Author Topic: Something important to know about the Revolution (Read 94391 times)

slingshot · « **Reply #175 on:** March 02, 2005, 07:41:20 AM »

I wonder- there would have to be some way of controling the gyro- function. Just think of all the monkey-cam headaches
that would occur from normal jostling of the controler while using other buttons. A Gyro would be awesome, but it should
only engage if you are depressing a "z" trigger button that is eazy to use frequently- maybe part of the handl or something.

It would be amazing, and effortless to look around with the slight tilt of the controller- but no one wants to have the screen
shaking wildly just from normal button or stick movements. I'm sure they worked out all the bugs- and I'm 99% positive that
the gyro theory is correct. And what a change it will make.

Don'tHate742 · « **Reply #176 on:** March 02, 2005, 08:09:40 AM »

First of all noone said that Nintendo is using the gyroscope, but it is a very realistic and educated guess.

Second of all, I'd like to say I like your "z" trigger idea, and that it should be an option....an option. I understand your concern, but that could easily be solved by the shape of the controller. If the controller is easily held and comfortable to hold, as well as to push the buttons (meaning every thing is easily reached) then I see no problems when pushing the buttons. The control moves with your wrist/arm movements not with your hand movements. I think people are competent enough to be able to keep their wrist steady while they hit buttons. Hell they can do it today, why not in the future? You may argue the case of leverage. Having two hands on the controller allows for more leverage while your hitting buttons. I'd reply, as long as the controller shape was again, comfortable and made it easy to hit the buttons, than it would be no different than hitting your pointer finger with your thumb while having a semi-closed fist (try it!). You mentioned stick movements, the same idea applies. You could also rest your elbows on arm rests or a desk or something if your having alot of trouble. You should check out my pic (in Let's talk controller), it's not great, but it does show you how comfortable they can make the controller.

nemo_83 · « **Reply #177 on:** March 02, 2005, 12:13:10 PM »

the idea of saying you have to hold the z button down to aim is like how in Metroid you can only do one thing at a time. it might be a nice option, but you shouldn't have to hold it down to use the gyro. you could just hit a button to use it freely. people are ready to use their controllers like steering wheels, mice, and flight sticks in open air. and the people who try to play games against such a controller without one will get stomped to death. the old way of gaming is about to be killed.

slingshot · « **Reply #178 on:** March 03, 2005, 03:39:44 AM »

I see- but I do like to shift around while playing. I just wouldn't want to change positions while the entire screen
bounces around. But, actually playing something may prove me wrong. simply resting the controler on my lap is very
comfortable.

KDR_11k · « **Reply #179 on:** March 03, 2005, 05:27:22 AM »

You probably wouldn't have direct camera control with the gyro or at least a dead zone.

Don'tHate742 · « **Reply #180 on:** March 03, 2005, 12:05:27 PM »

I was actually thinking about how gamers would be able to travel without disrupting their game session or camera view. I think reset switch on your controller could do the trick. You hit the switch, and once you have your new neutral position figured out, you click it back on. Kinda like a power button, but more useful since a power switch would have to be on both controllers and not just one. Of course the switch would have to be somewhere easy to reach so you don't have to use your other hand to click it on. Anyways....

Problem solved.

slingshot · « **Reply #181 on:** March 03, 2005, 03:26:20 PM »

I still think there should be a standard neutral view in games that require 1st p shooter perspective. This view is the forwd
view, an analog would move you fwd, backward, and turn left and right. By holding down a gyro activator button (somewhere
obvious, and unobtrusive to gameply-such as a z button) you could look all around by tilting the controler.

IN flight sim games the gyro would probably be constantly active, or you could choose to deactivate it by holding down the z,
or toggle on-off with a click.

I can easily see how the looking up and down will work on a gyro controller. But I have difficulty visualizing how it works
when trying to look left and right- or moving left and right for that matter. Would the gyro sense movement in any direction,
and sense tilt as well, or are there limitations of direction or angle that it may miss?

Again- all assuming that gyros will be used.

Don'tHate742 · « **Reply #182 on:** March 03, 2005, 03:57:54 PM »

I'm thinking that the part of the controller used for aiming (in a FPS; probably left), would be used much like a mouse would. But, on a vertical plane (in the air) with no depth, instead of a horizontal plane which the mouse uses (like a mousepad). So anyways, there's this imaginary square in the air that is a vertical plane and your hand is right in the middle of it; you move your hand accordingly to what you would like to see on screen (thus using the camera yourself). Like If you want to look up, you move your fist upwards, not above your head. Once you go out of this imaginary square (how big the square depends on sensitivity), the camera moves faster in the direction you wanted. So if you move your hand out of the square to the left, you spin left faster. The farther out, the faster you spin. This allows you to always view the television; so if you want to turn around in the game, you don't have to turn around in real-life. It would be best to ignore tilt and rotation on this part of the controller, it would allow for greater ease of use. I guess you could use the gyration based solely on tilt (as if your holding a big analog stick), but I think that it wouldn't be as fun. The other part (used for shooting and such) tilt is a definite must, becuase aiming is almost always based on how you tilt your hand/arm. Also rotation should come into play, turning your hand sideways results in turning your gun sideways on screen. The gun part of the controller should be able to sense everything really.

If your not getting my explanation on how you view; pick up your mouse pad so it's vertical and then use your mouse. While a little ackward, moving across the screen is still how it use to be when you had it on the desk. So, you should see that it still works (unless you have a mouse with a ball instead of a light), but ya you get the idea.

A flight stick would just sense tilt...no need for rotation or even up and down as well as side to side movements.

nemo_83 · « **Reply #183 on:** March 03, 2005, 04:08:43 PM »

The analog stick would move you left, right, forward, and backward. The gyro unlike other tilt technologies detects yaw which means you will not have to "tilt" the controller to the left to turn left, instead you would turn the controller left or right to turn left or right. Tilting the controller left or right would result in something like leaning the character around a corner or dodging a punch. A mouse gives you x and y axis control by moving the mouse forward, backward, left, and right; but the gyro would allow you to spin the handle as well as move along the x and y axises. The gyro's ability to detect the tilting and the turning of the controller makes it possible to use it as a way to control a sword, gun, steering wheel, camera, etc.

Don'tHate742 · « **Reply #184 on:** March 03, 2005, 04:44:26 PM »

Exactly, but spinning the gyroscope should be ignored for the viewing part of the controllers. Also, tilting could be including for such features as looking around the corner, but a button should have to be pressed so you don't accidently keep changing your view as you tilt. Again, the viewing part of the controller doesn't sense the forward and backwards movement of your fist. This allows you to move past this "invisible square", allowing for great comfortability. The other part senses everything, so if you hold your gun out forward or right next your your chest...it knows exactly what's going on.

I just can't help but like the idea of moving and looking all with one hand. Even shooting if double guns is implemented. It seems like an incredibly simplistic way to include everything to one hand. Then the possiblities become greater with the addition of a second hand. It just seems lovely, and I can imagine how a game like Halo (my favorite multiplayer shooter) could go up by leaps and bounds with a system like this. Shooting two different people at the same time seems so damn cool, or shooting while ducking behind a crate, or even driving while you shoot, GTA style. Oh the halarity!

For the love of God let this be the controller of the REV!

nemo_83 · « **Reply #185 on:** March 03, 2005, 05:47:32 PM »

it becomes complicated when you have to hold down a button to look. the biggest benefit of gyration is you never have to hold down an aim button or rely on targetting again.

Don'tHate742 · « **Reply #186 on:** March 04, 2005, 06:04:16 AM »

Well I meant for the tilting factor only. Every other instance can use the gyroscope as needed. For instance, when you click the button it locks your view into place (so if your facing forward you will remain facing foward). You can then adjust the view by tiliting, like around a corner; but that's it, you can't turn yourself completely around or look straight up and down. Also when your tilting, it could also lean your player in that direction also. This would be useful becuase then you wouldn't have to coordinate moving and changing your view, it's already one mechanic. Also, when you lean out, you can aim with your right hand, that is free to move and shoot; or even memorize where to aim then hide and shoot from behind the wall with your arm sticking out.

I don't know about using this mechanic in FPS's, but third-person shooter's definitely. Also, it would be alot easier to aim both guns since you don't control the view entirely.

ruby_onix · « **Reply #187 on:** May 28, 2005, 04:19:40 PM »

I'm bumping an ancient thread, for the sake of bumping an ancient thread.

Also, so that we can laugh at ourselves.

Quote
Originally posted by: ruby_onix
The whole system's gonna get unveiled in two months anyways, so what does it matter?

ThePerm · « **Reply #188 on:** May 28, 2005, 04:44:31 PM »

hmm gyros could weild fps like controls, built in camera/microphone..an extra z button...we'd be set.

mantidor · « **Reply #189 on:** May 28, 2005, 08:52:26 PM »

LOL rubi

so did our friend Noble Feather got debunked or not? I really didnt follow this thread to know if some of his predictions were accurate. A question for him though, how could he know someone developing for the Rev if the dev kits are supossedly not out yet, unless is some Nintendo first party title maybe?

KDR_11k · « **Reply #190 on:** May 28, 2005, 09:32:39 PM »

Last I heard there were dev kits out already.

stevey · « **Reply #191 on:** May 29, 2005, 05:17:20 AM »

"Bleh, please not 6 face buttons. There is no need for that many buttons on the front"

There going to be 6+ face buttons.

"Rev if the dev kits are supossedly not out yet'

There using the cube dev kits for now.

Noble~Feather said the format is hd dvd but I didn't see anthing about that at e3

Famicom · « **Reply #192 on:** May 29, 2005, 06:09:19 AM »

I'm guessing both Nintendo and MS strayed away from any HD format since neither Sony, Toshiba and all the companies backing them can make up their damn mind on what the main format will be. That and manufacturing costs probably weren't worked out yet.

KDR_11k · « **Reply #193 on:** May 29, 2005, 07:56:06 AM »

Actually Feather said they're "not going with the smaller format", i.e. using BRD.

Stimutacs Addict · « **Reply #194 on:** May 30, 2005, 07:56:01 AM »

i like the thought of using tilt to strafe in some FPS games. you could sidestep just by tilting either the left or right prong of the controller (assuming it is a single piece controller). the only drawback might be that people are now used to forward/back and sidestep controls all on the same analog stick. no one would want to tip their controller to sidestep

Truthliesn1seyes · « **Reply #195 on:** May 30, 2005, 06:37:52 PM »

Nintendo never specified what format they were using. They first said dvd, then changed it to 12 mm (or cm cant remember) discs. That could mean anything.

On another note, looks like the Rev touchscreen controller rumor is back now with force feedback lol.
http://www.nintendojo.com/infocus/view_item.php?1117484645

Also, seems like Mario 128 has officially moved onto the Rev's launch window...according to spong

http://www.nintendojo.com/infocus/view_item.php?1117489453

stevey · « **Reply #196 on:** May 31, 2005, 04:08:26 PM »

Hey Noble~Feather now be a good boy and let us know more now that e3 is over... please.

stevey · « **Reply #197 on:** May 31, 2005, 05:06:04 PM »

... come on ... I give you a cookie ... I give you gold ... I give you any thing ... Money ... Power ... Women ... uhh..men?

Truthliesn1seyes · « **Reply #198 on:** May 31, 2005, 06:39:04 PM »

Nintendo's strategy seems to be paying off already......

http://www.nintendojo.com/infocus/view_item.php?1117581436

... and some corporate mudslinging by the big 3....

http://www.gamespot.com/news/2005/05/31/news_6126725.html

Don'tHate742 · « **Reply #199 on:** May 31, 2005, 06:55:27 PM »

Yes...I remember reading that interview.

It was very odd how he spoke of the reasons for liking the Revolution, but either way, he likes the Revolution.

I think he meant to say this:

Sony's graphical power maybe too mighty to wield by any but the richest developers, so we could see alot of mediocre looking games for the platform. A blockbuster hit may come and go (FF), but all in all it's power will be neglected.

The Xbox is in the middle of the boat. It's power won't take a drastic amount of money to wield, nor will it take a very long development period (compared to this gen). However, due to its focus on graphics and not development, developers might have some trouble pumping out power the first/second generation.

The REV is all about developer-friendliness. Though Kojima may not know the specs of the REV, he believes it will be a very capable system (he mentions that fact by saying the REV can produce a great steak

)). He goes on to say that its low-cost development system coupled with its familarity can potentially make it "dinner" everyday, while the Xbox is a dinner that you'd consume every once and a while, with the PS3 only for special occasions such as an anniversary.

This is coming from a game-designer that has very atiquette funds as well as experience. If he's saying that the REV is "dinner everyday," I can't imagine what lesser developers believe.

News:

Author Topic: Something important to know about the Revolution (Read 94391 times)