Topic: Do you think lowering cost will attract more "mature" 3rd parties?

[Nyvlac]

Do you think by Nintendo lowering there royalty fees they will be able to attract more "mature" parties such as Rockstar Games, and others...

[Nyvlac]

bump

[bonestormer]

Not really. Well, maybe a little, but what Nintendo really needs to do is sell more GC's to increase its userbase. Right now PS2's huge userbase and Xbox's bigger userbase (then GC) are both more attractive even with these lower royalty fees (and are N's even lower then these now, or just close/same as them now?). THAT'S the bigger issue.

And until Nintendo can get people to think more then just Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon when then think Nintendo. It's not going to change any time soon. This is what Nintendo should be focused on. Image is everything....

[Mingesium]

read the rules. You can't bump topics especially after one minute.

Lowering the fees will attract any third parties. It doesn't matter if they make mature games or not.

[The Omen]

Well, the reason most 3rd parties dont release these 'mature' games on GC, is because of the perceived user base.  Its not really the fees, it's they think GC fans are mostly kids(incorrectly so).  So I would have to say no.

[WesDawg]

I think the best thing Nintendo could do would be to sell Cubes at $100 with a free game or two. Lowering costs to consumers seems to spark sales better than lowering developers costs, and the increase in user base would increase development.  Unfortunately, if they did, MS would just start giving away the XBox and we'd probably be in the same state we're in right now.

[BrianSLA]

Nope it isn't the royalty fee BUT it is the user base. The Cube isn't perceived as mature oriented and thus doesn't get the M titles.  

[StRaNgE]

Why are they thought of as kiddy when it seems the majority of users are older then 25?

I mean if you were 14 -15 or younger when NES came out you would be  over 30 or damn close to it by now.

[nolimit19]

that is a good question...i mean i know a lot of people with gamecubes and almost all are either in high school or beyond. i dont know any little kids with a cube(besides maybe 2)....but  i know almost 30 with a cube in the mid teens to early 20's. it really doesnt make any sense. i guess its the fact that nintendo makes games that are of a nature that is suitable for children, and are that "cool". i mean men have this testosterone thing that kills nintendo. i really dont get it. its quite barbaric.  call my system queer, but i could probably kick the crap out of 99 percent of those "hardcore" xbox owners, that think the cube is for kids. i think that the real problem is that nintendo themselves dont make games that kids cant play. i mean forget using blood and guts....everything they make is directly targeted towards kids. its one thing nto to make games like resident evil, but its another thing to not even make games like ff. not really controversial, but not directed towards kids. and another big thing thats wrong with the cube is that there are no rpgs. i really think that this is under rated. i think a lot of it is that square isnt with them, but beyond that there are about 5 rpgs for the gamecube. i know i have gotten off topic, but i think that in the end this could only help nintendo. hopefully there will be a bigger variety of games from this day forward.

[Grey Ninja]

I swear, the next person who says the word kiddy or mature in this context while in my presence gets a katana through the midsection.  I am about fed up with this stupidity.

http://www.penny-arcade.com/images/2001/20011214l.gif

[LMSx]

I think it would be more of a cumulative effect. It would be more attractive for minor third parties to bother to release a PS2 and/or Xbox title with the GC as well. The more who do it, the more attractive it is for Rockstar, Capcom, and Sega to support the GC thanks to a larger userbase because of those titles.

I wouldn't expect an immediate effect, though.  

[The Omen]

 

Quote
I swear, the next person who says the word kiddy or mature in this context while in my presence gets a katana through the midsection. I am about fed up with this stupidity.

Stupidity or not, thats how the ignorant see Nintendo.  most of us here know better, but some 15yr old kid in EB right now is being made fun of if he buys a GC.  I personally bel;ieve the Nintendo user base has the 25 and over crowd(like me) covered, but it's the 14-18 that they have a problem with.

[nolimit19]

exactly no matter what the truth is, a lot of people will see nintendo as just the kids console......which makes no sense. no kids can bear zelda or mario, or metroid......complete idiots. and i wanan see a kid take on mokey ball....not a chance.

[Arbok]

I actually think the biggest issue third parties have with the cube are current sales for third party games. Lets face it third party games just don't sell well on the Cube compared to Xbox and PS2. Heck I will admit that very few games in my GCN library are of third party titles, Nintendo's reputation of making great games is too hard to compeat with on the cube it may appear.

[thecubedcanuck]

I would be willing to bet that if you could get the ages of every single console owner (just not possible) that the Cube would have the lowest average user age.

I believe many third parties are aware of this, and therein lies the problem.

[egman]

I have to slighty disagree about the lowest average age userbase. I think if someone looked at this closely, you would see a swell for slightly younger gamers and another for slightly older one. Where the numbers skew, I'm not sure, but you can't deny that there are lot of older gamers who are very much attached to Nintendo. And it may be this realization that is part of the problem for Nintendo. They are trying as hard as they can to be console that everyone can play, but the real money seems to lie with the 13-17 who have pretty much swoon to the tune of the PS2 and the X-box. Like the movies these days, companies are trying to pack in the teens, who seem to have the most disposable income (or at least are the most like to blow away their extra money on entertainment). Unfortunately, family friendly or complicated/thought provoking material is something that immediately appeals to this age group.

Because of this, I don't think lowering fees will do much. Combine that with the fact the 3rd parties have to compete with Nintendo's titles while also trying sell to consumers who might have multiple consoles to begin with, and you just have a no win situation for nearly everyone except those 3rd parties who really can compete like Konami or Square. For Nintendo to attract the 3rd parties, they have to show that they can sell to the age group that developers are catering too. Whether that happens with their own GTA or someone like Konami or Capcom releases something that hits a nerve.

Personally I don't see much point in them trying to really duke it out with Sony and Microsoft if they can come up with a model where they can sell themselves as a niche. I think Nintendo has what it takes to make that happen, and I would rather have them do that than changing their image to the point that they are not Nintendo.  

[godwheel]

Hellalujah!

I think it will entice developers to make more games, not necessarily more mature titles. I think we will see drops in prices sooner etc

All good

[SoulPlayer]

I hope it increases 3rd party developers but I doubt it its all about the sales and until they increase then more 3rd parties won't come. Plus I know a lot of little kids with X-Boxs.  

[Perfect Cell]

This will help. Third Parties complain of costs on GCN, if the costs are lower, they have less to complain about... and it will make it more profitable for Third Parties... We just need to entice them even more.... if there are more "mature games" and more advertisments for the "mature" software then eventually the image will change. A good start would be making a "Mature" Nintendo Power with a Demo Disk each month, cause the more "kiddy" magazine helps enforce this idea that the GCN is for kids... to the common gamer of course...

[Ian Sane]

"and another big thing thats wrong with the cube is that there are no rpgs. i really think that this is under rated. i think a lot of it is that square isnt with them, but beyond that there are about 5 rpgs for the gamecube."

Good point but remember the Xbox has probably less RPGs and it sells better than the Gamecube in North America.  In Japan it's a different story of course but despite huge Final Fantasy and Pokemon sales, RPGs don't really sell that well in North America.

I think a big problem with third party support on the Gamecube is that a lot of third parties use some bizarre circular logic to determine whether or not their games will sell on Gamecube.  They don't think mature games will sell so they don't make any mature games and sure enough mature games don't sell on Gamecube because there aren't very many.  "Why are there not many mature games on the Gamecube?"  "Because they don't sell well."  "Why not?"  "Because there aren't very many mature games on the Gamecube."

Another attitude that a lot of third parties seem to have is that just because we own a Gamecube that for some reason we should be expected to buy all of their games regardless of how crappy they are.  A company will release a PS2 game that will sell pretty well and then they'll quickly port it to the Gamecube with all sorts of bugs and crappier graphics (despite the Gamecube having better graphic capabilities) and then, because it's a crappy port, the game doesn't sell well.  That third party then gets second thoughts about Gamecube suppport as if it's the Cube userbase's fault that the game didn't sell instead of themselves who released the game full of bugs.  It's like in their mind the game industry revolves around conning gamers into buying crap instead of selling games based on quality.  Nintendo gamers are used to Nintendo's standard of quality and therefore are less easily "fooled" into buying crap.

The userbase plays a big part too of course but a big reason that the userbase is smaller is because of less third party games being released because of the ideas mentionned above.

[rpglover]

Quote
Originally posted by: thecubedcanuck
I would be willing to bet that if you could get the ages of every single console owner (just not possible) that the Cube would have the lowest average user age.

I believe many third parties are aware of this, and therein lies the problem.

although i know a lot of people over 25 with a gamecube, i have to agree with you here
the problem is not just the royalties (which dropping them could help), its the user base of the console
i do not think the gc is kiddy, but the average user for the gamecube is probably the youngest of all
most parents when they look at consoles to get for their children go for the ones that have the largest supply of games for younger kids
and gamecube has that- 3rd party games on the gamecube have not sold very well (except for maybe capcom, sega, ea, factor 5)
and that comes in part that most people have a ps2 and buy those other titles for it than the gc
lowering the royalties will not be enough- you must establish a user base before you can sell the games- and the royalties and marketing of the gamecube and other products will be very intregal to the success of nintendo and 3rd parties if nintendo would start doing that  

[Nyvlac]

sorry for the "bump" then...anyway, i agree with bonestormer...Nintendo needs to widen it's userbase of games...they are really starting to, but it's a little bit too late, beacuse alot of people already know Nintendo for being more toward a younger audience...(i hate the "kid" thing)...either way, if Nintendo would just advertise more (which they are starting to now)...and accept more mature titles then i think that more peeps would choose Nintendo....

As for the lowering of cost...i don't know....but no doubt developers will take the offer up in mind...after all less money to get more money is always good right?

[WhoDey]

I don't think high costs to third parties is the real issue here. The problem is that most 3rd party games just don't sell well on the GC, atleast compared to X-Box and PS2. It comes down to 3rd parties having to decide if selling  20,000 copies of their game on the GC will make them any money or are they just wasting it having to take the time to port it over. If I was a 3rd party developer I'd put my games on PS2 first simply because of the large user base. I'd go to X-Box second because chances are it would sell better on this system than the GC. And GC would be last for me...speaking from a potential profit standpoint.

So why don't 3rd party games sell well on the GC? I'd say the biggest reason is Nintendo themselves. Their games are usually better than what a 3rd party developer will come up with. People that bought the GC did so because of Nintendo's franchises. That's what they buy. I'm not sure if age is as big a factor as many will have you believe. Personally, I'm 30 yrs old and only own a GC. I'll usually buy 10-12 games a year. Of those games, you can bet that 5 or 6 will be from Nintendo because that's what I bought the GC for. The remaining 4 or 5 will go to third party games. I'm guessing that most people don't buy that many games a year. And when you only buy 3 or 4 games a year, Zelda, Mario and Pokemon will be bought while Resident Evil, Skies of Arcadia, and Madden sit on the shelves. Thus 3rd parties don't sell well. On the PS2 and X-Box, the 3rd parties biggest competitor (Nintendo) has already been eliminated. It's a catch-22 for Nintendo.

[Ninja X]

Quote
Originally posted by: WesDawg
I think the best thing Nintendo could do would be to sell Cubes at $100 with a free game or two. Lowering costs to consumers seems to spark sales better than lowering developers costs, and the increase in user base would increase development.  Unfortunately, if they did, MS would just start giving away the XBox and we'd probably be in the same state we're in right now.

Nintendo needs money, especially since theiy profit expectations took a dive yet again.  Microsoft is marketing the Xbox at $200 and still losing money because it is underpriced.  

[Ninja X]

Lowering costs will attract third-parties, but we probably won't see much of an increase in mature games.  That's my guess.

As for the average user base, even if the GCN has 18 - 25 year olds as its average age group, remember, only 6 million GCNs are sold globally.  Compare that to the massive amount of PS2s sold, and you can see why some developers choose PS2 to put their major games on.  Also, Nintendo's games are what really sells on the Cube.  Most people who buy a Cube probably have either a Mario, Zelda, or Metroid in their collection.  Third parties try, but get shot down compared to Nintendo's games.  Look at NBA Street, RE, Smuggler's Run, etc...they're all good port (especially the remake of RE), but most people would save their money for a Nintendo game.