Author Topic: MSG3 got jacked from Sony's booth at E3 (Read 15201 times)

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #25 on:** May 19, 2004, 04:50:03 PM »

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Finally Konami supported N64 and they realized their games weren't selling on the Nintendo demographic. Their decision to not support Nintendo was not a F*CK YOU to Nintendo, it was a business decision based on prior experience. You shouldn't put support of one system or another into a personal context its business.

Right, a business decision: they release the detestable Castlevania on the N64, and is shocked it sells horribly. Konami then releases an equally bad sequel, Castlevania: Legacy of Darkness, and is shocked to find it sells horribly, too. They blame both games' poor sales on Nintendo and drop N64 support. What a great "business" decision- they shirk the blame as an excuse for ignoring Nintendo.

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And when theres a dispute about something it usually doesn't mean that one sides point is proven, it almost always means that theres a dispute for a reason.

My point is, if Konami really was a supporter of Nintendo there shouldn't be ANY dispute over it at all, because it should be obvious. The simple fact that it's not obvious is a huge blow to your case. Maybe I'm twisting your words around, but if you honestly AREN'T saying Konami cares about the Gamecube, what are you trying to prove? That Konami USED to care about Nintendo? How is that a reason for us not laughing hysterically that the MGS3 demo got stolen? If anything Konami owes Nintendo a great deal- whatever Konami did for Nintendo's business Nintendo did tenfold for Konami's.

In this case, I'm not twisting your words:

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This is not a good thing at all. People may be happy for Nintendo because of a Sony major seller code being leaked but it's bad chiefly for Konami. It's bad for the industry as a whole, I won't go to the lengths to explain why because I'm sure you can put the pieces together. And lets not forget Konami supports N too.

Why the hell should we "not forget Konami supports N too"? Konami USED to support N- Konami no longer cares about N. I'm not complaining about it, I just fail to see why we have to factor in Konami's support of Nintendo's home consoles, especially when it's former support of Nintendo's home consoles.

Ian Sane · « **Reply #26 on:** May 19, 2004, 05:28:02 PM »

"If anything Konami owes Nintendo a great deal- whatever Konami did for Nintendo's business Nintendo did tenfold for Konami's."

Agreed. The third parties didn't make the NES, the NES made third parties. The NES became a success with an initial lineup of entirely first party games. Later after it was a success Nintendo realized that could make even more money by allowing third parties to release games and pay licensing fees. Nintendo made the NES a success and made companies like Konami rich by giving them the priviledge of making games for it.

NinGurl69 *huggles · « **Reply #27 on:** May 19, 2004, 05:50:36 PM »

Castlevania64 came out in the slow shadow months that trailed AFTER Ocarina of Time's release. It was a decent 3D action game whose appeal and value hit rock bottom partly [greatly?] thanks to the simple fact that OoT came several months before it, completely overshadowed it, raised the bar for action-adventure game quality and spoiled us all.

The fact Konami didn't put in the polish that Symphony of the Night had also hurt. Had CV64 been released much earlier than OoT, our perception of it could've been more positive.

Incidentally, the game's developer, KCEK (Konami Computer Entertainment Kobe), went on the make the GBA Castlevanias.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #28 on:** May 19, 2004, 06:06:41 PM »

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Incidentally, the game's developer, KCEK (Konami Computer Entertainment Kobe), went on the make the GBA Castlevanias.

Which have subsequently been met with mixed reviews- some say they're incredible, some say they're horrible. I personally love them, but that's beside the point. My reason for bringing up Castlevania was that the reason they sold horribly was because Konami didn't give us any reason to buy them, and then blamed Nintendo for their failure (although that could be true if you're right about OoT, but that's hardly a bad thing).

joeamis · « **Reply #29 on:** May 19, 2004, 06:38:00 PM »

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Originally posted by: DrZoidberg
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Finally Konami supported N64 and they realized their games weren't selling on the Nintendo demographic

lol.
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My point is that they could've said no to let a company situated thousands of miles away from them to redo the greatest title they ever made INHOUSE. They had to spend money, time, & effort, and send Kojima to Canada instead of him working on his inhouse games in Japan in that timeframe.

lollerskates
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You act as if I make absolutely no valid points at all, when what I state is painfully obvious.

lollercoaster

Dr.Zoidberg way to be a complete A$$..... How can you say that Konami did not put any time, effort, or money into MGS:TS? How is the fact that Kojima is working in Canada for Nintendo instead of in Japan on his own titles just something to laugh about as if it's not a valid point? Then you antagonize me and laugh in my face when I say I've made valid points? What is your problem? Are you trying to piss me off?

Heres a little something you should all know about Konami.....

Titles they've released/plan to for GBA:
Airforce Delta Strike
Boktai
Castlevania: Aria of Sorrow
Castlevania: Circle of the Moon
Castlevania: Harmony of Dissonance
Contra Advance
Disney Sports Basketball
Disney Sports Football
Disney Sports Motocross
Disney Sports Skateboarding
Disney Sports Snowboarding
Disney Sports Soccer
Frogger Advance: The Great Quest
Frogger Adv.: Temple of the Frog
Froggers Journey: Forgotten Relic
Froggers Adv. 2: The Lost Wand
Gradius Galaxies
KCS: Arcade Advanced
Konami Crazy Racers
Motocross Maniacs Advance
Ninja Five O
Shaman King
Silent Scope
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
WTA Tour Tennis
Yu-Gi-Oh: Dungeon Dice Monsters
Yu-Gi-Oh: Reshef of Destruction
Yu-Gi-Oh: The Eternal Duelist Soul
Yu-Gi-Oh: The Sacred Cards
Yu-Gi-Oh: World Championship 04
Yu-Gi-Oh: Worldwide Edition
Zone of the Enders: The Fist of Mars

Titles they've released/plan to or helped develop for GC:
Disney Sports Basketball
Disney Sports Football
Disney Sports Skateboarding
Disney Sports Soccer
Evolution Skateboarding
Evolution Snowboarding
Froggers Adv. The Rescue
Frogger Beyond
Metal Gear Solid: TS
Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles
WTA Tour Tennis
Yu-Gi-Oh: The Falsebound Kingdom

Hmm that's 12 GC titles, now how many XB titles were listed? 13

So yea it seems Konami doesn't support Nintendo or the GC afterall...

You'd be surprised how many games Konami actually released for N64...
alot more than 2 Castlevanias....

NinGurl69 *huggles · « **Reply #30 on:** May 19, 2004, 06:47:32 PM »

Of that list, I've bought..............................................

METAL GEAR SOLID: THE TWIN SNAKES.
(I'm still a potential customer for Circle of the Moon and Aria of Sorrow, tho).

THANKS KONAMI. YOU REALLY KNOW HOW TO SEDUCE MY WALLET.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #31 on:** May 19, 2004, 07:00:51 PM »

Disney. Disney. Disney. Disney. I don't call that support, I call that crap, I call that stereotyping Gamecube owners.

But NOW are you trying to say Konami is supporting Nintendo? Is Nintendo really hurt without those games?

joeamis · « **Reply #32 on:** May 19, 2004, 07:28:49 PM »

The fact is they're supporting the Cube with software. Whether or not that software appeals to each individual person is another matter. They're clearly basing it on what they believe the demographics for each system to be. Which is the same for many 3rd party developers across the board. I agree it's not really games that interest me either but it's still software. There are more older people who own PS2 and XB than GC, which does not mean GC is kiddie, it's just how things happened. These companies have alot more information about how different demographic games have sold for every company and all the other factors like the kind of advertising used, etc than we the consumers do. They pay people whose sole job is to find out that stuff. Unfortunately they're not doing that great a job. Is Nintendo really hurt without those games? No in the case for GC, minus MGS:TS. For GBA yes they are hurt without those games, the Castlevania titles have been very awesome for GBA alone and they showcase it's hardware well. All those titles have helped make Nintendo money off 3rd party royalties, every one of them. They may not have helped Nintendo's image alot but they did make Nintendo some good money.

Some of the games for GC could've been awesome they're not all "kiddie" but they just didn't come out well. I planned on buying TMNT before I read the review.

Mario · « **Reply #33 on:** May 19, 2004, 10:19:24 PM »

Konami are doing everything they can to make sure Nintendo sell as least consoles as they possibly can. Those disney titles only bring down the GCN, if they didn't exist perhaps the GCN would be selling (very) slightly more?

DrZoidberg · « **Reply #34 on:** May 19, 2004, 10:21:07 PM »

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Dr.Zoidberg way to be a complete A$$..... How can you say that Konami did not put any time, effort, or money into MGS:TS? How is the fact that Kojima is working in Canada for Nintendo instead of in Japan on his own titles just something to laugh about as if it's not a valid point? Then you antagonize me and laugh in my face when I say I've made valid points? What is your problem? Are you trying to piss me off?

I'm trying to sass you on the internet. It's working.

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/me takes zoidbergs lollerskates and lols around the lollerrink.

lucky i have a spare set of lollerblades

KDR_11k · « **Reply #35 on:** May 20, 2004, 12:48:30 AM »

If you care, Konami has some Japan-only GC games. I think even some exclusives.

Whether they support Nintendo or not doesn't matter, they still deserve to get laughed at.

joeamis · « **Reply #36 on:** May 20, 2004, 10:39:16 AM »

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Originally posted by: DrZoidberg
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Dr.Zoidberg way to be a complete A$$..... How can you say that Konami did not put any time, effort, or money into MGS:TS? How is the fact that Kojima is working in Canada for Nintendo instead of in Japan on his own titles just something to laugh about as if it's not a valid point? Then you antagonize me and laugh in my face when I say I've made valid points? What is your problem? Are you trying to piss me off?

I'm trying to sass you on the internet. It's working.

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/me takes zoidbergs lollerskates and lols around the lollerrink.

lucky i have a spare set of lollerblades

Dr. Zoidberg go read the forum rules... or atleast make an intelligent post once out of every 50th post you make.

Uglydot · « **Reply #37 on:** May 20, 2004, 11:22:08 AM »

Report his posts and see nothing happen if it really bothers you.

I would agree that Konomi helped make the NES and SNES what they are remembered for today. Nintendo had some killer games themselves, but many came from third parties such as Konami and Square. Without those games, the NES and SNES would be much different. I can't picture the NES and SNES without Metal Gear or the Turtles games. Damn, I still play those and others.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #38 on:** May 20, 2004, 11:29:46 AM »

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Dr. Zoidberg go read the forum rules... or atleast make an intelligent post once out of every 50th post you make.

If you ask me, people like Dr.Zoidberg are more valuable to the forum than people like you and me, joe- lighten up a little, laugh once in a while. Even when I'm deadlocked in a flameware I still laugh at just about everything Zoidberg and Infernal post. Keeps things in perspective.

NinGurl69 *huggles · « **Reply #39 on:** May 20, 2004, 12:37:45 PM »

Hey, Zoidberg's got a higher intelligence ratio than I do!
D'oh!

Bill Aurion · « **Reply #40 on:** May 20, 2004, 01:22:13 PM »

"Dr. Zoidberg go read the forum rules... or atleast make an intelligent post once out of every 50th post you make."

Rather that then making a clown out of yourself by being serious all the time...You know you're being too serious when Mouse tells you to lighten up... ^_^

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #41 on:** May 20, 2004, 01:40:48 PM »

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You know you're being too serious when Mouse tells you to lighten up... ^_^

That's going in my signature.

joeamis · « **Reply #42 on:** May 20, 2004, 02:36:06 PM »

Yes I guess posts that contain nothing but comments like "lollerskates" facilitate good discussions between people. I'll start laughing at you guys when you make points that make sense too then, since it's the most valuable thing a person can do for the forum according to you. I now understand that making fun of people is the best thing for this forum! ^_^

I'm gonna be a "clown" now too!

NinGurl69 *huggles · « **Reply #43 on:** May 20, 2004, 03:43:15 PM »

Whatever you do, do it with happy feelings.

Uglydot · « **Reply #44 on:** May 20, 2004, 04:28:30 PM »

If you are going to be a prick, click the little X please.

S-U-P-E-R · « **Reply #45 on:** May 20, 2004, 06:28:56 PM »

watching this sassy thread

Shift Key · « **Reply #46 on:** May 20, 2004, 06:37:51 PM »

... needs more Infernal

Bill Aurion · « **Reply #47 on:** May 20, 2004, 06:55:01 PM »

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Originally posted by: joeamis
I'm gonna be a "clown" now too!

Looks like you've made a good start...

joeamis · « **Reply #48 on:** May 20, 2004, 08:37:02 PM »

Bill whats your problem with me? You keep taking potshots at me every chance you get, so why don't you just come out and say what your beef is...

S-U-P-E-R · « **Reply #49 on:** May 20, 2004, 09:54:44 PM »

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO

I CLAIM THIS THREAD IN THE NAME OF LOL

LOL

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Author Topic: MSG3 got jacked from Sony's booth at E3 (Read 15201 times)