Topic: Metroid Series Continuation

[KDR_11k]

Didn't SM have less handholding?

Yeah but it went down later on in ZM anyway, what annoyed me were things like the "Unknown Item" stuff and the placement of the powerbombs (that have zero use besides backtracking).

[Adrock]

I meant more that they left Samus heavily mutated at the end and unable to use powerups other than by absorbing an annoying and now extinct type of enemy. That's the problem with continuity.

That's not the impression I got. She can absorb the X due to the whole Metroid vaccine thing, but it's not like she can't use other powerups. Absorbing the X nucleus at the end of Fusion basically canceled out her weakness to cold. It changed the rules. The Space Pirates are gone (possibly), the Metroids are back, there's corruption in the Galactic Federation and Samus has all of the Metroid's strengths and none of their weaknesses. Can she steal the vitality from other living creatures? Samus' mutation seemed to only affect her on a genetic level. She looks physically normal sans Power Suit in the good/best endings of Metroid Fusion. IN any case, there are plenty of things they can explore in Metroid 5.

[KDR_11k]

No matter what route they take I hope it doesn't involve story or stealth, the two things that have been hurting Metroid lately.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

No matter what route they take I hope it doesn't involve story or stealth, the two things that have been hurting Metroid lately.

QUOTE.

[Stogi]

A 2D/3D Metroid could work if they made it similar to DKJB but have Samus just a little bit bigger. She could explore huge lush environments filled with enemies, platforms, gorgeous back drops and giant pedestrian fauna/flora.

As for the story, she is sent to retrieve a very precious super natural type of animal (not Metroids). There are many of them; all of them different, with different abilities. She'd have to track them, find out their weaknesses and trap them, all the while unlocking secrets in the world that will help her progress. She'd start out with all of her abilities (missile/super missile, ice/wave/plasma, bombs, screw attack, spider ball, grapple) but they'd change drastically as she unlocked secrets and traps these creatures. After their capture, they bestow onto her super natural powers, like the ability to miraculously grow thick vegetation, the abilty to project light, and the ability to tame creatures that inhabit the earth. The further she explores and the more creatures she captures, the more powerful she becomes; yet something strange happens. The world becomes more dull; the animals more angry; the sky more dark.....She is killing this world, one by one.

[EasyCure]

A 2D/3D Metroid could work if they made it similar to DKJB but have Samus just a little bit bigger. She could explore huge lush environments filled with enemies, platforms, gorgeous back drops and giant pedestrian fauna/flora.

As for the story, she is sent to retrieve a very precious super natural type of animal (not Metroids). There are many of them; all of them different, with different abilities. She'd have to track them, find out their weaknesses and trap them, all the while unlocking secrets in the world that will help her progress. She'd start out with all of her abilities (missile/super missile, ice/wave/plasma, bombs, screw attack, spider ball, grapple) but they'd change drastically as she unlocked secrets and traps these creatures. After their capture, they bestow onto her super natural powers, like the ability to miraculously grow thick vegetation, the abilty to project light, and the ability to tame creatures that inhabit the earth. The further she explores and the more creatures she captures, the more powerful she becomes; yet something strange happens. The world becomes more dull; the animals more angry; the sky more dark.....She is killing this world, one by one.

I pictured Link and it sounded awesome for a Zelda game.

[Stogi]

2D Zelda? Really?

[EasyCure]

yeah, why not? Zelda II wasnt that bad IMO and this nature setting seems to fit more with the Zelda universe than the Metroid one (although what they did in Metroid Prime with the Chozo and Talon IV was pretty awesome..).

[Stogi]

For one, I don't think the fans would allow for such a change. Not because it's so drastic, but because Zelda II is regarded as the worst of the series. And secondly, I honestly believe that Samus would fit in quite well in a world filled with unimaginable creatures and habitats. While Link requires some form of human interaction, Samus does not. And that is what makes her the perfect vehicle for pure exploration.

Now, while a 3D FP Samus would put a lot of sheer awe into the game, 2D Samus has a certain charm that is hard to replicate. Plus, when it comes to platforming, Metroid ranks up there with some of the best and that's something Zelda can never overcome.

[EasyCure]

For one, I don't think the fans would allow for such a change. Not because it's so drastic, but because Zelda II is regarded as the worst of the series. And secondly, I honestly believe that Samus would fit in quite well in a world filled with unimaginable creatures and habitats. While Link requires some form of human interaction, Samus does not. And that is what makes her the perfect vehicle for pure exploration.

Now, while a 3D FP Samus would put a lot of sheer awe into the game, 2D Samus has a certain charm that is hard to replicate. Plus, when it comes to platforming, Metroid ranks up there with some of the best and that's something Zelda can never overcome.

Oh i completely agree with you, and wasn't ragging on your idea. I was merely saying I can picture Link in a natural setting with greens and wildlife moreso than I can Samus.

Oh and "the fans" can go screw themselves because they're the ones (alot of them anyway) that ragged on WW's graphics for not being like OoT and then ragged on Twilight Princess for not being like WW

[Adrock]

No matter what route they take I hope it doesn't involve story or stealth, the two things that have been hurting Metroid lately.

No stealth, but I disagree that story has been hurting the series. Nintendo needs better writers or at least, they need to care more about plot. A good story can only enhance the experience. The Metroid Prime series started fairly strong, but by the end of Corruption, I couldn't take it anymore.

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Metroid Prime started "strongly" cuz there were hardly anything there.

A conveniently made-up in-between story that could fit almost anywhere in the chronology that consisted of:

1.  whut R space pirates up 2?
2.  goto Planet and scan everything, learn about 1) Pirates 2) Samus 3) Chozo 4) Metroids (basically existing junk from the previous games) and 5) the Planet
3.  DESTROY PLANET.

Practically nothing happens until "samus happens."  But I guess the minimalist approach is best for Metroid in an era where  game journalists shout for voice acting in Zelda.

[EasyCure]

i actually liked Prime (1) the most out of the trio becuase of its complete lack of story (when you ignore the Lore you scan). It was awesome being thrown into this foreign place and not knowing whats around every corner. The first time i played the game (borrowed from a friend) i scanned and read everything, but the second time i played thru it (bought my own copy cuz it was a great game and deserved re-play) i scanned everything, sure, but I didn't bother reading any of it becuase it was just more fun that way at the time.

Prime 3's story i felt took away from the game. I didn't feel like i was exploring for the sake of exploring, it was more like i was exploring enough to further the story and access the next area.

[King of Twitch]

Destroy.. Tallon 4? w t f

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Samus broke the planet, remember?

[King of Twitch]

all i remember is the shrine being destroyed

[KDR_11k]

The story is hurting Metroid by making it more linear and adding artificial barriers to progress that aren't dictated by Samus's abilities. I don't mean the scanner stories, those are fine (though by Prime 3 I didn't read any of them, just scanned them for the percentage and ignored them), the problem is with secondary characters and their development. Fusion and Prime 3 had the most story and also did a lot of story-based restricting.

A 2D/3D Metroid could work if they made it similar to DKJB but have Samus just a little bit bigger. She could explore huge lush environments filled with enemies, platforms, gorgeous back drops and giant pedestrian fauna/flora.

As for the story, she is sent to retrieve a very precious super natural type of animal (not Metroids). There are many of them; all of them different, with different abilities. She'd have to track them, find out their weaknesses and trap them, all the while unlocking secrets in the world that will help her progress. She'd start out with all of her abilities (missile/super missile, ice/wave/plasma, bombs, screw attack, spider ball, grapple) but they'd change drastically as she unlocked secrets and traps these creatures. After their capture, they bestow onto her super natural powers, like the ability to miraculously grow thick vegetation, the abilty to project light, and the ability to tame creatures that inhabit the earth. The further she explores and the more creatures she captures, the more powerful she becomes; yet something strange happens. The world becomes more dull; the animals more angry; the sky more dark.....She is killing this world, one by one.

I was trying to figure out which game you were parodying but I wasn't exactly keeping track of all those capture-them-all games... For perfection the game should start out at 320x240 and slowly increase to 1080p as the world gets more brown. Also bloom has to start out disabled and slowly increase to TP levels .

[Stogi]

I know it's not the most clever of stories, but I still think it's interesting. Plus Samus could be, ya know, an actual hunter.

[Ian Sane]

You guys avoid reading the scans?  I'm a total sucker for that kind of stuff!  While playing the first Metroid Prime I felt like some archaelogist exploring ancient ruins that hadn't been seen by human eyes for thousands of years.  It sometimes was annoying when I had to fight enemies.  Damn it Space Pirates!  F*ck off, I want to explore!  I even thought of the idea of some sort of "discovery game" where the gameplay is almost entirely about exploring a strange world without any real action involved (aside from encounters with hostile animals).  It's like you make a fictional world and let the player explore it.  Though I might be the only person in the world that would find something like that interesting.

I agree about no stealth.  Not just for Metroid but for any game that isn't specifically a stealth game.  It's not so much stealth itself that is annoying.  It's the abrupt changeover to that type of gameplay.  You spend the whole time being able to shoot the crap out of anything you encounter and then suddenly you can't be seen?  Screw that.  The real rule is don't spend an entire game training the player for one type of gameplay and then suddenly make it a requirement for them to master another for one part.

I'm open to the idea of another Zelda in the style of Zelda II.  I think the side scrolling perspective had potential, it was just hurt by a few design choices and the limitations of the NES.  To me my biggest problem with the game was the same thing I hate about the first Zelda: your sword has NO RANGE.  All you do is these little pokes.  You have to practically walk into the enemy to hurt it.  And of course many of the enemies don't have such a limited range and most of them just have to touch you to hurt you.  It's typical NES game bullsh!t that was common at the time.  Take that out and the game would be much better.  My only suggestion would be to have the towns top view.

[Stogi]

That actually what makes Metroid fun for me. It's not the hostiles, it's the exploring that keeps me coming back. It's the feeling "Wow, I haven't been here before" that makes the game worthy of my money.

[Chozo Ghost]

I honestly don't know if Nintendo has anyone who has what it takes to do another Metroid.

For shame, Kairon. For shame. Retro studios didn't even make a game before Prime (though they tried).

Metroid Prime was... well... I like to think of Prime as a significant collaboration between NCL and Retro, with NCL making some major design choices that molded the Prime series into what it became. I almost want to call the Prime series a re-imagining of Metroid for the 3D age, but NOT actually essentially Metroid. Also, I can't think of anyone who's actually responsible for carrying the torch for the Metroid vision.

I agree with this. Metroid started out as a 2D game where you could actually see your character on the screen, but now its just the opposite. While I personally think 3D is fine, I don't particularly care for the FPS genre. Call me old fashioned, but I actually like to see my characters on the screen (especially when its almost-naked Samus!).

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

Zelda2 is just the forerunner to Symphony of the Night.  A lot of good that did the world.

I want to see Samus go on an actual contract hunt (that leads to bigger issues, of course).  And not in the Fox VS. Wolf furry angst sort of way.

[KDR_11k]

I read the scans in the first Prime but couldn't be arsed to in the third (maybe because it didn't show them by default and I kept procratinating on that until I already finished the game with 100% items when I felt like there was no point in ever playing the game again).

If you want a discovery game without fighting get Endless Ocean. Oh, wait, it got branded as a nongame for not having fighting, silly me.

[Ian Sane]

If you want a discovery game without fighting get Endless Ocean. Oh, wait, it got branded as a nongame for not having fighting, silly me.

Well I didn't say the discovery game idea I had wouldn't have puzzles or challenge or even some danger.  There's still an objective - discover the mystery of the strange world you're in.  I think such a game would certainly have some non-gamer appeal but, if I was designing it anyway, it wouldn't strive specifically to achieve that.  I'd like to be put in a fictional world where I don't have specific bad guys, but that doesn't mean there isn't some problem or that you can't fail.  I love exploring in games like Zelda, Metroid and Pikmin and I wonder what it would be like to make that exploration the clear focus.

I think one big difference is Endless Ocean is about the real world.  I think a fantasy world makes the idea much more interesting.

Hey, if I could design a non-game that doesn't feel at all like a non-game to a core gamers then that would be great and something like this might work.  But if I was designing it I would want it to have a very detailed world that would be a little bit intimidating when you first start playing.  I would not retrict things intentionally because it might scare off grandma.  It would be "here's my discovery game, if you non-gamers like it that's great and if you don't I don't care."

[King of Twitch]

Some form of Myst for a new generation?