Topic: RetroActive #21: Fire Emblem: The Sacred Stones

[oohhboy]

For a game like this wandering around towns is no more than filler and padding. Besides, you met the townsfolk during the battles inside the towns. They do use the in game engine to produce cutscenes.The plot isn't the most original since it a bunch of people trying to stop the hell on earth. The blame lies with the writing, not the telling of the story.

[leahsdad]

For a game like this wandering around towns is no more than filler and padding. Besides, you met the townsfolk during the battles inside the towns. They do use the in game engine to produce cutscenes.The plot isn't the most original since it a bunch of people trying to stop the hell on earth. The blame lies with the writing, not the telling of the story.

Yeah, but the story itself is pretty bad.   I can already guess what's going to happen in the story, what's up with the emperor of Grado, why he wants to do what he wants to do, etc....because I've seen anime before, and it's always the same story again and again.   Maybe I'm wrong about where the story is going.  I'd sure like to be wrong. But I doubt it.

With that said, I think if I skipped every single story element, or if there was no story at all and this game was just a collection of random battles, I'd be pretty bored and disengaged from the game itself.   Isn't that funny?  Sure, a good story and good writing would be nice.  But even if it's a bad, cliche'd, irrelevant story, we still need it to enjoy the game?  Am I the only one who thinks this way?

[Ceric]

The Story in Fire Emblem is not meant to be enjoyed by itself.

If you extracted the Story and just read it, yeah, its not as developed as you need for written literature.
If you extracted just the gameplay you have some enjoyment but you be wondering why am I doing this.

You put the two together and you start to fill out the characters and let you know more about the relationships around you.  The conclusion of this story isn't the goal of the story.  This story doesn't want you to get to an end point.  This story wants to make your units a lot less generic.  Thats why the social aspect is in there.  Why you will see people object and put in there two cents.

The plot in this story is just something to help reinforce the decisions made by the characters.  Its not the main point.  The main point is for you to build how you think that character will grow while still allowing enough flexibility to personalize them to your own understanding.

Take Ross.  We know Grado was his Father.  We know that Grado use to be a great Warrior.  Ross starts weak because his Father wanted to protect him from the Soldier life.  All the upgrade choices for Ross are whether he wants to follow his fathers footstep or rebel a little and become his own man.  No matter which branch you pick he can be a Warrior like his Father.

Without the story I wouldn't have known that which makes his choices mean less.  I personaly never expect much from the overarching plot of the stories in the genre.  Its hard not to have similar plots because of gameplay, I'm going to give everyone in the world a puppy would be a hard plot to work with etc.  What I like about the good games in this genre when it comes to story is relationship and the character story.  Makes you feel closer to them when you know something about them and there not just Archer #1 or Sword User 3 Variant B.

[lolmonade]

So, for those of us that like this game and are interested in more, any other Fire Emblem or non-Fire Emblem games that the experts here could suggest?  This and Civ IV have really revved up my strategy game itch.

[gojira]

So, for those of us that like this game and are interested in more, any other Fire Emblem or non-Fire Emblem games that the experts here could suggest?  This and Civ IV have really revved up my strategy game itch.

Well I gushed about the Gamecube and Wii games earlier in this thread.  I also very much enjoyed the first Fire Emblem game on Gameboy Advance.  The DS one is interesting since it's a remake of the very first FE game.  But it had prerendered sprites instead of hand drawn ones.  So the game has much less character.  But if you turn off battle animations anyway it probably doesn't matter. 

For non-FE games the Advance Wars games are great.  I also like the Final Fantasy Tactics series and Tactics Ogre.  A little bit older, but still very good are the Shining Force games.

[noname2200]

So, for those of us that like this game and are interested in more, any other Fire Emblem or non-Fire Emblem games that the experts here could suggest?  This and Civ IV have really revved up my strategy game itch.

I'll second all of gojira's recommendations, especially the other Fire Emblem games and the original Final Fantasy Tactics. Shining Force II is also easily available and high quality. The DS game Might and Magic, Clash of Heroes is also worth your time. And of course I heartily endorse the Ogre Battle series.

As for good turn-based strategy titles, Panzer General's great, as is Master of Orion II. X-Com's been brought up in this discussion already, and for good reason. The Romance of the Three Kingdoms games are also generally good, although I prefer the older, simpler titles. And there's the granddaddy of them all, Europa Universalis. The titles in this group are more management-oriented than the first group; think of them as being closer to Civilization than Fire Emblem.

[Ceric]

Alright Ewan as a Druid is OP.  Chapter 13 was the first real mission that I had with him and I wanted to level up is Anima affinity.  I stepped in there and saw it was a survival mission.  I was like ok lets see how tough he is.  I walked him into the enemy forces alone.  3 turns later I had killed the boss and ended the mission.

Though I'm going to have to redo it because Amelia thought it be a good idea to attack Ewan and promptly died.  She had a death phrase so I'm assuming I can recruit her at some point.  Being a Newbie she must be really powerful eventually.

[noname2200]

Alright Ewan as a Druid is OP.  Chapter 13 was the first real mission that I had with him and I wanted to level up is Anima affinity.  I stepped in there and saw it was a survival mission.  I was like ok lets see how tough he is.  I walked him into the enemy forces alone.  3 turns later I had killed the boss and ended the mission.

Though I'm going to have to redo it because Amelia thought it be a good idea to attack Ewan and promptly died.  She had a death phrase so I'm assuming I can recruit her at some point.  Being a Newbie she must be really powerful eventually.

Regarding Amelia, you are correct sir. Make her a Knight, then a General, and watch as you get a double-attacking powerhouse who shrugs off physical and magical damage. She can only move five spaces, though...

Regarding Ewan, part of it is that he is indeed a powerhouse, but you have to keep in mind that he's probably over levelled at this point. Because you promoted him "early" he'll be less powerful in the late game. Fortunately, the main quest is designed to let you win with characters who have only gained about 30 levels, instead of 40, so you'll still be able to beat the game.

Also, judging from the order of recruitment you've presented, am I correct to assume that you chose Eirika after Chapter 8?

[Ceric]

Regarding Ewan, part of it is that he is indeed a powerhouse, but you have to keep in mind that he's probably over levelled at this point. Because you promoted him "early" he'll be less powerful in the late game. Fortunately, the main quest is designed to let you win with characters who have only gained about 30 levels, instead of 40, so you'll still be able to beat the game.

Also, judging from the order of recruitment you've presented, am I correct to assume that you chose Eirika after Chapter 8?

Yep. 
Though you are wrong about Ewan.  Unless you can hold off promoting recruits from when they said you can promote them.

Promotion Path:
Level 10 Pupil -> Level 1 Shaman
Level 20 Shaman -> Level 1 Druid
Now he's a level 7 Druid

So I should still have 13 levels of Druid which means he'll be leveled 50 levels total from his Pupil form being but since Recruits start at an effect -10 level He will be at level 40 when fully leveled.

[Nbz]

Though I haven't played in a few days I did make some significant progress over the weekend as I was away and could play a lot while travelling. I'm really quite annoyed that I didn't have internet access, because I completely forgot about the reward you get for saving the villagers in the fog chapter, which I failed to get. I really wanted to use Neimi and to upgrade her as early as possible, but now it looks like I'll have to wait for either the master seal or make sure I have enough money for an Orion's Bolt at the secret shop, which shouldn't be to hard seeing as I remember where to pick up the Silver and Gold cards. Otherwise things have been going pretty well, apart from my haphazard loss of Franz in Chapter 8. TBH though Franz isn't the greatest of cavalry units, and I much prefer Forde/Kyle, who were much higher levelled than Franz anyway, though that was mainly because I knew about Orson's Betrayal and loss as a playable character beforehand.


I have already beaten the game twice once going with Eirika and once going with Ephraim, so I decided to choose Eirika's path this time mainly because that was the one I did first before and it is the least fresh in my mind. I have to say though that I abused the hell out of the Tower of Valni when I got it open. I grinded Ross up to around level 15 alongside Lute, even though I don't quite have their promotion items yet, they are definitely 2 units that I want in my consistant squad. I also bumped Gilliam and Vanessa up to level 20 and promoted them both, Gilliam to the obvious choice of General and Vanessa to a Wyvern Knight, seeing as I plan to promote Tana to a Falco Knight later, and I prefer splitting their promotions in that fashion.


Chapter 9 was a bit of a pain in the ass though, I had to restart 3 times, mainly because I was going for perfection. I wanted to stop the bandit that spawns at the top of the map from destroying the village so that I could grab the item from it and I also wanted to recruit Amelia, which was tougher than normal because I didn't have Franz. It meant I had to move all my units within her range before she departs on turn 12 and I had to take all weapons off of Eirika so that she wouldn't kill Amelia on the counter attack. I managed to get through it though and wound up getting what I wanted so it was all good in the end. I feel though that I'm gonna start blasting through chapters now, seeing as I have a few promoted unit and a couple who are on the verge of promotion. I also don't really plan on using many of the units you get in the later chapters as pre-promoted guys, barring a couple, I'd like to be using my original guys for the majority of the playthrough, but we'll have to see how far my patience will take me, especially when I reach Chapter 18, which if I recall is a gruellingly long map with some real heavy annoyances.


I haven't really been concentrating too much on support convos, I never really bother with them that much, but I want to develop the Joshua/Natasha one seeing as I have never used Natasha fully before and I have a feeling that she is going to become a pretty powerful unit. I think those two would work really well together on the battlefield, especially with the support boosts. Colm and Neimi is the easy and obvious support relationship to develop, but I find it difficult to keep them together on the field of play, mainly because I let Colm run off towards the nearest chest/door and let Neimi do her own thing.

[noname2200]

Though you are wrong about Ewan.  Unless you can hold off promoting recruits from when they said you can promote them.

Promotion Path:
Level 10 Pupil -> Level 1 Shaman
Level 20 Shaman -> Level 1 Druid
Now he's a level 7 Druid

So I should still have 13 levels of Druid which means he'll be leveled 50 levels total from his Pupil form being but since Recruits start at an effect -10 level He will be at level 40 when fully leveled.

For some reason I thought you'd promoted your characters after they hit level 10. Since I'm wrong, your Ewan will indeed be a terror on the battlefield. He's also demolishing everyone because he's about fifteen levels above the enemy!

[Ceric]

Amelia.  Got her the first promotion to knight.  Then I did the tower with here as a level 1 knight and proceed to go three levels worth of the tower without using any other unit.  The only thing stopping me from going on was that the 135 Iron Lances I had stocked her with was not enough.

Just went to see how far I could get in the tower just for kicks.  Level 6 and thats not because of man power.  It was simply because I just didn't have the supplies to continue.  I'm going to have to bench my Ewan and Amelia now for a while and bring them back out later.  They are an army in and of themselves.

[Sarail]

FINALLY. Got past my breaking point in Chapter 9. Got the Dragonseal AND finally recruited Amelia. Now let's get this show back on the road. >_<

[Ceric]

GOing to have to redo Chapter 15...
I've decided to call my group the Hidden Lords Corp.

[Hey Einstein!]

Well well well, I'm not as far along in Sacred Stones as most of the folks posting on here,
but despite my moaning about the excessive exposition and talking head cut scenes I am now having a GREAT TIME with this game. 
And it's a darn good thing as it's detracting me from the fact that my copy of Resident Evil Revelations has been delayed in shipping.



To mirror an earlier quote but to be more specific, can anybody recommend any other strategy rpgs on the DS or IOS? Please no obvious ones (Final Fantasy Tactics, Other Fire Emblem /Advance War titles, Shining Force, Tactics Orge) as I've played a lot of those. Can anyone recommend anything a bit further off the beaten track?


Thanks in advance!

[Ceric]

Well well well, I'm not as far along in Sacred Stones as most of the folks posting on here,
but despite my moaning about the excessive exposition and talking head cut scenes I am now having a GREAT TIME with this game. 
And it's a darn good thing as it's detracting me from the fact that my copy of Resident Evil Revelations has been delayed in shipping.



To mirror an earlier quote but to be more specific, can anybody recommend any other strategy rpgs on the DS or IOS? Please no obvious ones (Final Fantasy Tactics, Other Fire Emblem /Advance War titles, Shining Force, Tactics Orge) as I've played a lot of those. Can anyone recommend anything a bit further off the beaten track?


Thanks in advance!

Disgaea  got released on DS at one point.  I'm sure there more I just can't think of.
If you can find a GBA Cart cheap Dungeon Dice Monster Is engaging strategy game. (That one is really off the beaten track.)

[Glad0s]

Well, I've finally hit my road block. I'm on the chapter titled "Father and Son" (#14, I believe), and I have tried it around 5 or 6 times, only for a few of my characters to die once I reach the boss. This is the first time I've been stuck so far, and up to this point I've actually found the game fairly easy. I think I may have let a few too many people die. Now I only have 7 party members.

[noname2200]

To mirror an earlier quote but to be more specific, can anybody recommend any other strategy rpgs on the DS or IOS? Please no obvious ones (Final Fantasy Tactics, Other Fire Emblem /Advance War titles, Shining Force, Tactics Orge) as I've played a lot of those. Can anyone recommend anything a bit further off the beaten track?

For the DS, the closest things I can think of would be Might and Magic and Valkyrie Profile. The former I own, the latter I've heard things about.

Well, I've finally hit my road block. I'm on the chapter titled "Father and Son" (#14, I believe), and I have tried it around 5 or 6 times, only for a few of my characters to die once I reach the boss. This is the first time I've been stuck so far, and up to this point I've actually found the game fairly easy. I think I may have let a few too many people die. Now I only have 7 party members.

 If the problem is just the boss himself, try the following: clear the boss' room. Equip Ephraim with his special anti-armor lance (I can't remember the exact name) and healing items, preferably Elixirs, and check to see if the boss can kill Ephraim in one hit.
 
 If not, move Ephraim adjacent to the boss, but do not attack. On the enemy's turn, the boss will attack Ephraim, and thus take severe damage. Heal if needed, then repeat until the boss is dead. This strategy lets you heal on your turn while still dealing steady damage.
 

[lolmonade]

GOing to have to redo Chapter 15...
I've decided to call my group the Hidden Lords Corp.

Oh ****...later in the game you get to name your group?
 
I'm going to call mine the Lolmonade stand!

[Ceric]

GOing to have to redo Chapter 15...
I've decided to call my group the Hidden Lords Corp.

Oh ****...later in the game you get to name your group?
 
I'm going to call mine the Lolmonade stand!

No, but they don't actually call it anything in the game so as the Overlord Intelligence directing the Will and Actions of this Group, I retain the right to name them as I see fit.

[Da Jarvis]

So after hearing on RFN this morning how the discussion on this game was being pushed back for next episode, I decided to finally pop the game in my Gameboy Micro (yes I have one and I love it xD) and play it. It has been about a year or so since I last played this game and I have to say, my opinion on it so far doesn't change at all. I still don't care about the story in this game and always find myself skipping cutscenes after the 2nd or 3rd chapter. Even on my first playthrough way back when this game came out I found the story a little melodramatic and kind of boring to say the least, which is funny as I really liked the one first on the GBA and Path of Radiance on GameCube, but it might be nostalgia and love for the main cast in those games that keep me coming back. Don't get me wrong, I like a lot of the characters in this game and as always, support conversation trees are always the best parts to read, but the overal plot I can't stand.

Back to my time with the game. I have only put about an hour into the game and after beginning to skip cutscenes after chapter 2 or so and changing my game settings so text move faster and only my favorite characters would have battle animations, I ended up mid way through level 5 without losing a single unit and having to restart. I know I am a Fire Emblem junky and all, but I am quite surprised how much easier this game is in comparison to the older on on GBA (Fire Emblem 7 or just Fire Emblem stateside). I am not even grinding really and Erica, Lute, Ross, and the first Pegasus girl have become some of my strongest units. I still need to train Colm and the archer chick in the next chapter, but these units are usually really hard to train without using the grind tower unlocked after level 7 or so. I mean, the gameplay is still great and I am enjoying it a lot, but I just remember the game being more challenging is all. Maybe it's cause I am older and play more defensively now, but maybe I need to go back and play Radiant Dawn for some really hard Fire Emblem action -_-

Quick Question before I go, has everyone how with Erica, cause I swear I haven't seem one person pick her brothers side of the story. I am planning to go with her brother as of now, but I was just seeing if anyone else was going to or has done the same. Of course this depends on how far I get today, but I am sure I can mange to get a few chapter done before tonight xD

[Da Jarvis]

Well, I've finally hit my road block. I'm on the chapter titled "Father and Son" (#14, I believe), and I have tried it around 5 or 6 times, only for a few of my characters to die once I reach the boss. This is the first time I've been stuck so far, and up to this point I've actually found the game fairly easy. I think I may have let a few too many people die. Now I only have 7 party members.

Lol! It sounds like your problem is the lack of units. 7 units on that map is a hard one. Then again, watched my cousin beat the game with only Erphrim, Seth, Erika, and Joshua and used every other character as death fodder. He was probably the worst strategist I have ever seen play the game and he beat the game faster then I did because of his tactics, so I guess it's doable under your conditions. It's just the later levels are a hell of a lot easier if your have units that you can put more responsibilities on xD

[Ceric]

I'm Farily sure Glad0s has because Chapter 14 was different for me.

I have full intentions of going back through to see Ephraim's side.  I would love to pick up the Gamecube one but, I can really only play these time of time consuming games portably.
 

Well, I've finally hit my road block. I'm on the chapter titled "Father and Son" (#14, I believe), and I have tried it around 5 or 6 times, only for a few of my characters to die once I reach the boss. This is the first time I've been stuck so far, and up to this point I've actually found the game fairly easy. I think I may have let a few too many people die. Now I only have 7 party members.

Lol! It sounds like your problem is the lack of units. 7 units on that map is a hard one. Then again, watched my cousin beat the game with only Erphrim, Seth, Erika, and Joshua and used every other character as death fodder. He was probably the worst strategist I have ever seen play the game and he beat the game faster then I did because of his tactics, so I guess it's doable under your conditions. It's just the later levels are a hell of a lot easier if your have units that you can put more responsibilities on xD

As of now Ch. 15 I am seriously considering doing this chapter with only Ewan and Amelia just to see it happen.  In fact I think I could do it with just Amelia and enough ammo.
 
Though I probably bring Tethys to speed it along.

[noname2200]

Quick Question before I go, has everyone how with Erica, cause I swear I haven't seem one person pick her brothers side of the story. I am planning to go with her brother as of now, but I was just seeing if anyone else was going to or has done the same. Of course this depends on how far I get today, but I am sure I can mange to get a few chapter done before tonight xD

I made the other choice. On Hard Mode, of course, because I am a man and I declare my manhood by taking on meaningless challenges in obscure videogames.

Question for you though: you seem like the only person here who's in a position to have tried the Link Arena. Did you ever give it a go back in the day and, if so, how was it? I was always intrigued, but I didn't know anyone else who owned a copy of the game on the GBA, so I never got to try it out.

[Ceric]

...
I made the other choice. On Hard Mode, of course, because I am a man and I declare my manhood by taking on meaningless challenges in obscure videogames.
..

Are you a Muppet of a Man?