Author Topic: That whole GTA ruckus (Read 23806 times)

SgtShiversBen · « **Reply #25 on:** July 17, 2005, 11:27:14 AM »

That's the Purtian way of life. Also I think that sex shouldn't be used how it is (even though I LOOOOVE sex) in media because it just takes away the imagination and the fun of things. Sure we could stop making sex and nudity as evil and the bearer of all sins but at least we get to choose whether or not we want to show these things. Look at the Muslim countries where women aren't even allowed to show their goods. Where as Britney Spears is flashing herself as a goddess of lust. Becasue of this girls, who are 6-15, are dressing like her and it's confusing the heck out of me! I'm like "Hey there's a pretty girl" then I go start hitting on her only to find out she's 15. BLECH!! Sure parents should do something, but I understand on how they're scared. Kids now are getting psychological treatment because of how stressed they are which is BS to begin with. They're kids, what do they know about being stressed (unless immediate family members have perished or some tragic event). Kids have the ultimate power on what they decide they get. If they don't get what they want they have a fit in public. A parent could do something, but then the a**hole brat parents think they're horrible. It's this form of peer pressure that made spanking "Child Abuse" and kids being sent to their room as "neglect".

Regardless of parents, kids will find ways to watch them, play them and imitate them. I myself imitated alot of crap when I was little. I wanted to play MK2 because of it's execessive amounts of blood and violence. I found ways to look at Playboy's when I was younger than 10. It wasn't because of bad parenting, it's just because my parents (they're some hard disciplining people) wanted me to have a great childhood. They let me go outside and play with my friends (which was where I got the Playboy's from) and let me work to pay for things I wanted (which was how I got MK2) but becuase I wasn't sheltered from stuff like this I understood what was right and wrong. Wrestling though was imitatable because I was stupid and always hurt myself and my friends (who in turn hurt me back) but I don't hold the WWF or WCW accountable becuase it was my own stupidity.

I'm not going to talk anymore...I hate kids.

TMW · « **Reply #26 on:** July 17, 2005, 12:09:32 PM »

No, the young girls are dressing like Britney Spears because their parents and teachers don't want them to. It was same reason I started smoking cigarettes and pot when I was 12. All kids rebel, each in their own way.

I've long since wisened up and stopped both, but the point is is that even though I knew that smoking was bad and that pot was illegal, and had been told my entire life that I shouldn't do either, I did it anyways...

I won't even get into the oppression of women in other cultures, (they get oppressed enough here as it is, just not as blatantly), but...this goes back to our backwards and patriarchal views of sexuality. I wouldn't want my kids reading a Playboy, but mainly because I don't want them getting false impressions of what "beauty" is (with the airbrushing and whatnot.) This would be where I start going off on gender roles and expectations in society, but that would a needless tangent.

Society, in the end, is what determines what is "Bad" and what is "Good". Interracial Marriage was once considered against God and a Victorian Woman showing any more than a calf was considered a whore and a harlot. Hopefully, one day, we'll overcome the dated, post-victorian mores that say that men can sleep around, but a woman is whore if she wants sex (we've made progress, but not enough), and we'll stop treating nudity like a crime and sex like a sin, and Rockstar can make a game where you have sex and not get Congress riled up.

nickmitch · « **Reply #27 on:** July 17, 2005, 12:42:49 PM »

Well if that hypothetical sex game was rated AO then no one would give a sh!t 'cause pretty much the only way to get those is on the net anyway, plus it gives the game an appropriate rating. I used to always do wrestling stuff too (and I kind of still do) but we would always be safe because of how we saw people getting hurt.

The real issue here is that parents need to get bitch slapped. Back when I was 6 parents didn't have guns for their kids to get to and even if they did the kid wouldn't touch it. And do you know why? F*ckin' Scruff McGruff! Where is he? I remember Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles told kids not to smoke mary jane and they didn't. Are all these important messages gone? NO! It's just that people tell children to go outside and play. When they do that they miss all the important messages out there. So, when they get home after dark they're just in time for Desperate Housewives, which is a terrible show. If anyone says nonhetero-marriage violates the sanctity of marriage and yet approves of this show is an *ss hole

SgtShiversBen · « **Reply #28 on:** July 17, 2005, 12:53:25 PM »

I think it was just the circle you grew up in TVman. The circle I was in was horrible. Crime everywhere (since I grew up in Corpus Christi, TX which is around 3 hours from the border) and TMNT and the McGruff's didn't really help. I didn't even know what crack or anything was until I saw that one Captain Planet cartoon where the kid dies from a drug (it had a B name).

Also my parents were all about letting me go outside and most of the time I wouldn't come back till 10 at night. Did I pick up dirty habits like swear words, nudity and violence? Yes, but I learned that they're bad on my own. If I saw two people going at it in front of me (which I didn't until college [and I'm not talking about porn]) would I think of it bad when I was 10? Heck yes because it's stuff that shouldn't be done in public. Yet violence is always done in public. From road rage to kids playing cops and robbers. Its acceptable for C&R to be played and not Whore House because kids are having fun and not doing adult things. C&R can be considered adult, but it's better than 5 year olds doing things with thier bodies (shudders).

That may just be me, but that's all I know about. My opinion and to me, my opinion is GOD!!

Also, when I worked at a skating rink for two years, breaking up fights was the best thing I liked to do. But when it came time to cleaning up the girls who are just starting puberty's restroom stuff....made me sick to my stomach. I can take vomit, I can take crap, but when it comes to PMS blood...count me out.

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #29 on:** July 17, 2005, 04:05:29 PM »

Ok. Video Games do effect kids, and adults. It may not make people serial killers, but it does make them more likely to accept violence.

Think about this fact. In World War 1 the draft saw several people that have never fired a gun in combat. When they were faced with the situation to shoot another human (in self defense) most dropped the guns or couldn't pull the trigger.

The military spent tons of money on research and found out that if you shape shooting targets like humans then people are more likely willing to shoot at a human. More soliders were willing to shoot in combat.

The research later went on to include computer simulators. The more realistic the computerized combatant looked the higher percentage of soldiers able to shoot in combat. Direct relationship.

Now we have games that depect very real human beings dying on screen. We laugh at their deaths because it is funny. The same thing is true with movies, but its worse in games, because we are directly responsible for causing the death of the computer characters.

We ARE de-sensitizing our children. HELL, we are de-senitizing ourselves.

Will we all become killers no. But, we do change our attitudes towards violence and sex. And for that we need to be careful. I am not for banning anything, but I am for responsibility of everyone: individuals, government and business.

And sex may not be as bad as violence, but to say it isn't something that can corrupt or hurt our kids is also stupid. Look at our divorce rate, our pre-martial sex rate and much more in our societies all around the world. Its really sad. And before you label me a hateful conservative. Let me just say. It's your life live it how you may, but the children born out of wedlock don't have the same chances of everyone else. The poverty in the world caused by violence and drugs is crippling people who don't even know there is something better.

mantidor · « **Reply #30 on:** July 17, 2005, 04:20:13 PM »

The problem with sex in media its not the sex itself, its the portrait of a person as an object. I completly agree with Spak, we are being desensitizied at an alarming rate, the things showed on todays TV wouldve make people from the 50 to throw up, will in the future the children of today witness a real murder and wont even blink? thats a scary thought.

SgtShiversBen · « **Reply #31 on:** July 17, 2005, 05:34:10 PM »

I don't knwo what it is about me, but I can't watch those Faces of Death videos or car crashes. It's just something that I really don't want to see and I won't choose to on my own. Like this one I saw (I was at a party and drunk) where a car ran a red light and then got t-boned by another scared the crap out of me. I'm always afraid of redlights now just for fear of getting hit.

I do know one way that sex is imitatible though, and that's the Kama Sutra ;-) I've imitated it, so I'm guilty

IceCold · « **Reply #32 on:** July 17, 2005, 08:41:51 PM »

"I saw that one Captain Planet cartoon where the kid dies from a drug (it had a B name). "

Bliss....(wow you just reminded me about that; that was one of the only really serious episodes I think (that and the AIDS one))

I knew about drugs & sex & violence early on in my childhood - my parents were actually really, really good about explaining to me about them and their implications, but NOT telling me what to do, rather influencing me and letting me decide. They didn't keep any secrets for me, and that is how I think it should be done.

And I also like the Canadian way before a violent program, or one that involves sex - there is a strong and clear message before the program, as well as the recommended rating, and if parents allow kids to watch shows like that even after those warnings, they are really irresponsible (moreso if they are not even there at that time).

ThePerm · « **Reply #33 on:** July 17, 2005, 09:38:22 PM »

hmmm...when i was editing the "wad" files forget what their called in gta they had playstation 2 controller textures still in the game.

Famicom · « **Reply #34 on:** July 18, 2005, 12:38:20 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: KDR_11k
Yes but videogames are the last thing I want introducing kids to sex, violence, etc. A parent should have done that long before the kid hits 14. A videogame is not supposed to be an unbiased and complete explaination of some facet of life, don't expect it to work as such. GTA shouldn't introduce them to crime and law enforcement, Water Closet shouldn't introduce them to sex.

No one should EVER speak of the abomination called Wat....no, I shall not speak of it.

KDR_11k · « **Reply #35 on:** July 18, 2005, 04:08:43 AM »

Oooh, sounds like we have someone who played it!

vudu · « **Reply #36 on:** July 18, 2005, 09:35:42 AM »

For what it's worth, there are rumors going around claiming that Rockstar deliberately leaked the Hot Coffee mod to stir up interest in the PC version of GTA:SA. Is it true? No clue.

Quote
Originally posted by: TVman
And as Gamespot put it the minigame didn't even sound 'pornographic' there was no nudity, and the guy kept his pants on. It sounds more like simple dry-humping which can be on TV.

Actually, the player remains fully clothed during the entire scene. However, the girl(s) can be naked. I haven't played the game, but I was curious, so I did a Google search and found a video of a scene. It was a little humorus, but mainly just because of Rockstar's God-awful character models.

stevey · « **Reply #37 on:** July 18, 2005, 09:59:28 AM »

"2) kids will just have sex earlier because they've known about it for a while and they feel they're ready, thus more teen pregnancies. "

Teen will allways have sex even if mom or dad tell about or don't. There were doing it in the 50 when no one ever talk about it and do it now. Kid will find out what sex is no matter what.

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #38 on:** July 18, 2005, 10:30:57 AM »

Stevey: Yes that is true. But it is worse in this generation.

The past we hid from sex because for generations we were dominated by a very puritan view. That view had its own personal problems, but as a whole it created a much better society than what we have now.

However, as we became more "sophisticated" and advanced our ideas we have GLORIFIED violence and sex.

No longer is sex looked down upon when it is reckless performed by adults or teenagers outside of marriage. Condoms aren't perfect. Birth Control is perfect, and it can cause SERIOUS mental and health issues. Yet our society says safe sex is just a condom or BC away.

Instead, a healthy society would take an approach of talking about the existance of violence and sex in a health way and keep up a moral guard to behaviors that have serious consequences on individuals and the community as a whole.

Video Games were one of the last artforms corrupted by this movement. Television and movies have been pushing this agenda for years.

I am not asking for censorship. Just responsibility...and sadly it won't come from developers and publishers so you have to go government. I hate going to government for anything. Government is should never be answer to freedom...but until we realize freedom actually means living responsibly and working together to build a greater community then government has to step in.

stevey · « **Reply #39 on:** July 18, 2005, 03:00:10 PM »

"Stevey: No, there is no such law. Some stores opt to enforce the ratings but they aren't required to. The courts have struck down any attempts to regulate video game sales as a violation of the first amendment."

No Hillary "Everyone did my husband in the 90's but me" Clinton is now make a law to stop people from buy a M game under 18. That is stupid because the M stand for 17 and up show that no one in law making know a thing about video game. *sigh* Bill Clinton now send his sperm (on and in a rocket) to space try to have sex with a alien

Dasmos · « **Reply #40 on:** July 18, 2005, 05:49:11 PM »

Nowhere in that article did it mention Bill Clinton.....

(yeah i know he's the pig, that's why there is many a fullstop)

nickmitch · « **Reply #41 on:** July 18, 2005, 07:53:27 PM »

He's calling Bill Clinton a pig.

And Stevey, it's not a law. It's a bill. Yes, it's only a bill and it's sitting there on capitol hill.

KDR_11k · « **Reply #42 on:** July 18, 2005, 09:56:12 PM »

Dasmos: Stevey is trolling, ignore him.

vudu: In the merely unlocked versions the girls are clothed, you need a second patch to make them nude.

couchmonkey · « **Reply #43 on:** July 19, 2005, 07:45:26 AM »

I'm going to make some people mad, but whatever. I was reading an interview with...I think his name is Leland Yee, on IGN. He's a politician in favour of Government regulations on videogames. After reading the interview, I agreed with him. My first impression was rather negative, ("Won't someone think of the children?") but he eventually convinced me by giving some real, rational reasons why the Government should be in control of rating games.

Instead of simply going on a tirade about how awful video games are, he pointed out that the ESRB basically gets its money from game sales, which is a conflict of interest. I don't personally trust corporations to regulate anything. He also pointed out that if the ESRB is doing the job of keeping kids from buying adult games as well as it claims to be, then the industry shouldn't lose any sales due to a Government ratings system that enforces age restrictions by law. Of course, he doesn't believe that the ESRB ratings system works, and he cited studies done by high school students showing that a pretty large percentage of stores will sell M-rated games to underage kids.

Of course, a decent percentage of stores will sell cigarettes and porn to kids here in Canada, and they face fines if they're caught. Even so, I don't trust the ESRB to come up with an appropriate rating...I feel a number of games like Manhunt and Grand Theft Auto may deserve Adults Only ratings based on their violent content alone (but I admit I haven't played them, so I'm not saying that for sure...it's just my impression from reading reviews).

stevey · « **Reply #44 on:** July 19, 2005, 07:56:39 AM »

I'm not trolling. I was just joking about bill doing everyone on earth and now hes trying to have sex with alien. and the pig sperm is the only thing I got when I google him.

KDR_11k · « **Reply #45 on:** July 19, 2005, 08:28:36 AM »

Making up statements like "he wants to have sex with an alien" or "the pig sperm is the only result I get for googling him" (i tried that, no pig sperm on the first ten results, try googling "miserable failure" instead) is trolling. Trolling means deliberately posting incorrect information to cause a reaction, usually flames.

Besides, Hillary Clinton isn't a dictator. She cannot enforce a law the courts don't agree with. That's what separation of power is meant for, that the courts will stop politicians or policemen from doing unlawful things. If Clinton thinks she can get away with that, fine, just don't cry when you see the Supreme Court tear your new law to shreds as unconstitutional.

couchmonkey: The MPAA gets its money from movie sales, the RIAA gets its money from music sales, both are considered rating authorities for their respective media. I don't see politicians complaining that movie ratings are bullshit just because the ratings board is kept alive with the money of the movie industry. The ratings were introduced when the government said "you make a ratings board or we'll make one for you!", it's in the best interest of the industry to keep the ratings honest to avoid government regulation. The problem is that today we have too many publicity whores in the political arena that completely ignore that the ESRB exists, functions and does exactly what you expect it to do. Jackass Thompson also claims the ESRB sucks and wants to replace it with his own Thoughtcrime Enforcement Agency, except he's a tinfoil hat and claims that ANYONE who doesn't hate the ESRB is a conspirator. Because, you know, trying to give parents an idea of what content is to be found in a videogame is such a despicable goal. They might make informed decisions! We can't have that, Ignorance is Strength! And get rid of that right to free speech, won't somebody please think of the children? Freedom is Slavery! Oh and be a good citizen and support all our military actions without questioning because War is Peace! (sorry had to get that last one in after having a nightmare about living in that world last night)

vudu · « **Reply #46 on:** July 19, 2005, 08:43:30 AM »

Quote
vudu: In the merely unlocked versions the girls are clothed, you need a second patch to make them nude.

I was umaware. No where in my research did I find out. Jeez, people need to chill out. Is there another patch that lets the player kill his girlfriend after having sex with her and then rob her home?

nickmitch · « **Reply #47 on:** July 19, 2005, 08:50:47 AM »

I like the fact that there was a book made to show everyone what COULD happen by 1984 and now there's a song about all nostalgia of 1985.

stevey · « **Reply #48 on:** July 19, 2005, 03:07:05 PM »

"And Stevey, it's not a law. It's a bill. Yes, it's only a bill and it's sitting there on capitol hill. "

And that bill just got past "found that a 15-year-old boy could purchase "Mature" rated video games (recommended for children 17 and older) at 11 of the 15 stores he visited."

O_O Oh sh!t how does he know I both doom 3 and my age? I'm freeking out now!

"Hillary Clinton isn't a dictator. "

Who call her that?

nickmitch · « **Reply #49 on:** July 19, 2005, 03:51:07 PM »

Illinois is retarded. So, if I'm 17 then I'm not allowed to buy a game that is rated 17 and up? In the timeless words of Carlos Mencia: WTF is that?!?

News:

Author Topic: That whole GTA ruckus (Read 23806 times)