Topic: New Super Mario Brothers 2?

[NWR_insanolord]

I never owned an SNES and I didn't know anyone who did so my first experience with the game was on the GBA. I've owned it both on that and on the Virtual Console and I've played through it a few times but I just don't like the game, it's my least favorite Mario game. Compare that to SMB3, not only my favorite Mario but my favorite game period, and I was expecting a lot from it.

[Peachylala]

I can see where many people come from when they don't consider Super Mario World a worthy sequal to SMB3. I, however, think that the game should be judged on it's own merits and not compared to Mario 3. As Spak pointed out with the items:

However, I would say that limiting the powerups to basically 5 powerups allowed for the game to be much tighter in level design.  Levels were generally much larger, better balance of difficulty, and overall much more enjoyable then Super Mario 3.

Which is true in the case of New SMB. It had a mixture of SMW's side-scrolling (meaning levels can either go up, down, left or right) and traditional SMB gameplay (just going right).

I would like suits to come back, but I personally want to see SMB2 remade and it getting the respect it deserves. (Hell, it was one of the better Mario Advance titles on the GBA)

[Spak-Spang]

I think my favorite part of Super Mario World is the fantastic Cape, that created an awesome flight experience, much better than the experience in Super Mario 3 or any other Mario game since...and probably any other platforming game.  It took skill, and had tons of options.

Yoshi was awesome and well balanced into the game design as well.  Levels that could be beaten with skillful expert playing could be made easier with Yoshi, but if you relied too much on Yoshi and lost him you were screwed. 

Also the spin jump was introduced and wasn't just a gimmicky more powerful but was carefully built into level design and enemy design. 

Still, although World is great and the best traditional 2D Mario, Yoshi's Island kicks its butt for sheer brilliance on every aspect of the game.

[NWR_insanolord]

I can see where many people come from when they don't consider Super Mario World a worthy sequal to SMB3. I, however, think that the game should be judged on it's own merits and not compared to Mario 3.

I don't see how it's possible to just forget about SMB3, but I just don't have fun when I'm playing World. I try not to say it but my gut reaction is to say that I hate Super Mario World.

Yoshi's Island kicks its butt for sheer brilliance on every aspect of the game.

At least we agree on this.

[TJ Spyke]

I don't see how it's possible to just forget about SMB3, but I just don't have fun when I'm playing World. I try not to say it but my gut reaction is to say that I hate Super Mario World.

You are free to think that since it is your opinion, but it baffles me how anyone could hate such a great game. The fact that the GBA release sold millions of copies too and the VC version is one of the top selling VC games shows people still love the game. It also got great reviews for a reason and was the top selling SNES game for a reason (yes it was bundled at launch, but it was also sold separately). It improved on SMB3 in almost every way.

[NWR_insanolord]

It was a step back from SMB3 in almost every way. But I realize I'm very much in the minority. I also hate Zelda: A Link to the Past.

[Snipper64]

Hmm... I hated NEW super mario bros. it had some good gameplay yes, but just didn't pull off the oringanal super mario bros. feel. Did feel like a worst version of mario three (More power ups, over head map, etc). I enjoy mario 3, and I enjoy super mario world, both are good games. Which on do I like more? Well I really can't tell... each have the good parts to it, and each has bad... I think SMB3 is a little better though, nice clean level design, many possible paths, unlike SMW...

[Snipper64]

I also hate Zelda: A Link to the Past.

I played almost every zelda game, like some more then others, but I really enjoyed Link to the past. It was nice and clean, and VERY well planned. I won't go any farther into it, because this tread is about new super mario bros. but I felt like I needed to defend link to the past...

[Spak-Spang]

How can anyone not like Link to the Past, to me it is the definitive and best Zelda game.  I have beaten it over 5 times and will do so again and again.

[TJ Spyke]

insano, could you explain why you think SMW is a step back compared to SMB3? It looked better, sounded better, more creative stages, more creative enemies, more challenge (specifically the Special World). The only advantage SMB3 has IMO is more powerups.

[NWR_insanolord]

I disagree with every one of those except maybe challenge.

[Spak-Spang]

Actually, I disagree with the Challenge.  Super Mario 3 is much harder than Super Mario World.  Level 8 of Super Mario 3 is cruelty in gaming at its best. 

Creative stages?  I actually would put the nod to Super Mario 3 on creative stages.  Super Mario World was able to do more with their stages, but 3 created the format and different worlds that World ended up just copying.  That being said, almost all the levels in Super Mario World were great and designed well.  But, what is hard to see is that Super Mario 3 had shorter levels which meant the level design focused on the unique aspect of the stage and then moved on. 

So even though I disagree with insanolord that World is disappointing, I will help with defending his position.

[Ian Sane]

never owned an SNES and I didn't know anyone who did so my first experience with the game was on the GBA.

The GBA version is not completely accurate and such I think it could provide a lesser first impression than the SNES version.  On the GBA the power-ups work like in Super Mario Bros 3 where if you have fire flower or cape and get hit you revert to Super Mario.  In the SNES original you revert to small Mario and if you have a power-up in the little item box at the top of the screen it will fall down.  But it is your responsibility to get it and sometimes you can't.  Meanwhile the GBA version also has the item box.  So you get an extra hit in a game that isn't really that difficult to begin with.  I think this could GREATLY affect one's enjoyment of the game, particularly since all the levels were designed under different assumptions and adding that extra hit messes with the balance of the game.

To really get a feel for a classic game I feel it's important to play it as it was originally designed.  Many developers, especially Nintendo, tinker with re-releases, usually to attract a more modern audience.

Regarding New Super Mario Bros. 2, after playing Warioland on the Wii I REALLY would like them to use sprites.  I REALLY don't like the 2.5D of New Super Mario Bros.  The game is still great but I just can't stand that look.  If they go with the same sort of retro design that NSMB had I think using Doki Doki Panic as the inspiration would be cool.  There is only one game that controls like that.  Why can't we have another?

Though I actually would prefer that they don't stick to the classics but go all out and make a completely original 2D Mario game.  Obviously the general gameplay should remain similar and have familiar enemies but they shouldn't feel the need to specifically pay homage to the older games.  Super Mario Bros 3 and Super Mario World just did their thing.  They still clearly felt like Mario but they just put whatever new enemies and new ideas they wanted in.  We weren't still sliding down the flagpole and entering a brick castle.  NSMB is a bit like Lost Levels were there is a lack of newness because they stick to the formula too closely.

[Spak-Spang]

Ian Sane:  I agree with the 2.5D, I hate the look and it actually keeps me from wanting to play New Super Mario Bros again and again.

I actually don't know if I can say I actually like New Super Mario Bros and partially it is because the art style sucks so much that there is no soul in the characters or levels.  But, I also feel the level design is not creative at all.  I feel like I am running through a bad Mario game knockoff, or perhaps a good Mario game knock off, but still not a REAL Mario game.  And that is a shame, because it is exactly what I wanted in a new Mario 2D game, yet not.

[NWR_insanolord]

Actually, I don't have much trouble with World 8, I've gotten through it without dying a bunch of times. And I realize that the GBA port of SMW isn't fully accuate, but I've played through it on the VC and I didn't like it any better that way.

[Mop it up]

I thought I was the only one who didn't like the "2.5D" look. It just looks so plain and generic compared to sprites. They probably used it because it is easier to do than sprites.

Mario vs. Donkey Kong uses pre-rendered graphics and it, too, has that bland, sterile look.

[Peachylala]

They could pull a ce-shading like Sonic Rush.

[IceCold]

Regarding SMW vs SMB3, my personal opinion is that Nintendo hit a level of perfection with SMB3 that has yet to be matched by any game since. When I played Super Mario World, it just felt bland in comparison. Still an amazing game, but not quite as good as SMB3.

[Spak-Spang]

IceCold:  I have always seen it differently. 

I thought Super Mario 3 was the most creative Mario game that pushed many great ideas, but was vastly limited by the limitations of the hardware.  Some levels were so short they were pointless. 

Super Mario World was when the design hit a close to perfection.  Everything just felt carefully balanced and well thought out.

Then Super Mario World 2 Yoshi's Island came out, and it seemed like not only was the design for each level creative it was also balanced.  Yoshi's Island was the first Mario game I felt had a scope greater than Mario 3.  I thought the story was personalized, but grand and the bosses were huge and inspired. 

But I realize talking about NSMB2, that if they use similar bland 3D models I don't want the game at all.  I can accept Cell shading techniques as long as Nintendo is putting their best artists on the case.

[Stratos]

I thought I was the only one who didn't like the "2.5D" look. It just looks so plain and generic compared to sprites. They probably used it because it is easier to do than sprites.

Mario vs. Donkey Kong uses pre-rendered graphics and it, too, has that bland, sterile look.

You are probably in the majority this time Mop it up (I know how you hate being part of a crowd ). I feel the 3D graphics of NSMB are uninspired. At least they didn't inspire me to finish the game. My friend got more fun out of it than I did. I do love the multiplayer.

Does anyone remember the multiplayer races through levels from Super Mario Brother DX on the GBC? That was rather fun as well.

[TJ Spyke]

I had no problem with the 3D look for NSMB. My only real problem was that the levels themselves are not that memorable. With SMB/SMB2/SM3/SMW/SMW2:YI I can remember specific levels and enjoy playing them again. NSMB's levels sorta blend together and aren't that memorable.

[Mop it up]

Does anyone remember the multiplayer races through levels from Super Mario Brother DX on the GBC? That was rather fun as well.

That was the best addition of that re-release. I never did get to try out New Super Mario Brothers' multiplayer though so I don't know how it compares.

[Stratos]

Does anyone remember the multiplayer races through levels from Super Mario Brother DX on the GBC? That was rather fun as well.

That was the best addition of that re-release. I never did get to try out New Super Mario Brothers' multiplayer though so I don't know how it compares.

Hopefully an eventual sequel will add Wi-Fi multiplayer support. It does have single-card play though so you just need another person nearby that has a DS.

[Mop it up]

It does have single-card play though so you just need another person nearby that has a DS.

I would also need to have a DS and the game myself.

[Stratos]

Do you really not have a DS? Sad day.

Do you want one or do you just not desire one right now?