Topic: The Graphical presentation of Mario games post Super Smash Bros Melee

[TheBlackStallion]

Is it just me or does the Super Smash Brothers Melee style presentation seem better and more refined than any mario game that nintendo made afterwards? Imean im playing mario golf here and it seems abit eh compared to the style that Melee had. Same goes wiht Mario Party. and Sunshine.

discuss.  

[Michael8983]

I think Smash Bros Melee made the Mario characters/levels out to be too realistic. There were too many textures and it took away from the light-hearted, cartoonish atmosphere that most Mario games have.
Mario Kart is EXACTLY what a Mario game should look like IMO.

[Infernal Monkey]

Me thinks Super Smash Bros. Melee got the most development time of the lot. Plus, it was a launch title (Wasn't it?), so they'd sorta want to make it look as damn good as possible to show off the power..

[Berto2K]

Wasn't launch title in North America.  Maybe down in Australia where everything gets delayed .

[Hybrid Hunter]

SSBM wasn't a launch title in Australia, it came like weeks later.

[Ian Sane]

I love the way Mario looks in Super Smash Bros Melee.  It's exactly what I thought he should look like on the Gamecube.  I find that EAD's vision of Mario is much too simplistic.  It looks more like a design one would be forced to use do to hardware limitations.  I always thought the reason that you couldn't see any stitching on Mario's pants in Mario 64 was because it was too hard to do so.  I mean Mario has pockets on his pants in Super Mario World so it's not like he was never designed to have some detail.

I find that EAD's Gamecube interpretations of Mario and Link and vastly inferior to the designs that companies like HAL and Namco have gone with.  EAD's designs seem to indicate that they are way out-of-touch with what their fanbase was expecting.  It's like now that the graphics are such that detail and realism is expected EAD has no clue how to design their characters to appeal to a mass audience anymore.

[Michael8983]

EAD is just doing what it's always done.
Mario and Zelda games were always meant to be bold and colorful, and definitly not realistic.
Maybe the characters would appeal more to the mainstream audience if Nintendo made them realistic . . . and gave them guns and let them shoot hookers.
But it has clearly decided it's not going that route.
It's working on getting other games to appeal to people who want realistic graphics but it's keeping its classic mascot characters true to their roots and not worrying about whether people think they're "cool" or not.

[Ian Sane]

"Maybe the characters would appeal more to the mainstream audience if Nintendo made them realistic . . . and gave them guns and let them shoot hookers."

There's a lot of people that always use that arguement and it doesn't make any sense.  Look at the Mario model in Smash Bros and the Link model in Soul Calibur II.  Are they detailed and look somewhat realistic?  Yes.  Are they holding any guns? No.  Both models and quite detailed without going against the original design of the character and both are still suitable for gamers of all ages.  Just having stitches and pockets on his pants doesn't make Mario some sort of blood and guts GTA reject.

Mario and Zelda were designed as games suitable for all ages.  That doesn't mean they have to be restricted to using low poly models with only solid colour textures.  They don't to put blood of Link's sword in order to make it look like a real sword.

[Uglydot]

Maybe they designed them the way they felt the characters would fit into the game.

[Michael8983]

"There's a lot of people that always use that arguement and it doesn't make any sense. Look at the Mario model in Smash Bros and the Link model in Soul Calibur II. Are they detailed and look somewhat realistic? Yes. Are they holding any guns? No. Both models and quite detailed without going against the original design of the character and both are still suitable for gamers of all ages. Just having stitches and pockets on his pants doesn't make Mario some sort of blood and guts GTA reject."

The point is it's all the same. If EAD's developers wanted to make realistic Mario and Zelda games, that would be different. But they don't. And if they were forced to make their games more realistic just to appeal to the so called "mainstream" audience, they might as well just go all the way and gore them up. The day Nintendo starts limiting its developers to only creating games that will appeal to the "mainstream" audience is the day I stop being a Nintendo fan.
It's not about the games being suitable for all ages or anything like that. It's about the developers getting to design the games the way they want. I don't mind that Hal wanted to make a more realistic Mario for Smash Bros and I think Link looks great in Soul Calibur. Since the developers wanted the characters to look that way in those games, it's fine. But the guys at EAD clearly have different views on what Mario and Link should look like and shouldn't have to sacrifice their visions of the games just because so many gamers only seem to want realistic graphics anymore.

[WesDawg]

We've had this stupid realistic discussion a million times, and I'm getting sick of it. Miyamoto said that they played around with realistic models of Link, and decided that they couldn't mix realistic graphics and the sort of movement they wanted Link to have. I've only played the SCII demo with Link, but he controls a lot different than WW Link. He just feels a bit more sluggish. Nothing against realism, but it's pretty constraining on game makers. I almost wish Nintendo had just made one ultra real game to show it could be done, and then moved on to make good products. Then we wouldn't have to have this discussion all the time.

I don't think that's what this post was about anyways though. The comment was just that SSBM Mario was a better model than the one used in some of the more recent games. I don't remember being disappointed with the model used in Sunshine. I guess, I'm not real worried about whether he's got pockets or not. The models in Golf look pretty nice I think, but the game really lacking in some of the Nintendo touch. Not just in models, but in animations and stuff. I mean, a 30ft putt should take more effort than a 2 ft one, and the swing should look different. When you get a Triple bogey, they charactors should do more than just kinda look at the ground and shuffle their feet embarrased like. Mario Golf is fun, but it's lacking in animation a lot. Don't use it as a basis for all of Nintendo's efforts. In fact, it's Camelot's baby.

[Dyne]

Quote
Originally posted by: WesDawg
I've only played the SCII demo with Link, but he controls a lot different than WW Link. He just feels a bit more sluggish.

How much freedom of movement do you expect in a fighting game???

[Hostile Creation]

I hate conventional fighting games.  Completely A: Unrealistic B: Boring C: Boring.  Unrealism is not important, but if you strive for it, you may as well get it.  SSBM is great, but fighting games = sleep for me.

Doesn't really matter to me.  He looks good in both.

[Dyne]

Well, I hate 3D fighting games.  Except for SC2 that is.  It's an awesome game.