Author Topic: Move forward nintendo!  (Read 5057 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline PugGTI

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
Move forward nintendo!
« on: June 08, 2004, 05:17:07 AM »
There are many issues in which Nintendo really needs to look at and improve on looking at the previuous generation, current generation and nintendo revolution.

Obvious areas include

a) Connectivity

- They can't ignore it forever
- Nothing. Hopefully they're just waiting to implement it free?

b) Second party developers and exclusivity

- Rare, Silicon Knights and Factor 5....They were all supposed to be the saving grace for gamecube. Now they are gone with no replacement
- Aren't we sick and tired of sequel after sequel? Some franchises are great yes, but can't we see some new stuff?
- There is little variety in the first party lineup
- Throw some cash at some real talent and let them grow, just like retro...

c) Extra features

- How many people do you know bought a PS2 or Xbox for DVD? Honestly.
- The next gameboy and Nrevoltion have to be alot more interlinked
- A bigger storage medium or rewritable media
- What's better than more stuff? + bragging rights

d) Audience

- Believe it or not nintendo, all ages does not mean "kiddy"
- I can't get all the games i want on the gamecube

e) Controller

- The gamecube had the best Nintendo controller yet, but it still needs more



To me GC was just too simple, nothing special. You can't say that this means it was just a "games machine" to make up for its downfalls. Gamers aren't that simple 'n' stoopid!
There is so much more to say but i really CBF'd right now
I wanna know what you guys think!  
Reggie is a sad, mentally challenged man...

Offline ghostVi

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2004, 10:57:39 AM »
Give me games And the prospects are only getting better for the GameCube IMHO in this regard...

Oh, and you'll have to give Nintendo a proper credit for the best _ever_ first party controller - the wavebird So that should rule out "e)", probably.

Offline darknight06

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2004, 05:01:57 PM »
Let's break this down...
A.  Nintendo has NEVER ignored online gaming.  The last three consoles have actually had it in some form.  It's just never took off for various reason, profitability being only one of them.  Personally, the way I see it.  If it's not free or at least 90% lag free, I see no reason to screw with it.  And before anyone goes screaming that they want to see someting like SSBM online, think of this.  When Capcom ported over Marvel vs. Capcom 2 for the X-Box, they completely scrapped the live support! Why, cuz it didn't run good enough and still wouldn't.
B. That's a load of crap.  Save for SK,  there's nothing Factor 5 and Rare could do that Retro couldn't do 10x better.  Besides, look at Rare now.  Do you really think they'd have been that beneficial.  Especially after pretty much bombing with SFA.
    I have absolutely no problem with their current lineup.  IMO they're some of the best games they've released yet.
C.  Yeah, lets give the thing a DVD drive, or heaver forbid, a rewritable drive so people can just pirate the games to death.  Remember, this is Nintendo we're talking about here not Sony or Microsoft.  Even though they do make their own games as well, the potential for widespread piracy of a big name title of N's would probably set them back farther than it ever would've have with the other two.
    No comments on the second point for now.
    You know, this wouldn't even be so much of a problem if almost every developer wasn't trying to fit an entire DVD movie's worth of largely pointeless FMV on the disk.  And can somebody please tell me what the heck is wrong with using more than one disk all of a sudden?  
    Why in the world would I ever need to brag about having a console of all things.  You're not gonna be any cooler with a PS2 or X-Box.
D.  Last I checked there were plenty of "mature" titles on the cube.  Oh, and no Nintendo game will never be "kiddy", just plain fun for those without insecurities.
     Well, then go get one of the other consoles then.  Most people do have at least 2 of them these days.
E.  What do you want, 20 buttons on the pad? Sheesh.

 

Offline PugGTI

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #3 on: June 09, 2004, 12:02:11 AM »
Thanks for your "opinion", dude... Why don't you just stick a skewer through me and chuck me on the barbie?I think maybe you are the insecure one I'm only speaking about how i see things at the moment, why don't you go ask some frien... oh, sorry dude I never meant to discredit anyone, these were only a few insights not fully discussed for others to share their own opinions upon. Your own ideas are also largely unfounded....

Anyway...

Your first comment is pretty much on the money however, nintendo may go nowhere fast if they don't see that online connectivity is with us when N.rev is released.

Secondly, you can't be serious on this matter.
"That's a load of crap. Save for SK, there's nothing Factor 5 and Rare could do that Retro couldn't do 10x better."
How do you know? They only released one game, which they almost cocked up completely. One game in 3 years of existing with the backing of Nintendo? Don't kid yourself. How can Retro be expected to release more than one title a year? I know they're new and all, no hongon they're made up of some really wicked talent! Rare didn't bomb out with starfox either, it wasn't the best game but is was a solid title it would've been much better if it wasn't starfox.
What happens if i want to play a decent GT game? What about a decent fighter?

Third. I never mentioned anything like what your talking about. How about say 50mb of flash memory? They could stick with 8cm optical, doesn't have to be 1.8 gig though.
Piracy, jeez settle petal! You might just wet yourself. Nintendo games are still pirated, its just a little harder.
"You know, this wouldn't even be so much of a problem if almost every developer wasn't trying to fit an entire DVD movie's worth of largely pointeless FMV on the disk. And can somebody please tell me what the heck is wrong with using more than one disk all of a sudden? " <<<--- hahaha, like you should say what ppl want! Whats wrong with some "pointless FMV", anyways nex gen could see this form redundant.
The bragging was a bit of a joke, see mr. smiley face there?

Again, yes there are some mature games and you are the insecure one Mr. not-so-bright-night sir! I never said the games weren't fun. My second point really relates to how small your cock is, and how I wouldn't mind just buying ONE console instead of forking out money for two. Yes I do have two consoles, but I'd just love for everything to be with the one console? A cool GT race another race, a fighter, a flight sim, actiuon, rpgs? Or am just asking too much?

20 buttons? Oh my god, mate. Maybe another z button and some cool innovation that nintendo can be trusted with, you are a drama queen!

Thankyou

Reggie is a sad, mentally challenged man...

Offline S-U-P-E-R

  • My Butt is Ready :reggie;
  • Score: -63
    • View Profile
    • oh my god
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2004, 12:23:09 AM »
Quote

When Capcom ported over Marvel vs. Capcom 2 for the X-Box, they completely scrapped the live support! Why, cuz it didn't run good enough and still wouldn't.

More like their Marvel license was expiring and they had to get it out right away or not at all

All the drama in this thread are belong to me

Offline darknight06

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2004, 08:47:12 AM »
But the live support was still being worked on.  Even if that was the case, I still can't see a game like that working on Live or anyone current connections.   Most people I've talked to already say CvS2EO live is either hit or miss, and that's a lot less complicated of a game (not strategically speaking) than MvC2 is.  

Offline skyfire

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #6 on: June 10, 2004, 01:28:18 PM »
You make some good points PugGTI but there are few things I would like to add on and clarify on others.

A) I think Connectivity has been getting a bad rap. Not saying the arguments against it are not legitiment reasons but the fact there hasn't been much incentive to use a $100+/- controller (GBAsp). Now FF:CC and TLoZ:FSA do make excellent use of it, but two games (no matter how fantastic, I have both) isn't going to be enough to sway popular opinion. IMO, I think there is a future for connectivity just not by itself. I don't want to sound like another 'Nintendo needs online' guy but I can see many gaming possibilities with the combination of connectivity and online gaming together!

B) Here is where you made your mistake. First, The only dev out of those 3 that you mentioned that is gone is Rare as they were bought out by Microsoft. Silicon Knights and Factor 5 can and probubly will make games for Nintendo. You mistook the announcement when you heard SK and F5 are leaving. I don't know what Sk is up to but I assume they are doing the same thing that F5 is doing and that is working on Next gen software since there isn't much time left in this gen to do much of anything that would stand out in the already big crowd.

Also, out of those 3 (heck any GC dev) Factor 5 has pushed the GC WAY BEYOND it's spec's and even the all mighty xbox's which has not been able to beat Rogue squadron 3's specs, or more exactly, no other developer has been able to match it thus far, so when it comes to talent I got to give a tip of my hat to them and not Retro but that doesn't mean Retro isn't good in there own right, I mean they did take a 2-d adventure game and bring it into 3-d without losing that games classic adventure 'feel' (I'am ofcourse referring to Metroid Prime) afterall.

Throwing cash around doesn't do anything (just ask Microsoft about there purchase of rare). But your right, Nintendo should have a little more variety of it's OWN franchises and I think they are solving that. Look at whats coming from them, we got Metroid's (action/adventure), Zelda's(adventure), Geist (fps), Marios(platformers?, sports), Pikmin(strategy). I think Nintendo is covering a lot of bases with just those alone. As for different franchises Nintendo is bringing out donkey konga, mario party 6 that supposidly(sp?) doesn't use controllers and uses an 'eye toy' prepheral for the GC (I think so anyway) so it doesn't matter weather you or me or anyone else likes it or not, the fact is, it's a new way of gaming.

C) I agree with you here too, I think Nintendo should give us those SD card adapters. That is ofcourse dependant on the cost. Last I checked, SD cards were at about 1 gig so these could very well act as HDD's, couple that with some D/L content goodness and online/connectivity gaming and I think were all set here. But ofcourse the big question of all this is cost so we will have to wait and see.

D) I guess this plays with what were both saying about variety. Not only should Nintendo carry a good variety of it's own software but to make contracts with all the 3rd party devs out there and get games for every genre especially RPG's and sports since those two areas have seem to be Nintendo's weakest points (system library wise anyway).

E) Heh, just the other night I did a little cut and pasting in windows paint and put together my dream controller. It goes roughly as follows: (btw, picture a N64 controller without the middle handle and z trigger to get an idea)

-6 Face buttons like the xbox buttons. Not the layout but the type of buttons
-n64/snes style D-pad
-GBAsp screen in middle
-2 analog sticks like PS2
-Wireless
-rumble
-start/select
-GC style L&R shoulder buttons
-Memory card slot for GC and SD card adpaters.

whew, well thats enough out of me .  Personally, I think Nintendo made a huge 180 with the GC compared to the travisty that was the N64. I don't care if anyone disagrees with me or what anyone else thinks, that thing was a huge dissapointment period, especially since guys like me were coming off the SNES, there was a lot to live up to and the n64 did not deliver, luckily, the GC is making amends and I think if Nintendo holds it's course (especially if they do what were all saying here ) and continues to change I think we're in for a real treat next gen.
 

Offline PugGTI

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #7 on: June 11, 2004, 03:40:08 AM »
Maybe its just the whole developer exclusivity deal that I feel Nintendo will miss out on this time round. It does sell systems. Third parties are just bonuses if they release an exclusive title, most third party games are usually ports or cross platform titles anyway.

That controller sound pretty trick minus the select button!

Long live nintendo!
Reggie is a sad, mentally challenged man...

Offline norebonomis

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #8 on: June 12, 2004, 08:05:32 AM »
i think a major thing everyone is forgetting is nintendo is under practically new 'younger' management, we are allready seeing amazing directions with the DS. give it time and i'm sure we will all be blown away, after all. nintendo own the industry. the started it.

god dammit, i just sounded like a fanboy didn't i?
viva la revolution! <img src="i/expressions/devil.gif" border="0"><BR><a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://www.livejournal.com/community/nintendo_ds/">livejournal.com/~nintendo_ds[/url]<BR>

Offline Chongman

  • LOL Breaking Tables is Cool!
  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2004, 01:19:41 PM »

My opinion is conflicted because...


ok look, two things can happen this year. Nintendo can pull through this fall season, Reggie will pull out a ridiculously big stick, and smack you on your ass because of Nintendo's line up.

or, the bottem will fall out and everyone will be left with a bittersweet taste of broken promises.

I truly hope it's the latter, but until one of these happens, I don't think many people have room to talk. This is a pivitol year...just wait and see.


oh, and PugGTI, the cock reference is sorely unappreciated. grow up, and the people you're discussing, not arguing with, will hopefully be civil back. And even if they're not...grow up.
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
ooberage
------------
in the days of yesteryear I'm still playing SMB3, chrono trigger, and
reading calvin and hobbes

~*~*~*~
PSP vs NDS....c'mon...really...who in their right gaming mind will buy the PSP?

Believe...Nintendo
Stop....whining

Offline PugGTI

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #10 on: June 26, 2004, 04:55:46 AM »
Sorry, I don't really get the deal with this reggie thing. It sounds like a big chunk of nothing, what's he even supposed to do? (plz don't recite that taking names and kicking rear poo)

Is the DS another gameboy, if not why do people compare it to the PSP?

Does anyone reckon that the dual cpu setup could be an easier system for managing the said "revolutionary features"?


hmmm... a little off topic but maybe some1 can help me.....
Reggie is a sad, mentally challenged man...

Offline DrZoidberg

  • Secreted by the Internet Bee
  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2004, 11:25:35 AM »
Kicking rear poo in this thread.
OUT OF DATE.

Offline RABicle

  • Used to be The Finisher
  • Score: 9
    • View Profile
    • Pietriots
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #12 on: June 26, 2004, 03:12:32 PM »
Pug, Reggie is prehaps the only fistworthy Nintendo employee who lives outside of Japan. He is not a big chunk of nothing, the future pratically rests with fists. You on the other hand pug are weak and get NO FIST.
Pietriots  - Post ironic gaming log.

Offline mjbd

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #13 on: June 27, 2004, 05:08:40 PM »
I personally think that nintendo has taken steps in the right direction.  Nintendo may never be number one again, as far as hardware sold anyway.  Even if nintendo's hardware is always outsold by Sony 3 to 1, thats still 20-30 million installed userbase.  I think Nintendo has done alot to attract more 3rd party support, and it shows.  Look how many games are on Cube, alot more than were on the N64.  As far as second parties go, Factor 5 isnt one, we got two great games from SK before their contract was up, Rare was great, but the money they got for selling them was probably worth it.  I feel that nintendo has a much wider userbase than X-box, and probably about the same as Sony's.  From what I can tell, the kiddy image has faded.  If they continue to take the proper steps to improve their future, I think Nintendo will be in great shape.
Formerly Known As Mike_OPN2000

Offline PugGTI

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #14 on: June 28, 2004, 06:01:18 AM »


I'm not sure if i agree there regarding the sales of the system. In Australia as we all know the system did (almost) dismally in comparison to the PS2 and Xbox. It really does show when you look for games in popular retailers and there's only 3 games and that they are 50% off because said retailer is clearing the gamecube from their shelves forever. This isn't that bad because there will always be a way to get the game you want, but then for newcomers to console gaming they have a look around and see walls full of games for the competition...
As for image, perhaps they should just stop targeting audiences and just make good games? Who knows

... who's this reggie guy?  
Reggie is a sad, mentally challenged man...

Offline Lamech

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #15 on: June 29, 2004, 07:28:34 AM »
I think nintendo made a few mistakes with the gamecube's late release, but the system and games are great. As for connectivity and all, if people want that in todays world they use their computer. Everyone is getting new computers within the last couple years, and with this upgrade consoles dont stand a chance at beating out internet games on computers. Nintendo's got what it needs, and it does know what it is doing. As stated in Game Informer Magazine, "Nintendo is the only company in the gaming industry with heart, all the others are just soulless machines."

-Lamech
The Greatest Thing Since Avenue Q

Offline Lamech

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #16 on: June 29, 2004, 07:40:22 AM »
oh yeah, one more thing from up above there ^

Anyone who wants a DVD player has one, and they payed the $50 one costs when they got it with Xbox and Playstation. And I have never seen a Nintendo pirated game, but it is a known fact that 1 out of 8 people who own a Xbox or Playstation own ONLY pirated games. And I must say its true out of the people I know. So I think Nintendo doesnt need to spend that extra money only to lose money. Peace Out.
The Greatest Thing Since Avenue Q

Offline mjbd

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #17 on: June 30, 2004, 03:13:24 PM »
When I was at Media Play, a guy was trying to sell me on an X-box, can you guess what his big selling point was?  The fact that you can send out your x-box, have it rigged so that you can rent games, and load them to the harddrive.  
Formerly Known As Mike_OPN2000

Offline xts3

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #18 on: July 01, 2004, 08:03:59 AM »
Well if 1/8th of a console hardware was purchased with intent to pirate (as with Xbox and PS2) via mod chips then thats 1/8th of ~80millon for Ps2, which is 10 million people, thats almost the size of nintendo's entire installed base!  With Xbox it's about 2 million people, again nothing to sneeze at, and those are customers that aren't buying games.

I think Nintendo has a few problems they need to seriously look into...  increasing the storage medium so that they are equal with their next competitors, including broadband adapter WITH the console as in BUILT IN, also a built in memory card with extra memory card slots would be nice as well.  They also need to have backwards compatability or they will be screwed when the PS3 and XBox2 arrive with it, the playstation 2 was in part such a success because of backwards compatability with the PS controllers and whatnot so they're existing PS1 customers didn't have to re-purchase everything all over again (huge bonus for existing PS1 owners upgrading to PS2).

Thats one thing I liked about the Xbox, no need for extra peripherals.  If you take Xbox's 200 (CDN) price that comes with a game and S-Controller and compare it with the GC (1 controller, no game), then add memory card $20-40 (depending on if its the 251 or the 1019) the GC start's getting up their in price, then add $20-30 for 2-3 more GC controllers to play.  Then on top of that Gameboy players for the GC/GBA connected multiplayer games, and it all starts to add up and look bad for Nintendo.  They have to realize that their customers aren't stupid

PS2 and Xbox both use DVD which means if they use dual layer discs thats about ~4.3 and ~9 Gigs (dual) of space on ONE disc compared to GC's small 1.5GB minidisc's.  This is probably the BANE of all RPG's nowadays that use FMV, if they want to get RPG developers onboard then they are going to have to keep up at least with other consoles in regards to storage medium.  People may thing 1.5GB is adequate haven't seen the size of FFX, the size of the game is easily 4+ GIGS of game data.  You can't do FFX or FFX-2 on a GC using the minidisc without using at least 3-4 GC discs.  Nintendo really needs to stop shooting themselves in the foot when it comes to storage mediums, this is what killed the N64 from being the dominant player during the PS1 era.  They need to learn this or else suffer the consequences when companies wont develop or port games because of multi-disc requirements and re-working of an existing game for another platform that has a storage medium size that doesn't require multiple discs.

The GC controller buttons are messed up, I'm sorry but the Giant "A" button and the B, Y, X button placement suck, they should have stuck with the SNES XY/AB style layout on the GC controller, The DPAD and the analogue controller need to reverse places.  I'd rather use the dpad then analogue for most games anyway unless its a game that really needs the use of analuge stick.  The C stick needs to have individual diagonal buttons, try playing soul calibur two with the C-stick on the GC, you'll accidentally soul charge if you accidentally hit a diagonal direction (fricking annoying) because of the C-stick diagonal works.  They need a complimentary "Z" button on the left size of the controller as well.  This is why the PS2 controller has 2 "Left" and 2 "right" buttons on the top of its controller.

They need to get RPG's back on their next gen systems with a vengence or they are going to get killed, literally.  The GC only has survival/horror, Nintendo first party games, the odd fighting game and FPS that are already multiplatform.  They need to get back in bed with square, konami and capcom and get exclusive deals for their next gen console or they are going to get steamrolled by Sony.  I only see sony killing everyone else unless Xbox2 has some special tech that no one else has that attracts developers en-mass like the PS1 did when Nintendo refused to give up cartridges for the CD rom which had easily over 10X the storage space of a cart.  Nintendo keeps making dumb technology mistakes although less, they still have smaller storage then the PS2 which was released earlier then the Gamecube and smaller then Xbox which was release around the same time as GC which also has bigger storage then GC.  

They have to stop with the stupid mistakes or they are going to get raped silly.  The whole reason I got a PS1 and PS2 was for roleplaying games and fighting games and mainly Metal gear solid series, that was it.  GTA3 or grand turismo didn't interest me a whole lot and were just bonus's.  I mainly got a PS2 because all my favorite former NES/SNES/PS1 developers were making games for the PS2, thats the whole reason why.  If Nintendo can get exclusive games back on their platform they might have a chance but they need to get their act together.

Offline KDR_11k

  • boring person
  • Score: 28
    • View Profile
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #19 on: July 02, 2004, 12:55:44 AM »
Since the other thread was locked I'll respond to your second reply here.

1. UT2004 is NOT an example of current gen technology. It's closer to next gen (it takes up more texture memory than the XBox has in total RAM!) than current gen and by next gen we're going to see higher capacity discs. Besides, UT2004 is simply overkill, a lot of that space could have been saved by using more efficient UV layouts and smaller textures (there's no reason to use two 1024x1024 textures if the object isn't larger than 100 pixels in the game, anyway). Besides, you couldn't feed those into the PS2 despite the larger disks, the device cannot handle textures of that size due to cache restrictions.
2. As mentioned before, if DVDs were the only reason the PS2 got those RPGs, then why are there almost NONE on the XBox? The Cube is getting Tales of Symphonia and Baten Kaitos, two RPGs with FMVs and the like. What has the Box got? Fable? Is Fable going to use that much space? I've seen epic adventures on the PC that fit on two CDs, so were's the problem?

Offline eylor

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #20 on: July 02, 2004, 09:53:59 PM »
xts3:

I'm not one to post very often but the sheer level of misinformation that you are attempting to shovel has brought me out of retirement, if only this once.

For starters, your CONSTANT attacking of Nintendo's reluctance to use current, but also EASILY PIRATED, media. Let's go back in time for a short while shall we? The generation leap is about to shift from the 16bit to the 32/64bit and everyone is waiting in awe for Nintendo's next system. The SNES is still going strong and the PSX is just a small player who looks to be nothing more than a nitch market if that. Just because the system supported CD did NOT mean that developers jumped on it. In fact, there were INUMERABLE CD based systems as well as add-ons that FAILED at the exact same time that Nintendo was looking to develop the N64. The Sega Saturn (Nintendo's only competition at the time) was flopping, as had the Sega CD add-on, and the 3DO was nothing more than a bad memory. Really, from everything that was going on with CD at the time, Nintendo made the only viable decision that they could after shifting back and forth from one format to another: avoid it. Afterall, CD was a bad gamble. Up until the PSX took off, which wasn't until AFTER the N64 was released coincidentaly, developers had all but REFUSED to support a CD based system even though they clammored for the media as everyone NOW states.

Media size did not become an issue until FFVII was released, a game which I still feel to this day all but bastardized gaming forever. It was a good game but it should have been ONE game and FMV should NEVER have come to become such an important part of video games. In the end though, was the MASSIVE PSX CD format even big enough for that title? NO! The game required no less than 3 DISCS! Following that were the trite FFVIII, on 4 DISCS!, and the FFVI remake, FFIX which was again on 4 discs. Apparently not even CD was enough to satiate developers lust for space last generation. Well, I should say developers lust to fill games with movies as all 3 of those titles would have fit on an N64 cart without the FMV.

Moving on from the reason as to WHY CD took off in the first place, FMV, we find that Sony had also implimented several changes to the industry that Nintendo simply couldn't afford to make as well. Namely paying developers to make games for their system as well as publishing and advertising them. Nintendo makes their OWN games, something that Sony still does a very weak job of to this day. So Sony was willing to PAY developers to make games for their system, much like MS has done this generation, as well as gave them a new way to sell games to, well... stupid gamers. For clerifications sake, I consider FMV to be a CRUTCH for bad games and lazy developers. Add on the fact that CD was much cheaper to produce for as well and you begin to see how several factors more or less built up against Nintendo completely unexpectedly. Had all of these events happened a year before they did, there's a good possibility that Nintendo would have gone with another media besides carts. As it was, they were already waffling on CD anyway.

From that point on though, NO storage media has been large enough for developers, not even the MIGHTY PS2 format. Developers have simply made games that would fit on what they were given. Believe it or not but if the PS2 had used a 20gig disk, developers would have found a way to fill it up, while at the same time games are getting shorter and shorter with less replay value. More or less it's just bloated code and lazy developers, or FMV clips and I'm sure by now that you understand my stance on them.

But anyway, you're ragging all over Nintendo for not being PSYCHIC and seeing that the industry would have a massive shift in a matter of MONTHS after they released the N64. Then yell at them for not going with full sized DVD even though last generation MANY developers had to use SEVERAL CDs for their PSX games. So... all of a sudden multi-disc games are bad??? Since when did that happen? Oh, because it's a "Nintendo" system. I gotcha.

Then you whine about the cost of GC and it's peripherals. Citing how much it costs to buy the system, 4 controllers, a memory card, bla, bla, bla... The SAME could be said about the XBox which you use as an example against it, as well as the PS2, which required it's OWN controllers and memory cards as well if you expect to actually PLAY the games the way they were meant to be played. You know, saving and the like. But in your little comparison you also neglect to factor in the cost of having to buy the DVD kit seperate for the XBox, OR the cost of XBox Live! All of a sudden ALL 3 of the systems look more expensive than they did before, now don't they? Nintendo didn't throw any "hidden costs" at gamers, that's for Sony and MS to do.

Your rant about the controller is your opinnion, and you're welcome to it so I have nothing further to add on that subject.

As for RPGs though, as has been brought up by other users, DVD does not automatically mean RPG. Again, how many RPGs are on the XBox? RPGs are mostly made by Japanese developers and most of those developers favor the PS2. It's got nothing to do with media size. If it did, there wouldn't be ANY RPGs on the GC. And yet there are a few notable exceptions to that rule now aren't there. Especially since Sony isn't buying software from developers anymore and Nintendo is beginning to cut favorable deals with certain ones. Tales of Symphonia, it's planned sequal, and Baten Kaitos are of course the most obviouse examples. But then again, wonder of wonders, who's developing for the little purple lunch-box with the small medium? Why, none other than SquareEnix! The company who almost single handedly destroyed Nintendo just one generation before because they couldn't live without CD. But what's this? They're not developing for the XBox? Now that can't be right. I mean, look at the size of their media!

Just... Get over yourself. Media size isn't all that important except to lazy developers, of which most are.

And I've expelled WAY too much effort and energy on this post so I'm going to drop it here. I dunno, guess it's just been so long since I've posted on any video games related message boards that I just went overboard. Anyway, I don't expect you to actually read any of this or to have actual INTELLIGENT and WELL THOUGHT OUT responses. I mean, you're obviousely a Nintendo hater. Which makes you most likely a Sony fanboy. However I will not pass judgment. That is for lesser, smaller beings.

Offline xts3

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #21 on: July 04, 2004, 09:05:54 AM »
You missed the point, Nintendo was the leader at the time right before the PS1 and N64 came out as soon as square and all the other key developers on the SNES announced that they were going to develop for the PS1 it was all over.  The console that wins is the one thats won the allegiance of the best game developers and a sizeable portion of third party ones.  Sega's systems failed because they had no developers with _system selling games_ and they couldn't develop hit games that sold as well and had the brand recognition that Nintendo did.  All of the playstation one games were originally former NES/SNES games or sequels to those games, then they got all the original titles as well since you could just make better, bigger, longer games with more quality content, if this shows us anything CONTENT IS KING.

I may came off on a 'rant mode' but I really just got to hate the layout of the GC controllers 4 XYAB buttons in certain games.  So I apologize for ranting. the snes sold ~50 million units over its lifetim, the N64 ~30 million (over its entire lifetime) and the GC a paltry 13 million.  They lost 20 million+ customers over the PS1 debacle and it was all because they lost their key developers because of the technology gap (roms vs. CD's) not just because sony lined their pockets with cash, that argument will only take you so far.  Its because game companies wanted to make better games with more levels and more content that you just couldn't simply do on a N64.

As for multi-discs, again this is POST PS1 generation of consoles and the GC came out after the PS2 but has 1.5x less storage on a single disc.  Sure the GC is 'less piratable' but thats only until the next console emulator comes out for the PC and you can play all the rom images of GC games, I'm sure Snes9X, nesticle, gens and ePsxe have made repackaging and selling old games obsolete when you can dl them off the internet or rent them and copy and burn them in the case of PS1 games.  Emulation I'm sure will happen towards the end of life for the cube, PS2 and xbox as well.  Sure it might be harder to pirate games, but pirating games on a system with not that many good games in the first place makes little sense, the best system to warez yourself silly with would be the PS2 due to the huge amount of titles.

You can use your old Playstation controllers with the PS2, so no you dont have to rebuy them when you get a PS2, this was my point!  This shows you dont own a PS2 because the controllers are interchangable between all playstation systems.  Either way Nintendo lost developer support because of the technology they decided to go with.  Final fantasy and other devs games became  EXCLUSIVE to the PS1 so it was a must buy, all the fighting games formerly on snes, went to the PS1, all the RPG's formerly on snes to ps1, everything else 3rd party basically to ps1.  It wasn't just because sony bought them off it was because the PS1 has superior tech (storage) and easier and cheaper to develop for in liscensing fee's, media, etc then the N64 it was a no brainer.

Offline eylor

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #22 on: July 04, 2004, 04:39:36 PM »
xts3:

I'm not even going to dignify that with a response.

And thank-you for proving to me that I had made a grevous error in believing that I might actually be able to return to ANY message board without running face first into a wall of disinformation and propaganda.

When you learn the difference between the words "opinion" and "fact" give me a call.

Until then however...

Offline PugGTI

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #23 on: July 05, 2004, 05:27:27 AM »
I think nintendo went the right way with the 8cm discs, but to keep up they're going to have to go to 8cm blueray nextgen. Few games on any system passed the 1.2 Gb mark anyways.

Eylor: you make some really crap points and you should question your own credibility. Sounds like pretty ignorant fanboyism, really you're trying to make some lame excuses for nintendo. Just remember that you aren't everybody.

xts3: your controller idea blows donkey balls! Sounds like sony dualshock-erism.
Reggie is a sad, mentally challenged man...

Offline ThePerm

  • predicted it first.
  • Score: 64
    • View Profile
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #24 on: July 10, 2004, 09:56:53 AM »
i remember waiting for dolphin to come out nd mroe information about it...anyways Nintendo was a big beleiver of the wait and see stance..they were using this so they could have the hardware power advantage...on the other thing xbox gettign into the mix totally screwed this up.
NWR has permission to use any tentative mockup/artwork I post

Offline Ian Sane

  • Champion for Urban Champion
  • Score: 1
    • View Profile
RE: Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #25 on: July 10, 2004, 12:49:13 PM »
"on the other thing xbox gettign into the mix totally screwed this up."

You know I think you're right.  Odds are pretty likely that Nintendo's plans for the Cube were under the assumption that they would compete with only the PS2 and maybe the Dreamcast.  Realistically they may plans things better this time since they'll know MS will be involved.

Offline Mumei

  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
RE:Move forward nintendo!
« Reply #26 on: July 15, 2004, 09:19:42 AM »
Quote

Originally posted by: eylor
xts3:

I'm not even going to dignify that with a response.

And thank-you for proving to me that I had made a grevous error in believing that I might actually be able to return to ANY message board without running face first into a wall of disinformation and propaganda.

When you learn the difference between the words "opinion" and "fact" give me a call.

Until then however...


He was correct that Nintendo has lost many, many customers since the end of the SNES era... They are hoping to sell 33 million Gamecubes by the end of this generation.  And I don't believe that he is a Nintendo hater.  I agree with him on many points, and I never had any systems but Nintendo systems up until 2 years ago, and I still love my Nintendo games.

Pointing out obvious flaws in what Nintendo did is not being a Nintendo hater.