should be doing better because of its branding and the company who makes it.  The PS1 and the PS2 were both huge sellers regardless of the faults of the systems, that the PS3 should also be enjoying the same success.

Just like how "third time's the charm" but only in an alternate reality.

Yeah, brilliant strategy.

[Ceric]

GP:  Yeah I put the PSP in there so people would know who was top for Sony.  Though this early in the Wii and PS3 lifecycle I personally believe that the Hardware units at the given moment are a little more important then the Software.  Going into this holiday season though is a different story.  From then on its software.  Unfortunately though we don't really get hard numbers on software sales.  We can approximate with the rankings but without the real hard numbers all the rankings give us is if they are doing well.  With hard numbers we could start to compare things like number of games per system and the like.  Which would be really cool.  Though I don't think they'll ever release those raw numbers in a convenient format though without paying a good amount for them.

To sum it up until the beginning of this holiday season establishing a user-base I believe to be more important and then this holiday season and beyond software sales.  Though you can debate each way.  Its very Chicken and the Egg.

On another note I thought the PSP unit has been profitable for the last year.

[GoldenPhoenix]

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Originally posted by: Ceric
GP:  Yeah I put the PSP in there so people would know who was top for Sony.  Though this early in the Wii and PS3 lifecycle I personally believe that the Hardware units at the given moment are a little more important then the Software.  Going into this holiday season though is a different story.  From then on its software.  Unfortunately though we don't really get hard numbers on software sales.  We can approximate with the rankings but without the real hard numbers all the rankings give us is if they are doing well.  With hard numbers we could start to compare things like number of games per system and the like.  Which would be really cool.  Though I don't think they'll ever release those raw numbers in a convenient format though without paying a good amount for them.

To sum it up until the beginning of this holiday season establishing a user-base I believe to be more important and then this holiday season and beyond software sales.  Though you can debate each way.  Its very Chicken and the Egg.

On another note I thought the PSP unit has been profitable for the last year.

You may be right about software not being as important but when your software fails to make it in the top 25, and if it does it is only for a short time that is a terrible sign. Look Wii has been out the same amount of time yet we've seen numerous titles in the top 25 list, especially in Japan. Not to mention when a console is being outsold almost 20:1 that signals disaster, and I don't know of any system historically that has pulled out of that.

[Adrock]

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Someone is a little grumpy aren't they? The main reason why I jumped on this is that it reminded me so much of Harrison's little spin, even if you may not have intended it that way. When I originally read it came across as spin that things are not going too badly when you take things into consideration, which is pretty much what Harrison said in EGM.

Confused, not grumpy. You made a few accusations and I don't see where you got them. Specifically, I don't really understand the whole "pretending to be an anti-fanboy" thing. I just think every company should be held by the same standard. You take the good with the bad and there are no excuses because failure is failure and success is success. It's not always so black and white. I'm just saying that you (not you specifically) can't give a company passes just because you like them.

I think you misunderstood my comment on Sony. I'm not saying PS3 is doing well. Rather, I can't believe people are even considering paying $600 for what is essentially a videogame and movie player. So, really, if you want to blame me of anything, it should be blatant consumerism. I want the best deals. You can look at PS3 in different ways. For the technology and potential, it's a steal (cheap Blu-Ray player, some great upcoming titles). However, if you're like me, it's still $600. Last I checked, PS3 has sold like 3-4 million worldwide. Depsite all the negatives, that many people paid $600 for mostly potential? The way I see it, PS3 is a bad product selling better than a bad product should.

Nintendo's worldwide sales are astonishing, but it's already a good product. I think Wii could be a better product right now, but it's still a good product. That said, no one is waiting for it to be a good product, you're waiting for it to be a better product than it already is. That, to me, is a good investment. All things considered, it's performing as it should.

If you simply want to compare sales, Nintendo is crushing Sony and catching up to Microsoft at a good rate. There's sure to be some margin of error, but generally, that is what the numbers suggest.  

[BlackNMild2k1]

Just because you mentioned it, I have some rough estimates of the WW hardware #'s

360 - 9.5million
Wii - 7.5million
PS3 - 3.25million

These estimates are not including May NPD which comes out this thursday.

[UncleBob]

Not that I much trust NexGenWars.com, but why are your Wii/PS3 numbers so close but your 360 number so far off?

[BlackNMild2k1]

Has the 360 crossed the 10Million sold mark yet?

I'm going off memory of some estimates that I saw earlier in the week.
From what I remember it was broken down something like:

Xbox360
USA - 6million
EUR - 3.1million
JPN - .4million

Wii
USA - 2.5million
EUR - 2.5million
JPN - 2.5million

PS3
USA - 1.3million
EUR - 1million
JPN - .9million

I'm sure its the European estimates that are throwing it off, but my US # might be a little low too. I don't keep a spread sheet or anything like that, and I'm not quite bored enough to skim back through all the NPD postings in this(or any other) thread, so I tend to just trust the chart trackers over at GAF when it comes to stuff like this.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Cuz they get their info from different gaming forums.

[Adrock]

This is why I don't usually bother with sales data. Everywhere I've read, 360 has passed the 10 million mark. However, BlackNMild2k1 is like the sales data guru so I'm more inclined believe him.

[BlackNMild2k1]

The thing is though, even if my #'s were off for 360(lets say it was 1million short), the point is that Wii has been out for 1/3 the time and has almost caught up already to what ever the 360 has sold WW, has more than doubled what the PS3 has sold WW and shows no signs of slowing down just yet.

Something I just remembered about the 360 though, is that MS had flooded the channel with 360's during March(?) so that they could claim their 10million shipped figure before fiscal year had ended*, and it turned out that most of that shipment had just ended up sitting on store shelves. MS even admitted to making a mistake by forcing product upon the retailers with threats of not giving them retail access to Vista (which also seemed to just sit on the shelves).

*It might have been Christmas, my memory is fuzzy on on the date, but the event did happen and it might have been so that they could get to that milestone before the end of Calender 2006 instead of fiscal '06.  

[TJ Spyke]

Nobody should EVER use NexGenWars or VGChartz. Both sites are well known for making up BS numbers and then changing them when the REAL numbers are made known.

Microsoft flooded the market before Christmas so they could say they met their goal of 10 million shipped. That is why they also announced that they would only be shipping 500K Xbox 360's during the entire first six months of 2007.

The Wii has sold about 7.5 million copies already, and at this rate it will easily pass the Xbox 360 worldwide by the end of the year (maybe even by the end of the summer depending on how well it does in North America). It will take a little longer in North America (the only region where the 360 is still doing pretty well), but now it's just a matter of WHEN the Wii becomes #1 rather than IF.

Also, we do get monthly sales data from the NPD. So it's not just Japan that we get regular data from.

Oh, it's pretty interesting that the PS3 has been under 10K in Japan for the last couple of weeks. The PS2 has been out in Japan for over 7 years, and it has only sold less than 10K twice (both times were in November 2000 when the PS2 was suffering a wordwide shortage).

[BlackNMild2k1]

So what you're saying is that if MS had stayed with their shipment estimates for the 1st half of '07, then the most they could have sold WW(assuming that they sell everything they ship) would be 10.5million. So by default what you would also be saying is that since we know that there are plenty of 360's sitting on shelves just about everywhere you go, that it is pretty safe to assume that there could possibly be rougly 1million unsold 360's floating around the world. If we all agree that that may be possible and also agree that the data you have supplied above is true, then it would also be safe to assume that the #'s that I provided for WW sales of the 360 (9.5million) should also be alot more accurate than those of Nextgenwars.com and UncleBob should never question me ever again.

j/k UB, but I do think that the estimate I posted is probably closer to the truth than what NGW.com extrapolates and then corrects later when the actual data comes out.

p.s. NGC86, we know that we get monthly NPD data, its posted all throughout the Wii & DS sales threads, its just that I don't want to go back and check them all just to get the US sales for 360.

[BigJim]

MS shipped 10.4 million as of Dec. 31.  Their highest possible base right now is just under 11m with those extra 500K units. I believe MS hit the 9 million mark back in Dec. There are lots of boxes in the wild, but I would THINK they managed to sell another million by now. They're not selling that poorly are they? Whatever, who knows.

If Nintendo's estimates of selling another 14 million units this fiscal year are accurate, that'd put them roughly at 16.5M by year's end if supply is steady and manufacturing lives up to that expectation. MS is going to NEED Halo and a price cut to have a chance at maintaining any lead this year. But it looks like it really is just a matter of time.

[Ceric]

Yes, we get NPD data.  Though it is horribly one sided.  Media Create gives as life-to-date, year-to-date, Last Week, and This week.  If I had a database to store all the data then I could replicate some of that for NPD.  I wish they did the same in easy to format manner.  Give a better world picture.  Though we still really don't have any consistent numbers for Europe or the smaller territories.

[BlackNMild2k1]

NPD used to be the raw data, every game from every company on every system, but that cracked down on their leak, and now NeoGAF is the only place I know of that The NPF Group will give restricted #'s to in exchange for them to stop getting the whole chart leaked and some sort of legal action being explored.  At least we still get a Top 10 and all the hardware sales though.

As far as Europe goes though, you have to add MC & NPD and then subtract that from the latest press release of WW sales/shipments totals and then adjust for "shipping" into "sold" where applicable, and then you have the estimated Euro #'s left over.

[TJ Spyke]

Maybe the 500K number was just for North America, but I do remember them announcing that shipment number for somewhere. The Xbox 360 is basically dead in Japan and only doing so-so in Europe (outside of the UK, since it does pretty well there), so sales numbers outside of North America are almost a non-factor.

[Ceric]

I wouldn't give 360 "dead" status yet in Japan.  It's had a game break the top 15 within the past month if memory serves.  Also has been on an increase in system sales the past few weeks.  While the PS3 is decreasing.

Edit:

Week of May 21st
You'll want to look at System Sale Growth