Topic: Nintendo 3DS U.S. Sales Reach 4.5 Million

[Chozo Ghost]

The 3DS is powerful enough, but it lacks in versatility because of only one analog. The CPP temporarily addresses this, and hopefully there will also be a revision which permanently addresses it.

[broodwars]

The 3DS...lacks in versatility because of only one analog. The CPP temporarily addresses this, and hopefully there will also be a revision which permanently addresses it.

This.  Plus, I wonder how of the device's power Nintendo could have freed for other functions if they didn't have to waste their resources on the 3D gimmick that I can't even use because it rapidly gives me a nasty headache.

And mods, if you're going to insult me with terrible custom titles, you should at least get your grammar right.  It's "Poor Man's Imitation of Ian Sane".  "Imitation" only has one "m" as well.

I'm starting to think that Jim Sterling isn't the only one who likes poking fanboys with a stick...   

Well, I am starting to see why he enjoys it so much.   

[Adrock]

What wasted resources? The 3D effect is just a parallax barrier placed in front of the LCD. That's the simplest technology and has nothing to do with how powerful 3DS is. DMP's custom PICA200 GPU is as powerful as Nintendo wanted it to be. Games don't even have to use the 3D effect if developers want the extra processing punch instead. The depth slider would just do nothing if 3D wasn't specifically programmed into the game. You just sound bitter because you can't use it.

[broodwars]

What wasted resources? The 3D effect is just a parallax barrier placed in front of the LCD. That's the simplest technology and has nothing to do with how powerful 3DS is. DMP's custom PICA200 GPU is as powerful as Nintendo wanted it to be. Games don't even have to use the 3D effect if developers want the extra processing punch instead. The depth slider would just do nothing if 3D wasn't specifically programmed into the game. You just sound bitter because you can't use it.

Actually, to display the 3D effect the device has to render every frame of every game twice, as well as the additional non-3D screen.  That means that unless the game just does not respond to the 3D slider to begin with, a large chunk of the 3DS' processing power should be tied up producing the 3D effect.  You waste the processing power of a 60-frame 2D image on a 30-frame 3D image, and that's processing power that could be better put to use elsewhere.  You can see the results of this in early 3DS titles like Dead or Alive, where I believe there were complaints about framerate issues because the device was struggling to render every frame twice for the 3D effect.

And I'm not "bitter because I can't use it."  I have no problem seeing 3D without side effects when I'm at theme parks and whatnot.  I dislike 3D in the theater and home entertainment markets because it's a useless, tacky gimmick that was designed to sucker people.  And yes, that includes Sony's pathetic obsession with it as well, though as least I can understand why they cling to it: they have TVs to sell.  Nintendo just jumped on the bandwagon because they couldn't think of anything else that could be a notable gimmick for their next-generation handheld.  Because, you know, it's not like a second analog stick (or, rather, "two" analog sticks since the 3DS doesn't use analog sticks) right out of the gate would have affected gameplay more than the illusion of 3D.

[UncleBob]

And mods, if you're going to insult me with terrible custom titles, you should at least get your grammar right.  It's "Poor Man's Imitation of Ian Sane".  "Imitation" only has one "m" as well.

I will admit to the double-m type-o, but regarding the "of" part...


Regardless, now I'm going to leave the two M's there.  Just because I can.

[Adrock]

Actually...

Like I said:

Games don't even have to use the 3D effect if developers want the extra processing punch instead. The depth slider would just do nothing if 3D wasn't specifically programmed into the game.

3D isn't required. Processing resources aren't wasted when developers are willingly programming 3D into the game. That's not Nintendo's fault or concern. Nintendo gave developers the tools and let them decide how to use them which is on their own volition and at their own discretion. Developers are aware of the limitations and make adjustments accordingly. 3D is one of the least intrusive innovations Nintendo has ever included in their hardware as it can be avoided entirely by developers and consumers. It adds very little cost to the hardware because the parallax barrier is such a cheap component.

[NWR_insanolord]

The second analog isn't that important in most types of games, especially since the touch screen is capable of assuming its duties in a lot of (but not all) cases. Of the 31 3DS games I own, only a small few of them would have been meaningfully improved with a second analog, and one of them includes the ability through the CPP. And in regard to power, look at Resident Evil: Revelaitons and tell me the system needs more horsepower. Capcom said they were able to port RE5 to the thing.

[Adrock]

The right slider couldn't hurt but I don't see how it's being used as a mark against 3D. What? Because 3D was included and the right slider wasn't? That's faulty thinking. 3D and the right slider aren't mutually exclusive. Nintendo could have included both. They just didn't and including 3D wasn't the reason they didn't include the right slider. I just don't understand how anyone can find fault in 3D being included. It's entirely avoidable for people who can't or don't want to use it. I never play 3DS games with 3D on. I simply prefer not to. Some people like it and it's great for them.

[Chocobo_Rider]

At this point hating on Nintendo after an extremely brief moment of praise and ultimately predicting their complete down fall isn't just the trend with the gaming media it is one of Newton's Laws.

And that kind of pure bias hardly ever seen with Sony and Microsoft. EVER!

Amen, brotha.

~~~

@Insandolord

Agreed.

@DJ Adrock

Agreed.

~~~

Also, does anyone else find the 3DS-induced headaches thing to sound psychosomatic?  I mean, I can understand if those same people simply get headaches from any monitor - because real life is not "backlit," so to speak, so the literally more intense light could be irritating to eyes and cause a discomfort.

But what problem could possibly be caused by sending a slightly different intense image to each eye? As opposed to the same intense image to both eyes? Take away the intensity and that's what real life does!  And it's not like the intensity multiplies when sending two separate images.

So what gives?

My theory is this: the media loves scare tactics (2001: "will soy milk make you go blind!? news at 11!"). So, I imagine that when certain members of the media got their hands on the 3DS they thought "this is really new... new things are unknown... unknown things can be scary... am I scared of this? I think I am! I should tell everyone!"  Thus, they start writing up stories like this one which sound reasonably official (it's a Dr! They're never wrong!) but really offer no concrete explanation and even less conclusiveness.

Thus Nintendo had to be like "fine, fine, we'll put a warning on and do our normal 'please take a break!' deal again ... happy?"  At which point, the damage is done... if Nintendo ignored the reports then it's "what are you hiding, hmm??" but if they add the warning it's "a ha! See! It must be true!"

So, again, I don't doubt that the 3D effect gives some people headaches.  But I don't see any way it could be more than psychosomatic - which is valid to an extent, us humans experience psychosomatic symptoms all the time.   But unless this one can be proven, I don't think we should be faulting the hardware.

[TJ Spyke]

I can't use the 3D at full effect, even halfway can make my eyes sore. Only the 3DS does that though, when I watch 3D movies in theatres or 3D content on a TV, I don't experience that.

I still love my 3DS though.

[broodwars]

Also, does anyone else find the 3DS-induced headaches thing to sound psychosomatic?  I mean, I can understand if those same people simply get headaches from any monitor - because real life is not "backlit," so to speak, so the literally more intense light could be irritating to eyes and cause a discomfort.

But what problem could possibly be caused by sending a slightly different intense image to each eye? As opposed to the same intense image to both eyes? Take away the intensity and that's what real life does!  And it's not like the intensity multiplies when sending two separate images.

So what gives?

So, again, I don't doubt that the 3D effect gives some people headaches.  But I don't see any way it could be more than psychosomatic - which is valid to an extent, us humans experience psychosomatic symptoms all the time.   But unless this one can be proven, I don't think we should be faulting the hardware.

Here. Roger Ebert had a great piece on why 3D has its health problems.

[Caterkiller]

I can't use the 3D at full effect, even halfway can make my eyes sore. Only the 3DS does that though, when I watch 3D movies in theatres or 3D content on a TV, I don't experience that.

I still love my 3DS though.

It's funny, I am just the opposite. Watching movies is the worst, 3DS I can do, probably due to the fact that I can just turn it off when ever I feel like.

[Chozo Ghost]

3D is a harmless gimmick which can be disabled by either the user or the developer if it is unwanted. We should consider ourselves lucky Nintendo choose that as the gimmick this time around instead of something like waggle controls like on the Wii. Could you imagine if Nintendo had designed the 3DS to use a tiny waggle stick like the wiimote except tinier?

[Chocobo_Rider]

Here. Roger Ebert had a great piece on why 3D has its health problems.

Hey, man, look at us! We did it! You provided me with evidence and it changed my mind! *birds sing, rainbows dance across the clear, blue sky* 

"We can do this. 3D films would not work if we couldn't. But it is like tapping your head and rubbing your stomach at the same time, difficult. So the 'CPU' of our perceptual brain has to work extra hard, which is why after 20 minutes or so many people get headaches. They are doing something that 600 million years of evolution never prepared them for."

That's what I was looking for.  An explanation with face validity... not just "it's more strenuous!... cuz it is!" which is all I'd ever heard.  Great find, broodwars! 


My responses to the rest of the article would be:

1. He's right about any 3D that requires glasses.  It's (SO MUCH) darker, and alienating.  I will never willingly attend one again and as someone who wears corrective glasses, I look forward to that awkward glasses-on-glasses action disappearing from theaters entirely.

2. The only drawback still present in the way the 3DS handles 3D is that demand on our brain's "CPU."  However, mathematically they would have to be less severe than the 3D movies discussed in the article.  Instead of our eyes/brains grappling with differences in triangle lengths of 10' - 120', we're dealing with lengths of, what, 6" - 36"?  Less, mental gymnastics should decrease the frequency/severity of strain, no?

... and of course, the inclusion of the 3D slider means you can always turn it down, or off.

3. I can't believe I didn't make this connection this before, but, the way the article described the issue as being more of mental strain than physical (eye) strain, I realized that as I get closer to sleepy time, I tend to turn the 3D slider down! In other words, as my mind becomes fatigued later in the day, it becomes harder to find the mental strength required to accomplish the "work" described in the article!  I never get headaches, but I just "don't feel like it" - it must be too mentally demanding at those times!

Look at all this learning!

This also makes sense for why they make a big deal about kids whose eye/mind connection may still be developing.  It could potentially be like having a kid learn to walk with weights on his feet.  Ultimately not a big danger, but a developmental hindrance.

4. Also, really, anyone who has this issue... even if this is the proper explanation... it's not that your mental CPU is "weak," rather, as he described, it's like patting your head and rubbing your stomach - it's a very specific skill that everyone will be more or less adept at.  Some people are dumb as a brick but they can quarterback a professional football offense.  Some people can solve complex physics problems but don't know how to tell a joke, etc ...

I've never had a problem with 3DS, but if I try to read in a car I get nauseous ... I'm sure it's a very similar principle: optical processing with added difficulty (moving car).  But no one thinks it makes me stupid or books dangerous...... right? 

@Caterkiller

3D movies (with glasses) just suck... who cares about the headache, the payoff just isn't good!

[TJ Spyke]

"tapping your head and rubbing your stomach at the same time, difficult", never been difficult to me. It's not hard to do at all.

3D movies done right are great (key word is "right" since some just slap it on without trying to make it work).

[MegaByte]

Hayashida used a more difficult example in his Mario talk: do a sequence of rock paper scissors with one hand while doing just rock and paper with the other.

[Chocobo_Rider]

Hayashida used a more difficult example in his Mario talk: do a sequence of rock paper scissors with one hand while doing just rock and paper with the other.

... this isn't so ba--... AH! MY HEAD!!