Topic: Disney bought Fox: Fox Shareholders Agreed to $71B Disney Buyout!!

[BlackNMild2k1]

AT&T still got that Cohen scandal that could muck things up, so here's to hopes that Comcast is just posturing.

Iger ain't budging though, and Murdoch already tried to explain past this to Fox shareholders about what's more valuable and what would get passed through regulation.

Although there were rumors that shareholders may ask Murdoch to "recuse" himself from negotiations due to his heavy tax implications of an all cash deal. But I think it was based off speculation more than anything.

[nickmitch]

The AT&T scandal could totally blow over though.  The longer things drag out, the more that short-term memory kicks in.  Without making it sound too political, there's a really high turnover with that sort of thing these days; so if no one's going to jail, no one is going to care.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Well.... there have been further developments on the Cohen thing, which could lead to Cohen himself cooperating, which in turn could lead to more info about the AT&T involvement.... although they already have all his data, so they probably already know all they need to know anyway.

Point being, is that it keeps staying in the news, but not specifically the AT&T involvement, so you're right, in that it might be overlooked in the public eye. But we are talking about a DOJ ruling for a court case infront of a judge where all evidence may not be presented publicly, or for public knowledge. I expect them to have all pertinent evidence, including things that were seized a month or 2 ago and testimonies that may be relevant to the case but not public knowledge.

It's all wait and see at this point, because it seems at this point, at least from a public perspective, that there are no consequences for many things at a high level ($$ = influence, Influence = Power), regardless of how much publicly know evidence exist (including on camera confessions, and suspiciously pre-emptive tweets).

AT&T Trial is in June, Disney Bid vote is in July, Comcast will supposedly make an official offer somewhere inbetween those 2 things depending on how the 1st goes. I don't expect the trail to be over in the 1st hearing, so I'm hoping the hearing gets dragged out for several months as I'm sure these types of things usually do.
There is still lots of time between now and that trial date for lots of yet unknown and so far seemingly unconnected drama to somehow become very relevant and damaging to the case at hand.

::fingerscrossed::

[segagamersteph]

I personally want the Disney deal to go through just because I want to see Marvel get as many of their characters back as they can. I also want Fox to add to the strength of the pending Disney service that I want to knock Netflix down a peg or two.


The (@p1t@li$t in me wants the Comcast deal to go through to knock Disney down a peg. Either way whatever comes out of this deal is going to shape the future of mass media for at least the next decade.

[segagamersteph]

I just read if Comcast buys Fox they will have a 60 percent share of Hulu. If Disney buys Fox they get a 60 percent share of Hulu. It seems like Hulu is going to be the biggest loser in this deal no matter what happens.

[BranDonk Kong]

Hulu already sucks.

[NWR_insanolord]

What's wrong with Hulu? I use it more than I use Netflix these days. I'm watching Seinfeld on it right now.

[BranDonk Kong]

Because you pay for it and you still get ads. I understand that with the live stuff, but for the on demand only it's dumb.

Edit: ok so you can pay extra for no ads. It used to be free with limited ads, and paid with no ads. Now it's paid with ads or paid more with no ads. Admittedly, I haven't used it in a long time, but is sucked when I used it last.

[NWR_insanolord]

Yeah, I get the no ads package, which is still the same price as Netflix. My only complaint is I'm not really a fan of the way their app is laid out, but they've got tons of great content.

[Stratos]

Is Hulu's layout better than Amazon's? I really despise how Amazon displays their videos.

[NWR_insanolord]

It's definitely better than Amazon's. Really, if it just let me set it to default to open straight to the My Stuff page when I open it instead of having to go through the trouble of navigating to it every time I wouldn't have that much of a problem with it.

[nickmitch]

I don't care for Hulu's UI, personally.

[segagamersteph]

Hulu's UI is better than Amazon but their catalog is not as good.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I don't really understand all this, but the summary of it all is that if Comcast continues to pursue the ALL CASH bid for SKY and for 21CF, They will likely get their credit downgraded, meaning they become a lender risk and that is bad for their bottom line and their shareholders....
http://www.philly.com/philly/business/comcast/comcast-fox-disney-sky-netflix-20180523.html

Basically Comcast is putting itself at risk pursuing this deal, even if the deal gets rejected.
Shareholders may not want to continue watching their stocks drop and then the company credit rating get downgraded on top of that....

Maybe someone with a deeper understanding can explain it in laymans terms for the rest of us.

edit:
Some additional articles
-AT&T Merger in trouble?
https://nypost.com/2018/05/28/antitrust-professor-att-time-warner-merger-is-in-trouble/

-Disney lining up financing in case Fox Shareholders demand some Cash?
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/29/disney-lines-up-financing-in-case-fox-board-demands-cash-sources.html

Looks like Disney is ready to make this happen and quickly and smoothly as possible.

[segagamersteph]

Them getting desperate sounds like someone losing at Monopoly when they mortgage all their property to buy hotels on the purple properties only to lose the game 3 rounds later.


Cash is the better deal though. The problem with a stock deal is the stock could burst and then both companies sink. With a cash deal they could use that money to invest in other companies and get a better return on their investment, the Fox shareholders not Comcast.

It sounds like, as much as you hate Comcast BnM, it might be better for them to buy Fox and then sink into oblivion that much faster. Then Disney can snatch up the Marvel IP for dirt cheap and walk away the real winners. Okay not going to  happen, this whole deal sucks no matter which of these two companies win.

I would be happier if Fox just went bankrupt and auctioned off all their properties but they aren't selling because of financial need they are selling so Murdock and focus on the news side without the distraction of giving a **** what the X-Men are doing.

[nickmitch]

I don't really understand all this, but the summary of it all is that if Comcast continues to pursue the ALL CASH bid for SKY and for 21CF, They will likely get their credit downgraded, meaning they become a lender risk and that is bad for their bottom line and their shareholders....
http://www.philly.com/philly/business/comcast/comcast-fox-disney-sky-netflix-20180523.html

Basically Comcast is putting itself at risk pursuing this deal, even if the deal gets rejected.
Shareholders may not want to continue watching their stocks drop and then the company credit rating get downgraded on top of that....

Maybe someone with a deeper understanding can explain it in laymans terms for the rest of us.

So, if Comcast buys Fox is an all-cash deal, they'll basically have to do so "on credit".  They're gonna borrow most of the cash.  So, they're balance sheet is gonna gain huge assets from Fox, but also a HUGE liability.  Whereas if they already had the cash, it'd be one asset for another.  Creditors tend to look at certain ratios to decide how credit worthy a potential borrower is, and flipping their balance sheet like that would throw those ratios off.  Additionally, while the new assets will drive up their cash flows (form operations, presumably), the interest on the debt will drive it down.  Which means they make have trouble paying off any new debt they'd take on after the purchase.

To compare, Disney is doing a primarily stock deal hits their balance sheet differently.  That's gonna bump their equity and assets. 

[BlackNMild2k1]

Cash is the better deal though. The problem with a stock deal is the stock could burst and then both companies sink. With a cash deal they could use that money to invest in other companies and get a better return on their investment, the Fox shareholders not Comcast.

Actually all the analyst say that All Cash IS NOT the better deal, as the cash comes with HEAVY tax implications, especially for Murdoch. You see the cash, then you get taxed, and then there goes X% of your cash.... I don't believe the same issues arise with stock trades, which are actually poised to become even more valuable with time.

And thanks for the further explanation Nickmitch. I had a general idea of what was going on, but that cleared it up quite a bit.

[segagamersteph]

Cash is the better deal though. The problem with a stock deal is the stock could burst and then both companies sink. With a cash deal they could use that money to invest in other companies and get a better return on their investment, the Fox shareholders not Comcast.

Actually all the analyst say that All Cash IS NOT the better deal, as the cash comes with HEAVY tax implications, especially for Murdoch. You see the cash, then you get taxed, and then there goes X% of your cash.... I don't believe the same issues arise with stock trades, which are actually poised to become even more valuable with time.

And thanks for the further explanation Nickmitch. I had a general idea of what was going on, but that cleared it up quite a bit.

Except you get taxed twice on stocks, for the sale and for any growth so it's all the same. I just meant the share holders could reinvest that cash into Disney shares and come out well better off.

[BranDonk Kong]

Fox shareholders are voting on the Disney sale in July.

[nickmitch]

So, at least another month of fun times!

[segagamersteph]

WHy can't Disney just buy the Marvel characters and let Comcast have the rest. Besides the Simpsons what does Fox really have of value anyways? They cancel every single show they produce it seems too soon to even build a following.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I don't even want to get into a discussion about all the things that is wrong with Comcast gaining even more of a foothold in any industry it is interested in.

[nickmitch]

WHy can't Disney just buy the Marvel characters and let Comcast have the rest. Besides the Simpsons what does Fox really have of value anyways? They cancel every single show they produce it seems too soon to even build a following.

The marvel characters are big money, but owning another network is also huge.  They're getting everything in that Sunday lineup, day time NFL games, and local sports networks.  Fox mismanaging their shows is something that's easily fixable, once you own them.  Also, you're not just getting TV, you're getting a film studio and their indy film distribution imprint.  This will also include the original Star Wars movies, which can be digitally remastered without all the special effects added later and resold to possibly millions of grateful nerds.

I don't even want to get into a discussion about all the things that is wrong with Comcast gaining even more of a foothold in any industry it is interested in.

Yeah, **** Comcast.  I feel this way about most cable companies, but 90% of my friends say they are crooks.

[segagamersteph]

I get the benefits to Disney, I meant why can't Fox just sell the Marvel stuff to Disney and offer everything else to Comcast.

Why the $*&% is it such a terrible sin for Comcast to grow into an unstoppable corporate blog but it's okay for Disney to own a monopoly of our entertainment? I think from a free market perspective I would rather Disney be stopped from getting total control over the film industry.

Also, you seem to operate under the assumption Disney is going to keep things going business as usual and save the Simpons, I don't, it does not fit their culture I see it getting axed. Along with Family Guy and anything in that sort of comedy. Disney doesn't need Fox, they are buying it for the control over the media industry.
I would prefer Fox go out of business and auction off their assets to the highest bidder in small blocks. However, they aren't selling because of financial difficulties they are selling because Murdock wants to flex his media muscle and needs the cash and wants to cut the dead weight.
I fully understand what they are getting I just am far more worried Disney getting the stuff than Comcast.It sounds to me like those opposing the Comcast deal are doing so exclusively on hating their internet service, you do realize their service isn't going to get any worse just because they buy crap, a shitty company is a shitty company but I don't see what their internet interests has to do with anything, at all.
Now I personally would rather Universal get control of the Fantastic Four, Aliens, and Avatar franchises than Disney. In a perfect world I would want Disney to just get the Marvel assets because then they still have competition in the sci-fi and fantasy market, DC notwithstanding.

[NWR_insanolord]

Neither one of them is a good outcome, this is a "lesser of two evils" situation.