Topic: Official Sales Thread

[Nile Boogie Returns]

I don't think its a technicality so much as its a value choice. Wii U is just a better value. PS4 wont outsell Wii U year ending 2014, even with a 200,000 console lead and that new car smell.

[BlackNMild2k1]

It would be a technicality because technically all the consoles would have failed miserably, even if the Wii U sold the most.

Like being the only survivor in the "drink a cup of paint thinner contest".

Yay you won... now you get to live by eating through a tube and tapping out yes or no answers on this little finger pad.

Even though you won, you still lost.

[Khushrenada]

Like being the only survivor in the "drink a cup of paint thinner contest".

Yay you won... now you get to live by eating through a tube and tapping out yes or no answers on this little finger pad.

I'm guessing this happened to you. It would explain this post:

I know all abotraine handheld preference of Japan, big train why I think Nintendo is researching a hybrid console/handheld.

And a lot other previous posts of yours too actually.....

(Or maybe you just like trains.)

[BlackNMild2k1]

LOL. damn mobile devices.

Forgot to double check my swype. LOL.



edit: I fixed it now.

[azeke]

It's not even about any preferences.
PS4 has no games (for Japan), simple as that.

[BlackNMild2k1]

So it is a drought. It sold just below the Wii U and had no games on the chart.

[azeke]

It's going to fall even further behind Wii U because Mario Kart is coming.

[Ian Sane]

If Nintendo's goal is to "win" the console market in Japan then truly they have had their reward.  Sony wants to win in the console markets that actually, you know, fuckin' matter and make money.  The PS4's lineup is very Western-centric but that makes sense because that's the market that buys consoles and it is also the bigger market period.  We all make fun of Sony's handhelds but the PSP sold well in Japan, just not in America.  Sony probably doesn't care because they're smart enough to cater their handheld to the market that's most interested in handhelds.  Sony's approach seems to be to focus their products on the market that is most interested in them and if you get some sales in the other markets, great.  Nintendo's approach is to focus on their local market, regardless of whether the product is actually the sort of thing Japanese consumers want to buy, regardless of the fact that it's one of the smaller markets, and presume that that success will translate everywhere else.

So what the Wii U is is a console designed for the market that doesn't want consoles that they hope will also sell in the West.  In other words it is a product for NOBODY and is selling exactly like that.

[Nile Boogie Returns]

If Nintendo's goal is to "win" the console market in Japan then truly they have had their reward.  Sony wants to win in the console markets that actually, you know, fuckin' matter and make money.  The PS4's lineup is very Western-centric but that makes sense because that's the market that buys consoles and it is also the bigger market period.  We all make fun of Sony's handhelds but the PSP sold well in Japan, just not in America.  Sony probably doesn't care because they're smart enough to cater their handheld to the market that's most interested in handhelds.  Sony's approach seems to be to focus their products on the market that is most interested in them and if you get some sales in the other markets, great.  Nintendo's approach is to focus on their local market, regardless of whether the product is actually the sort of thing Japanese consumers want to buy, regardless of the fact that it's one of the smaller markets, and presume that that success will translate everywhere else.

So what the Wii U is is a console designed for the market that doesn't want consoles that they hope will also sell in the West.  In other words it is a product for NOBODY and is selling exactly like that.

So basically your saying that Sony doesn't care about Japan? Really? So why launch a system in a place you don't care to do well in. I could see if you said XBOXONE, but you said Sony, A Japanese mega company doesn't care about Japan.

I know you're down on the Big N right now but you can't just be blinded by hate or apathy. Yes the console market in Japan is much smaller than it was 5 years ago however, you can't tell me Sony just said the hell with the 30,000,000 gamers over there. Sony makes BILLION$ of dollars in japan off gaming over the lifetime of a console. How do they not care about that. They may have overestimated their position and underplayed the ios /android market share but that's about it.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I think you read Ian's post wrong.
He didn't say Sony didn't care about Japan, just that they focus their console efforts the west where consoles make big money, and then attempt to translate that success to the handheld market in Japan where handhelds are king.

Also if the consoles happen to sell in Japan then great, and same with the handhelds in the West.


Nintendo does the opposite in attempting to dictate what the world wants based on them trying to mold to Japanese taste. In the case of the Wii U, they catered to neither market with their approach.

[Nile Boogie Returns]

Focus = Care, or "core" since we are talking business.

If Nintendo's goal is to "win" the console market in Japan then truly they have had their reward.  Sony wants to win in the console markets that actually, you know, fuckin' matter and make money.

Nah bra, I read that right. Japan does not matter to Sony in the console market. MircoSoft doesn't care about Japan, that is not only true, it makes sense. Sony has an established brand and while the ups and downs of consumerism changes, you just don't jump ship and the first sign of rough seas.

And why or how would Sony decide that Japan doesn't matter for the PS4? PS3 wasn't the juggernaut many thought it could have been but by no means was it that much of a disappointment that the idea of a healthy console should be abandoned. I'm missing something?

[Ceric]

Thinking the overall point is to not design something for worldwide release for the smaller segment of the world and think that will be success.

[Luigi Dude]

If Nintendo's goal is to "win" the console market in Japan then truly they have had their reward.  Sony wants to win in the console markets that actually, you know, fuckin' matter and make money.

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101670334

>Sony
>Make Money

Pick One


Yeah people can say well the Playstation 4 is doing great, but the reason Sony can release systems as powerful as the PS4 is because the company has other divisions that they can fall back on if one of their gaming systems doesn't do well.  If Sony was a pure gaming company like Nintendo, there wouldn't even be a PS4 since the PS3 would have killed the company.

Plus lets not act like the West is this glorious market that's making everyone money.  Thanks to those insane dev cost to create those pretty graphics on Microsoft and Sony's machines that you like so much, most Western companies aren't exactly rolling in on the dough either.  If a userbase of over 160 million 360/PS3's combined with 90% of that in the West isn't big enough to support a healthy industry, the PS4 sure as hell isn't going to change that.  Especially when it's already been estimated dev cost are expected to rise up to 3 times as high as they were last gen, which was already too high.

Nintendo designing something more for Japan where cheaper cost is more important might not have been the best thing for the West, but considering just how much of a money hole the Western market has become, did Nintendo really make a bad decision?  Catering to a market that has no problem bankrupting itself in the name of the prettiest graphics possible isn't exactly a smart choice either.  Yeah Wii U sales have currently cost Nintendo money as well, but they still haven't lost anything close to what studio's lost last gen or would have lost if the Wii U was as powerful as the One/PS4.

[Ian Sane]

Nintendo designing something more for Japan where cheaper cost is more important might not have been the best thing for the West, but considering just how much of a money hole the Western market has become, did Nintendo really make a bad decision?  Catering to a market that has no problem bankrupting itself in the name of the prettiest graphics possible isn't exactly a smart choice either.  Yeah Wii U sales have currently cost Nintendo money as well, but they still haven't lost anything close to what studio's lost last gen or would have lost if the Wii U was as powerful as the One/PS4.

Gee, let's all congratulate Nintendo on their bomb not being as financially disasterous as it potentially could of been.

If Nintendo can't afford to match the PS4/XB1 then they cannot make consoles anymore.  Sorry, that's what the market expects.

[Nile Boogie Returns]

I don't know about what the industry wants but I expect Nintendo to be the best game maker in the world. And while the that gap is closer than its ever been, for me its still them.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I don't think Sony nor MS can afford to continue matching the PS4/XBO either.

Nintendo's fault isn't just designing a console that they thought Japanese people would buy and pushing it worldwide, but also making mostly games catered to that Japanese market as well.

Even though Zelda is/was Huge in the west and not so hot in the east, Nintendo still altered the game to cater more to Japanese taste instead of doubling down on western interest. Those types of decisions are what I believe the original point was getting at.

Nintendo could probably make some headway if they opened a few more studios that were focused on more western style games. This is where Rare used to shine, and we all thought Retro would fill that gap.

[Nile Boogie Returns]

Its funny cause I think the Wii U doesn't have enough Japanese games. I thought we'd have far more ds like  titles by this point in the consoles life cycle. Sometimes I feel like Nintendo waited for Sony and Microsoft to show their hand. Take their best punch and see if they could stand up. Dumb as that would be.

[broodwars]

Nintendo chose to focus on the dying Japanese console market, and they're struggling to turn a profit on 7-9 year old technology.  Sony puts out the PS4 focusing on the Western market with new technology (for consoles), and they're "already turning a profit."

Source

Just sayin'. Sony may get dragged down due to the Albatrosses that are their other divisions, but it won't be the PlayStation Division that'll doom them.

[BlackNMild2k1]

The Playstation division already did it's damage last gen by losing practically everything it's made up till that point.

They may not be part of the problem now, but they certainly were a major cause for concern from 2006-2011ish.
Funny thing is Sony's most profitable division (from what I remember reading a while back) is their Insurance division.... <I didn't even know it existed until I read about it>, and their Movie division <thanks to Spider-man** & Bond*>.

*Bond is on loan and they are only guaranteed the next movie in the franchise at this point in time.
**Spider-man is down in return investment and might not actually make a profit till DVD sales.

[Shaymin]

Kudos to Sony for designing a system to be profitable in six month on the back of price gouging everybody outside of the United States.

[ymeegod]

Delays is what is killing the PS4.  Driveclub and Deep Down are still MIA and won't be released until 4th quarter.  Kingdom Hearts III release date is still in the air (Square is supposed to announce something at E3)  The Order and FFXV were pushed back until 2015 along with MGS5. 

Really surprised at Sony, if I was them I would have pushed PS NOW (the ability to stream PS3 titles to ps4) and had a couple of "free" games ready to roll when MK8 and SSBM were released--namely Modnation and Playstation Allstar.
Right now MK8 is being released and Sony doesn't have anything to counter this with (in Japan anyhow, in the west we have Watchdogs).

[Louieturkey]

**Spider-man is down in return investment and might not actually make a profit till DVD sales.

Spider Man will make money internationally.  It'll be close to around $700 million worldwide.

[BlackNMild2k1]

**Spider-man is down in return investment and might not actually make a profit till DVD sales.

Spider Man will make money internationally.  It'll be close to around $700 million worldwide.

Which surprisingly may not break even still. It could need as little as $640M, which it has already, but it could need as much as $830M, which is absolutely ridiculous, so I'll just estimate somewhere south of the middle at $725M, which means they might not make a profit till DVD sales.

I broke it down in one of the movie threads, but the short version is:
production = $225M
marketing = $190M
est. 50% return on Box Office means double the production & marketing cost
est. marketing cost is probably 50% of budget (product placement/cross promotion)

$225M x2 + $190M = $640M (w/ 50% marketing budget)
$225M x2 + $190M x2 = $830M (w/ 100% marketing budget)

and none of that is figuring in the fact that BO gross in China isn't est. @ 50%, but closer to 20-25%, which is why you aim for somewhere in the middle.[/i]

[azeke]

I love videogames!

[Ceric]

Delays is what is killing the PS4.  Driveclub and Deep Down are still MIA and won't be released until 4th quarter.  Kingdom Hearts III release date is still in the air (Square is supposed to announce something at E3)  The Order and FFXV were pushed back until 2015 along with MGS5. 

Really surprised at Sony, if I was them I would have pushed PS NOW (the ability to stream PS3 titles to ps4) and had a couple of "free" games ready to roll when MK8 and SSBM were released--namely Modnation and Playstation Allstar.
Right now MK8 is being released and Sony doesn't have anything to counter this with (in Japan anyhow, in the west we have Watchdogs).

They might have nothing to counter it but, they also don't need anything to counter it.  At the moment there really is no compelling reason to own a PS4 if your happy with the PS3 and you don't want to remote play on Vita.

PS4 does NOTHING better in general terms than the PS3 if your ok with PS3 level of graphics.