Topic: REVIEWS: Super Swing Golf PANGYA

[Kairon]

NO! I'm going back to play some FARCRY! YEAH! YOU HEARD ME!

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[IceCold]

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BUT, I have no issue with the final score. a 3.5 on NWR is about a 6.0 on a normal game site, by my guess

Oh yeah? Then what would Stan's 10 for Mario Tennis be?

There's little doubt that NWR in general has been deteriorating. I haven't trusted most of the reviews here for a while now, and the main draw for me is the forums. The scores are part of the matter, but the style and justification are usually weak, and many times not worth even reading.

I also find that most of the staffers aren't very connected with the NWR community. It's like they are a separate identity - you will much more likely find them posting on, say, NeoGAF, than on the NWR forums.

Some of them might want to take a few lessons in diplomacy, too..  

[ShyGuy]

Sadly IceCold brings up some relevant points.

Things sure have gone downhill since Bloodworth left.

[Bloodworth]

Great, I've read all of those comments and now I'm exhausted.

I do think that Stan complained about some things that weren't worth complaining about and he definitely took on the gutter game review style that Jeff has become famous for, and all of us have used from time to time. I don't think that was the best choice with this game though.  This isn't the half-finished licensed game thrust on an uninformed audience.  This is an original title that people were expecting more out of, and I don't think Stan's review ever makes it clear that he wanted to like it and was disappointed.

As for the responses here, I think it took way too long for someone to actually call out the problems they saw in the review.  If you bring up your disagreements in a level-headed analytical manner, your views are going to be addressed more appropriately.  But when you just go and make broad generalizations, attack someone's integrity, or start talking about the site going downhill, your opinion is likely going to be met in kind and brushed aside.  

Whenever I've come across opposition in the past, no matter how crazy it sounds, I've always tried to sift through it to see if there's any place where I am at fault or areas where I can improve.  That's not easy to do though.  You have to be open to criticism without losing confidence in your opinion or becoming paranoid about upsetting people. There's always someone who's going to disagree.  So as you can see, from the writer's perspective, there all these thin lines between being humble, being jaded, and being self-conscious, and I'm sure we've all crossed back and forth between them.

[TheYoungerPlumber]

You know, I really don't like these broad "NWR reviews are now crap" statements, because as far as I can tell you guys really mean there are a few recent reviews you strongly disagree with or think are not well written.  And if I had to take a guess at which ones you're alluding to, I'd say you're really tweaked at this review (obviously), Evan's Sonic review, and perhaps a scattering of others.  I'm going to sit here and say you're BSing if you're going to tell me dinosaurs like Steven, Jonny, Aaron, Jeff, or Dan (before he left), or I have suddenly gone sour with our reviews because our styles and positions on games really haven't changed all that much over the last year or two.  Maybe I should have played Sonic.  Maybe I should have then reviewed Sonic.  But I did not and will not at this point.  

[Shift Key]

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Originally posted by: TheYoungerPlumber
You know, I really don't like these broad "NWR reviews are now crap" statements, because as far as I can tell you guys really mean there are a few recent reviews you strongly disagree with or think are not well written.  And if I had to take a guess at which ones you're alluding to, I'd say you're really tweaked at this review (obviously), Evan's Sonic review, and perhaps a scattering of others.  I'm going to sit here and say you're BSing if you're going to tell me dinosaurs like Steven, Jonny, Aaron, Jeff, or Dan (before he left), or I have suddenly gone sour with our reviews because our styles and positions on games really haven't changed all that much over the last year or two.  Maybe I should have played Sonic.  Maybe I should have then reviewed Sonic.  But I did not and will not at this point.

I rate this critique 7.9. The Wiimote interactivity tacked on and the graphics are sub-par at best.

But seriously, not much has changed. Its not like the NWR staff had lobotomies while they were in line for the Wii launch. As Bloodworth said, if you (and by you I mean the readers) are going to criticize the reviews, put it constructively. No one benefits from verbal diarrhea.

The only real difference I see between reviews these days and the Gamecube reviews is that the Wiimote controls produce a different gaming experience depending largely on the person playing the game, and its producing a greater degree of polarity in readers. That appears to be the big X-factor for the Wii - and the thing that is driving sales - is the controller and the potential for new and bizarre ways of playing games (the elephant minigames in Wario Ware sealed it, next-gen involves me acting like a clown, forget gfx or gameplay).

But if people can have totally difference experiences with the same game using the same controller, then perhaps there's needs to be an adjustment in the focus of the review? Do you incorporate a "Wiimote Curve" or something to indicate how easy the gestures are to pick up and how confident you are after a period of playing the game? It is obvious that the Wiimote is having a greater effect on gameplay and the experience than any other controller around (does the Virtual Boy count? of course not, that product is dead in the gutter) and so perhaps you need to focus more on the Wiimote rather than just "Controls" in general.

NWR staff, stick to your guns when you review games. When someone tells you how you should think, the terrorists have already won.
Fanboys, use the Reader Review forum if you think you can do a better job of reviewing games.

[planetidiot]

wtf is going on in here?

[Infernal Monkey]

Is capamerica part of the development team behind this game or something? Bloody hell, it's a golf game. Calm down.

[Plugabugz]

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The only real difference I see between reviews these days and the Gamecube reviews is that the Wiimote controls produce a different gaming experience depending largely on the person playing the game, and its producing a greater degree of polarity in readers.

Ultimately, this is what all of the "arguably" heavy scores boil down to.

For that reason, it may be advisable to have a second reviewer who isn't a PhD in that area to review the same game (but conversely, not someone who hates that genre). The two reviews are then averaged out and given a final score. If i know one person who, for example, likes the sonic franchise played Rings, alongside someone who hasn't before, it wont seem like person x can scream and shout lobotomy and rate it badly because the camera threw them into a chasm of porridge.  

[Darkheart]

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Originally posted by: Infernal Monkey
Is capamerica part of the development team behind this game or something? Bloody hell, it's a golf game. Calm down.

ITS NOT JUST A GOLF GAME, its a demon of many tiers of darkness, shrouded in the clouds of madness, teething and knawing at what can be only described as "CONSUMER OF MANY SOULS"~!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111111111111111111111_shift + 1111111111111  

This thread needs more Pro666 hilarity of sarcastic  remarks .


Ok just gonna toss my two cents in:

Review:  Yea I was sort of taken aback on the score of this review but reviews are subjective.  If anyone here is going to take this site alone on their reviews to purchase games I feel sorry for you.  I personally, look at several reviews of the game to get a general concensus of what people like or liked about it and they still could be all wrong.  Fantastic games like Chibi Robo was fun but I stopped playing because the gameplay was too slow for me.  Having my characters die and leave me forever irked me on the Fire Emblem games.  Both games got decent scores all around but both games failed in my eyes when I played them.  Personal taste is a factor in what you play/buy.  

Super Swing Golf:  I am sorry I really had high hopes for this game because I loved its online counterpart.  That game is still a fun game that I can pick up any day I am bored and start hitting the tourneys all over again.  I personally had no problems with the Wii controls, but the game did get sort of old fast.  For all of you guys claiming you can play as Hana, ummm thats still two characters that are really generic, and it does take a LONG time before you can go nab one of better characters that ACTUALLY have personality.  Speaking of generic scout, how funny that he called him that because when I first got Albatross 18 online I called scout Generic Anime Boy # 38  He looks so plain and compared to any other characters in the game he lacks personality and life.  

NWR:  Now I do not know about these accusations about staffers posting elsewhere in other site forums, but I do know for a fact that these people have been running this site with other stuff going on.  VgCats is a webcomic site where the artist is able to work out of his home and actually live off of his site.  This site however does not,  all of the people who work here are on volunteer basis and have different activities going on in their lives.  I know as a college student, being able to live a semi normal life, working, helping out the family, etc etc. alone is hard enough work.  I can not imagine what these people have to do to keep up with a site and the crap they have in their own lives.  The only thing I do sort of agree with is that it would be nice to see staffers post in threads more often.  It does feel like the forums are a seperate part of the site.  Other than that keep up the good work.


P.S.  I fully agree with Smash's great rebuttal.

P.S.S To keep this thread going.............







Elebits is the Super Mario 64 of the Wii~!

[nitsu niflheim]

I turned off the Wii-centric controls and played via button pressing only.

But Stan didn't like the game, so why should he be attacked because of his opinion?  If he thinks the game is worth a 3.5, then that's the end of it.  I sincerely doubt that he gave it a 3.5 it to attack fans of the game or for any other reason.  

[Arbok]

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Originally posted by: Artimus
I didn't know Evan loved Kurosawa! I didn't know YOU loved Kurosawa! I love Kurosawa! He's my favorite director.

And the world is a happier place...

[MegaByte]

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Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix

Then again there are times where people complain about a negative review when they haven't even played the game. Wish I could recall which individuals do that though

[Artimus]

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Originally posted by: Arbok

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Originally posted by: Artimus
I didn't know Evan loved Kurosawa! I didn't know YOU loved Kurosawa! I love Kurosawa! He's my favorite director.

And the world is a happier place...

Which of his films are your favorites?

(I don't think NWR's quality has really deteriorated. That's just foolish. I think if you write this kind of review you need to be prepared for the same reaction, which you guys obviously weren't, but otherwise people are mainly just peeved at the score. Just be glad you only get this much flak when it's a 3.5. The whole IGN/DD thing was far far worse. Especially since the damn game deserved a 7.5. The only thing that NWR needs to fix is the design, but we won't go there. )

[Ceric]

I will say one more time.  The score I didn't care about.  The inner text of the review I did.

On a side note:  I'm playing elebits right now.  I like the mulitplayer, the story, art direction but, I don't like the core gameplay in single player.

[ShyGuy]

Oh Noes! that image is 49 pixels too wide!

The fact of the matter is that if the readership doesn't trust NWR's reviews, that is a Nintendo World Report problem, not a Nintendo World Report visitor problem. That is the nature of the free market.

[nitsu niflheim]

People have been pissed off for less.

[Arbok]

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Originally posted by: Artimus
Which of his films are your favorites?

Seven Samurai, Yojimbo and Ikiru, roughly in that order.

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Originally posted by: ShyGuy
The fact of the matter is that if the readership doesn't trust NWR's reviews, that is a Nintendo World Report problem, not a Nintendo World Report visitor problem. That is the nature of the free market.

Tis true. Video games are a very competitive sector of the internet in terms of reporting and reviewing.

[vudu]

You list is faulty for the lack of Rashômon.

[Arbok]

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Originally posted by: vudu
You list is faulty for the lack of Rashômon.

I'm a heathen, I know...

[NWR_pap64]

My concern right now with NWR reviews is that they seem to take any small issue (or ANY issue in general), make it the main focus and trash the game for it. For example, you ripped Wii Play apart simply because it was a collection of mini games. I can understand that these are arcade style games with little staying power, but its FAR from the worst game ever (and its a good thing a more level headed review was written). Same with Raving Rabbids (which I HAVE played Golden! :p). The review focused far too much on the fact that you had to unlock content, especially since its commonly seen in games, Mario Party games included.

In other words, it seems that the NWR reviews focuses far too much on the negative aspect of a game and very little on the good, or even offer a fair and balanced view of the game, despite overall quality of the game.

As a fellow reviewer, all I am stating is that you guys shouldn't focus far too much on the bad and actually try to spend more time with the game enough and point out the good. Also, I know reviews are based on ONE'S experience with the game, but it doesn't hurt to keep in mind how gamers will react to it.

So this is my overall gripe with reviews at the moment.

[Arbok]

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Originally posted by: pap64
Also, I know reviews are based on ONE'S experience with the game, but it doesn't hurt to keep in mind how gamers will react to it.

Word of golden advice right here. I take the same approach. I may not care for a subject much or, on the flip side love it... and I will state this in my review, but I will also try and approach my job as how I think others will like the title. I guess it's more of a philosophy. You can look at a review as a chance to vent ones own thoughts about the product, or you can approach it as walking through the matter with the reader, allowing them to use your work as a guide as to if the title is right for them. However, it is only a philosophy, and everyone prefers different approaches.

[NWR_pap64]

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Originally posted by: Arbok

Quote
Originally posted by: pap64
Also, I know reviews are based on ONE'S experience with the game, but it doesn't hurt to keep in mind how gamers will react to it.

Word of golden advice right here. I take the same approach. I may not care for a subject much or, on the flip side love it... and I will state this in my review, but I will also try and approach my job as how I think others will like the title. I guess it's more of a philosophy. You can look at a review as a chance to vent ones own thoughts about the product, or you can approach it as walking through the matter with the reader, allowing them to use your work as a guide as to if the title is right for them. However, it is only a philosophy, and everyone prefers different approaches.

Yeah I agree.

For example, this SSG review came very late. The game was a launch title, so that gave Stan more than enough time to see how the community sees this game. He would've understood that there are some fans of the game.

If I were Stan I would've written this:
"In my humble opinion, I didn't see what was so much fun and captivating about this game. I encountered far too many issues that ruined my experience. But I may be the minority here and its understandable why some gamers would like it. If SSG is your type of game, give it a rent. But keep in mind that the game has some issues that may put a damp on the overall enjoyment"

He would've stated in a calm manner that he didn't like the game while respecting the fan's love towards it.

It would've been far better than the angst and angry style he chose for this game.

[that Baby guy]

What is he reviewing, though.  The game, or the behavior of the game's fans.  You read the review to find out what that person thinks of the game, and not what people that person has read about on web forums think about the the game.

[GoldenPhoenix]

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Originally posted by: ShyGuy
Oh Noes! that image is 49 pixels too wide!

The fact of the matter is that a vocal minority doesn't trust NWR's reviews, that is a Nintendo World Report problem, not a Nintendo World Report visitor problem. That is the nature of the free market.

Fixed