Topic: EA talks about the next generation.

[Gibdo Master]

Clicky

God, I hope this hasn't been posted already.

Anyway, I found this stuff to be quite interesting. I was delighted that EA didn't disclude Nintendo in this since I was half expecting them to only mention Sony and Microsoft.

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Huge, immersive, living worlds; described as Zelda... on steroids

fap fap fap fap fap  

[Bloodworth]

Yeah, it was a good presentation.  The thing that strikes me though is that your link is from Nintendojo, who as far as I know, weren't there.  I saw IGN, G4, GameSpy, Game Informer, 1Up, Newsweek, and heard Variety was there, but Nintendojo?  

[Gibdo Master]

Yes, I suppose I should be punished for that, but it was the first place I saw it at.

By the way, moving this gave me quite a scare. I thought you had just outright deleted it or something, and I was frantically searching all over the place for it.

EDIT: I also considered the possibility that unkown to me I had traveled back in time to before I posted it.  

[Gibdo Master]

Eh, I just read IGN's and GameSpot's article on this, and it looks like Nintendojo added Zelda into the quote I made in my first post. Bastards.

[Oldskool]

Er, how is EA in the position to predict what next-gen consoles will be like?

[KDR_11k]

I say over 50% of that is pure BS. Hydrodynamics... Yeah, right.

[vudu]

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The ability to model Pixar quality characters

correct me if i'm wrong, but didn't sony say the exact same thing about the ps2 before it was released?

[Pale]

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Originally posted by: Bloodworth
Yeah, it was a good presentation.  The thing that strikes me though is that your link is from Nintendojo, who as far as I know, weren't there.  I saw IGN, G4, GameSpy, Game Informer, 1Up, Newsweek, and heard Variety was there, but Nintendojo?

Does that mean you guys got to hang out with Billy again?

[KDR_11k]

Well, any PC has the ability to model Pixar quality characters. At less than one frame per second.

[Bloodworth]

He wasn't talking about the next generation of consoles so much as the future of games themselves.

And yeah, I got to hang out with Billy and some of the guys I met last year, and met a ton of new people.  

[Uncle Rich AiAi]

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Originally posted by: KDR_11k
I say over 50% of that is pure BS. Hydrodynamics... Yeah, right.

That's exactly what I was thinking.  Hydrodynamics?  hrhrhrhrhrhrhrhr!1!!!.......

I'm sticking w/ Miyamoto.  The jump next gen. won't be so big.

[KDR_11k]

I know Clonk. It doesn't even simulate close to the amounts needed for 3d display and still manages to choke ANY computer. That means >10 SPF (seconds/frame)

[ThePerm]

Well like it says in the article, they are really compating things to doom 3. Doom 3 is freaking impressive, as is half-life 2. Doom has some of the most impressive geometry and lighting i have ever seen. The detail is atrounding. Likewise for half-life 2, half-life 2 i dont think s lit as well or has a detailed of lighting, but its physics is crazy. It has extremely realistic physics that are just astounding. I mean if it has the right texture it will react realistically and according to physics. And it also has some really realistic water that is...hydrodynamic. Anyways these are pc games that are coming out really soon. Ther thing is pcs have a technical limitation in that games are always made to support multiple configurations of systems. This limit prevents them from making the engine really take advantage of the system to its fullest. On consoles however there is only one system configuration so devlopers can take more advantage of the system.

On my pc i run a program called facwegen. Its a demo, and its nto like i have the most buffed out pc, but the faces from facegen are extremely photoreal.The eyes have perfect radiosity maps, good skin detail and are about 2000 polygons i beleive, you can sport really deep empotion and you can make the faces look like just about any person unless they had some sort of weird deformaty. Anyways games will look very realistic very soon. They will not have like the perfect lighting that you see in pixar films, but their bleievability will be super high. The thing about renders is that they do the lighting effects perfect and it takes into the account all reflections and all shadows. Games only use gouroud shading with texture maps, and they create special engines for creating shadows that aren't raycast like in pixar images, but are simulated. However the simulation detail of this is going to soon be high enough to where all the extra shortcuts and stuff that are used in real time to trick the eye into beleiving that it is a highly rendered image.

anyways i will criticize miyamoto, hwe really hasn't taken full advantage of gamecube himself. Zelda and mario are using middleware if you remember and as such will not take advantage ully of the system. On n64 nintendo's prgrammers really worked the metal themselves and were able to get the msot out of the system. However their relying on i forgot who's middle wear to make hteir latest game and this is not an efficient method of making the software(unless you want to amek games faster) because middlwear doesnt take full advantage of the system. If i look at soem dreamcast games like shenmue...you can see that serga has actually taken more advantage of its sytem in some areas then nitnendo has. In shenmue the game is realistic and beleivable..but not totally real. There are some textures in there that are so clear you could read the text on them. Nintendo made games currently have blurry warped looks.

well i'll finish this later.

the next generation is going to be great....

[KDR_11k]

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Originally posted by: ThePerm
The eyes have perfect radiosity maps, good skin detail and are about 2000 polygons i beleive

1. What in hell are radiosity maps supposed to be? AFAIK radiosity means "bounced lights" (also called HDR(I)-rendering nowadays), nothing you'd need a map for. Did you mean the specmap or what?
2. Miyamoto has nothing to do with the tools the coders used, he's just the "ideas man" and has zero involvement with the coding itself.
3. Realism will always look better than cartoon stuff, since there are more small details in the textures. Another factor is how the levels are structured and priorities set. If you have only a few textures in memory at a time you can use larger ones, but if you have to keep a large level in RAM and are expecting fast movemenrts anyway you can/must use lower resolution textures.

Also, I heard somebody complain about the lacking texture memory of consoles, which resulted in "cleaner" textures (because you don't have enough pixels to paint dirt). That might be why PC games and survival horror games (which have few stuff on screen at a given time) look better than most realistic console games.

[ThePerm]

essentially radiosity lighting  is a very simple thing to fake..basically a radiosity map is a spec of color on a transparency that just follows the center of the camera(kinda like an environmental map)...its not real radiosity..this simply looks like real radiosity...thats prolyl what you mean by spec map..im sure different people in different companies and circles refer to the same things differently

also Im aware that miyamoto isn't a coder, but really you are going to notcie the difference between this generation and next. Its not like miyamoto games have really changed much from this generation from the last. Their essentially the same games they were in the last generation with better graphics adjusted for a better controller(one good thing he's done this generation) with a few improvements...but nothing real significant. This generation and n64 were not really much of a leap. I'v actually seen some gcn games that looked more pathetic then some n64 games(though not miyamoto games). The leap from this generation to next generation isn't really big, but the leap from the n64 generation to the next is. And really i dont think they have really taken advantage of this hardware. The only people who seem to really be takign advantage of this  generation is factor 5. Thier games look absolutely astounding. The only problem is their not making the type of games people would really want to play.

if we look at how well 3rd parties have doen this generation compared to the last you will see how things are going. In the last generation mediocre 3rd party games were less then mediocre....they were just crap really. This generation 3rd party games have improved signifigantly. I'm not jsut talking graphically. Theres alot more you can do with your gameplay when your not stifled by so many limitations. In the n64 days 3rd party efforts were downright crippled. Also, those pc devlopers complaining about the lack of ram don't know how to take advantage of the hardware. You don't see factor 5 complaining...and they have the best engines. They run at an eye pleasing 60(not completely steady..but good enough) frames per second..have complex geometry, lighting, physics, and good textures. Iv read some interviews with some gcn devlopers who were under the impression that gcn only had 20mb of ram.....anyways there are devlopers who are optimistic and are making good games..and there are those that are pessimistic and making crappy games.

anyways like i was saying graphically your going to notice the difference...there are even games on gamecube that look outstanding...looking very realistic..i would comment on resident evil 4..but i havnt seen a very good video of it because the latest was taped off a tv..when a better version comes out ill make my judgement. But from the looks of it it is really making gamecube do wonders. It looks from what i can tell like a newer pc game graphically...but  im not gonna say that quite yet until i get a better video of it.

my point is that in the next generation games are going to look incredibly like rendered fmvs. Thier not doing the same type of math. Their using alot of shortcuts and the end image is gonna look really close. Its hard to talk about graphics without sounding like a graphic whore, but I think since all a game is a vision on the screen which is communicating with the player then if you can visually communicate with the player in a better way..somehow you can entertain the player on a higher level...its kinda hard to explain

theres mroe...later..i msut go back to playing mystical ninja