Author Topic: Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.  (Read 5772 times)

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Offline Byron

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I know in the past few months there have been a lot of bad news about the Gamecube.  But I think that is the way Nintendo wants it.  I think Nintendo wants profit vs. userbase.

Nintendo has made 55 million profit in 2002 while the XBox has lot 170 million.  Of course with the XBox slaughtering the GC in sales worldwide lately Nintendo would have to be pretty stupid not do something about it like making more advertisements and marketing since they could probably annilhilate the XBox if they were willing to spend a large portion of their 8 billion dollar warchest to do it.

So why aren't they?  Well Nintendo knows that beating the XBox would be useless because they know the XBox is just an advertisement for XBox 2.  So if Nintendo spends their resources beating XBox 1 then they won't have enough to contend with XBox 2.  So Nintendo is just trying to build up profit to fight XBox 2.

Microsoft says they want to make profit off XBox 2 and thus probably won't give away free games or cut the price down as early as they did with XBox 1.  Lets face it Nintendo was killing XBox in Europe until Microsoft decided to give away the free games and cut the price down.  Also XBox was losing its touch in America until they did the same thing.  Microsoft assured their shareholders that the loss in XBox 1 will be made up in XBox 2.

So will the people who bought XBox just for the free stuff and the cheap price be willing to pay full price for XBox 2?  Now this is where Nintendo comes in.  If they can hype up the next Nintendo system with the profit they've been making then XBox 2 will lose money and the M$ shareholders will be pissed and maybe vote for Microsoft to leave the gaming industry.  Microsoft is taking a big gamble here.

Reputation is important in the videogame industry.  N64 sold 50 million consoles just because of SNES but of course when Gamecube came along those 50 million dumped the GC because they got burned off the N64.  Dreamcast died because of reputation and PS2 thrived because of it.

Now Nintendo is trying to make as many award winning games as possible and not advertising them to make profit for the war against XBox 2.  The award winning games are there to generate GOOD REPUTATION for the next Nintendo system so the people who have Gamecube won't leave the next Nintendo system like the N64 userbase did with the Gamecube.

Lets face it most people bought XBox because of the cheap price and free games and so far most XBox games have been getting lack luster reviews so if history repeats itself XBox 2 will be in a bind because the XBox 1 hasn't been too impressive so far.  So MAYBE the userbase of XBox 1 will leave Microsoft unless Microsoft decides to give free games and lower the price again but I doubt they will since they are sacrificing profit just so they can make a big bang with XBox 2 and are trying to make profit.

This might not be the plan Nintendo has but it is a theory.  But if it is their plan and thats why they haven't been doing anything about marketing and stuff then it is a big gamble for Nintendo to try to save up most of their marketing to get rid of XBox 2 and Microsoft from the gaming industry.

It does make sense since Nintendo had more ads with the NES when they had less money and there are more GBA ads than GC ads even at the beginning.

Nintendo did say that PS2 is #1 because they had a headstart so maybe Nintendo's plan is to compete with the next gen systems and not with the current one.  And since the PS2 has not gotten a lot of great games lately either maybe Nintendo is trying to get #1 place in one swoop and be king again in the next gen wars.

So I hope Nintendo's long plan forecasting works out for them.

Offline Taco

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2003, 08:18:04 AM »
Wow another one of these threads....

Offline Agent

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2003, 08:45:22 AM »
You mean a feel good topic?  

Offline theaveng

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2003, 11:59:56 AM »
For every 1 GameCube sold last month, almost *6* PS2s were sold.

How can anyone feel good about that?  GameCube's market share right now is comparable to the Sega Master System in the late 80's.  Or the Sega Saturn in the late 90's.

Offline PIAC

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #4 on: February 22, 2003, 12:25:17 PM »
i think that it was a well put togeather theory/post
makes alot of sence, and perhaps im generalising here but it seems most Xbox owners are "casual gamers" which means they will most likely be turned off alot easyer than say your die hard nintendo fan.

negativity breeds negativity, positive thinking all the way

Offline DRSMU

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #5 on: February 22, 2003, 01:48:52 PM »
Sorry Lyron....I mean Bryon.But most people who own an Xbox will most likly buy the Xbox 2 because the people who own the Xbox have 10+ games(Example) and will most likly buy the Xbox 2.Since Xbox 2 will be compatable with Xbox 1.


The same happend with the PSX,and the PS2.And will happen to the Xbox,and Xbox 2.Your wild theorys are so ummmm wild!



Offline Mario

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Offline Agent

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2003, 03:19:52 PM »
I ment how the first few paragraphs were about how the xbox 2 was gonna fail and nintendo would take over again. A feel good topic...  

Offline Byron

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2003, 02:43:00 AM »
Quote

Originally posted by: DRSMU
Sorry Lyron....I mean Bryon.But most people who own an Xbox will most likly buy the Xbox 2 because the people who own the Xbox have 10+ games(Example) and will most likly buy the Xbox 2.Since Xbox 2 will be compatable with Xbox 1.


The same happend with the PSX,and the PS2.And will happen to the Xbox,and Xbox 2.Your wild theorys are so ummmm wild!


Uh are you saying the XBox 1 will finish in 1st place?  Because PS2 was sucessful because the PSX was in #1 place.  Since reputation of good games will get the customers.  Fact is even #2 is not good enough to get a following if the games aren't spectacular just look at the N64 and its game drought even though it was #2 and sold 50 million.  But when the GC came every dumped it.  Look at the XBox now.  Now I'm not going to say XBox games blow but according to gamerankings their games are mostly mediocre.  Do you think people are going to buy XBox 2 because the games on XBox 1 ruled???  You and I both know XBox is only #2 because of the early price cuts and free games.  GC was dominating in Europe and Japan and starting to in America until Microsoft pulled that stunt.

Do you think the same people who bought the XBox for the free stuff will buy XBox 2 for full price?  Yeah maybe if the games on the XBox were award winning.

Nintendo on the other hand have been releasing award winning games like every 2 months and I'm guessing they want to create a good word of mouth for the next console based on the repuation of the good games on the GC.  

The second reason why people want an XBox is because of the power.  Sorry but Microsoft says they want to get XBox 2 out the door as early as possible so the XBox 2 might not be as powerful as the next Nintendo system since it is coming after XBox 2 and usually the newer technology is the more powerful.  This could turn off a lot of XBox owners because a lot of them bought it because it was the most powerful hardware wise.

So in the next gen wars Microsoft will lose both console hardware and not enough good games so far.  Just like the N64 did.  But again I'm not saying this is 100% fact it is a THEORY.

Offline Termin8Anakin

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2003, 04:33:15 AM »
Nintendo wants to get their next console (let's just call it GC2) out around about the same time as PS3, and maybe Xbox2. The next-gen will be THE MOST competetive in history. Three consoles aiming for release around the same time as each other will cause pandemonium. If Nintendo actually DO delay their console, they CANNOT do it for more than a year, heck, not even a month. If Microsoft releases the XB2 before GC2, a month is not enough to put more features into it to be more powerful and flashy. A year may do it, but then it's already too late.
Like Byron said, Nintendo NEED to use those awards to their advantage. Advertise the games that won them. Have big blowouts. Starting a TV ad with the comments of various game mediums like movies do: "Game of the year", "Winner of five (insert award name) awards", "The graphics and sound are mind-blowing", "It's an edge of your seat action game" will make lots of people think it's one of the best selling PS2 or XBox games like GTA3/Vice City or Halo. Then something like Zelda shows up, and people will be pretty shocked , and their opinions will change.

And yeah. Anyone who bought the XBox with free games might not even buy the XBox 2 full price, since the games that were given with the deal were crap anyway. Sega GT 2002 is crap (I hate simulations), JSRF has clunky controls and awkward level design. And Halo, well, lets just say there is something called Metroid Prime.
With Gamecube's free game deal (here in Australia anyway), the only mediocre game is NBA Cortside 2002. The other three are STar Fox Adventures, Super Smash Bros Melee and Eternal Darkness. And I believe that Metroid Prime is also a free game in America.
Nintendo put the best games with deal, so it would give gamers more incentive to continue with Nintendo.

And XBox2 might be released first, but since Nintendo want to release GC2 around the same time as PS3 and XBox2, it won't give them much time to change the specs or upgrade some parts. If Nintendo want the most powerful console, that is easy to develop for, they need to get ALL the bottle necks from Gamecube and fix them all for GC2 right at the start of planning it. These bottlenecks (although considered fixed), include more RAM, faster processor, much more capable video compression techniques, and 5.1 surround sound. Others can include the design of the console itself (some didn't buy GC cause of it's look - you know who you are), and the size of the disc.

And hopefully, Microsoft will look at it's 'welcome' into the console game industry and take a hint.
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Offline Hemmorrhoid

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2003, 05:27:44 AM »
Damn you people the console war is just about a year and a couple months old, and this generation sure wont end until end of 2005 perhaps 2006.
LZ 2005

Offline )Dark-LInk(

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2003, 07:49:02 AM »
my theory is that the garanteed victory in the next con war for nintendo is MAKE the CONSOLE as or more powerful then its rivals AND the most important HAVE 2-3 games GROUDNDBREAKING games rdy for LAUNCH the exact same DAY!
examples
legend of zelda
NEW MARIO GAMES(sequel to M64 of course!)
AND maybe even A SSB game
have one of these 3 and many other 3rd party at launch and YOU got your CROWN back NINTENDO.(even if MS had HALO3 OR SOMETHING LIKE IT they couldnt compete with a M64 SEQUEL MARIO)

Offline VideoGamerX

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #12 on: February 23, 2003, 08:50:38 AM »
I'm sorry, but Sony has already demonstrated that system specifications make about as much difference as the original Nintendo Entertainment System's did. If specifications made such a huge difference in the market, the Xbox would be outselling its competition, which it's not. What Microsoft is doing right is following Nintendo's old formula. Sony has done some of the same thing, too. They're advertising their product out the wazoo and getting it over to the "mainstream" which happens to encompass most of the consumer market. If you consider yourself to not be mainstream, then that's comparable to living under a rock. There's nothing wrong with that or appealing to the mainstream. It's how Nintendo got into first place to begin with. It's how you increase sales of a product.

Obviously, having a good system to work with is very important to the developers. Some of the advertisement of system spec's is directed at a certain demographic. Most PS2 gamers do not care about console power. Some of the guys who specialize in PC gaming may care (considering that where man's automobile used to be a show of his 'manhood', computers have seemingly taken over for some). The system power, if advertised correctly, can be somewhat effective on some, but the keyword is advertised. Most Xbox owners had system power implanted in their minds. They know as little about the Xbox's power as they do the Gamecube's. So what? The key is that it was advertised. The Xbox's true winning specification is its platform compatability. It uses many of the same tools a PC does. Programmers know a lot about it. In the end, all they care about is that it takes little work to port PC-to-Xbox and the little clunky box has the hardware to support the software without butchering it too much. That's all it amounts to. If it wasn't specifically like that, the Xbox's power would go unnoticed.

For Sony, its formula remains cranking out the key titles people are looking for. Plain and simple. They are relaxed in development for their system, and third parties like that. Sony doesn't go around telling developers what to do for their system. Sony, in the beginning, had the full equation for winning. That's not so much the truth anymore, but they still have the upperhand. They advertise and manage to satisfy their consumers. What can be said about Sony now is not so much important to this argument as it is Sony's performances in this generation that gives us the example. Sony did something right a while back. They've made sure their consumers have plenty to keep them occupied, they've delivered the requested products, and they advertised it like crazy. Sony has set a standard in the industry by managing to give their games (third parties most importantly) the exposure needed to cause their consumers to buy a wider variety of games; the demo discs are an example.

The point of the two companies and their performance is that they're doing basically what Nintendo used to. They have gotten over to the consumer. That's all it takes. Once the consumer readily knows you, they wouldn't have a clue if your consoles exploded or you had only one good game, and they would buy your product. It's recognition that you exist. The more Xbox ads we see, the more we know Xbox is a product that is surviving. If we stopped seeing Xbox, wouldn't we all start to assume they are dying or weakening? The more I see of Xbox, the more I think it's taking over. When I see it all over TV, all over billboards and signs, I start to think it's overpowering the competition. This is subconscious. Because I'm a more diverse consumer (diverse in that I use considerably more sources for product information), the exposure from TV and signs means less to me, but I am not the statistical norm. Even with my sources, I sometimes wonder where Nintendo is, and if they're thriving. I have to go out of my way to see how Nintendo is doing. I don't have to do that with Sony and Xbox. They make sure I know they're alive. This is the point I make, and it brings up more questions.

Why has Nintendo changed? What has gone on inside of Nintendo to change the company from what it used to be? We know Nintendo is a bully, or was is more like it. They have angered developing groups in the past. They have had entire chains of stores to not want to do business with them. Nintendo used to be a shark. I know this to be true just by looking at how they view today's market with their products. However, somewhere during the 1990's, they transformed. They transformed from a hungry competitive gaming business to a relaxed conservative business. Since that transformation, they have slipped from first. The consumer has started to forget what a Nintendo is. I have actually met serious gamers who do not know what a Gamecube is. The audience for Nintendo is growing up and unless we see more exposure for the products, young gamers will grow up on a Playstation or an Xbox, and that is the absolute truth in America. I grew up playing the console my dad bought. Why doesn't this make sense to Nintendo?

The bottom line is that quality games and system power do not move consoles. Playstation2 is making the competition look bad on recognition alone. Yes, that recognition stems from having a handful of quality products, but without the recognition the games would go largely unnoticed. The Nintendo64 is a prime example of how important exposure is, granted it was depleating exposure, it still played a major role in the N64's early success. While Nintendo was still battling with Sony over top spot in the spotlight, the games were selling very well, but Nintendo was already cutting back on its message to the mainstream and sure enough, not too long after the launch, the advertisement was disappearing and gamers were losing a sense that the N64 was a success. It wasn't until the Legend of Zelda, a greatly hyped game, that the N64 would pull itself back into the minds of the media. We all know what happened after Ocarina of Time. Sony continued its advertisement just as always while Nintendo forfeited its exposure and trailed the rest of the way. Having the quality titles did next to nothing to boost Nintendo sales simply because gamers were uncertain over the well-being of the Nintendo64. They knew it was out there, but many of them would not buy it because they saw the Playstation as being the console with the most happening (a more confident purchase because Sony is letting them know it's alive).

The formula for console gaming has not changed. Let Sony and Microsoft be an example that Nintendo's old formula still works. If Nintendo wants to compete with Microsoft and Sony, they will meet them in battle on TVs everywhere. It doesn't matter what games, they can do it with the franchises they've got! Get the gamers back into the games, Nintendo. Recognition is all it takes to convince consumers you're a good buy. It doesn't matter so much about image as long as you appear to be giving a good fight.

Now, I have to say one more thing that's not quite related to the above. Some of you are making the comment that Xbox2 won't do as well, but I don't know for sure. After what Sony has done in this current generation, I'm under the impression that if it happens again, Sony will take the tumble. They are not playing the game as sharply as they did with the first Playstation, and if Sony is as arrogant as I think they are (translation: as arrogant as Nintendo was), Microsoft is going to climb into number one in America in the next generation if it continues the onslaught. However, it largely depends on what Bill wants to do. He has the media power to plaster Sony if it makes the same mistake again. The Playstation2 was so vulnerable during that first year that a competitor could have made the jump. The shortage of consoles looked bad and the lack of quality games was ugly and looked an awful lot like what Nintendo does. Plain and simple, all Nintnedo needs to do is show a little market power and advertise in the next generation.  

Offline Dolphin64X

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #13 on: February 25, 2003, 07:38:05 AM »
I believe that one reason Nintendo cut back on advertising is the rising costs of game development.  A game still sells the same amounts, but it costs much more to make, and so Nintendo, perhaps in order to preserve its bottom line, feels it needs to cut something.  Thus, advertising gets cut so that profits will remain the same.  As I have said before, I believe the reason Nintendo does not advertising much is because they think of every action in terms of immediate profitability.  If advertising over a certain extent for Metroid Prime would start deteriorating profits (because of the expense of the advertising), then they cut back, in order to maximize the income from that one game.  The problem with this is that Nintendo seems to not realize that advertising for one game is in turn advertising for all GameCube games.  If a consumer buys a GameCube because of Metroid Prime commercials, they're going to buy more games.  The advertising budget for Metroid Prime has then in essence advertised for the rest of Nintendo's product line.  This strategy seems certainly adopted by Microsoft and Sony but has been ignored by Nintendo, who seems to wish to keep up the bottom line, at all costs (including future profitability).
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Offline Sean

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #14 on: February 25, 2003, 07:45:16 AM »
Quote

Of course with the XBox slaughtering the GC in sales worldwide.......


Ummm...to my knowledge, this isn't true at all.  Every sales data I've seen says that WORLDWIDE, the GameCube is #2 behind Sony.  In the US, the XBOX is something like a million consoles ahead or something, I guess.  Please check my facts, someone, but I think the #2 worldwide thing is definitely true.

Oh, I forgot--America is the only important country.  ;-)
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Offline RickPowers

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Gamecube doing bad? Well maybe if you only look at the short term.
« Reply #15 on: February 25, 2003, 07:57:59 AM »
Quote

For every 1 GameCube sold last month, almost *6* PS2s were sold


And for every six PS2s that Sony sells, they don't make the same profit Nintendo makes on one GameCube.

It's all about your perspective people.  Nintendo may not be the sales leader you all want them to be, but they're making more money than Sony, and that's pretty SICK.  

Anyway, let's all talk about this in one place, if you please.

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