Topic: No Revolution at E3?

[BigJim]

Nintendo's GameCube message at SpaceWorld 2000 was compelling and adequate. They showed the hardware, gave specs, and showed several "tech demo" videos. Granted, they weren't competing for attention since it was a Nintendo-only show, but I think that much would be enough.

Live demos and show floor playable games aren't necessary just yet. The games are far too early along anyway. Anything along the lines of a live Miyamoto demo would just be a huge bonus to me.

As for the competition stealing their ideas, the dev kits have GOT to come out shortly after E3. If Nintendo doesn't share the big secret at E3, MS and Sony will find out almost right away anyway because the secret will leak when the kits ship. Any fool should be able to assume this.

(As an aside editorial, being "different" is not as important as Nintendo thinks it is. So even if the idea is copied, their lunch isn't going to be eaten just because of that. Being "different" didn't work for GameCube. Why would it for Revolution?)

Also remember that Nintendo's comments on what they will or won't show were made BEFORE Sony and MS got into last week's pissing contest. The situation has changed. Nintendo may just be laying in wait to see what Sony and MS do first. I think they'll be capable of showing a lot, but they're not going to volunteer more than they have to.

All that being said, Nintendo has 3 platforms they need to cover in their presentation. You know there will be an extensive Zelda demo. You know there will be a wireless DS demo. Unfortunately, Revolution will likely be the last and lowest priority item, because at the end the the day, they need to make a case for their current lineup of products. But I am hopeful they'll impress us somehow anyway.    

[Hostile Creation]

Or we can take a look at the N64, where the total reconfiguration of how we play video games took place, defining 3 dimensional gameplay as we know it and setting the standard for the new platformer.

Mario is saying that they might not have to show the system to show the innovation, and that makes perfect sense.  Even not with graphics, it can sometimes be determined in gameplay.

[Caillan]

Now holding a Spaceworld to unveil it wouldn't be too bad, just as long as they don't hold back too much at E3. Because it's a pretty quiet time of year, I think most large publications would cover it. Of course we'd also get more Zelda info

Sony and Microsoft can't copy Nintendo's ideas for the Revoltuon because their systems are being unveiled before E3. They can't just revamp their design a few months before launch. Also, if it's something like the DS it will be neat but not something that everyone else wants to copy.

[PaLaDiN]

I think you guys are putting a little too much stock in E3.

Nintendo had an awesome E3 last year and nobody cared except people who go to game sites. It had no noticeable effect on Nintendo's standing or sales.

[BlackGriffen]

The only way a tactic like this would work for Nintendo is if the N5 were truly revolutionary, and obviously so.

Somehow, I doubt it.

Somebody needs to knock some heads together and take away the kool-aid over at NCL, because they've become the Howard Hughs of the gaming industry: once great, but now just whacky and paranoid.

BG  

[Mario]

Except they're still great.

[Dirk Temporo]

Quote
Originally posted by: BlackNMild2k1
Nintendo will most likely not show the controller or system to anyone of the press, but they will most-likely give a behind closed door presentation w/ NDA's to all the rest of the publisher & developers that aren't already sold on the Rev.  

Like Reggie said "E3 will not be the Revolutions coming out party", I honestly think they will save that for a seperate event when they will have the spotlight all on them.  I'm guessing about a month or 2 or 3 before Xbox 360 is released, around Sept. or right when Zelda '05 is about to be released.

How about a Spaceworld 2005 for the official full unvieling of the Revolution? E3 is way too soon for something that won't be out for at least another year, year and a half.

Spaceworld is an industry-wide thing in Japan. They aren't going to bring it back just for the Revolution.

If this turns out to be true, I'm going to be majorly disappointed, as well as many others. Most of us were looking forward to seeing the controller, agreed?

[Ian Sane]

"As an aside editorial, being 'different' is not as important as Nintendo thinks it is. So even if the idea is copied, their lunch isn't going to be eaten just because of that. Being 'different' didn't work for GameCube. Why would it for Revolution?"

Being different isn't important.  What's important is being perceived as better.  Super Mario 64 was copied.  Tomb Raider ended up coming out around the same time and Crash Bandicoot and NiGHTS came out shortly after.  Almost every company was making something inspired by Mario 64.  But Mario 64 still crushed those other games in sales because it was clearly the best of all those games.  It was perceived as the best.  Sure in the end the N64 lost to the Playstation but that didn't happen until at least a year after launch and it had nothing to do with Super Mario 64 being copied.  If anything the N64 survived because of Super Mario 64.

So let's say Nintendo reveals the big new feature and Sony and MS copy it.  It won't matter if Nintendo has games that use this idea that just blow everyone away.  If Nintendo has a good idea and has good ideas for using this idea being copied won't be that big of deal.

Of course this only works if they have good ideas.  Connectivity didn't work because they thought of the concept but didn't release any games that made good use of it until years later.

[TheYoungerPlumber]

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I think you guys are putting a little too much stock in E3.

I think any promotional event can seem successful and not produce results.  Sega did the MTV stuff years ago for the Dreamcast--look at Sega now!  Obviously Mr. Moore thought Sega's work with MTV was successful, or else he woulldn't be doing it againg for Xbox 360.  Xbox's first E3 was pretty poor compared to GameCube's showing.  So anything can happen, no matter how good/bad a E3 showing is for Microsoft, Sony or Nintendo.

[Nile Boogie]

"Nintendos selling point is the interface and the gameplay

So it makes ZERO sense to show video clips and graphics, when Iwata has harked on and on on how these very same things dont matter

So really id like to see them show it, no one will copy them but if they wont show the selling point. DONT show it at all."


I agree whole-heartedly with this statement.  I also believe if Nintendo shows nothing then you can just forget about Nintendo ever getting back to No#1.  The grace period for failure in the console race is just about up for them. "We see anything less the leader in the interactive entertainment as a failure". Yet Nintendo has been making the same mistakes since the late 1990's. We, "The Followers of the Shroomâ„¢" have been down this road before.  E3 wont be the end all, tell all but it will be very very important to the future of Nintendo. As unfair as it is, in today's world if you don't have the media-hype behind you, you're Decukf. When you don't have ºMedia-Hypeº behind you and you're trying to be no#1, you're dead.  Hopefully I'm all wrong like most of the time.


50cent is ºMedia-Hypeº


 

[zakkiel]

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The grace period for failure in the console race is just about up for them

Based on what? A crystal ball?

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As unfair as it is, in today's world if you don't have the media-hype behind you, you're Decukf. When you don't have ºMedia-Hypeº behind you and you're trying to be no#1, you're dead.

Based on what? Nintendo hasn't had media hype to speak of in four years at least, and they keep raking in cash.

[PaLaDiN]

I think Nintendo shouldn't show anything about the Rev at E3... if they do, no matter how good it is, they'll be overshadowed by MS and Sony.

It would probably be better if they waited for the ridiculous amount of hype to cool down somewhat then had a grand unveiling somewhere else to whip up media frenzy. Plus, they'll be able to modify their console to better take on Sony and MS's claims.

It's all about first impressions.

[Artimus]

Quote
Originally posted by: Dirk Temporo

Spaceworld is an industry-wide thing in Japan. They aren't going to bring it back just for the Revolution.

No...it's a Nintendo only show they stopped a few years ago.

[BiLdItUp1]

I agree with the statement someone said earlier about not putting too much stock in e3. Nintendo has had great e3's in the past, and it hasn't done jack in terms of changing the public's image of the company. At the same time, whenever Nintendo is doing something that a competitor isn't doing, it'll probably damage them from an image standpoint regardless. In any case, the 'stealing our stuff' argument is completely baseless at this point...if NCL is going to continue to run the company the way they like it, and not at least try to pander to the public demands immediately, not five years down the pipe like with online, then they will continue to lose their already small mindshare. With each passing year, doesn't the Nintendo-fan pool get smaller? What will happen to them when the pool dries up, and when the PSP is pushed even harder? What happens if NOA isn't given more autonomy? I'll tell you. Reggie will turn out to be a spinster, his hands tied by a parent company that doesn't seem to understand the business outside of their country.

Of course, this whole rant is based on a lot of ifs. So we just have to wait and see what really happens...

[Nile Boogie]

Quote
Originally posted by: zakkiel

Quote
The grace period for failure in the console race is just about up for them

Based on what? A crystal ball?

Quote
As unfair as it is, in today's world if you don't have the media-hype behind you, you're Decukf. When you don't have ºMedia-Hypeº behind you and you're trying to be no#1, you're dead.

Based on what? Nintendo hasn't had media hype to speak of in four years at least, and they keep raking in cash.

Market share is the only crystal ball I need. Nintendos' market share and more importantly, its fanbase is getting smaller every generation. Noa/japan seems to make the same mistakes everytime and for evey mistake made and promise broken they lose fanbase.  What I mean by grace period is The Followers of the Shroomâ„¢ has allowed Nintendo to get away with the mistakes they make because we love them. Thier games put us where we need to be. He who is loyal shall stand but the grace of man is weak. " Nintendo hasn't had media hype to speak of in four years..." and they continue to grow smaller as others take up the slack.
But anyway, E3 is fun and it wont decide anything but hopefully it'll bring faith to those starting to think the last days of Link are soon to come.  

[ThePerm]

I work in an elementary school as a tutor of 30 kids none of them have a gamecube....some don't even know what one is. They have xbox or ps2.......they have games like grand theft auto..dead to rights....max payne....and this is a private school......WTF THESE KIDS HAVE NEVER HEARD OF NINTENDO. NINTENDO NEEDS TO STOP THIS SECRECY BULLSHIT

it pisses me off because i grew up with Mario and its my culture. I just don't want Mario to go the way of Sinatra.  

[TheYoungerPlumber]

I'm more concerned that elemetry school kids are playing GTA and Max Payne, and parents are OK with that.  Not just because kids have no interest in kid-friendly games, but because it just isn't appropriate.  Call me old-fashioned, but if the new generation cannot give anything that isn't ultra-violent a chance, then we are seriously @$@ed as a nation and culture.

[Caillan]

I think it's just video games that are screwing themselves with too much violence. As long as violence sells, games will not gather mainstream acceptance as something useful and worthwhile. Video is an example of a modern medium which has respect as an art form. Right now it seems to me that most of the big games are like the crappy blockbuster action movies with little internal value over the explosions. I like Nintendo's games because they have a sort of original and creatve character you don't find anywhere else.

[Switchblade Cross]

I belive that Nintendo should show Zelda in all its glory.  Announce new and suprizing games for the GameCube!  After all, Rev will be backward compatable, so so the issue of "why make new games if it's console will obsoleted soon" will not be in the way.  Display some truly awsome items for the Nintendo DS.  Lets see a Palm OS add on cart, show off some new software and shed some more light on once we are already aware of.  Blow the lid off the Nintendo DS's online plans.

And finally, have Iwata give us a small glimpse of the Revolution.  Announce the offical name, and show some picutres, if not the actual console and controller.  No need to go into huge detail of the console's feature and new interface, just let us know what they are.  Then, show a teaser reel of game footage.  After the reel ends, the President's final statement will be "Thank you all for coming this morning, and I hope to see you again this August in Kyoto for Spaceworld 2005."

If that last part does't get people hyped, I don't know what will.

[The Omen]

Does anyone here actually beleive that Sony or Microsoft have NO idea what Nintendo is doing?  I'm fairly certain they have enough of an idea. Industry secrets are leaked ad nauseum.  They probably look at it as" Why would we copy Nintendo?" Or, "It's too ambitious and may backfire, so we'll play it safe"

Nintendo should show it in action behind closed doors to a few gaming sites, who then have to sign papers stating they cannot reveal it for 6 months.  This would enable Matt from IGN to drop hints like 'believe me, it'll be worth the wait'.  Or "You won't belive you eyes" Which will start to gather some hype.  Which will build up until Nintendo finally unviels it to the public.      

[Spak-Spang]

These elmentary school kids have PS2s and Xboxs because the parents are buying them for their older kids, or those kids are just buying them.  Then other cases are the fact that kids are hearing from other kids how cool their system is.  Kids are sheep.  They play whatever they are told to play and looks cool.

Parents need to actually take control and watch what their kids play and such, but they don't because its too hard.  They don't want to deal with their kids crying and throwing fits.  And the parents feel, I can't watch them all the time.  They will just play it at their friend's house.  Well games, movies, music everything influences children.  It won't make the kids into serial killers, but it does mess with them.

Now, back to E3.

(In next post)

[Grant10k]

Quote
Originally posted by: The Omen
Does anyone here actually beleive that Sony or Microsoft have NO idea what Nintendo is doing?  I'm fairly certain they have enough of an idea. Industry secrets are leaked ad nauseum.  They probably look at it as" Why would we copy Nintendo?" Or, "It's too ambitious and may backfire, so we'll play it safe"

Nintendo should show it in action behind closed doors to a few gaming sites, who then have to sign papers stating they cannot reveal it for 6 months.  This would enable Matt from IGN to drop hints like 'believe me, it'll be worth the wait'.  Or "You won't belive you eyes" Which will start to gather some hype.  Which will build up until Nintendo finally unviels it to the public.

If you start letting random people from game sites in on the secret, then there will be zero chance that it will remain a secret.

Most of Nintendo's great ideas have been copied in the past, you can't blame them for at least trying to protect their research. Let's take an example, a school science fair. Every year Nintendo makes an awsome project, and then Sony copies it. Sony is the popular kid and askes his friends to see his project and not look at Nintendo's project. Even if Nintendo's project is a little better, Sony takes away his thunder. Don't you think if Nintendo got a really good idea for the science fair, he might try a little harder to keep it a secret? If I keept getting copied year after year, I'd make damn sure that my research budget isn't aiding my competitors.

[Spak-Spang]

This is why Nintendo needs to start a serious ad campaign to make Nintendo seem like a viable choice.  I don't want Nintendo to be cool, their characters are beyond that.  Mickey Mouse and Bugs Bunny don't have to be "cool."  They just have to exist because they are good character.

I still say Nintendo needs to show as much as possible at E3 concerning Revolution.

Here is why:  Microsoft will be out this year.  Sony will not allow MS a whole year to build marketshare.  I predict Sony will launch next year in the summer.  Possibly even before next E3.  Nintendo must be ready for that possibility and be ready to launch as early as well.  Or Nintendo needs to make the first strike and launch earlier than Sony plans.  Make Sony completely last out of the gates and it becomes a huge uphill battle for Sony.

So what can Nintendo show?  At the conference videos are a must.  Then have somebody play the system for the audience explaining the system.  What will they be playing Mario 128.  Rumor has it that it has been pushed to the Revolution.  I am willing to bet with all years spent on the game it would be presentable at the show, and it will truly rock.  

Then let the press play Revolution backstage.  Perhaps even have one single unit out for the general E3 attendent to play.  I believe more and more that this is a must.  

Nintendo must start building the hype.  They must create a tidal wave image, such as this:

"Zelda is amazing at E3, but did you see how great online gaming with DS is.  So much easier and more enjoyable than PSP.  Oh and did you see the ultimate goodness of Revolution?  Nintendo is coming back.  Wow, are they ever coming back."

[vudu]

Quote
Originally posted by: Dirk Temporo
Spaceworld is an industry-wide thing in Japan. They aren't going to bring it back just for the Revolution.

I believe you're thinking of the Tokyo Game Show, not Spaceworld.

[nickmitch]

Nintendo needs to find a way to make you want to play but ten tell you that you can't.
The best way to do that is show Reggie The Great plying behind a cutain and have a good hefty ammount of video.