Author Topic: Am I a Dinosaur? (Read 13743 times)

Ian Sane · « **Reply #25 on:** July 24, 2003, 11:37:22 AM »

I'd say selling out is when you snub your own fanbase in favour of the mainstream market. Therefore a company that achieves mainstream success but is still true to their loyal fanbase is not a sell out. Nintendo for example is successful but is not a sell out. If they started targeting only the mainstream and stopped releasing the games us fans love in favour of generic sports games and gorefests then they would be a sell out.

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #26 on:** July 24, 2003, 11:53:59 AM »

Ian Sane, that's the single most perfect statement I have seen on these boards. I have grown way too sick of people suggesting that Nintendo basically make Grand Theft Mario, or a Zelda game with blood and guts.

Anyways, thanks for all the replies here. I am a little too drunk to comment on them right now, but I will do so at a later point.

ThePerm · « **Reply #27 on:** July 24, 2003, 11:54:18 AM »

They're younger than my GameBoy!

ahahah thats classic....

and sell outs. A company who snubbed 98% of their fans...hmm are we talking about a certain british company?

The Omen · « **Reply #28 on:** July 24, 2003, 12:11:49 PM »

I have come to find in my old age of 29, the golden age for everything is between 12-18 years old. Which puts me with the NES. Even music, Metallica i still view as the best metal band ever, because thats who i liked back then, and still listen to. To all you youngins, your tastes will change and you'll like other things, but in movies, music and games, you'll always defend what you liked best at that age as being the best. Thats why parents always like what they liked when they were young, it stays with you somehow.

And Mario, SNES ...boring? It still has the best catalogue of games...ever.

ThePerm · « **Reply #29 on:** July 24, 2003, 12:14:24 PM »

actually when i was younger i used to really like metallica...now i dont really like them all that much anymore...i dont like alot of new music either....

The Omen · « **Reply #30 on:** July 24, 2003, 01:54:10 PM »

I tend to stand up for things i liked back when i was in the 12-18 age group, like' Please, Jay-z is nowhere near as good as Ice Cube back in the day' or my friend says that Disturbed is the best metal group. and i laugh. Or, M$ saved video games...which i just roll my eyes to. Its not that i dont like new things, its that in my eyes, they will never measure up to my favorites.

The RPG comments are funny, because i dont think any get better than the first 3 Final Fantasy games, the Mana series, Dragon Warrior series, Chrono Trigger and the Ultima series. But then that shows my age, right?

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #31 on:** July 24, 2003, 02:18:13 PM »

Which first thre FF games, Omen? Do you mean the actual/Japanese Final Fantasy 1, 2, and 3 for the NES (of which only FF1 was released here), or Final Fantasy 1, 4, and 6 (which were called FF1, 2, and 3 here)?

I don't have to stand up for bands that much- my favorite band ever is an extremely obscure weird/ska/punk band by the name of Pain (you've probably seen their Jabberjaw music video on Cartoon Network), my second favorite band is At the Drive-In, and I haven't found too many people that will actually badmouth them, and then there's bands like Queen or the Beatles who people have just gotten in the habit of NOT saying bad things about.

KnowsNothing · « **Reply #32 on:** July 24, 2003, 03:33:45 PM »

I'm not really into music. But lately I've been listening to Bob Marley (raggae), Israel Kamakawiwo`ole (Hawaiian), and Phish. I doubt that I'll stand up to people who hate them when I'm older, but when it comes to video games, I'll always defend Nintendo. As for Gamecube, I don't knwo if I'll consider this MY golden age of gaming, we'll have to see what next gen brings us.

manunited4eva22 · « **Reply #33 on:** July 24, 2003, 07:41:58 PM »

isn't that the guy who sings somewhere over the rainbow with that small guitar?

Ocarina Blue · « **Reply #34 on:** July 24, 2003, 07:59:53 PM »

Sorry, I realize that my post was a little exaggerated, it should only be targeted at the pop industry, not the music industry in general, but pop is a large part of the industry. Mario: A good example would be the Payola scandal, where record companies paid DJ's to play and hype up certain songs they released on the radio. It worked well. That was a while ago, but things haven't changed much. My second source is the advertising I see for pop. I'm not talking about a band advertising their concert, but for giant posters and TV adverts for popstars. Most of them aren't even advertising an album, only the pop star them. This would imply that they are not advertising to raise awareness of an album, or even the artist themselves (most people know the big names of pop anyway), but to just cram the idea that the artist advertised is big and (therefore) good. My last (and main) source for that statement was experience; I still go to school, and most of the people who like pop there all like the same pop. I'm always caught in the middle of discussions about how good one singer is or how good at dancing another is, but I've never heard anyone claim they like one song when another doesn't. I regret generalizing people who like pop, and I regret wording it so harshly, and I apologize if I offended you or anyone else.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #35 on:** July 24, 2003, 09:30:29 PM »

KnowsNothing- if you like raggae, i think you'd like The Specials. Technically they're ska, but ska kind of spawned from raggae way back in the day and The Special's music certainly shows a lot of influence from it. My favorite songs from them are Message to You, Rudy and Shanty Town 007.

Mario · « **Reply #36 on:** July 24, 2003, 10:03:18 PM »

Quote
And Mario, SNES ...boring? It still has the best catalogue of games...ever.

... in your opinion.

Ocarina Blue: Ok fair enough, but just because an artist or band is popular, doesnt mean they aren't talented.

HiTmaN · « **Reply #37 on:** July 24, 2003, 10:09:58 PM »

Quote
I'd say selling out is when you snub your own fanbase in favour of the mainstream market. Therefore a company that achieves mainstream success but is still true to their loyal fanbase is not a sell out. Nintendo for example is successful but is not a sell out. If they started targeting only the mainstream and stopped releasing the games us fans love in favour of generic sports games and gorefests then they would be a sell out.

I'll agree with you but to a point. What if your in the position that not being in favor of the mainstream market is casuing bad sales and your buisness to crumble. Do you go make the fans you have happy? Or make the general public happy and make more money. I mean yeah I like when bands/companies are small and at their peak and are kick ass, but that can only go on for so long. Eventually we all get money hungry.

PIAC · « **Reply #38 on:** July 24, 2003, 11:29:19 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: mouse_clicker
KnowsNothing- if you like raggae, i think you'd like The Specials. Technically they're ska, but ska kind of spawned from raggae way back in the day and The Special's music certainly shows a lot of influence from it. My favorite songs from them are Message to You, Rudy and Shanty Town 007.

sorry to be a bitch, but reggae came from ska ;P
i have a few specials songs have a looky at some more specials songs, also check out Desmond Dekker, The Beat (aka The English Beat) and Madness

ska owns

KnowsNothing · « **Reply #39 on:** July 25, 2003, 05:21:10 AM »

I've only heard to a few ska songs, and they were weird. which is good.

Oh, and PIAC, put the actual url up. Geocities doesn't allow direct linking.

Ian Sane · « **Reply #40 on:** July 25, 2003, 07:31:15 AM »

"sorry to be a bitch, but reggae came from ska"

Really? When did ska "debut"? Reggae's been around for a long time.

"What if your in the position that not being in favor of the mainstream market is casuing bad sales and your buisness to crumble. Do you go make the fans you have happy? Or make the general public happy and make more money. I mean yeah I like when bands/companies are small and at their peak and are kick ass, but that can only go on for so long. Eventually we all get money hungry."

It is possible to remain true to your fans and target the mainstream at the same time. It's not like bands suddenly suck because they're popular. I find that most bands that "make it" tend to evolve their sound as they go on. It's sort of a natural progression, a desire to improve. If a band becomes popular gradually because of it then they're not really sell outs. A sell out is a band that complete caters to the market, the sort of band that changes their sound almost overnight just to accomodate the mainstream market.

Round Eye · « **Reply #41 on:** July 25, 2003, 08:45:34 AM »

A sell out is any band, or singer, that puts the commercial success of the song ahead of their personal artistic and creative merit. In other words they take a look at what is popular now and write their song to match the trend. That is why the pop music scene is always seems so stale, all the popular bands and artists are just feeding off of themselves, hence the term 'Pop will eat itself.'

The main issue I have with pop music is that it is extremely youth driven. That is why boy bands enjoy the success that they do, and crap like American Idol is so popular. I think the sooner that the music industry chokes on its own sh!te and dies the better it will be for us all. Britney and Timberlake may be out of a job but they could always work at Mcdonalds where they belong. All you youngins who like that kind of tripe please keep downloading the songs from Kazaa, free is all that they are worth, and you are helping end the music industy autocracy.

Thank you

Grey Ninja · « **Reply #42 on:** July 25, 2003, 12:40:07 PM »

lol. Well said Round Eye.

HiTmaN · « **Reply #43 on:** July 25, 2003, 12:58:27 PM »

"It is possible to remain true to your fans and target the mainstream at the same time. It's not like bands suddenly suck because they're popular. I find that most bands that "make it" tend to evolve their sound as they go on. It's sort of a natural progression, a desire to improve. If a band becomes popular gradually because of it then they're not really sell outs. A sell out is a band that complete caters to the market, the sort of band that changes their sound almost overnight just to accomodate the mainstream market. "

Yeah I know what your saying and I agree with you. But there are alot of people who enjoy underground rock and once one of their videos hit MTV they instantly think they sold out.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #44 on:** July 25, 2003, 01:10:53 PM »

Yeah, I'm pretty sure ska came from raggae- like Ian's said, raggae's been around for a loooong time and ska's been around since like the early 60's, I think. In any case, The Specials' sound has a lot of raggae in it, which I personally like a lot.

PIAC · « **Reply #45 on:** July 25, 2003, 07:35:41 PM »

heh, trust me guys, reggae was a derivative from ska, atleast from all the history things ive read, dont have any onhand at the moment, but search for 'a history of ska' or something and that should clear things up

www.geocities.com/clan_fanforced/piacsplaylist.html

and yeah, the specials are an awsome band

get some songs by madness mouse_clicker, take the specials and 2 shakes of nuttyness and there you go, madness

HiTmaN · « **Reply #46 on:** July 25, 2003, 07:45:25 PM »

Bob Marley is the ultimate reggae singer without a doubt. Anyone like Ziggy Marley?

Ms.Pikmin · « **Reply #47 on:** July 25, 2003, 08:15:57 PM »

Actually, it appears that PIAC is right. I just looked at several articles about reggae and ska. Ska dates back to the VERY late fifties and early 60's but reggae didn't come around until the mid to late 60's.

mouse_clicker · « **Reply #48 on:** July 25, 2003, 08:35:14 PM »

Really? Ha- here I was all along thinking ska had been the bastard child of raggae when it was the other way around- CRAZY.

I'll definitely check out Madness, PIAC- it's obvious you're a huge ska fan, one whose opinion I won't take lightly.

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Author Topic: Am I a Dinosaur? (Read 13743 times)