Topic: Wii U - e3 is over... now what?

[Caterkiller]

I guess I'm different.  My wife and I loved RE5 because we got to play it together, even though she was scared through most of it.  She loved watching me play RE4 on the GC when it was released (it was the only thing that scared her for a long time).  So I am greatly anticipated RE6 to be able to play it with my wife (even if we can only play after putting our son to bed).

Oh how I dream of this future for myself. The closest I ever got to that was NSMBW, but even that was too difficult for her.

[Stogi]

I think they may let a few nuggets out of the bag...

Too Easy.

...play it with my wife (even if we can only play after putting our son to bed).

Again, too easy.

Not having RE right out of the gate kinda blows, but we'll have Pikmin 3 so I doubt any of us would have played it anyway.

[Kytim89]

What if Nintendo offered a cloud based Virtual Console where the player would pay a monthly subscription fee (2000 Wii points) and be able to pay all the Virtual Console games any time they want to play games?

[Evan_B]

I'd rather pick and choose, truthfully.

[broodwars]

I'd rather pick and choose, truthfully.

I agree.  I'd rather have them on my HDD to play at my whim (and rarely actually do so) than feel pressured into playing them because of the monthly fee (and subsequently interfere with my gaming time w/ new retail games I want to play).

[Chozo Ghost]

Broodwars, how the heck do you have 57 platinum trophies? That's almost as many Platinums as I have Gold trophies. You've probably had your PS3 a lot longer than me, but still...

Even if you are that good how can you find the time?

[broodwars]

Broodwars, how the heck do you have 57 platinum trophies? That's almost as many Platinums as I have Gold trophies. You've probably had your PS3 a lot longer than me, but still...

Even if you are that good how can you find the time?

I have a good site for guiding me in my trophy hunts, I game likely far more than is healthy, and I tend to have a lot of time on my hands.  Plus, I largely play RPG and adventure games, though I do have the occasional sadistic Platinum like Dead Space 2 (with its insanely hard "Hard Core" mode completion trophy).  I've also had my PS3 for going on 3 years now.

Honestly, most Platinum trophies really aren't that difficult to acquire if you're willing to focus your efforts and you know the right tricks to certain trophies.  And that site I linked above tends to have a very enthusiastic and detail-oriented community always willing to give advice.  It's not a gaming lifestyle I would unreservedly recommend to others, but it works for me.

If it makes you feel better, I used to be a gaming QA tester as well, so I'm used to the kind of mindset it takes to fully complete one of these titles.

[Spak-Spang]

I wouldn't mind a subscription Virtual console of like 5 dollars a month...if it is compatible with the WiiU and 3DS...and if you still have the option to buy the games separate.  Though if Nintendo is going to go that route.  Just charge $49.99 a year...or $59.99 and offer the Nintendo backlog of VC games streaming as a bonus.

[Kytim89]

I wouldn't mind a subscription Virtual console of like 5 dollars a month...if it is compatible with the WiiU and 3DS...and if you still have the option to buy the games separate.  Though if Nintendo is going to go that route.  Just charge $49.99 a year...or $59.99 and offer the Nintendo backlog of VC games streaming as a bonus.

The service should be $49.99 for a yearly package with the Virtual Console and $59.99 for the Virtual Console and additional online features.

[Louieturkey]

Broodwars, how the heck do you have 57 platinum trophies? That's almost as many Platinums as I have Gold trophies. You've probably had your PS3 a lot longer than me, but still...

Even if you are that good how can you find the time?

I have a good site for guiding me in my trophy hunts, I game likely far more than is healthy, and I tend to have a lot of time on my hands.  Plus, I largely play RPG and adventure games, though I do have the occasional sadistic Platinum like Dead Space 2 (with its insanely hard "Hard Core" mode completion trophy).  I've also had my PS3 for going on 3 years now.

Honestly, most Platinum trophies really aren't that difficult to acquire if you're willing to focus your efforts and you know the right tricks to certain trophies.  And that site I linked above tends to have a very enthusiastic and detail-oriented community always willing to give advice.  It's not a gaming lifestyle I would unreservedly recommend to others, but it works for me.

If it makes you feel better, I used to be a gaming QA tester as well, so I'm used to the kind of mindset it takes to fully complete one of these titles.

I'd recommend that site as well.  If you need a guide to get the platinum trophy (or 100% a PSN title), they are the place to go.  And I agree about the DS2 platinum being tough, though you just need to take your time and have patience when running it.  I'd argue my Disgaea 3 platinum was much tougher to acquire.

[Chozo Ghost]

Broodwars, how the heck do you have 57 platinum trophies? That's almost as many Platinums as I have Gold trophies. You've probably had your PS3 a lot longer than me, but still...

Even if you are that good how can you find the time?

I have a good site for guiding me in my trophy hunts, I game likely far more than is healthy, and I tend to have a lot of time on my hands.  Plus, I largely play RPG and adventure games, though I do have the occasional sadistic Platinum like Dead Space 2 (with its insanely hard "Hard Core" mode completion trophy).  I've also had my PS3 for going on 3 years now.

Honestly, most Platinum trophies really aren't that difficult to acquire if you're willing to focus your efforts and you know the right tricks to certain trophies.  And that site I linked above tends to have a very enthusiastic and detail-oriented community always willing to give advice.  It's not a gaming lifestyle I would unreservedly recommend to others, but it works for me.

If it makes you feel better, I used to be a gaming QA tester as well, so I'm used to the kind of mindset it takes to fully complete one of these titles.

Do you ever run into trophies which you find too frustratingly difficult? The worst thing I've ever attempted to do was beat COD Classic on Veteran difficulty. I got about 2/3rds through and I just couldn't take anymore. I got "shell shocked". I still have the game save, so I may attempt it again someday, but it makes me sick to even think about it.

I've beated World at War, Black Ops, MW2, MW3, and other FPS games on Veteran or equivalent difficulties, but COD Classic takes the cake. My main problem is you can't heal in it at all, so any damage you take you are stuck with for the remainder of the game. In other games you can take cover for a few seconds and heal, but in this one you can't. I still struggled through it 2/3rds through but I read on forums that there is some really hard stuff ahead, so I just quit. And what really sucks is that game doesn't let you turn down the difficulty mid-game. If I wanted to try it on a lower difficulty I would literally have to do the whole thing all over again.

Another thing I hate that games try to force you to do is hunting down collectible things. If its like 50 things I have to find, I'll tolerate it, but I've seen games where you have to find 300 things and I refuse to do that. Its not that it is hard or I can't do it, but it would take such a huge amount of time and I would have to use some sort of guide. There are a number of games I refuse to Platinum for this very reason. Do you put in the long amount of time necessary to do that? How do they ever expect someone to find all these things without a guide? I suppose if someone meticulously combed every single inch of a vast game world they could every collectible on their own, but that could take months.

[broodwars]

Do you ever run into trophies which you find too frustratingly difficult?

Certainly.  Black Ops certainly drove me to that trying to beat it on Veteran w/ several levels having infinitely respawning levels, and I eventually just put the game up rather than endure the aggravation.  And don't get me started on Star Ocean: The Last Hope's insultingly time-greedy trophies (here's a hint: without even taking the 900 battle trophies into consideration, you have to beat this 100 hour JPRG FOUR TIMES for the Plat), which played a large role in me shelving that game permanently.  You just have to pick and choose your battles, and I strongly suggest only going for Plats on games you really enjoy.  I don't bother with going for Plats on most FPS games because of having to beat the game on the hardest difficulty settings and the huge time sink of the online modes.  Still, I have managed to do so on a few titles like that, such as Resistance 3; Syndicate; and The Darkness 2.

Another thing I hate that games try to force you to do is hunting down collectible things. If its like 50 things I have to find, I'll tolerate it, but I've seen games where you have to find 300 things and I refuse to do that. Its not that it is hard or I can't do it, but it would take such a huge amount of time and I would have to use some sort of guide.

Do you put in the long amount of time necessary to do that? How do they ever expect someone to find all these things without a guide? I suppose if someone meticulously combed every single inch of a vast game world they could every collectible on their own, but that could take months.

I've lost track of the number of games I've had to use Collectible Guides on for that very reason.  Most RPGs have some sort of trophy related to the collectibles, including Tales of Graces F (the game I'm playing right now).  For me, it's a choice between either doing the collectibles all in 1 run and having a slightly longer (but usually more rewarding) playthrough, or playing through the entire game again.  Usually, the former wins rather easily (especially with 30-100 hour RPGs), because if I have to play the game again I'd rather be able to just focus on the game rather than the collectibles.  I'd rather avoid a second playthrough altogether if I can, as I have burned out on games doing two playthroughs in a row.

Like I said, pick and choose your battles and know your limits because it's extremely easy to burn-out trying to be a completionist.  It's happened to me on more than one occasion.

To throw this thread back on-topic, though, I hope that Nintendo does implement some kind of system-wide achievement feature with the Wii U.  Some folks here have major issues with achievement systems, but I've found in my experience that they really enrich my gaming experience & allow me to keep an eye on how my friends are doing at certain games.

[Chozo Ghost]

Certainly.  Black Ops certainly drove me to that trying to beat it on Veteran w/ several levels having infinitely respawning levels, and I eventually just put the game up rather than endure the aggravation.

I actually did beat that on Veteran, but I don't have the Platinum for it because of two zombie trophies which are impossible for me to get on my own, and trying to pull it off with random players so far hasn't paid off. I don't think co op or multiplayer trophies should exist at all. Trophies should be about personal achievements, so if you have to depend on someone else to get it what's the point?

I've also seen some really stupid co op trophies which have criteria such as "play a game with another player who has beaten the campaign". What the hell is the point of that? This trophy was in the game Red Faction, btw. The very first online match I played I got that, and it was a Gold trophy too. That's probably the easiest Gold trophy I've ever earned. Just play an online game and you get it, whether you win or lose. I don't feel proud about getting it, but I got it.

As for Black Ops on Veteran, the hardest part for me in that whole game was the 3rd or so mission where you are at this Russian base thing, and eventually you come to this part where there is this really long hallway and you are supposed to move forward but you can't because you move out of cover and you get killed killed instantly, but you can't stay where you are either because then you get spammed with grenades which you can't evade or toss back because there are multiple of them. I swear I must have died on that checkpoint at least 50 times and I swear I'm not exaggerating. It really was that bad. Maybe that's the part where you gave up, and if it was I don't blame you.

But what saved me and helped me get past that was watching a video on youtube, and I just tried to duplicate what they did as closely as possible. It was tough, but I finally got it. But what really sucks with that one is it seems like there should have been another checkpoint halfway through. Distance wise it was probably like 500ft, but that's the longest 500ft you will ever walk in any video game.

After I got past that the rest of the game wasn't so bad. There was still some tough moments, but never anything quite as bad as that. Although near the end of the game at that same point where you get the trophy for barbecuing the Russians that was extremely tough on Veteran. You just have to keep trying and hope eventually you get lucky. But you are right the infinitely spawning enemies are the problem. Treyarch likes to do that in their games for some reason. World at War was also really bad like that.

To throw this thread back on-topic, though, I hope that Nintendo does implement some kind of system-wide achievement feature with the Wii U.  Some folks here have major issues with achievement systems, but I've found in my experience that they really enrich my gaming experience & allow me to keep an eye on how my friends are doing at certain games.

I agree, it doesn't really hurt to include it. If people don't like it that's fine, but it  doesn't do much harm for it to be there... well, I guess it does harm when you consider the lengths people will go through to obsessively obtain trophies. The time wasted and the stress and frustration isn't really a positive thing, but people fall into that trap of their own accord.

[Spak-Spang]

I wouldn't mind a subscription Virtual console of like 5 dollars a month...if it is compatible with the WiiU and 3DS...and if you still have the option to buy the games separate.  Though if Nintendo is going to go that route.  Just charge $49.99 a year...or $59.99 and offer the Nintendo backlog of VC games streaming as a bonus.

 
The service should be $49.99 for a yearly package with the Virtual Console and $59.99 for the Virtual Console and additional online features.

I could go with that, but what are the additional features? 
Actually what I would love Nintendo to do is create a basic online structure that is $39.99 a year.  This gets you online play and voice chat on dedicated servers.  Then Nintendo partners and works with companies like Netflix to get a premium package up that is like:  2-3 free streaming movies a month, streaming virtual console games...with optional buy and download options.  And other features.  Then Nintendo centralizes a bank that stores your Nintendo points or credit card information, and if you want to rent more movies, or buy games, or DLC or whatnot, it is all done easily and simply without managing or juggling multiple accounts. 

[broodwars]

I'd argue my Disgaea 3 platinum was much tougher to acquire.

Yeah, that's a pretty hard Platinum to beat.  The only one I have that probably comes close is my Resonance of Fate Platinum, though that really wasn't hard.  Just incredibly tedious (116 hours!) because of all the crap you have to do and how crappy that game is.  But seriously, man, you actually took the 200 or so hours to Platinum a Disgaea game?  That's just insane.   

It's funny, really, that Resonance's time requirement bugs me like it does, because my Skyrim (100+ hours so far) and Tales of Graces F (around 150 hours so far) playthroughs are taking far longer.  But they are infinitely better games, though it took Skyrim almost 4 months of patching to reach that point.

And yeah, Chozo, that just so happens to be exactly where I got fed up with Black Ops on Veteran difficulty.  I managed to get far enough in that I got check-pointed in the final hallway, and I just gave up there.

As for Online trophies, I'm fine with them being there so long as they aren't particularly labor-intensive, and are mainly there just to introduce you to various modes (Killzone 3 and Uncharted 2's trophy lists were particularly good in that respect).  In some cases, they've gotten me to play games online that I otherwise wouldn't have bothered with and surprisingly enjoyed.  For instance, Syndicate's Online Co-Op is actually pretty fantastic, and without the nudging of the trophy list I would have completely ignored it.

[oohhboy]

Actually what I would love Nintendo to do is create a basic online structure that is $39.99 a year. This gets you online play and voice chat on dedicated servers

This alone would sour me off Nintendo. It's absurd, outright alien to have to pay to get online play or voice chat. Paying for an online service gets you nothing and assures you of nothing. Online play and voice chat should be a standard tick box feature, not not something to more to pay for. Over 5 years it would nearly equal the cost of the console or cost 5 - 10 games you could have brought otherwise and played, money developers could be using to make more games.

Nowhere else but the Xbox has this asinine system in play. It is not something I want anybody to import anywhere or something to be proud of. It doesn't guarantee online play to older titles since Xbox live is no more than a front end with server control in the hands of the publisher. The money isn't being used to improve servers or pay for uptime. It's just MS skimming off the top of every game that goes online.

[Padawan of Windu]

    Yeah, I'm not too hot on the pay for a Virtual Console subscription idea either.  I love choosing what games I want and always having them, regardless of if my router is working correctly that day.  And I always feel angry when months go by and I haven't used netflix - though I love the service, I hate having paid for time when I never even used it.  In fact I'm going to cancel it right now, as it hasn't been used since Christmas break.  I can always resubscribe if I want it again. 

    As for the achievements/trophies stuff, I never usually care much about them.  With a huge backlog, I just want to play through a game and experience it and it's story.  I get frustrated with my boyfriend when he'll play Xbox games he's long been done with just to get these achievements.  Especially the asinine ones! Well, I do suppose Kid Icarus 3 has made me actually pursue the achievements more than I thought I ever would, as you actually get in game rewards for them, rather than some number on your profile.  The idea of having achievements on Wii U where you get hats/ Metroid helmet/ armor / clothes / etc. as rewards is somewhat cool to me though.  55 days to E3!

[Chozo Ghost]

And yeah, Chozo, that just so happens to be exactly where I got fed up with Black Ops on Veteran difficulty.  I managed to get far enough in that I got check-pointed in the final hallway, and I just gave up there.

I bet this is where most people give up. If you are ever up to attempting it again, look for a video on youtube and maybe you can find the same one I did and see how they did it and you can just attempt to repeat that. From what I recall a major key to getting through that is the use of smoke grenades which mask your approach. So having those is essential.

I'm not saying the rest of the game is smooth sailing past that, but if you can get past that one part you should be able to do the rest.

[Spak-Spang]

Well, Microsoft is the only system using it...but guess what...they are also the BEST online service in the console business.

Do I want to pay more for online...not really, I hate paying extra.  But would I pay more if I knew it meant consistent servers and bandwidth expansion.  That Nintendo would be putting the money to make sure everything runs smoothly and quickly through their servers.  Yes I would.  I remember posting messages through my Wii and my friend not getting it until the next day or so.  That is not acceptable in a serious online environment.

Throwing in the streaming VC just adds value to the service...but I would still want Nintendo to sell the games as downloads.  In the end, I think charging for GOOD online is the lesser of two evils.  charging for good, or having poor online to no online.

[Kytim89]

Well, Microsoft is the only system using it...but guess what...they are also the BEST online service in the console business.

Do I want to pay more for online...not really, I hate paying extra.  But would I pay more if I knew it meant consistent servers and bandwidth expansion.  That Nintendo would be putting the money to make sure everything runs smoothly and quickly through their servers.  Yes I would.  I remember posting messages through my Wii and my friend not getting it until the next day or so.  That is not acceptable in a serious online environment.

Throwing in the streaming VC just adds value to the service...but I would still want Nintendo to sell the games as downloads.  In the end, I think charging for GOOD online is the lesser of two evils.  charging for good, or having poor online to no online.

If I could give Nintendo $49.99 for yearly online subscription that would make it easier to purchase bigger games via an online store then by all means I would give them my money. Do not get me wrong, there should be a basic online system that is intuitive enough for eveyone to utilize for a good gaming experience. Look at it this way, Nintendo's biggest concern with online is predators. So, if all the adults knew that they could pay for an even better and more modern online system than most would go for it because mommies and daddies and the casuals will most likely not pay for online.
 
As for the cloud based Virtual Console, keep in mind that Nintendo is kind of turned off by demos, so if a person could pay to play all Virtual Console games and then pay to own the ones that they like then Nintendo could have an even bigger profit incentive to keep the VC service going.

[Louieturkey]

Yeah, that's a pretty hard Platinum to beat.  The only one I have that probably comes close is my Resonance of Fate Platinum, though that really wasn't hard.  Just incredibly tedious (116 hours!) because of all the crap you have to do and how crappy that game is.  But seriously, man, you actually took the 200 or so hours to Platinum a Disgaea game?  That's just insane.   

Yeah, I did get it.  I wouldn't have if I hadn't been able to get trophies on my original save.  When it first came out, trophies were not available for it (I had about 100 hours in the game at that point).  Luckily, they allowed me to use that save file and it only took another 150 hours to get the platinum.    Here's my trophy card to show what I've done.  I've done a lot less gaming since my son was born.  I'll probably get back to it when he is a little older and I can play with him.  Then again, I'll end up with games like Cars 2 on my trophy list at that point.

I'd also enjoy it if the WiiU had an achievement system.  I'm hoping they link it with the 3DS and be able to do achievements with both systems like with the PS3 and Vita and probably with the PS4 as well.

[Caterkiller]

http://www.edge-online.com/news/miyamoto-keen-new-link-past


Miyamoto would like a brand new Link to the Past style game.


And talks of F-Zero possibly coming for Wii U.

[Ian Sane]

I wonder if Miyamoto remembers that A Link to the Past is actually pretty hard in places.  It's like fuckin' Gradius compared to recent Zelda games.

Who knows what he even means by that anyway?  Minish Cap and Four Swords Adventure are not that old yet and they both have some elements of A Link to the Past.  Do those not meet his requirements?

Hey, if it results in a Zelda game with normal controls, none of those stupid guardians, and not recycling the same three areas again and again then I am all for it.  I wouldn't be too thrilled though if we got A Link to the Past's Twilight Princess.

[Adrock]

A Link to the Past recycled its entire world map.

[Stogi]

As much as I'd love any F-Zero to come out anywhere, I don't understand his hesitancy of making it for the 3DS. It seems like the perfect title for it. A huge sense of speed would translate well with a 3D screen, plus you have the extra screen for your map, and so on.