Topic: So...the Dark Knight?

[BranDonk Kong]

Seriously when the Joker is on screen, you (at least I didn't) don't ever think - that's Heath Ledger with some makeup under there, you think - that's the fucking Joker playing himself in a movie.

[Khushrenada]

Wow. Amazing. I couldn't wait to find out what Two-Face was going to look like in this film and it didn't disappoint. Awesome and terrifying. My friend's sister couldn't look at his face for the rest of the movie. Everytime he came on screen after, she'd look away. Although I need to see the movie again. I'm a bit confused as to whether Two-Face died or not. I didn't think he did at first but now I'm thinking he did.

As for villians in the next movie, I would like to see Catwoman and or the Riddler. The could fit well in this Batman universe. Catwoman is a villainess that confuses Batman's loyalties. Sometimes she's good, sometimes she's a thief.

The Riddler is best to view him as a man with an ego. He want's to flaunt his intellectual superiority. That's the way I've always viewed the reason he leaves clues behind in his crimes. He's so certain that he can outsmart everyone, he even leaves hints behind to help people because he's sure he can still beat them by giving them a handicap.

Recently in the comics, The Riddler has gone straight and become a rival detective of Batman's. He gets more joy out of solving a crime before Batman can figure it out. That goes back to my belief about him wanting to show off his intellectual superiority. A person like that could work in this "realistic" Batman world. A movie about elitism. I like it.

As for the Mad Hatter, I always thought Martin Short would make the best role for that but I think it would be more suited for a Tim Burton type Batman. Martin Short's smile just seems right for the Mad Hatter and even his short stature and antics seem right for the character. The question is, how do you make the Mad Hatter work in this Batman universe? His crimes are based around hats? He has mind control devices? What is his purpose?

The Ventriloquist could work in the Batman movies because the way I see The Ventriloquist is a man who is too shy or timid to do things on his own, so he's created this character to hide behind, that being the Scarface dummy. Scarface is how he releases everything bottled up inside him. Sort of like an imaginary friend in a way. That's why, when Scarface often gets destroyed, he acts like it's a real person who killed. He's lost that way of avenue of releasing his emotions.

[Maverick]

Just saw it tonight. WOW what a great movie. Easily the best "super hero movie" I've ever seen.

One question though:

Where the hell is the Gotham city I saw in the first movie? It didn't even feel like the same place to me. And why is Wayne Tower now super bland instead of the "unofficial center of Gotham city"? Did anyone else feel this way?

[ThePerm]

the last two movies were in Chicago

i get sort of a dirty harry vibe out of nolan's movies

as for riddler..i was thinking...I watched the last 2 seasons of dexter religiously, and the ice truck killer was one who left little clues as to who he was, i imagine riddler as leaving dead bodies all around with little clues, little does batman know he works for wayne enterprises.

for mad hatter Wayne is dating some girl hatter is obsessed with, he becomes a stalker but bruce abuses his batman power and hatter figures it out, batman is captured, and sent down the rabit hole, some psychotic set of traps wityh an alice and wonderland theme, and now that iv mentioned it..it will never happen

[ShyGuy]

Some people are speculating we had the Riddler in this movie. Or at least the character pre-Riddler.

[Smash_Brother]

Movie was awesome. I've heard they never intend to bring Robin into it, though.

Also, I don't think hatter and the ventriloquist could work because they're a bit too hard to swallow. The hatter has a better chance, but the moviegoing audience can only be asked to suspend so much disbelief and I think that would kick in once they saw goons taking orders from a dummy. I think that would be the point where the franchise nukes the fridge, as it were.

This has already happened to the X-men movie series, as in the killing off of characters just doesn't work in movies like it can work in comic books. Once death becomes inconsequential, the audience can't fear for the hero and the movie loses them.

[Maverick]

They're never going to bring Robin in?  I was kind of looking forward to them doing the whole sidekick thing right. 

[NWR_pap64]

They're never going to bring Robin in?  I was kind of looking forward to them doing the whole sidekick thing right. 

In a way, it makes sense.

To me, Nolan's Batman movies are more about Batman than it is about the other characters.

Batman Begins was pretty much a psychological view of the comic book character. As in, why, how, and when did he become the caped crusader.

I haven't seen Dark Knight yet, but I take it the film will heavily focus on Batman's actions, how the Joker affects his hero persona and such.

Bring Robin into the mix would probably take away from that, especially since Batman is viewed as a solo hero.

Not to mention that Robin has never been seen as seriously as he should. Pardon my ignorance, but it seems that whenever Robin is introduced people don't take him seriously.

Even in Teen Titans, where he is the LEADER, the writers just can't help but bug him around.

So maybe they fear that adding Robin would take away the edge off of Batman.

[ThePerm]

Some people are speculating we had the Riddler in this movie. Or at least the character pre-Riddler.

oh yeah Mr. Reese, the man who knows Bruce Wayne's identity

Will Mr. Reese reveal Batman's true identity?, will he go by his other alias Edward Nygma?, Will Reese get laid off due to company wide layoff's and not be able to find a job and fuel his hate for wayne/batman? Find out same bat time, same bat channel.

[Maverick]

Bring Robin into the mix would probably take away from that, especially since Batman is viewed as a solo hero.

Not to mention that Robin has never been seen as seriously as he should. Pardon my ignorance, but it seems that whenever Robin is introduced people don't take him seriously.

Even in Teen Titans, where he is the LEADER, the writers just can't help but bug him around.

So maybe they fear that adding Robin would take away the edge off of Batman.

I think there's a lot of potential there for the "adopted son" version of Robin in Nolan's universe.  They just have not make him "comic relief" and treat him as a serious character.  I never despised Robin, just thought he was always too much of a goof ball.  It would be nice to see him treated as a serious character.  (And by "serious character", I don't mean a bunch of annoying teen angst or something like that.)

[ThePerm]

i dont see how robin would work at all. This series is supposed to be realistic, Realism with a capital R. First imagine if you were a vigilante would you even think to adopt someone? Seriously, your a super risk case, why would you adopt someone? Second if you were a vigilante would you let some kid tag along? Why would you put them at risk. Bruce Wayne is crazy, but i don't think he would be that crazy untill he's in his late 40s.

both Nolan and Bale said they'd jet if they had to put Robin in. Seriously? I could see Joker having some kid sidekick, but he's a douche-bag and would want the kid to get hurt.

[ShyGuy]

I don't know if a Robin would work, but I could see the Dick Grayson origin story working. Batman adopts an 11 year old Dick after the circus murder, and then trains him to get vengeance on Zucco, sans costume. Make the story more of a one shot like they did with Two-face rather than make him a recurring character.

[Maverick]

both Nolan and Bale said they'd jet if they had to put Robin in.

That sucks.

I could see Joker having some kid sidekick, but he's a douche-bag and would want the kid to get hurt.

I would be far more interested in Harley Quinn myself.  That is definitely something I would like to see adapted to film.

[Mashiro]

Saw the movie last night . . .

it wasn't "The Best movie EVER" as some of my co-workers had described it, but it was good.

Ledger was, for lack of a better word, phenomenal. In fact, he was the movie. It makes me wish there was just a movie about the Joker, he was that damned good. Probably one of the best villains in a movie I have ever seen. Truly brilliant.

Things I didn't like:

- Batman's voice
- It didn't feel much like Gothan City to me
- Lack of any sort of *get ready for this in the next movie* scenes. The tank-bat-car thing was destroyed and I was so hoping for some sort of hints at future batmobile designs throughout the film. Also, no build up for the next villain.
- It felt a bit lengthy

Also, in terms of the films next villain, my friend pointed out a very subtle statement made in the movie. When Batman gets his new suit and is hearing about it's trade off of mobility for less protection, he asks if it can stand up to dogs, to which Fox says something about small dogs and maybe cats. I didn't even think of Catwoman but the whole cats line would make some sense. Just a thought.

[EasyCure]

i didnt think of it that way... but i dont think its a hint at anything. he was attacked by dogs prior to that scene remember? i think it was more of a joking reference to him actually being vulnerable to stupd dogs yet invincible to hordes of goons.

could be wrong though

[ShyGuy]

Well if you look at Begins in hindsight you can see several things were setup for this film.

- The D.A. got murdered leaving a space for Harvey Dent to be elected.
- Scarecrow was still on the loose
- The Joker leaves a calling card
- Rachel rejects Bruce leaving room for the Bruce/Rachel/Harvey love triangle in TDK

I think they setup several things very well for the next movie.

- Batman is now an outlaw
- They need a new Batmobile, probably more traditional in appearance.
- The Riddler is coming and I would bet money that...
- He's going to discover that Two Face has been hid away in Arkham.

[EasyCure]

Well if you look at Begins in hindsight you can see several things were setup for this film.

- The D.A. got murdered leaving a space for Harvey Dent to be elected.
- Scarecrow was still on the loose
- The Joker leaves a calling card
- Rachel rejects Bruce leaving room for the Bruce/Rachel/Harvey love triangle in TDK

I think they setup several things very well for the next movie.

- Batman is now an outlaw
- They need a new Batmobile, probably more traditional in appearance.
- The Riddler is coming and I would bet money that...
- He's going to discover that Two Face has been hid away in Arkham.

i'm not saying you're wrong or anything... i just dont want to see another batman movie with The Riddler and Two-face as villians again, atleast not in the same movie. Also a new batmobile could be not only more traditional in appearance to the batmobile.. but a more traditional looking vehicle period. Since everyone will be out to get batman now that they think he's murdered a few people, driving another tank like vehicle (even at night) isn't very low profile. Maybe it'll be a modded lamborgini or something that has hints of a more classic batmobile design? just throwing ideas out there.

[UncleBob]

I could see Robin working in the story - if done right.

Think of a story where a young Dick sees his parents murdered.  Years later, around 16 or so, he takes to the streets to find their killer.  Eventually, his activity attracts the Batman who tries to scare/force him from vigilante justice, but Dick won't be stop.  Eventually, Batman realizes that, eventually, Dick is going to get himself killed unless he gets some training, and thus takes Dick under his bat-wing.  It's still close enough to be the story of "Batman", but almost-realistic enough to work.

Basically, Batman doesn't *want* Robin, but doesn't have much of a choice.

But, yeah, I'd prefer to keep Robin out for awhile.

[ShyGuy]

I don't think Two Face will completely be a villian in the next movie. He will come forward to clear Bruce's name.

[ThePerm]

Harvey wasn't breathing, they had a funeral. I don't think he's coming back. As good as this movie was (phenomenol), i almost would say i'd almost prefer they just leave the series be. What more is there to accomplish other than a fat paycheck? Like spiderman 2, i think the series can almost go downhill from here.

[ShyGuy]

I would be content if there was no third film. I need to see this one again in Imax.

[nickmitch]

I could see Robin working in the story - if done right.

Think of a story where a young Dick sees his parents murdered.  Years later, around 16 or so, he takes to the streets to find their killer.  Eventually, his activity attracts the Batman who tries to scare/force him from vigilante justice, but Dick won't be stop.  Eventually, Batman realizes that, eventually, Dick is going to get himself killed unless he gets some training, and thus takes Dick under his bat-wing.  It's still close enough to be the story of "Batman", but almost-realistic enough to work.

Basically, Batman doesn't *want* Robin, but doesn't have much of a choice.

But, yeah, I'd prefer to keep Robin out for awhile.

Isn't that what happened with Tim in TAS?
Side note; if Ledger hadn't died, the Jason Todd story could've been neat.

[UncleBob]

Isn't that what happened with Tim in TAS?
Side note; if Ledger hadn't died, the Jason Todd story could've been neat.

Dunno... never got to see those episodes...

[ThePerm]

i'd ake robin only if they used Christian Bale from  Empire of the Sun they can't so no Robin

[Smash_Brother]

Remember that Raz Al' Ghol (spelling) is far from dead...